Support NeoGAF

BizzyBum · Dec 17, 2017

caffeware said:
Yep.

LOL! I mean, was it really THAT bad?

Cool visuals, Del Toro's character, showing some small backstory on how TFO and even the Rebels acquire their war gear and how these people live like nothing is wrong, and it was a cool sequence and satisfying seeing them race through and destroy the entire casino in the process. It was also relatively short and didn't really overstay its welcome, IMO.

ShodanMAN · Dec 17, 2017

I must say even though I'm relatively dissapointed with TLJ, the movie isn't completely void of interesting ideas.

I've always been interested in the concept of questioning the whole Sith vs Jedi dynamic and its possible negative effects on the universe through the years. Effectively the Sith and the Jedi are two opposing philosophies of how to use ''the force''. They could also be seen as two extremist groups, one on each side of the spectrum. It seems that TLJ is touching on the idea (through Ben Solo) that subscribing to neither is an option. This idea isn't foreign to the Star Wars expanded universe. Grey Jedi's believed that to truly have balance of the force you needed to learn all aspects of it, both light and dark. In other words they could be described as centrists. I can't help feel this is where Johnson might be going in this movie, especially with Ray going down that dark hole during her training, something Luke wasn't happy about in the slightest, unsurprisingly because he himself has been indoctrinated by the opposing side.

Fnord · Dec 17, 2017

They immediately pulled me out of the movie before I even had a chance to settle into it with that cringe worthy answering machine gag. That was just awful.

The biggest two issues I have with this film, however, are that characters routinely make really stupid decisions for no good reason and basically the main thrust of the story should have lasted all of thirty seconds.

An example of someone doing something stupid - Leia just standing there looking over the sands and waiting to see incoming ships before closing the blast door. Stupid. Just straight up stupid.

As for the main story mechanism... We spent what, an hour and a half with the remaining "rebel" "fleet" cruising just out of blaster range with no way out only to discover that there was a way out sitting right there that would took 30 seconds to execute. Ugh.

Also, the fight in Snoke's throne room was the worst lightsaber battle in the series. Even Yoda jumping around like a monkey was better than that. It was slow, plodding, and at every moment looked and felt choreographed. A good fight scene should never feel choreographed.

Nikana · Dec 17, 2017

ShodanMAN said:
I must say even though I'm relatively dissapointed with TLJ, the movie isn't completely void of interesting ideas.

I've always been interested in the concept of questioning the whole Sith vs Jedi dynamic and its possible negative effects on the universe through the years. Effectively the Sith and the Jedi are two opposing philosophies of how to use ''the force''. They could also be seen as two extremist groups, one on each side of the spectrum. It seems that TLJ is touching on the idea (through Ben Solo) that subscribing to neither is an option. This idea isn't foreign to the Star Wars expanded universe. Grey Jedi's believed that to truly have balance of the force you needed to learn all aspects of it, both light and dark. In other words they could be described as centrists. I can't help feel this is where Johnson might be going in this movie, especially with Ray going down that dark hole during her training, something Luke wasn't happy about in the slightest, unsurprisingly because he himself has been indoctrinated by the opposing side.

That's sort of the take away I got too but it's just written so poorly. As well as Leia scene where she chats death completely ignored rules set in the past.

There's good ideas but it's so poorly excuted and is so far from the focus of the movie.

Fnord · Dec 17, 2017

BizzyBum said:
Am I the only person who enjoyed the Casino subplot?

I would have had less of an issue with it if it hadn't played out like an open world RPG. They had a pretty strict schedule to prevent the destruction of the fleet. But that didn't deter them from going off on some short side quests.

Fnord · Dec 17, 2017

Also, Leia should have died when the bridge was blown up. Would have added some weight to basically everything that followed. Kylo couldn't pull the trigger, but by making just that decision, he still couldn't prevent her from dying. Could have done a lot with that. Instead we get angel Leia and any weight from that scene pulled right out.

ShodanMAN · Dec 17, 2017

Nikana said:
That's sort of the take away I got too but it's just written so poorly. As well as Leia scene where she chats death completely ignored rules set in the past.

There's good ideas but it's so poorly excuted and is so far from the focus of the movie.

I agree. It would have been more interesting if Snoke decided that Kylo needed more intensive training after his loss against Rey in TFA, finally allowing us to see how the Sith train. With Luke training Rey we would be able to see the differences and similarities between the two sides. Kylo and Rey talking to eachother during their respective training could lead them to the realization that neither side has all the answers.

kunonabi · Dec 17, 2017

ShodanMAN said:
I must say even though I'm relatively dissapointed with TLJ, the movie isn't completely void of interesting ideas.

I've always been interested in the concept of questioning the whole Sith vs Jedi dynamic and its possible negative effects on the universe through the years. Effectively the Sith and the Jedi are two opposing philosophies of how to use ''the force''. They could also be seen as two extremist groups, one on each side of the spectrum. It seems that TLJ is touching on the idea (through Ben Solo) that subscribing to neither is an option. This idea isn't foreign to the Star Wars expanded universe. Grey Jedi's believed that to truly have balance of the force you needed to learn all aspects of it, both light and dark. In other words they could be described as centrists. I can't help feel this is where Johnson might be going in this movie, especially with Ray going down that dark hole during her training, something Luke wasn't happy about in the slightest, unsurprisingly because he himself has been indoctrinated by the opposing side.

The thing is Luke was already the answer to the whole jedi/sith conflict. He was proof that emotion and attachments weren't inherently a path to the darkside but could be a source of a strength instead. Its why i find the grey jedi thing so silly.

davepoobond · Dec 17, 2017

I thought it was dog shit. The first 10 minutes of the movie was a sign of things to come. Luke throwing the lightsaber over his shoulder was a metaphor for this movie.

caffeware · Dec 18, 2017

BizzyBum said:
LOL! I mean, was it really THAT bad?

Cool visuals, Del Toro's character, showing some small backstory on how TFO and even the Rebels acquire their war gear and how these people live like nothing is wrong, and it was a cool sequence and satisfying seeing them race through and destroy the entire casino in the process. It was also relatively short and didn't really overstay its welcome, IMO.

The casino scene remind me of the prequels: Bright, colorful, filled with cgi creatures that make silly gestures.

Instead of that, they should had made something like the bar scene from the first movie: small, dark room filled with shady looking fellows.

Instead of the whole "horse race" business, have the heroes meet the rich hacker and have some witty interesting dialogue with him.

He refuses the deal because he's busy (or whatever reason). Instead, he recommends Benicio for the job. Which is funny considering the appearance of the latter.

Have some scene(s) to stablish Benicio's character. Maybe have him hack BB8, etc.

This way you avoid the whole "breaking from prison" deal which is so cliche and felt very rushed in the movie.

Of coarse, the problem is, how to you introduce the "broom kid" then? Some are speculating he may be the star of the new trilogy.

LegendofDragoonLives · Dec 18, 2017

Andodalf said:
Snoke and Reys parents not mattering at all was amazing. That would have been too typical, by subverting those things this movie won.

Was it too typical for Snoke to have a fucking backstory? That would have probably helped.

Movie did some very great things, but had several huge flaws that just left me confused due to how dumb it was. Suffice to say, I was really disappointed and was going into it expected a hell lot more.

7/10

Raynes · Dec 18, 2017

Fnord said:
Also, Leia should have died when the bridge was blown up. Would have added some weight to basically everything that followed. Kylo couldn't pull the trigger, but by making just that decision, he still couldn't prevent her from dying. Could have done a lot with that. Instead we get angel Leia and any weight from that scene pulled right out.

Superman Leia

TheChewyWaffles · Dec 18, 2017

Dcube said:
I watched this today. This film wasn't bad, definitely not prequel territory. It was decently made, but the story was kind of dragged out. I was so bored during the first half that by the big lightsaber battle I was ready for it to end..and then there's a whole other planet. I don't think it did anything exceptionally bad, but I can't recall anything memorable either, its just kind of there. I don't think I'll ever have the desire to see it again.

The Jedi Island just went on and on and on. And Rey just repeats the same crap to Luke over and over. Most of that island should have been on the cutting room floor. Make Luke train her but still teach her that the Jedi need to end (whatever the hell that means)....anything but have Rey following Luke all over the island ad nauseum.

TheChewyWaffles · Dec 18, 2017

davepoobond said:
I thought it was dog shit. The first 10 minutes of the movie was a sign of things to come. Luke throwing the lightsaber over his shoulder was a metaphor for this movie.

Yah, I would have been OK with a discouraged Luke, just not Harrison Ford-grumpy Luke. He says to Rey Go awayyyyyyy. Stfu Luke youre a Jedi master. Have some dignity.

Edit: why didnt the idiot resistance just warp right next to the planet they intended to hide on instead of 16 hour flight away? Huge plot hole.

Betty · Dec 18, 2017

TheChewyWaffles said:
Yah, I would have been OK with a discouraged Luke, just not Harrison Ford-grumpy Luke. He says to Rey Go awayyyyyyy. Stfu Luke youre a Jedi master. Have some dignity.

Edit: why didnt the idiot resistance just warp right next to the planet they intended to hide on instead of 16 hour flight away? Huge plot hole.

I think the idea was to get as close to Crait as possible then use the escape pods without the First Order noticing, but that was kinda ruined when Finn and Rose were captured and DJ gave the First Order the details of what the Rebels were up to.

Anyway, I think it's the best Star Wars movie by a good margin, looking forward to the future of the series.

davepoobond · Dec 18, 2017

that plan is stupid as hell, like the First Order is going to look at the nearest planet and be like "they went there"

why didnt they just use the light speed ship missile at the beginning?

Shouta · Dec 18, 2017

TheChewyWaffles said:
Yah, I would have been OK with a discouraged Luke, just not Harrison Ford-grumpy Luke. He says to Rey Go awayyyyyyy. Stfu Luke youre a Jedi master. Have some dignity.

Edit: why didnt the idiot resistance just warp right next to the planet they intended to hide on instead of 16 hour flight away? Huge plot hole.

They couldn't. Their warp was being tracked so if they had jumped to near the planet, it would be obvious they were sending escape ships. That's on top of the problem that was mentioned in the movie about hyperspacing out, running out of fuel thus having no way out after TFO jumped in.

davepoobond said:
that plan is stupid as hell, like the First Order is going to look at the nearest planet and be like "they went there"

why didnt they just use the light speed ship missile at the beginning?

They'd need to sacrifice the cruiser to do that and that was their flagship. Dunno if the smaller frigates would have been good for that.

KingHenrik30 · Dec 18, 2017

Did Rian Johnson watch Force Awakens?

Biske · Dec 18, 2017

Shouta said:
They couldn't. Their warp was being tracked so if they had jumped to near the planet, it would be obvious they were sending escape ships. That's on top of the problem that was mentioned in the movie about hyperspacing out, running out of fuel thus having no way out after TFO jumped in.

They'd need to sacrifice the cruiser to do that and that was their flagship. Dunno if the smaller frigates would have been good for that.

They lost like 40 of them. I'm pretty sure a handful would have been fine, Specially as they let a lot of those ships die with the pilots just sitting in them anyways.

Shouta · Dec 18, 2017

Biske said:
They lost like 40 of them. I'm pretty sure a handful would have been fine, Specially as they let a lot of those ships die with the pilots just sitting in them anyways.

The original plan, run away until they passed by the planet, would have actually let them save all the escape ships. Finn and Rose bringing DeL Toro back and BB8 getting them caught got everyone killed since Del Toro let TFO see through the Resistance cloaks.

davepoobond · Dec 18, 2017

Shouta said:
They'd need to sacrifice the cruiser to do that and that was their flagship. Dunno if the smaller frigates would have been good for that.

i dont know why they would NEED the cruiser for that though. The smaller frigates were already being destroyed. Two or three of them could have pounded them enough. The First Order definitely wasn't ready for that sort of attack.

There were no rules established for this sort of attack, so the question of "why didn't they do that before" is pretty logical. They didn't have to wait for everyone to start dying. They were evacuating the ships already and letting the frigates get blown up

Biske · Dec 18, 2017

Shouta said:
The original plan, run away until they passed by the planet, would have actually let them save all the escape ships. Finn and Rose bringing DeL Toro back and BB8 getting them caught got everyone killed since Del Toro let TFO see through the Resistance cloaks.

True, this movie is a clear display of good guy idiots getting people murdered cause of their heroics.

But you'd think Kamikaze attacks would be a well established tactic. Specially if you can hit them with something at light speed. Anything is going to do damage, but these aren't smart movies... so its a total waste to even think about.

Like... why do the bomber ship have a manual drop control in a physical switch? Can't have some kind of voice control? Okay. Okay.

But still.

DaleinCalgary · Dec 18, 2017

Just watched it.

It's poop

Shouta · Dec 18, 2017

davepoobond said:
i dont know why they would NEED the cruiser for that though. The smaller frigates were already being destroyed. Two or three of them could have pounded them enough. The First Order definitely wasn't ready for that sort of attack.

There were no rules established for this sort of attack, so the question of "why didn't they do that before" is pretty logical. They didn't have to wait for everyone to start dying. They were evacuating the ships already and letting the frigates get blown up

True, if they were gonna run out of fuel on the frigates, why not try it. No precedent in the series for it either so it would be logical consider the situation.

I just pointed out the cruiser because of the size and scale of the ships. The medical frigate is like 300 meters long while the cruiser was 3500 meters or so. The Supremacy is 13200 meters long by.

Biske said:
True, this movie is a clear display of good guy idiots getting people murdered cause of their heroics.

But you'd think Kamikaze attacks would be a well established tactic. Specially if you can hit them with something at light speed. Anything is going to do damage, but these aren't smart movies... so its a total waste to even think about.

Like... why do the bomber ship have a manual drop control in a physical switch? Can't have some kind of voice control? Okay. Okay.

But still.

Yeah, there's a lot of that sort of problem in SW and just films in general. You'd think they'd consider that sort of attack if absolutely necessary.

That manual switch definitely bothered me at the start, lol. I can kind of chalk it up to tension building but it'd be on the list of things to point out that are really stupid from a logical standpoint.

Biske · Dec 18, 2017

Shouta said:
Yeah, there's a lot of that sort of problem in SW and just films in general. You'd think they'd consider that sort of attack if absolutely necessary.

That manual switch definitely bothered me at the start, lol. I can kind of chalk it up to tension building but it'd be on the list of things to point out that are really stupid from a logical standpoint.

One other thing I realized that is monumentally dumb, they have all kinds of robots, to do just about everything you could possibly do, but ships, don't have any sort of AI?

Seems like it would be incredibly helpful.

I get they can use that to shoe horn in a purpose for stuff like BB-8 but wouldn't the ships also basically be robots...

Fucking star wars... just need to turn my brain off.

jason10mm · Dec 18, 2017

I gotta wonder, what sort of shit show condition was Rogue One in when they re-edited it but they let TLJ go out like this? Or what crap were the Lord brothers doing that Lucasarts couldn't stomach? 'Cause TLJ was a nonsensical mess with almost no plot and it did fuck all towards making eps 7&8 feel like it was building towards anything. Where the hell is the rest of the galaxy? Does the First Order have 5 total ships (now zero) or do they have thousands but couldn't be bothered to call up anything smaller than a super star destroyer?

I really need a rewatch. I want to like this film because there are some really moments, but it feels like they started with Luke facing down a line of mega AT-ATs and did a really bad job of figuring out how that scene could come to be. What exactly were Poe, Finn, and the maintenance tech/crack pilot going to do in those shitty speeders? Or those damned bombers that blew themselves up. How exactly where those bombs sliding out the bottom of a spaceship? They took the WW2 imagery way too literal.

I really want to know if it was a deliberate statement to have Rose lament the poor treatment the 1% gives the working class just to cut to Chewbacca cooking the Porgs or Rey trashing the island, making the poor Caretaker frog nuns clean up after her. I thought it was quite brilliant and kinda ties into the arms dealers making bank off both the First Order and the Resistance but it was probably just a coincidence.

bill0527 · Dec 18, 2017

KingHenrik30 said:
Did Rian Johnson watch Force Awakens?

Long enough to say.. fuck JJ Abrams ideas. Fuck all this shit.

pramod · Dec 18, 2017

Biske said:
True, this movie is a clear display of good guy idiots getting people murdered cause of their heroics.

But you'd think Kamikaze attacks would be a well established tactic. Specially if you can hit them with something at light speed. Anything is going to do damage, but these aren't smart movies... so its a total waste to even think about.

Like... why do the bomber ship have a manual drop control in a physical switch? Can't have some kind of voice control? Okay. Okay.

But still.

Or...just the idea of "dropping bombs" in zero gravity....

Anyway, 10 minutes in I already subconsicously told myself I had to tune out all this illogical crap if I wanted to enjoy this movie at all. So I did that and was able to sit thru till the end. It was still a crap movie though.

davepoobond · Dec 18, 2017

pramod said:
Or...just the idea of "dropping bombs" in zero gravity....

Anyway, 10 minutes in I already subconsicously told myself I had to tune out all this illogical crap if I wanted to enjoy this movie at all. So I did that and was able to sit thru till the end. It was still a crap movie though.

why do they need a physical switch to drop bombs? why do they have droids that have AI but ships don't have AI already that can do this stuff and minimize human casualties?

why does leia dress down poe for a suicide mission early in the movie, but at the end resigns to sending everyone on a suicide mission?

there was a lot of things that just didn't make sense in this movie.

dmann · Dec 18, 2017

I lol'ed at the bombers. What no missile/torpedo ships? Also, those bomber ships were slow as molasses and their design was dumb af.

Despite all the holes and the pacing of the movie, I liked it. Not what I expected from a Star Wars movie but it was still an enjoyable film. Looking forward to the conclusion of this trilogy, next director has a tough task to tie all the loose ends together. Interested in how they are going to write out Leia being that she was suppose to be integral to IX's story.

andythinkpad · Dec 18, 2017

Khoryos said:
What the fuck is the point of Finn?

Team up with another minority character for the oversea market? I have no idea.

Also this guy is a double deserter douchebag.

While I am at it I don't get the point of the codebreaker guy. It's a half note character that got huge amount of screen time and dialogue. Why?

Ravek · Dec 18, 2017

I've seen the movie twice now.

And I need to know if I'm seeing shit but did anyone else see a yellow crystal in Luke's hut thing ?

Shouta · Dec 18, 2017

dmann said:
I lol'ed at the bombers. What no missile/torpedo ships? Also, those bomber ships were slow as molasses and their design was dumb af.

Despite all the holes and the pacing of the movie, I liked it. Not what I expected from a Star Wars movie but it was still an enjoyable film. Looking forward to the conclusion of this trilogy, next director has a tough task to tie all the loose ends together. Interested in how they are going to write out Leia being that she was suppose to be integral to IX's story.

The design reminded me of the B-Wing but then it was way larger. Kinda weird not have the two bomber class fighters be used at all for a weird giant cousin of one, lol.

godhandiscen · Dec 18, 2017

One of the weakest Star Wars movies, just above the weakest of the prequel movies.

JimiNutz · Dec 18, 2017

ShodanMAN said:
I agree. It would have been more interesting if Snoke decided that Kylo needed more intensive training after his loss against Rey in TFA, finally allowing us to see how the Sith train. With Luke training Rey we would be able to see the differences and similarities between the two sides. Kylo and Rey talking to eachother during their respective training could lead them to the realization that neither side has all the answers.

Yeah I was really disappointed that we didn't get to see both Rey and Ren training. At the end of TFA Snoke tells Hux to to bring him Kylo Ren so that he can complete his training, would have been cool to actually see that and it could have set up interesting scenes as you've described above.

Just so much wasted potential in this film.

Fnord · Dec 18, 2017

NutJobJim said:
Yeah I was really disappointed that we didn't get to see both Rey and Ren training. At the end of TFA Snoke tells Hux to to bring him Kylo Ren so that he can complete his training, would have been cool to actually see that and it could have set up interesting scenes as you've described above.

Just so much wasted potential in this film.

It's weak, but Snoke did actually put Ren in position to do just that. He stated as much explicitly. By bringing Rey in and giving Kylo the opportunity to kill her, thus "completing his training."

ssj5krillhan · Dec 18, 2017

Just finished watching. The end reminded me to some similarities in Naruto. I thought Luke was collecting natural chakra from the sun to fuel his shadow clone to fight Kilo.

cantona222 · Dec 18, 2017

This trilogy is going to be a mess. JJ is going to direct ep 9 while Johnson in ep 8 ignored a lot of what JJ built in ep 7.

luxsol · Dec 18, 2017

cantona222 said:
This trilogy is going to be a mess. JJ is going to direct ep 9 while Johnson in ep 8 ignored a lot of what JJ built in ep 7.

Going to be?
It was from the first movie.
Nothing but unexplained garbage that was pretty much thrown out with this movie.
They really needed to explain who/what Snoke was and why everyone should follow Kylo from here on out.

I'm not bothering to watch the third one after this almost literal shit.

CampbellzSoup · Dec 18, 2017

That opening with Poe was so cringy who on earth thought for a Star Wars film that would be a good idea...?

Vidiot · Dec 18, 2017

luxsol said:
Going to be?
It was from the first movie.
Nothing but unexplained garbage that was pretty much thrown out with this movie.
They really needed to explain who/what Snoke was and why everyone should follow Kylo from here on out.

I'm not bothering to watch the third one after this almost literal shit.

That's about where my mindset is as well. This shit was so poorly thought out.

luxsol · Dec 18, 2017

CampbellzSoup said:
That opening with Poe was so cringy who on earth thought for a Star Wars film that would be a good idea...?

Eh, i thought a lot of what happened in Force Awakens also had stupid earthian modern comedy shit like that too. They opened up the door to that crap.
All those actors from Lost and Heroes smiling that they're XWing pilots in a Star Wars movie is just as out of place and cringe worthy.

It's another retread from the first trilogy (Han in the Death Star's prison room) too, but it's just so out of place.

Soapbox Killer · Dec 18, 2017

KingHenrik30 said:
Did Rian Johnson watch Force Awakens?

I think he may have listened to it in the back ground while he painted the kitchen

bill0527 said:
Long enough to say.. fuck JJ Abrams ideas. Fuck all this shit.

and also this.

Maybe JJ can open the so-called "mystery boxes" that he packaged in the first film. Maybe "Solo" will somehow reveal more about Snoke? Maybe the last unannounced Star Wars story is NOT another prequel but a current Trilogy side story?

Harlock · Dec 18, 2017

Is a movie about Kylo Ren and Luke. Everyone else did anything relevant. And, by the end, I was shilling for Kylo. A solid character, that knows what want, fuck the past, focus in the future. Maybe he can build an illuminati empire.

andythinkpad · Dec 18, 2017

Harlock said:
Is a movie about Kylo Ren and Luke. Everyone else did anything relevant. And, by the end, I was shilling for Kylo. A solid character, that knows what want, fuck the past, focus in the future. Maybe he can build an illuminati empire.

Kylo is the only character with real human like motivation. I also root for him in the end. Rion Johnson turned me to the dark side.

longdi · Dec 18, 2017

I watched it, i think i did. Because it all felt like fucking nothing.

There is breaking away from tradition and there is terrible directing from rian.

Luke milking the cow, drinking the milk and gave that fuck you rian look. Someone need to screencap that face.

Harlock · Dec 18, 2017

longdi said:
Luke milking the cow, drinking the milk and gave that fuck you rian look. Someone need to screencap that face.

Thinking about, Luke always liked milk.

Crazyorloco · Dec 18, 2017

davepoobond said:
I thought it was dog shit. The first 10 minutes of the movie was a sign of things to come. Luke throwing the lightsaber over his shoulder was a metaphor for this movie.

Pretty much. Foreshadowing. We saw an intergalactic comedy.

And then they finally use light sabers in a fight again 120 mins later.

Crankshaft · Dec 18, 2017

I think the Resistance should just buy a bunch of BB-8's to fight the war. Seems like it can do everything. I'm expecting in SW9 that a hatch opens up and a mini light saber comes out of him while he fights Ben.

caffeware · Dec 18, 2017

Biske said:
One other thing I realized that is monumentally dumb, they have all kinds of robots, to do just about everything you could possibly do, but ships, don't have any sort of AI?

Seems like it would be incredibly helpful.

I get they can use that to shoe horn in a purpose for stuff like BB-8 but wouldn't the ships also basically be robots...

Fucking star wars... just need to turn my brain off.

Star Wars is the future from the 70/80s, not what we now think the future will look like now.

Look at the computer monitors for instance, that's what computers used to look in the 70s with the lowdef monochrome bulky didplays.

In my opinion, those elements is what makes the visual style of the series unique and interesting.

Whatever new vehicles, devices or technology you show, need to have that very specific look/feel to it.

Going back to you comment, I don't think any of the Apollo spacecraft that went to the moon had any advance AI.

Support NeoGAF

Star Wars The Last Jedi Spoiler discussion thread: THERE WILL BE UNMARKED SPOILERS!

Member

Member

Member

Go Go Neo Rangers!

Member

Member

Member

Member

you can't put a price on sparks

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Member

Banned

you can't put a price on sparks

Member

Member

Member

Member

you can't put a price on sparks

Member

Member

Member

Member

Gold Member

Member

Banned

you can't put a price on sparks

Member

Member

Banned

Member

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Grand Nagus

Member

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Similar threads