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Sony is officially helping with funding and development with Shenmue 3

fedexpeon

Banned
I agree here.

The fact that some people feel they should close it for fans who's already reserved their copy
For fans who get once in a lifetime opportunities
For fans who wanted to be apart of this just because of some funding is selfish AF.

I have never played Shenmue in my life but I can totally understand why some put money towards this project and I'm okay with this entirely.

Yup.
These "concerned" moralist can take their consumer right and ethical business/transparency and go home. Sometime corporation can act in good faith and care enough to present an option to fans instead of just saying fuck you, $$$ bitches.
We knew when we pledged $100+ for the game that it might be crappy since it was only asking for 2M.
We didn't care, we still threw our money into the wind because we'd waited for over a decade to throw money for the sequel but never got a chance to do so until now.
 

ironcreed

Banned
June 15th: Shenmue III revealed at the Sony E3 Event
June 16th: "I wish they would have said there was some kind of partnership with Sony"

...

926.gif


It was not obvious at all, was it? Now people are mad that they are backing the damn game and letting fans kickstart and be a part of it as well.
 
the fact that people can't seem to separate discussing the politics of this and being concerned =/= excitement for the actual game is so weird

"JUST BE HAPPY DON'T OVERTHINK IT THIS IS A MIRACLE BE HAPPY PLEASE!"

what a weird thing. I can be happy for the game and wonder about it too. Like, I actually care

Also this

This thread is turning into a giant "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" even if I kinda wanna discuss the man behind the curtain
 

Garlador

Member
I laugh at anyone who thought that $2 million could fund the entire game.

Skullgirls had every new character costing roughly $200,000 and an end budget of roughly $1.7 million.

Shenmue NEEDED extra funding to be made, and it NEEDED the kickstarter to show interest in the project to warrant funding.
 

J-Rzez

Member
So donating 2 million is to gauge interest? Why not a survey, poll or market research like, you know, usually happens.

I'm not a fan of this approach, I think it's sly.

Money + keystrokes speaks louder than keystrokes alone.
 
I'm somewhat okay with them using KS to gauge interest, what I'm not really okay with is if they don't close the KS now that there's offiical backing.

It's already sitting at $2.7m, it'll probably $3m by the morning and who knows where it could go if they don't close it.

How they mkve forward is key. I'm not a fan of games using KS to spread the development costs out to gamers when there's a publisher/backer behind the project.

That's pretty underhanded in my opinion. KS should be for games that genuinely struggle to receive funding, not to gauge interest in a game before a publisher commits to a project.

tumblr_ltsra4931B1qb21tjo1_400.gif


Been hearing this mantra of "Kickstarter should only be for struggling game projects" since the very beginning but it errs on naïve idealism. Gauging interest with crowdfunding has been a thing since the very beginning, not just Kickstarter but other outlets like for films.
 

ItIsOkBro

Member
I am a 100% absolute fan of this approach.

Several fanbases are all talk and no action. Others are a vocal minority. Shenmue fans showed that they're no joke through the Kickstarter. They had no avenue to do so for more than a decade.
 

Fat4all

Banned
So donating 2 million is to gauge interest? Why not a survey, poll or market research like, you know, usually happens.

I'm not a fan of this approach, I think it's sly.

Donating?

Your paying for the game. It's practically a pre-order.
 

Patapwn

Member
Oh that justifies publishers getting development discounts, I didn't know that, nvm

So you disagree with kickstarter fundamentally?

Because getting funding directly from buyers A.K.A 'development discounts' is the basis of the entire system.
 

Josh7289

Member
Exactly my point.

Sony has exploited the kickstarter model in order for gamers to pay well in excess for a retail copy of the game under the guise "it needs funded", when they shouldn't have to do this at all.

Kickstarter is used to demonstrate that people are willing to pay money for a game. That's how it's used for video games. It almost never fully funds games. Shenmue was a commercial failure in its first two iterations. Sony needed some kind of proof that people were going to spend money for a third game, and that's where Kickstarter comes in.

It's not even nearly over yet. The better the Kickstarter does, the more content will be added to the game, so we've got to keep it going.
 

Kieli

Member
Meh, guys.

Don't get too bent out of shape from the negative-nancies regarding Shenmue, FFVII/Re and The Last Guardian.

There's always going to be someone complaining. Let them complain. If they don't want to buy the games, more power to them.

Let's enjoy the 3 megatons. What a time to be alive!

Edit: And Shenmue is definitely one of those vocal-minority type things. Sounds reasonable to me for Sony to gauge interest via Kickstarter and let those who talk the talk, walk the walk.
 

Ithil

Member
I'm somewhat okay with them using KS to gauge interest, what I'm not really okay with is if they don't close the KS now that there's offiical backing.

It's already sitting at $2.7m, it'll probably $3m by the morning and who knows where it could go if they don't close it.

How they mkve forward is key. I'm not a fan of games using KS to spread the development costs out to gamers when there's a publisher/backer behind the project.

That's pretty underhanded in my opinion. KS should be for games that genuinely struggle to receive funding, not to gauge interest in a game before a publisher commits to a project.

I can't think of a game that has had more of a struggle getting funded than Shenmue 3.
 
Well, I saw this coming from a mile away. No mention of other consoles in stretch goals, really low target for a full 3D adventure game with Mo-Cap.

It screamed Sony partnership from the get go.
 

test_account

XP-39C²
the fact that people can't seem to separate discussing the politics of this and being concerned =/= excitement for the actual game is so weird

"JUST BE HAPPY DON'T OVERTHINK IT THIS IS A MIRACLE BE HAPPY PLEASE!"

what a weird thing. I can be happy for the game and wonder about it too. Like, I actually care
That is fair. Out of curiousity, what are you concerned about though?
 

RoboPlato

I'd be in the dick
I mean, there was a meeting where someone explicitely went "lets mention that we have nothing to do with this in case it sucks / doesnt reach its goal even tho we signed this thing days ago and are set to give X money"

that's clear to me

otherwise Boyes would have been even more cryptic about the nature of the deal and say nothing on stage
I think him saying it wasn't a Sony project was more in terms of the actual development being done by Suzuki's team and not an internal Sony studio. I'm not sure if they meant to mislead or not but it was definitely poor phrasing.
 
Having a kickstarter doesn't require you to use only those funds for a project from beginning to end - many launch only intending to finance part of a project or to demonstrate interest to potential investors. This is pretty normal and also, I think, totally fine in the wider scheme of things.

So the people who want to make Shenmue 3 maybe took it to Sony who said 'we don't know if this is worth the investment'. The team then decided (or worked with Sony) to try and demonstrate that there is some serious interest in the game, and they've had a pretty huge success overnight with that.

The people who backed Shenmue 3 will get their digital copies of the game and whatever other reward stuff that went along with the KS, and Sony will provide the funding and other support that was contingent on its success.

What exactly is sleazy about this? The alternative scenarios are either

A) the team try and make the Shenmue 3 people are hoping for on a few million from kickstarter (10% of which is taken by KS and fees, and another chunk is taken fulfilling rewards)

B) Sony gives the Shenmue 3 team $100 million because that's what a pal would do.

OR they could see how many people were willing to put money down, how much and then Sony use that to gauge how much to invest in the development of the game. Crowdfunding is a part of the entertainment business and there
isn't any one correct way to do it.

These are entertainment products. They aren't prying the money out of your hand.

That's my perspective on it as someone who didn't really like Shenmue 1 that much and hasn't played 2. I dunno if I'll even play this game, but the announcement was pretty interesting anyway.
 

OmegaDL50

Member
Really not a fan of this approach.

Do you think they would have gotten the necessary funding to even DEVELOP the game without a extensive budget being considered?

How much do you honestly think the amount of money is necessary to develop a game like this?

Without any publisher or additional funding involvement the game would never be made. Seriously, Yu Suzuki would have raise Star Citizen levels worth of funding just to do this on his own. With a Kickstarter alone, that would NEVER HAPPEN.
 

lupinko

Member
Seeing as Sony is known to fund these kinds of games all the time I'm surprised they didn't just fund it out right instead of using Kickstarter. I don't like this.

Those kinds of games didn't almost bankrupt Sega, so this is a lot different than a thatgamecompany game.
 

ninjabat

Member
I do not understand how some people think Sony was not going to help out in some capacity when the announcement was made.

They were standing on Sony's stage. Not Microsoft or Nintendo, but a Sony stage.

Was the thought that they were just giving him free stage time at e3? Is Sony a charity?
 

DorkyMohr

Banned
The only "canceled kickstarter because it got funding" example I know of from recent memory was Dive-Kick once Iron Galaxy stepped in. I don't remember the logistics as I want to say they still honored some of the reward tiers despite not collecting the money. Letting the kickstarter run it's course seems like a simpler way of handling things.
 

Pikma

Banned
Because Sony wasn't interested in funding the whole game. Never was, never will be.

It was this or nothing. Doing the cynical spin and pretending this is evil Sony squeezing cash out of poor unsuspecting fans is just drivel. But push the agenda it helps you downplay the hype.
Downplaying my arguments with the mention of imaginary "agendas" because I don't agree with you doesn't make you win by default though, you got to try harder
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Kickstarter is for games to be crowd funded that wouldn't have happened otherwise.

Shenmue III is a game that hasn't "happened" for like 15 years. Sony got on board only because KS made it possible for fans to subsidize the game. Otherwise they, like every other publisher on the industry for the past 15 years, would've passed on the project.

This is a problem how? The game wasn't going to happen otherwise, as Sony wasn't going to be footing the whole bill. I think people are just being childishly salty about this just because it happened under the Sony banner at E3.

That's exactly why people are mad. I'm sure if MS or Nintendo had done the same, some of the people whining in this thread wouldn't be whining right now.

RG0BS1U.gif
 

RPGamer92

Banned
I am a 100% absolute fan of this approach.

Several fanbases are all talk and no action. Others are a vocal minority. Shenmue fans showed that they're no joke through the Kickstarter. They had no avenue to do so for more than a decade.
Yep, Bayonetta 2 is a great example of this imo. Being well loved on forums =/= sales.
 

Squishy3

Member
Yeah, when I think about it, reserving the game for $29 is not a bad deal after all. Plus people can downgrade or outright cancel their pledges, right? [Citation needed]
They can cancel them through Kickstarter itself as long as they do it before the campaign ends. After that they'd need to issue chargebacks through their bank or credit card company.

The only "canceled kickstarter because it got funding" example I know of from recent memory was Dive-Kick once Iron Galaxy stepped in. I don't remember the logistics as I want to say they still honored some of the reward tiers despite not collecting the money. Letting the kickstarter run it's course seems like a simpler way of handling things.
The Baz being in the game still is a perfect example of this.
 
I pledged $20 hoping to help it get to its $2M goal.

It got there, but now Sony are probably throwing another $10M+ on to the development budget so my $20 has helped this game get the development budget it deserves. Am I stretching?

TBF I don't give a shit, really happy Sony is helping make this game!
 

Edzi

Member
So what are the odds that Shenmue 1 and 2 are released through PSN at some point? I've always been interested in the series and would love a chance to dive in and get properly excited for Shenmue 3.
 
I'm somewhat shocked that in 2015 people don't understand that a majority of these big titles aren't solely created from the funds earned through crowd funding.

People just look at the surface, they don't realize it takes wayyyyyyy more than 2 million to make a video game. Hell for all we know, the Kickstarter money barely scratches the surface of the development cost. Hell it's barely enough for marketing.
 

FStop7

Banned
That's pretty underhanded in my opinion. KS should be for games that genuinely struggle to receive funding, not to gauge interest in a game before a publisher commits to a project.

yeah because fucking SHENMUE 3 has been on the shelf for 14 years because of all the publishers tripping over each other to throw money at the project.
 

Brakus

Banned
Who gives a rats bum, we're getting a sequel we never thought would happen, Kickstarter is the saviour, why on earth would Sony just stump up the cash, for a series that crashed hard previously! Sony could really help craft this game into something very special! They have just bought themselves a truckload of goodwill.
 

Josh7289

Member
I am a 100% absolute fan of this approach.

Several fanbases are all talk and no action. Others are a vocal minority. Shenmue fans showed that they're no joke through the Kickstarter. They had no avenue to do so for more than a decade.

I agree. Kickstarter has been amazing for proving demand for games. Maybe with this discussion more people will begin to understand how KS works when it comes to video games, because there seems to be some confusion here on GAF, at least.
 

fantomena

Member
the fact that people can't seem to separate discussing the politics of this and being concerned =/= excitement for the actual game is so weird

"JUST BE HAPPY DON'T OVERTHINK IT THIS IS A MIRACLE BE HAPPY PLEASE!"

what a weird thing. I can be happy for the game and wonder about it too. Like, I actually care

I agreed, so what's your concern?
 
Kickstarter is generally used to fund projects that can't get funding through traditional means.

Sony is a Giant Mega Dollars Corporation. If they wanted Shenmue 3, they have the money to fund it. This is a billion dollar company asking for crowd-funding handouts.

This is also the second time they've done this.

This is my line of thinking.

Shenmue fans: "YES FINALLY! IM SO HAPPY!"
Some other people "I don't like this approach, feels scummy".

I'm a Shenmue fan that feels both ways. I have both Shenmue and Shenmue II on my PAL Dreamcast, I am not "some other person" in this regard.

I think I've expressed my thoughts on the Kickstarter matter enough. I am happy the game exists; I am displeased with the way it was executed.
 

xxracerxx

Don't worry, I'll vouch for them.
So donating 2 million is to gauge interest? Why not a survey, poll or market research like, you know, usually happens.

I'm not a fan of this approach, I think it's sly.

That is like inviting people to a party using Facebook and the overwhelming majority clicks YES and then never shows up to the party.

This way actually is much more tangible to understand.
 
Something tells me this thread should be bookmarked to reference some of these responses at some yet undetermined point in the future...
 
Well it's possible.

We got TLG, FF7 Remake, Shenmue 3 and Nier 2. Fuck might as well help develop Vagrant Story 3 and a Chrono Trigger sequel while you're at it Sony. Oh and a proper Suikoden for next-gen, and maybe a new PowerStone or Tobal No.2.
Change Trigger to Cross and I'm there. But I'll take both. But most importantly, just give me LOD reboot. #bringDartback
 
Well it's possible.

We got TLG, FF7 Remake, Shenmue 3 and Nier 2. Fuck might as well help develop Vagrant Story 3 and a Chrono Trigger sequel while you're at it Sony. Oh and a proper Suikoden for next-gen, and maybe a new PowerStone or Tobal No.2.

It's as if SCEI decided to put their entire annual budget into a card pulled out of a hat, and they got "Long-Requested Sequels and Remakes".

Not that that anyone's complaining, obviously.
 
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