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Angry Joe gets called out by IGNs review editor for misquoting their Titanfall review

mysteriousmage09

mysteriousmage09

Member
The fact that Dan is trying to brag about a massive gaming site's channel having more Youtube subscribers than a single person's personal channel truly shows the quality of people IGN hires.

The only thing Joe did "wrong" was do the human nature thing and round up the 8.9 to a 9. The "believe the hype" quote doesn't matter if it's from a preview or a review. Either IGN stands by their statement or they admit they were shouting PR shit when they said it. The quote is also used all over the place and wasn't a hand selected thing by just Joe. Dan also trying to state that 8.0-8.9 is the exact same thing and that the .1 difference is a river of differences is the most ridiculous thing i've seen argued in quite some time.
 
S

SapientWolf

Trucker Sexologist
daviyoung said:
If I got paid to do it and became a professional, I could then be accused of acting unprofessionally if I were to resort to mud slinging and misattribution. Them's the breaks between amateur and professional. Although I see where you're coming from in terms of comparison, should IGN and Angry Joe's companies be compared at all on any level?

And your namesake is Angry Joe? That's kinda unfortunate.
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He's a professional asshole. He's just doing his job.

Actually, it's kind of amazing that Dan has a small (but just) cause for grievance against a guy who is paid to act like a jerk, and still cannot manage to look like the bigger man in the argument. What's next? Is he going to call himself Angry Dan and cut a promo?
 
K

Kworn

Banned
Kade said:
I feel like the name calling and tone of Joe's tweets are just him staying true to his brand to please his fanbase.
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Joe is like Marmite, you love him or hate him. But you have to love that he stays true to who he is..."Angry Joe". He is not ever trying to be more or less.

Yes I think he acts like an ass sometimes, but he also makes some very good points in his reviews and is not often wrong with them.
 
T

The Jackdog

Member
The fact that either of these two can call themselves professional while having hissy fits on twitter is astounding to me.

And we as gamers are stuck with these two being examples of the "best" we have in game journalism.
 
Son of Cervantes

Son of Cervantes

Member
Pretty much all gaming "journalism" sites do what IGN did - hype games via previews, while providing any criticism in reviews.

Game previews have always been essentially free advertising for upcoming products.
 
J

jimi_dini

Member
mysteriousmage09 said:
that the .1 difference is a river of differences is the most ridiculous thing i've seen argued in quite some time.
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They should add another digit.

8.90 - great
8.95 - almost awesome
8.99 - we are almost there, but not awesome yet, better rent it
9.00 - awesome, superb, buy it day 1, Mountain Dew!!!
 
B

Briarios

Member
chaobreaker said:
Stapleton's was right, though he could have handled that argument a bit more professionally.

Angry Joe is a immature twat.
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Angry Joe is a blogger. IGN is the professional outlet. It's really up to the "professional" journalist to handle it better -- like for example, not starting anything.
 
S

Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew

Banned
The_Monk said:
My good GAFfers, you will always be 10/10 in my heart. Don't let anyone tell you are 9.9/10 okay?
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Say that one more time and I'll start posting vertically.

I mean it! :mad:

Jokes aside, watching them argue reminds me of children. Game critics are children when they argue with each other. Stop playing mature games and play E-Rated titles when you all argue like children!
 
J

Jado

Banned
I'm on Joe's side. When previews endlessly hype the shit out of big titles and don't even try to show a semblance of restraint or objectivity, review sites can't make the flimsy claim that previews and reviews are so separate and distinct. The preview practically serves to not offend the publisher while simultaneously building up hype and draw in as many eyeballs when the review comes out.
 
Clockwork5

Clockwork5

Member
Joe is an amateur and doesn't understand that an intentional misquote is something you don't do if you want to maintain credibility with your peers and sources.

I would blacklist him.
 
O

oxidax

Member
On point with Joel here. And this is another reason why score review should go away. How stupid is arguing over 0.1?
 
D

Dr.Schlomo

Banned
The Jackdog said:
The fact that either of these two can call themselves professional while having hissy fits on twitter is astounding to me.

And we as gamers are stuck with these two being examples of the "best" we have in game journalism.
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My thoughts exactly! The IGN guy is just plain embarrassing himself but angry joe showed a lot of immaturity in his response. Theses are grown men acting like babies on...a freaking social network. Grow up, grow a pair, be adults and talk it out in person or over the phone...
 
InfiniteUnrest

InfiniteUnrest

Member
The IGN preview was published and is therefore fair game to criticism. If they want to argue semantics of whether it was a review or preview (let's be fair, it is a rough draft of their review, a preview of the review), they can, but it looks extremely silly if not unprofessional, especially since it was PUBLISHED. The difference to me between Joe and IGN, is that IGN are supposed to be the professionals, and Joe is just some guy from Youtube. He's an amateur. You expect him to argue over Twitter, whether he's in the right or not (and to me, he's far more in the right here than Dan Stapleton).

In either case, Joe's point stands - the game is fun, but it doesn't deserve a score anywhere near 9 or 10. What's crazy about IGN's final review is that it mentions quite a few of the problems of Titanfall, yet still gives the game an 8.9 out of 10. That seems extremely shady.
 
B

BGBW

Maturity, bitches.
harSon said:
What's so shady about it? There are differences between a preview and a review, with the biggest difference being the fact that the former was likely formed by only playing a portion of the game while the latter is the result of experiencing the final or near final product in its entirety.

A lot can change between those two experiences. Maybe the game is incredibly fun in short bursts, and at the forefront of your time with it, but its funfactor wears thin the longer you play it. Maybe the one or two modes you did play were ridiculously fun, but once the final product came into your possession, you came to the realization that feature depth (modes, maps, weapons, etc) were lacking. These are things that can be hidden in a preview, artificially inflating a game, that wouldn't be known until you have considerable time with the final product.

A lot of people in this thread are just out for blood, but a lot can change between a preview and a review. Also, I agree that a 100 point scale is stupid for media reviews, but there is a big difference between an 8.9 and a 9. I bet everyone here would do everything in their power to get their 89% in a class bumped up to a 90% The same thing applies here.
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Well much like you and I, IGN has access to all the words of the English language. The possibilities for constructing sentences are endless. In their closing statement they could have explained the many aspects you put forward. Say for the short time they spent with it it was an enjoyable experience and they hope the final product delivers more of this. Say that the preview build has delivered on certain expectations and helped satisfy some of the hype they had for it (see, using the word hype can be used legitimately). No, instead it almost comes off as if they are saying 'Titanfall spunked in my face and now I am an eternal sex slave to it'. There's being honest about your excitement and then there's "believe the hype" (which we just wrote) excitement. Basically, and this goes to all journalists not just IGN, calm down dear it's just a videogame.
 
T

TheOhrenberger.

Banned
It's dumb to argue over .1 of a score, but if anyone's in the right it's Dan simply by a technicality. Joe was technically misrepresenting their review and he did mention in his review that other reviews were not criticizing a lack of a single player campaign while showing the IGN review. He may not have specifically said that it was IGN who didn't criticize it, but he certainly was inferring it.

It's a dumb argument to get in, but if anyone is in the right it's the IGN side.
 
H

harSon

Banned
I don't know about other people, but I remember back in the day when I used to frequent IGN, whenever I was looking for the absolute best games to play for a new platform I purchased, I'd set the filter to games that scored 9.0 and better.
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
The most interesting thing about this whole exchange is how there was a very consious choice over at IGN's to give this game lower then a 9.

The reviewer wanted to give it a 9 and then decided or was told not to give it a 9.

Or, he wanted to give it well below a 9 and was told it had to be as close to a 9 as possible.

Either way, I can't for the life of me explain why it is so important to this guy that there is a huge difference between a 8.9 and a 9. There is some backstory there I'm dying to find out about.
 
F

FiggyCal

Banned
big_erk said:
...and this is why they should only use a 10 point scale if they have to give a numerical score. If they felt the game didn't deserve a 9, which seems to be the case, then give it an 8. Better yet ditch the numbers and just use the verbiage that they assign to the score ranges.

10.0 - MASTERPIECE
9.0-9.9 - AMAZING
8.0-8.9 - GREAT
7.0-7.9 - GOOD
6.0-6.9 - OKAY
5.0-5.9 - MEDIOCRE

and so on. Just drop the numbers already, especially the decimals.
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Yeah, but then people are gonna start asking what's the difference between mediocre and okay? Or what makes an amazing game a masterpiece. I like the 10 point scale (though I prefer the 5 star model instead) I just hate when things get into the decimals (or half stars). What exactly is the difference between an 8.2 game and an 8.0 game?
 
I

I.R.I.S.

Neo Member
The Jackdog said:
Who IS then?

I actually.....dont have an answer.
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As far as gaming reviews, or ANY reviews for that matter, who is the best source is completely subjective. But it's clear that one guy was being a bully when he said that Angry Joe was malicious (with no evidence).
 
D

djtiesto

is beloved, despite what anyone might say
Who is Angry Joe? This is the first time I've heard of him. Angry Video Game Nerd wannabe?
 
T

The Jackdog

Member
djtiesto said:
Who is Angry Joe? This is the first time I've heard of him. Angry Video Game Nerd wannabe?
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He does youtube videos. Has a decent following. His name is joe and he gets angry about stuff.

Personally not a fan but some people really like him. Makes some good points that ive seen a few times.
 
A

Archaix

Drunky McMurder
Do you have to be a complete fucking imbecile to work for IGN, or do you just get a better parking space for it?
 
C

Cragvis

Member
Numbered game review scores are a joke and have been for a while. They all ignore 90% of the numbers and live in the 8-10 range. Thats crazy.

It should be something like

0 - DONT BUY, dont even think about buying
1 - getting it as a gift for free is ok, otherwise avoid
2 - Rental at best
3 - buying it used is ideal, but make sure you research the game a bit first
4 - not bad, not day 1, but its a fun game
5 - get it day 1 if you are a big fan, otherwise its a good game
6 - pretty fun game, should check it out
7 - great game, you should totally check it out, worth $60
8 - REALLY great game, worth $60 day 1 easily
9 - Amazing game, will always be known for being a great game and a classic. day 1, $60 everyone should buy
10 - If you don't buy it, you are insane. Something to enjoy in the game for anyone. Great writing, graphics, audio, everything top notch.

All the above come with the reminder that it applies only if you like that genre of game as some people just dont like certain genres such as RPG or TBS or FPS. If its your genre the chart applies to you.

There should never be any decimal points. Arguing that an 8.9 is a totally different level than a 9 is crazy when you are dealing with the decimals and quality of a game. When someone sells something for $59.99 you dont think, "oh that is a totally different price than $60.00....TECHNICALLY it is, but realistically it isnt.
 
Clockwork5

Clockwork5

Member
Jado said:
I'm on Joe's side. When previews endlessly hype the shit out of big titles and don't even try to show a semblance of restraint or objectivity, review sites can't make the flimsy claim that previews and reviews are so separate and distinct. The preview practically serves to not offend the publisher while simultaneously building up hype and draw in as many eyeballs when the review comes out.
Click to expand...

Except previews and reviews are written and edited by seperate departments have separate uses and as you describe, previews serve to hype and reviews critique and inform.

By claiming a preview is a review you are crediting a piece of work to a staff that had nothing to do with the piece.

Joe is dumb for doing it.
 
L

LTWood12

Member
I write off pretty much anyone that self-ascribes a negative adjective in front of their name ('Angry', 'Annoyed', etc.). Dan should have realized that arguing with AJ on twitter was essentially giving him exactly what he wanted.
 
T

The Jackdog

Member
neoenigma said:
IGN taking to twitter to start petty little arguments? What the hell....
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This is whats so pathetic to me. I think its shameful both are doing this, but IGN is a professional organization. Angry joe is angry joe. He can carry himself however he wants, IGN should know better. Getting into a fight on twitter with a youtube personality? Cmon. Whatd they honestly expect?
 
Z

zashga

Member
No one ever looks good in Twitter fights.

IGN's 100-point "not an average" review scale has never made any sense. Pretending that there is a meaningful difference between an 8.9 and a 9.0 is just beyond dumb.
 
Dr. Kitty Muffins

Dr. Kitty Muffins

Member
When did everyone in the industry get a thin skin? Okay, it isn't everyone. Maybe it isn't even a majority. But as of late, we seem to have more people being vocal about being criticized be they a game developer, or a reviewer (Sessler). The recent trend certainly makes it feel as if everyone is upset though. It seems like more people are coming out about how irratated they are by either forumers or others. I think some of this just needs to go away. It isn't helping anything by going on about how rubbed raw you are.
 
X

Xenex

Member
IGN looking really petty right about now, 0.1 lmfao. Why not go a few steps further, 8.9915 - so great it's almost amazing.
 
InfiniteUnrest

InfiniteUnrest

Member
For those who haven't seen it, Joe's review of Titanfall is probably the most fair I've seen. He calls it like it is. The game is extremely fun. But it has a lot of shortcomings and omissions that you'd expect from a game in that genre, especially at this point in time. He called out a lot of other reviewing entities because regardless of whether they mention these shortcomings or not, many still gave the game review score near 9 or 10.
 
V

VariantX

Member
shampoowarrior said:
I disagree. The IGN guy came out of this looking like bitter and childish while Angry Joe came out looking like Angry Joe. You may call that immature but that's what pays his bills. I'd say only IGN really lost in the exchange.
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Maybe. The IGN guy definitely should have mailed Joe to begin with so he could present his argument with more than a sentence or two instead of intentionally starting a public argument. Getting all flustered at Joe is about equivalent to politicians getting mad at a comedian.
 
F

FiggyCal

Banned
Cragvis said:
Numbered game review scores are a joke and have been for a while. They all ignore 90% of the numbers and live in the 8-10 range. Thats crazy.

It should be something like

0 - DONT BUY, dont even think about buying
1 - getting it as a gift for free is ok, otherwise avoid
2 - Rental at best
3 - buying it used is ideal, but make sure you research the game a bit first
4 - not bad, not day 1, but its a fun game
5 - get it day 1 if you are a big fan, otherwise its a good game
6 - pretty fun game, should check it out
7 - great game, you should totally check it out, worth $60
8 - REALLY great game, worth $60 day 1 easily
9 - Amazing game, will always be known for being a great game and a classic. day 1, $60 everyone should buy
10 - If you don't buy it, you are insane. Something to enjoy in the game for anyone. Great writing, graphics, audio, everything top notch.

All the above come with the reminder that it applies only if you like that genre of game as some people just dont like certain genres such as RPG or TBS or FPS. If its your genre the chart applies to you.

There should never be any decimal points. Arguing that an 8.9 is a totally different level than a 9 is crazy when you are dealing with the decimals and quality of a game. When someone sells something for $59.99 you dont think, "oh that is a totally different price than $60.00....TECHNICALLY it is, but realistically it isnt.
Click to expand...

I like Kotaku's review scale. Should you buy this game: Yes or No. That's all you really need. Anything else you need to know they'll tell you in the summary of the review or you can read the entire review for yourself.
 
A

ActStriker

Member
The whole situation is stupid, but the IGN guy doesn't come out too well in this. The nitpicking is just that they're probably a bit sore from being used to drive a point home.

Clockwork5 said:
Except previews and reviews are written and edited by seperate departments have separate uses and as you describe, previews serve to hype and reviews critique and inform.

By claiming a preview is a review you are crediting a piece of work to a staff that had nothing to do with the piece.

Joe is dumb for doing it.
Click to expand...

Both the preview and review are written by the same person.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/08/22/i-played-titanfall-and
http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/03/10/titanfall-review-2
 
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