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magnetic · Nov 25, 2016

sixteen-bit said:
The battle cry of Monster Hunter apologists.

There's nothing to apologize for with Monster Hunter. It's filled to the brim with mechanics and concepts that are very intimidating at first but rewarding in a way very few games can achieve.

The first few gathering quests in the game take maybe two hours, max. After that it's just monster after monster.

The games could definitely use more in depth tutorials, that's for sure - but the effort you have to put into the games comes purely from learning all the mechanics, not from some sort of linear progression keeping you from the "good stuff".

In the last two games, you can even directly jump into the training mode and just learn about the battle mechanics alone.

Neoleo2143 · Nov 25, 2016

sixteen-bit said:
The battle cry of Monster Hunter apologists.

I'd argue the opposite, Monster Hunter throws a metric ton of things at you if you're a beginner. It's quite overwhelming and the slower start that veterans can easily burn through is generally a decent design decision because it acclimates the player to the weighty nature of combat before throwing them to the wolves.

Weltall Zero · Nov 25, 2016

Scrooge McDuck said:
How the heck does Final Fantasy XIII qualifies as "nothing happens at the start"? It starts with a train hijack and deaths, followed by manhunts with the party members punching and pointing guns at each other every other chapters.

If anything it demonstrates how the quiet build-ups are important to make the player care about the characters and the world surrounding them, else you'd just get strings of dramatic moments that pays little.

Regardless, you'd find that some people playing videogames care more about plot than gameplay, and the OP is specifically talking about them. "The story is slow" is still a criticism that happens regardless of a game's gameplay.

But even for people who care a lot about plot, it rarely destroys their enjoyment of the game, if they are having fun with the gameplay. Another matter entirely is if the plot is actively bad.

Hell, your very first point confirms what I just said. People dislike FFXIII because it's gameplay is dull (supposedly) until the several dozen hours mark. Well, people dislike it for very many reasons, but the "nothing happens", I believe, refers to that.

It feels to me that, while you're right in that some games exist where the common complaint is that the plot moves very slowly until late in the game, even plot fans don't usually dismiss the entire game just because of that, if the game is otherwise solid. Do you have in mind any such game (again, outside plot-only games like visual novels)?

VincentMatts · Nov 25, 2016

sanstesy said:
Which game takes 20 hours to get going?

How does someone even get through 20 un-interesting hours?

Kataploom · Nov 25, 2016

Isn't The Witcher one of those games? I've tried to get into it but it just doesn't click with me, I'm right before fighting the beast in Wizima after saving the witch from the crowd and don't find any motivation to continue so I left it... The art style doesn't help neither, looks boring with that gray-ish palette

RedSwirl · Nov 25, 2016

sixteen-bit said:
The battle cry of Monster Hunter apologists.

This. When I tried Monster Hunter Tri it was like six hours before I actually hunted a monster.

Gen X · Nov 25, 2016

The main problem is a majority of the complaints come from people that have the cash to buy games regularly. If we were kids again getting one game every few months from our parents we'd be happy with a game that lasts 30hrs or more at least, but now we want to be entertained quickly before we miss the boat on the next game.

Now I have a family I have limited time so I have to choose wisely. Eg, I'm still chipping away at Alien Isolation, just finished all the dlc in Driveclub, both games that I bought in October 2014 (25 months ago). Now and then I buy a new game about once every three months. I've bought two games since Uncharted 4 in May this year (or was it June?) and I've still not finished it, then it was Witcher 3 in Aug and Deus Ex last weekend. If they last me 30+ and see me through the next year then I'll be happy.

Yes, I'm the minority.

Scrooge McDuck · Dec 5, 2016

Weltall Zero said:
But even for people who care a lot about plot, it rarely destroys their enjoyment of the game, if they are having fun with the gameplay. Another matter entirely is if the plot is actively bad.

Hell, your very first point confirms what I just said. People dislike FFXIII because it's gameplay is dull (supposedly) until the several dozen hours mark. Well, people dislike it for very many reasons, but the "nothing happens", I believe, refers to that.

It feels to me that, while you're right in that some games exist where the common complaint is that the plot moves very slowly until late in the game, even plot fans don't usually dismiss the entire game just because of that, if the game is otherwise solid. Do you have in mind any such game (again, outside plot-only games like visual novels)?

"I quit the game because nothing exciting happens in the story" is a sentiment I occasionally read for Suikoden V and Trails in the Sky, at least. I'm not saying whether their ultra long introductions to the world are warranted in those two games or not, mind.

I get that people dislike Final Fantasy XIII for many things; monotone battles among many. However, the OP is specifically talking about how slow story build-ups. This is the exact opposite of what FF13 does and I argue that the game is poorer precisely because it doesn't have these segments where "nothing happens".

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