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Detective · May 26, 2017

TheLionsDen said:
Anything above $399 then Microsoft would really be pushing it.

Anyone think Microsoft will have any decent trade-in deals for fat Xbox1?

They are not pushing anything, can't afford it? Buy the S.

They have said it million times, Its premium and targeting some group.

Again, not everyone can buy GTX1080 or whatever. They have a low entry model for those who can't afford the more expensive one.

Head.spawn · May 26, 2017

How the hell are there no leaks yet?

They even had their practice e3 set run already... did they pile into a fucking isolation chamber and go over it in there?

Somewhere somebody saw something... spill it nerd.

Rumblebones · May 26, 2017

Fuck leaks and fuck leakers.

Septic360 · May 26, 2017

Head.spawn said:
How the hell are there no leaks yet?

They even had their practice e3 set run already... did they pile into a fucking isolation chamber and go over it in there?

Somewhere somebody saw something... spill it nerd.

NOOO!

MS need to remain tight lipped ffs.

E3 is a glorious day. Lets not waste time

hanspampel · May 26, 2017

AlStrong said:
I'd be surprised if the 4Pro chip was 350mm^2 (to fit your +3%).

roughly 342 or 343 if i remeber correctly.
I can search for the post, or post a picture and you can measure by yourself.

The small SOC is the whole reason, im #399.
They went for higher clockspeeds instead of a bigger chip with more CUs

Bsigg12 · May 26, 2017

Rumblebones said:
Fuck leaks and fuck leakers.

👍

I like the surprises!

Finaj · May 26, 2017

Head.spawn said:
How the hell are there no leaks yet?

They even had their practice e3 set run already... did they pile into a fucking isolation chamber and go over it in there?

Somewhere somebody saw something... spill it nerd.

Well, Project Scorpio was developed by the Surface team and as far as I can tell, they work in a literal bunker. While other stuff may leak, the Scorpio is pretty much locked down.

Raide · May 26, 2017

Plug the leaks! I want surprises/shocks/annoyances live! Part of the E3 fun!

cakely · May 26, 2017

gamz said:
Anyone expecting 399 is nutso.

gamz said:
You can assume whatever price you want.

Ok.

Ushay · May 26, 2017

Head.spawn said:
How the hell are there no leaks yet?

They even had their practice e3 set run already... did they pile into a fucking isolation chamber and go over it in there?

Somewhere somebody saw something... spill it nerd.

LMAO, the hype is getting real. I truly do not know what to expect (games wise).

2 weeks to go!

Xamdou · May 26, 2017

No leaks until E3? Megatons in bound!

pitchfork · May 26, 2017

Well, the specs are all out there

Now we wait for the price and design

Head.spawn · May 26, 2017

I think we can all agree e3 always takes too long to get here.

I need a two week coma at this point.

Septic360 said:
NOOO!

MS need to remain tight lipped ffs.

E3 is a glorious day. Lets not waste time

Finaj said:
Well, Project Scorpio was developed by the Surface team and as far as I can tell, they work in a literal bunker. While other stuff may leak, the Scorpio is pretty much locked down.

As long as they're aware it's killing me. Hope they're okay with that. lol

Klocker · May 26, 2017

Lady Gaia said:
Targeting higher clock speeds with the same design and process will invariably reduce yields. How much of an impact that will have on production costs is harder to estimate but it's a factor. So the SoC is more expensive to produce, RAM will be 50% more expensive, the optical drive is modestly more expensive. The power supply and cooling solution are likely to be more expensive, too, and I'm expecting the industrial design to be attention grabbing with some associated cost.

$399 would be an aggressive price point.

Logic and reason. Nice.

Detective said:
They are not pushing anything, can't afford it? Buy the S.

They have said it million times, Its premium and targeting some group.

Again, not everyone can buy GTX1080 or whatever. They have a low entry model for those who can't afford the more expensive one.

Which is why I am expecting $449-$499

Also, If they offer a Trade in an old One for $100 puts you at $399 net... Not bad.

jelly · May 26, 2017

pitchfork said:
Well, the specs are all out there

Now we wait for the price and design

I can't see it not looking more or less like the dev kit minus the LED panel and other extra bits. The basic design looks solid and in line with what a premium version of the S would be like.

Just make it black.

LukasTaves · May 26, 2017

Rolf NB said:
Assuming Sony stays on old process nodes while MS uses new ones, of course.
Assuming Sony not only stays on old process nodes, but doesn't even benefit from the maturing of said old process nodes.

No, the list you quoted was pretty spot on.

Both use the same node.

The Scorpio apu is practically the same as the pro one, probably use the same base, but with Ms customizations and Co processors adding a bit of the size.

PSGames · May 26, 2017

I'm hoping they use a slice of the additional CPU grunt to allow for TV DVR recording. A promised feature that has yet to materialize.

AlStrong · May 26, 2017

hanspampel said:
roughly 342 or 343 if i remeber correctly.
I can search for the post, or post a picture and you can measure by yourself.

Based on the iFixit shot of the motherboard, I'm getting approximately 310-315mm^2 (using the 7.5 x 11 mm DDR3 chip as reference).

edit: typo

310-325

Shpeshal Nick · May 26, 2017

DenogginizerOS said:
I firmly believe it will $399 with a 1TB drive.

This is most likely, but I firmly believe there's a very outside chance of a 500GB (or even 1TB) $349 model.

Orca · May 26, 2017

Raide said:
I think that will probably be the retailers job but I could be wrong. Would love to hang in my Xbox One to MS and they transfer all my stuff over haha.

Just move everything to an external HDD and plug it into the new unit.

Rumblebones · May 27, 2017

Bsigg12 said:
👍

I like the surprises!

👊🏾 Amen. I hate the fact leakers rob developers from the experience of unveiling the fruits of their labour. I don't need or want leaks. I can tolerate rumours; hell, I'll even go as far as to say I like them, but I don't like leaks, I hate them and I think the people responsible for them are selfish and petty.

TLZ · May 27, 2017

Rumblebones said:
👊🏾 Amen. I hate the fact leakers rob developers from the experience of unveiling the fruits of their labour. I don't need or want leaks. I can tolerate rumours; hell, I'll even go as far as to say I like them, but I don't like leaks, I hate them and I think the people responsible for them are selfish and petty.

Most of them are petty glory hunters and attention seekers.

hanspampel · May 27, 2017

AlStrong said:
Based on the iFixit shot of the motherboard, I'm getting approximately 310-315mm^2 (using the 7.5 x 11 mm DDR3 chip as reference).

This was the post: http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=233472465
Seems like i have to measure myself. You can't trust anyone.

Here is the original Ps4 SOC in 18*19mm =342mm²

Here is the Ps4 Pro SOC. What are your lenght and hight mm? Please use the SATA Port as reference point

This is the Scorpio SOC in 360mm² as comparison

TheLionsDen · May 27, 2017

Can confirm I'll be having the day off to watch the event.

Can't wait.

op_ivy · May 27, 2017

Collingwood said:
This is most likely, but I firmly believe there's a very outside chance of a 500GB (or even 1TB) $349 model.

Yeah, I just cant see a 4k ready system, with actual 4k content, launching with only a 500gb hdd

AlStrong · May 27, 2017

hanspampel said:
Here is the original Ps4 SOC in 18*19mm =342mm²

Chipworks' measurement of the PS4 chip is 348mm^2. I'm not sure where you're pulling the 342 from.

Please use the SATA Port as reference point

I don't know what reference size this is supposed to be.

edit: make sure you're not counting the epoxy resin at the edges as well, makes it trickier given the low resolution. I've used 95 x 63 pixels for the chip. Unfortunately, the right side of the chip is potentially obscured.

edit2:

The Cypress CYUSB3312 chip there appears to be QFN (exposed leads on the 4 edges, whereas BGA would not have those), which is 10 mm x 10 mm @ 44 x 44 pixels, which leads me back to the results I got with using the DDR3 chip as a reference.

95 x 63 pixels -> ~310mm^2
100 x 63 pixels -> ~325mm^2 (if the chip extends into that red part a few more pixels)

CrimsonEclipse · May 27, 2017

op_ivy said:
Yeah, I just cant see a 4k ready system, with actual 4k content, launching with only a 500gb hdd

Hmmm, didn't think about that but its possible they can launch with a 500GB model to keep prices down.

Welfare · May 27, 2017

The minimum is going to be 1TB. They already said this back in DF reveal. 500GB is already too low nowadays but XB1S can get away with it because of it being the cheapest model.

res1nbawlz · May 27, 2017

Can't believe people are thinking this is going to be below 499. The original Xbox was 499. The PS4 pro was 400. Xbox already stated this console was for a premium console. Essentially stating if your not a hardcore gamer you probably won't buy it. I expect a 500+ price and I'll be buying day zero regardless! No way this is 399 or below lol.

SenjutsuSage · May 27, 2017

jelly said:
I can't see it not looking more or less like the dev kit minus the LED panel and other extra bits. The basic design looks solid and in line with what a premium version of the S would be like.

Just make it black.

Don't think it's going to look anything like the dev kit. That's probably why Microsoft had no problems showing us the dev kit.

nekkid · May 27, 2017

Collingwood said:
This is most likely, but I firmly believe there's a very outside chance of a 500GB (or even 1TB) $349 model.

I doubt that change in HDD size would result in a $50 difference.

Chobel · May 27, 2017

With $399 1TB SKU, MS will be barely making profit on hardware, if they're making any at all.

A $349 500GB SKU to "keep prices down" is one sure way to lose at least $20 in each unit sold, so I don't think this supposedly cheaper 500GB SKU is gonna happen, at least not this year.

mrklaw · May 27, 2017

Lady Gaia said:
Targeting higher clock speeds with the same design and process will invariably reduce yields. How much of an impact that will have on production costs is harder to estimate but it's a factor. So the SoC is more expensive to produce, RAM will be 50% more expensive, the optical drive is modestly more expensive. The power supply and cooling solution are likely to be more expensive, too, and I'm expecting the industrial design to be attention grabbing with some associated cost.

$399 would be an aggressive price point.

The APU will be more expensive than the PS Pro APU now, but we don't know it would be significantly more expensive than the PS Pro when it launched last year (which would inform a potential $399 price). Increases in production maturity may offset the lower yields from needing to work at a higher clock speed.

That would also mean the pro APU would cost Sony less which may allow them room to cut prices in response (no reason to now as there isn't competition at that performance level)

plip.plop · May 27, 2017

I hope Scorpio will load games from disc on par or faster than the PS4pro. That would be a much-needed improvement.

EvB · May 27, 2017

Chobel said:
With $399 1TB SKU, MS will be barely making profit on hardware, if they're making any at all.

A $349 500GB SKU to "keep prices down" is one sure way to lose at least $20 in each unit sold, so I don't think this supposedly cheaper 500GB SKU is gonna happen, at least not this year.

500gb is beyond unsuitable. 1TB needs to be a cheap option

rokkerkory · May 27, 2017

Chobel said:
With $399 1TB SKU, MS will be barely making profit on hardware, if they're making any at all.

A $349 500GB SKU to "keep prices down" is one sure way to lose at least $20 in each unit sold, so I don't think this supposedly cheaper 500GB SKU is gonna happen, at least not this year.

MS already said lowest sku is 1TB

jroc74 · May 27, 2017

plip.plop said:
I hope Scorpio will load games from disc on par or faster than the PS4pro. That would be a much-needed improvement.

And install.

After having both a PS3 and 360, I greatly appreciate it this gen. And hope MS changes the way they do it.

Ushay · May 27, 2017

SenjutsuSage said:
Don't think it's going to look anything like the dev kit. That's probably why Microsoft had no problems showing us the dev kit.

I agree, the final unit will look quite different.

OT - What are the odds of a discless retail unit?

Yoday · May 27, 2017

Ushay said:
I agree, the final unit will look quite different.

OT - What are the odds of a discless retail unit?

Zero. Consoles aren't going to have a discless version for a very long time. I wouldn't expect it until the tail end of next generation. I still don't know why people even want a discless. It's costs ~$20 to put in, so you aren't going to see a discless unit magically cost $50-$100 less.They would have a version of a console on the market that has a tiny target audience for the benefit of a $20-$30 price drop. That just doesn't make sense.

nekkid · May 27, 2017

Ushay said:
I agree, the final unit will look quite different.

OT - What are the odds of a discless retail unit?

I'm pretty sure the Digital Foundry exposé confirmed it has a UHD BR drive.

MosquitoSmasher · May 27, 2017

If shops have a trade in program I hope they still accept the fat Xbox One as well. It's the only one I have.

Walshicus · May 27, 2017

Yoday said:
Zero. Consoles aren't going to have a discless version for a very long time. I wouldn't expect it until the tail end of next generation. I still don't know why people even want a discless. It's costs ~$20 to put in, so you aren't going to see a discless unit magically cost $50-$100 less.They would have a version of a console on the market that has a tiny target audience for the benefit of a $20-$30 price drop. That just doesn't make sense.

Discless surely had benefits beyond that cost of materials. Should reduce heating etc. too?

scoobs · May 27, 2017

Walshicus said:
Discless surely had benefits beyond that cost of materials. Should reduce heating etc. too?

Ehhhh marginally? The real gain here would be freeing up space inside the box.

ChubbleDucks · May 27, 2017

My 6yr old has my 360 and was going to give him my x1 when Scorpio released.
Now decided to get 2 Scorpios and let him have a new gift instead of my hand me downs.

Hopefully be a nice birthday present.

TLZ · May 27, 2017

ChubbleDucks said:
My 6yr old has my 360 and was going to give him my x1 when Scorpio released.
Now decided to get 2 Scorpios and let him have a new gift instead of my hand me downs.

Hopefully be a nice birthday present.

That's awesome.........

Can I be your kid?

Hip Hop · May 27, 2017

What color do you guys think Scorpio will be officially? Black or White? Something else...

Raide · May 27, 2017

Hip Hop said:
What color do you guys think Scorpio will be officially? Black or White? Something else...

Hrmmmm...white so they differentiate it from the Xbox One. Would love to see red!

AmyS · May 27, 2017

Yoday said:
Zero. Consoles aren't going to have a discless version for a very long time. I wouldn't expect it until the tail end of next generation. I still don't know why people even want a discless. It's costs ~$20 to put in, so you aren't going to see a discless unit magically cost $50-$100 less.They would have a version of a console on the market that has a tiny target audience for the benefit of a $20-$30 price drop. That just doesn't make sense.

Agreed. I don't expect discs to go away for another 10 to 15 years. maybe around 2030.

nekkid · May 27, 2017

AmyS said:
Agreed. I don't expect discs to go away for another 10 to 15 years. maybe around 2030.

What about no-disc options, though? That'll be much sooner.

Doffen · May 27, 2017

Hip Hop said:
What color do you guys think Scorpio will be officially? Black or White? Something else...

Black.

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