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Nintendo's stance on Wii storage: only "geeks and otaku" want that addressed
- Thread starter Visualante
- Start date
Mithos
Member
Jirotrom said:
And IMO move the accounts for VC/Wiiware content to SERVERSIDE.
So that IF my Wii breaks down after warranty is out I can just go in to a store buy a new Wii, go home and redownload all content on the new Wii.
DrGAKMAN said:
The problem with this would be.... All things you can NOT copy/delete, aka saves for games that have Wi-Fi access (Mario-Kart/Smash Bros saves).
Eventually those saves will take up all blocks, how to use #2 way of working then?
yeah I'm quite fearful if my wii breaks down. Nintendo Australia do not have the customer service that I hear about on this board that Nintendo America has, so I'm really worried. Means I won't be upgrading if they release a wiiDVD either, which normally I would do in a heartbeat.Mithos said:
But yes, I've already had to move loads of games to my SD card, and I wouldn't say I'm that heavy a VC gamer. I had to move a few just to get the latest channel which was really really annoying.
I fiully agree... I would buy MANY more VC games if this issue was solved.Mithos said:
Strikers for example has WiFi access and is NOT copy-protected. Still, you should be able to copy them even if you can't restore them on another console (still bad, but less problematic).Mithos said:
As for the original question, this is NoE... I don't think the shortages are so bad that it's a big problem in Europe (is it a problem in UK ?). So yes, I don't think the issue has really to be adressed.
Prime crotch
Banned
Wait, they don't do that?! What kind of service is Nintendo running here? That's just dumb, seriously it makes no sense.Mithos said:
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Prime crotch said:
Whether it is Sony, Microsoft, Apple, or in this case Nintendo... often the market leader having an incredibly hot product on its hands, that seems to sell no matter what, becomes patronizing and gives you only what they believe you should have as the simply "know best".
If they had to win users over you bet that the internal flash storage would have been upgradable (even with an official and overpriced Nintendo item, but they would have been behaving themselves this way).
Nintendo's going to have something for Wii's storage problem, after all it means more profit to them - they sold ~$75 million in downloads last fiscal year, but it will only come when they feel they've done the best they can to minimise piracy.
Obviously they can't and won't be able to stop it, piracy always finds a way, it's whether they can make it awkward enough so the least amount of people bother with it, this is what they'll be working on and what's taking the time.
Oh, and really, it's pointless listening to anyone other than Iwata, Miyamoto or other NCL exces for what Nintendo's actually doing, and even then things can change. Everybody else is just part of a glorified box shifting and marketing operation at NCL's bidding.
Obviously they can't and won't be able to stop it, piracy always finds a way, it's whether they can make it awkward enough so the least amount of people bother with it, this is what they'll be working on and what's taking the time.
Oh, and really, it's pointless listening to anyone other than Iwata, Miyamoto or other NCL exces for what Nintendo's actually doing, and even then things can change. Everybody else is just part of a glorified box shifting and marketing operation at NCL's bidding.
fortified_concept
Banned
Haunted One said:
My self-sarcarm is always in check and I appreciate some constructive criticism from friends. What I do not appreciate is a fucking corporation that I give my money to talking down on me just because I asked them to add features. You can bet your ass that unlike certain loyalists in here if Sony or MS ever did that I'd be one the first amongst many to call them out.
Mithos said:
There's homebrew out that allows you to copy and delete those unmovable saves. Just use that. Also you can now use USB hard drives and devices with homebrew, so perhaps some method to run VC and Wiiware games from USB will be found. Since Nintendo is obviously not doing anything we need to rely on the homebrew scene.
Prime crotch
Banned
But we're talking about the bare basics of a online subscription based program, it's like releasing an MMO with the character data on the client side.Panajev2001a said:
radioheadrule83
Banned
Some records must be stored server side... when you log in to Nintendo Europes site you can see which VC games you've downloaded. It baffles me that the shop doesnt seem to use those records though. I think it will in future.
Anasui Kishibe
Banned
blu said:
ohhh, I wouldn't count on that :lol
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Prime crotch said:
People keep buying their systems along with their 1st party games ? It means they can get away with it and avoid wasting precious profit margins on something to make their product seem a more attractive offer since it cannot seem to stay on the shelves...
I'd like them too to try a bit harder ALONGSIDE making lots of profits, but it does not seem to be the case...
Mr_Furious
Member
What?Mariah Carey said:
:lol You got me there. Maybe I'm a little nerdy but I don't look it and I sure as hell don't fit the stereotype of your typical geek/otaku.dead souls said:
Classic_Gs
Member
Sounds about right. They've ditched us so now we ditch them!Linkzg said:
SonicMegaDrive
Member
HUELEN10 said:
lol
A co-worker who hasn't owned a console since the SNES bought a Wii this weekend. Today he asked me how big the storage was in the Wii and I told him 512MB. When he heard that he commented on how small that was and that it looked like he wouldn't be buying any downloadable games for the Wii. I told him that VC games were small so he could get some of his favourites from back in the day but he told me that he didn't want to fill up the Wii or else he couldn't save games. Good job Nintendo. :lol
Version 3.0
Member
Fuzzy said:
I wouldn't be surprised to hear a sales clerk tell people something like that. They're very good at picking up the overblown nitpicky points, rumors, or stereotypes about consoles and using them to give customers information overload.
I also wouldn't be surprised to hear a clerk tell a customer that Nintendo has a HDD coming soon.
Nintendo has a plethora of options in regards to storage space. Some of which could generate a lot of additional revenue for Nintendo.
So despite the poor choice of wording on the part of this rep (which I hope he realizes only furthers the generalization that Nintendo is focused on casual gamers...this is something that 3rd parties will note), I can see the frustration on the part of Nintendo and Wii fans (and perhaps developers as well!).
Again, with the wide variety of options Nintendo has, from my perspective the solution has to cover some bases, and take into account some things...
-most likely has to be a USB format.
-Nintendo has the luxury of going with a 3.5 inch disk drive, far more economical than the 2.5 inch drives you see in the PS3 and 360. $120 for 1/2 a Terabyte is feasible, but likely overkill for the needs of Wii owners.
-flash memory is faster than a disk based drive, and despite being more expensive for gigabyte, you could have an economically priced 8Gb drive, which is more than enough space for Wii owners.
-flash memory means it does not require any other power source. External HDDs require a power outlet, and thus are a bad idea.
-the VC game attach ratio seems very poor on the Wii. People may be uncomfortable buying these games over the internet. Why not include a handful of VC titles, preloaded onto an 8Gb memory solution, to encourage more VC sales?
-memory solution should include a video introducing gamers to the WiiWare platform.
-for security purposes, make it proprietary, and disallow transfers from this device to anything else and vice versa.
So despite the poor choice of wording on the part of this rep (which I hope he realizes only furthers the generalization that Nintendo is focused on casual gamers...this is something that 3rd parties will note), I can see the frustration on the part of Nintendo and Wii fans (and perhaps developers as well!).
Again, with the wide variety of options Nintendo has, from my perspective the solution has to cover some bases, and take into account some things...
-most likely has to be a USB format.
-Nintendo has the luxury of going with a 3.5 inch disk drive, far more economical than the 2.5 inch drives you see in the PS3 and 360. $120 for 1/2 a Terabyte is feasible, but likely overkill for the needs of Wii owners.
-flash memory is faster than a disk based drive, and despite being more expensive for gigabyte, you could have an economically priced 8Gb drive, which is more than enough space for Wii owners.
-flash memory means it does not require any other power source. External HDDs require a power outlet, and thus are a bad idea.
-the VC game attach ratio seems very poor on the Wii. People may be uncomfortable buying these games over the internet. Why not include a handful of VC titles, preloaded onto an 8Gb memory solution, to encourage more VC sales?
-memory solution should include a video introducing gamers to the WiiWare platform.
-for security purposes, make it proprietary, and disallow transfers from this device to anything else and vice versa.
To those that say a HDD or flash drive again I say, if Nintendo isn't going to allow it on SD, what makes you think they would through USB?
Not saying that they won't, but it doesn't make much sense to me. Yeah they could over-price a usb flash drive knowing that us hardcore nerds/otaku's would buy it...BUT...what about keeping the system simple & secure (which seems to be the reason they limited the Channels to a low # and why they won't allow us to execute Channels from an external source)???
Not saying that they won't, but it doesn't make much sense to me. Yeah they could over-price a usb flash drive knowing that us hardcore nerds/otaku's would buy it...BUT...what about keeping the system simple & secure (which seems to be the reason they limited the Channels to a low # and why they won't allow us to execute Channels from an external source)???
Nexus Zero
Member
How many Wii owners are there? What percentage of Wii owners are online? What is the total sales value of VC/Ware? What is the average number of blocks per dollar? How much has each online Wii spent on average? How many blocks has each Wii owner got left? If it's less than half that's pretty bad.
......
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2 Minutes Turkish
Banned
Honestly, there's two important points here that prove to me Nintendo hasn't changed their stripes: (those of you who can remember back far enough will know what I'm talking about)
1) Flash memory costs next to nothing. ESPECIALLY in the quantities Nintendo would have required. It would have cost them next to zero to build at least 2GB of flash memory in this thing and STILL make massive profit.
2) Even without enough flash memory this whole problem could realistically be solved with a firmware update that allows us to run software/channels off of an SD card.
Number 2) highlights Nintendo's true lack of 80s attitude change more than anything else could.
1) Flash memory costs next to nothing. ESPECIALLY in the quantities Nintendo would have required. It would have cost them next to zero to build at least 2GB of flash memory in this thing and STILL make massive profit.
2) Even without enough flash memory this whole problem could realistically be solved with a firmware update that allows us to run software/channels off of an SD card.
Number 2) highlights Nintendo's true lack of 80s attitude change more than anything else could.
ThatObviousUser
ὠαἴÏÏιÏÏÎ¿Ï Ïαá¿Ï εἶ
DrGAKMAN said:
USB keyboard drivers being on the Wii already possibly?
Visualante
Member
What the hell is wrong with a USB pen drive? It's always SD this, SD that. The card reader is slow.
Cosmonaut X
Member
Andrex said:
...and? Support for USB keyboards - or microphones for that matter - doesn't really suggest Nintendo are likely to permit launching of Channels from an external source, be it SD card, USB flash drive or USB hard disc.
V
Vilix
Unconfirmed Member
Mithos said:
Actually, Nintendo already does this. Your Wii is married to your account on Nintendo.com.
Cosmonaut X
Member
HUELEN10 said:
I suspect that a Nintendo branded USB pendrive is the most likely of the options on hand.
SD cards are slow and potentially less secure, external hard drives are more expensive and power hungry and a new SKU with a larger flash memory runs counter to what Nintendo are aiming for with the system (and since transferring your VC games etc. off the system isn't possible, it doesn't solve anything for existing owners).
A Wii-themed, proprietary 8GB pendrive could probably retail for under £40 and would offer the kind of storage space to make regular VC/WiiWare purchases and DLC viable and convenient.
jts
...hate me...
Iwata:
"Statistically speaking, it is true that there are a small number of customers who feel that the flash memory is too small, while many others find that they have plenty of memory. However, because this small number of people are none other than the most avid players, we know we have to review the best possible solution to eliminate their inconvenience."
Random NoE dude:
"Lol geeks and otaku."
Which one makes decisions at Nintendo? YOU DECIDE.
"Statistically speaking, it is true that there are a small number of customers who feel that the flash memory is too small, while many others find that they have plenty of memory. However, because this small number of people are none other than the most avid players, we know we have to review the best possible solution to eliminate their inconvenience."
Random NoE dude:
"Lol geeks and otaku."
Which one makes decisions at Nintendo? YOU DECIDE.
DrGAKMAN said:
The Wii only supports up to 2Gb SD...according to Wikipedia (if you have contrary evidence please share). And Flash memory via USB is extremely fast.
mio said:
Good point!
But I think it has to be realized at Nintendo that it's not only current consumers who want to see a solution, it's developers as well. Storage space is providing a hurdle for WiiWare sales. A solution that gives ample storage space, means that even larger WiiWare games can come out, if need be.
The most important aspect of the extra storage is. Would it be fast enough to bother?
Does anyone have real info on what USB type the Wii uses? Or what speed the SD slot transfers at? (Going by the time it took me 30+ minutes to transfer Sin and Punishment, it can't be very fast)
Edit:
As far as I know, there are people who have successfully used 8gB SD Cards on the Wii, using the front slot.
I'll try to find more info about it
Does anyone have real info on what USB type the Wii uses? Or what speed the SD slot transfers at? (Going by the time it took me 30+ minutes to transfer Sin and Punishment, it can't be very fast)
Edit:
As far as I know, there are people who have successfully used 8gB SD Cards on the Wii, using the front slot.
I'll try to find more info about it
Cosmonaut X
Member
Easy_D said:
USB 2.0, AFAIK.
The issue with the SD speeds seems to be - and I'm just relaying what I've read elsewhere, so don't shoot me down if I'm incorrect - that files aren't just copied, they're encrypted/decrypted as well and it's that process that slows the transfer down.
Easy_D said:
Sin & Punnishment took me:
-6 minutes to download
-3 minutes to copy to SD (a process you only have to do once, unless you erase it from the card)
-1 minute to move back
This is using the 2GB Wii branded SD card, if it's taking you 30 minutes to do it maybe your card is bad?
Cosmonaut X said:
You're right, encrypting is why it must takes longer to copy to SD than to copy back. I think *this* is more the problem rather than Nintendo just being assholes on purpose...they basically want to prevent Channels from being run externally. This is why I question why Nintendo would use USB, when they're not even willing to use the already available SD?
HUELEN10 said:
Explain a hardware key...if it's USB then it can plug into a PC right? Nintendo doesn't have a problem with moving or storing the files in external sources (wether SD or USB), but they (or the Wii itself) seems to have a problem with running Channels from an external source.
Explain this hardware key...is it something that would totally prevent this USB drive from being read by other USB devices? If so then yeah, maybe that's what they'll do rather than "openning up SD".
Cosmonaut X said:
This makes the most sense, except i don't understand how running a Channel from this drive would be more secure...what is meant by hardware key?
Okay I looked up hardware keys and traditionally it's a dongle that proprietarily runs (or allows the hardware that it's connected to run) software in order to keep it protected. But if Nintendo opens USB for this device, aren't they just inviting other companies to do the same (thus making it easier for hackers). I mean, explain it to me, would it really be secure and by what means, a hardware password to access data on the dongle drive, a synch button or a wireless signal that authenticates that it's a Nintendo branded dongle???
FightyF said:
Nintendo's firmware-wise it officially can only do 2GB SD at this point, but hackers have made it to where Wii can read up to 8GB SDHC cards as well as USB mass-storage devices. I would imagine Nintendo could do the same, but simply again don't want to "open up" SD or USB in such a way to allow Wii to run Channel's exteramlly.
The suggestion I'm hearing about a dongle flash drive makes the most sense and would be a good reason why Nintendo hasn't already "openned up" SD or USB already...but qould such a flash drive be secure enough for Nintendo's anal standerds?
If this is Nintendo's route I'm sure they're waiting for the proper time and software to release it with (Animal Crossing pre-installed maybe?) and it does make sense if SquareENIX & others (CAPCOM with Monster Hunter Tri) are looking into MMO's on Wii. This seems like Nintendo's route 'cos it'd be proprietary, maybe "safe" (this is the biggy I would think) and they'd have software that would require/support it (ie: WiiFit = more peripherals = more profit). It'd totally buy Animal Crossing + flash drive for $60 to $80 if it meant I could more easily store my WiiWare/VC titles as well as have MMO's possible. The only other issue is the UI filing system (which Nintendo has always expressed they want to keep simple), as far as I would guess the flash drive would have to be it's own Channel with a "sub menu" with unlimited Channel opennings (depending on the capacity) and would have to work that way though the Wii can't do sub menu's as it is.
Surely they would know anyway? Since they run the shop, they'd know what products each user has bought and thus the total number of blocks used.Vinci said:
Or would that information be considered private and thus something can't keep? I know there are some laws regarding this sort of thing, but I'm pretty damned fuzzy on them.
Oh, and with copying to SD card, I had the same issue with sin and punishment, but I did wonder - is it possible that this is due to the wii first setting up some copy protection on the card itself, then copying the game over? Or does the game already have the copy protection allowing it to run on one wii only?
Mithos said:
Prime crotch said:
Dunno if this has been addressed yet, but if you have one of those My Nintendo accounts where you input codes found in first party games and have them registered, this shouldn't be a problem. If your Wii is synced with your My Nintendo account, all VC games you buy automatically get registered on your account. So when you do sell your busted Wii and buy a new one, inform them of the games you have on your My Nintendo account, and you should be able to redownload them.
Well that is according to guys I know who has an account and a Wii, tho their machine haven't broken down yet; but that's the theory.
Tho, this is still far more retarded than what everyone else is doing.
HUELEN10
Member
Those are few and far between, however I do know of a lot of people in the 50+ club including myself.bigswords said:I think it should be lower, but someone on gaf bought the WHOLE collection of VC games. Might have spiked it up
Space pisses me off. Lack of channels pisses me off more.
AlphaTwo00
Member
It's not exactly fair to include sales of Wiis that a)never connect online, or b)is modified for other purposes.Jiggy37 said:
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