Hold L2 or R2 while getting into the character select screen in an online game and thank me later.
(or just go to training mode)
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
What went wrong with Marvel vs Capcom 3 ?
- Thread starter dragonzdogma
- Start date
Hold L2 or R2 while getting into the character select screen in an online game and thank me later.
(or just go to training mode)
What?
You mean the capcom drout right?
Namco
Nintendo
Neither realms were doing just fine.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
Cable, Magneto, Storm, Sentinel, Doom, and Wolverine were the most used characters in 2. MvC3 has more variety despite the characters you mentioned being used a lot. PR Rog used to play a killer Felicia and Tron Bonne.
Hellshingu
Member
NetherRealm Studios is what I am assuming this is and they didn't get founded until 2010 or so.
What you're telling me in this post is that you never watched competitive MvC2, but you have watched a bit of competitive MvC3.
dragonzdogma
Member
For those us that only had the game for a week, what does l2 or r2 at the character select screen do?
Whatever the Boon base was called at the time, they were making... attempts at fighting games. Attempts and they did well
Plays one of three remixed versions of the MvC2 character select screen music.
dragonzdogma
Member
Wolverine was mid tier in MVC 2, no?
I'd seen more people playing with BB hood,iceman,black heart than Wolverine.
Dreams-Visions
Member
i play it regularly. it's still amazing.
DustyVonEric
Member
No Ken, no buy.
Hellshingu
Member
Top level Marvel 2 play was way more stagnant than 3 ever was IMO. Almost every team that was competitive consisted of at least Sentinel, Storm, Cable, and Magneto. Then you'd see your random cyclops, captain commando, psylocke(Yipes), and a few other characters sometimes mixed in with those 2 of those chars mentioned above.
Lol what? Those characters are not randomly low tier pics just because. They're top tier assist and you'll always see them.
I dont get the point of this thread.
MvC3 sold just as well if not more than MvC2. MvC3 did a pretty good run at EVO. Sure it might not last as long as MvC2 , but FGC/EVO has blown up so much compared to 2008. You cant keep such an old game like MvC when there are so many newer games that keep coming out.
MvC3 sold just as well if not more than MvC2. MvC3 did a pretty good run at EVO. Sure it might not last as long as MvC2 , but FGC/EVO has blown up so much compared to 2008. You cant keep such an old game like MvC when there are so many newer games that keep coming out.
Except Marvel's community has collapsed hard over the past two or three years. The local scene around here has dropped Marvel completely and focused on Street Fighter and Guilty Gear(! Shock and Horror for me since they never wanted to play XX before XXX hit) over Marvel when during SF4's rocket rising/"revival" of the genre they played Marvel for a good year or two.
Sectorseven
Member
It has to be more than licensing.
I mean, the game already exists and it's a quality product. It can't be that difficult to strike a new deal.
I mean, the game already exists and it's a quality product. It can't be that difficult to strike a new deal.
crimzonflame
Member
A lot of 09er's givin answers in this thread
j/k
I mean, of course. We've known Marvel was never going to change for years. I personally asked the head of Marvel's gaming division if they were ever going to do anything with MvsC3 ever again in 2013 and got a hard no. People moved on. It's kind of crazy that Marvel 3 has the community that it does with it's members knowing that fact.
JeTmAn81
Member
Not every game needs to be patched constantly to stay interesting. Melee, for instance.
Why does maintaining a FGC presence necessitate constant updates now? People were hyped on MvC2 when MvC3 wasn't even on the table, people were hard into Third Strike when the concept of a Street Fighter IV was a pipe dream.
In a way, the end of updates is a good thing for matchups to refine themselves, there's not the looming threat of "shit my tactics got nerfed" hanging over peoples' heads anymore.
MrChocolate
Member
Melee is/was only interesting because of the glitching abuse.
Also, we are discussing fighting games. Not party games.
JeTmAn81
Member
It doesn't matter why it stayed interesting, the audience stayed with it regardless of the lack of changes. And quibbling about labels is definitely not interesting.
Galactic Barret
Member
Maybe it was the wireless controller, but everything felt a split-second late in MvC3 when compared to MvC2.
Hsien Ko being Melee Kirby tier killed the game ;-;
For realsies it was simply down to Marvel and how weird they were to work with. If they'd cooperated and let the game get more love with patches and updates then it could've been a lot better and the community would be a lot healthier compared to what it is right now. Shame really, cause for as shit as the game's balance is it's an incredibly stylish game in both presentation and mechanics.
For realsies it was simply down to Marvel and how weird they were to work with. If they'd cooperated and let the game get more love with patches and updates then it could've been a lot better and the community would be a lot healthier compared to what it is right now. Shame really, cause for as shit as the game's balance is it's an incredibly stylish game in both presentation and mechanics.
EatinOlives
Member
Not every game, no.
UMvsC3 DEFINITELY did though. DEFFFFINITELY!
But regardless, it's more than just balance patches, it's the ability to add new characters, new modes, new features, the ability to keep the game fresh. It's not hard to understand why, when the parent company says the game is done, people move on to something new and different.
Decisions like "let's nerf She Hulk's slide and take 2 missiles away from Doom's assist, but leave Hsien-ko, Arthur, Chunners, Tron, Spiderman alone because they weren't problems" are definitely what killed a lot of interest in the 3 to U3 change over. They always punched down, never punched up, which made half of the roster meaningless.
HylianScribe
Member
The story circulating behind-the-scenes back then was that UMVC3 had to come out as soon as it did because Capcom was losing the license sooner than they wanted because Marvel did not want to renew (either a result of how Disney's acquisition affected their relationship or Capcom couldn't afford to renew, or maybe both). So they rushed out UMVC3 and final updates before they lost the rights shortly after. That is also why they can never patch/update UMVC3 -- it requires approval from Marvel, and there's no more deal in place. So no more patches...which hurt balancing which usually extends a competitive game's life span. It's not necessary, but it helps.
Also uh, a lot of people forget that a major incident happened in Japan around UMVC3s development where there floods and a power plant almost pulling a chernboyl
it is extremely suspect as a competitive game due to a whole ton of really retarded design decisions both character and system wise that are easily fixable.
the way games flow make it stale to watch because when someone gets hit it's steamroll city in a really monotonous manner.
the ratio between high-paced action and decision making between players and 'well time to watch this movie' is too far to the right, basically- it hurts both the competitor and spectator angles.
that's what 'went wrong' from a competitive angle and why it eventually died out instead of being evergreen. though i do suspect most games that go on 5 years without any balance changes would probably suffer similar fates in scene dwindling as long as there were newer games coming out to move onto.
in terms of attracting casual players, it's just another barebones experience- there's nothing for them at all besides arcade mode. they even took out the survival and challenge survival modes from vanilla mvc3 in ultimate as to replace it with heroes & heralds.
they had this giant franchise crossover thing where one of the franchises is primarily known for their storytelling so to not play on that is fucking insane- a competent story mode would've probably made the game sell a bajillion copies. apparently marvel had folks even write up a story for capcom, but they refused. capcom stays capcom i guess
the way games flow make it stale to watch because when someone gets hit it's steamroll city in a really monotonous manner.
the ratio between high-paced action and decision making between players and 'well time to watch this movie' is too far to the right, basically- it hurts both the competitor and spectator angles.
that's what 'went wrong' from a competitive angle and why it eventually died out instead of being evergreen. though i do suspect most games that go on 5 years without any balance changes would probably suffer similar fates in scene dwindling as long as there were newer games coming out to move onto.
in terms of attracting casual players, it's just another barebones experience- there's nothing for them at all besides arcade mode. they even took out the survival and challenge survival modes from vanilla mvc3 in ultimate as to replace it with heroes & heralds.
they had this giant franchise crossover thing where one of the franchises is primarily known for their storytelling so to not play on that is fucking insane- a competent story mode would've probably made the game sell a bajillion copies. apparently marvel had folks even write up a story for capcom, but they refused. capcom stays capcom i guess
~Devil Trigger~
In favor of setting Muslim women on fire
Broke ass Capcom
Disney
thats about it
Disney
thats about it
Times are different, and those were the dark ages. Also read Seyvesh's post. A patch for umvc3 would have been very beneficial.
Well unlike Melee the audience didn't stay for Marvel, so I don't get your point. A patch would have helped it remain more in the spotlight.
In my opinion, it was too difficult to play. I loved the characters in the game but there were just too many mechanics int he game to make it enjoyable to me. I'm sure that will make people mad who don't want the games dumbed down, but in my case I just couldn't have a lot of fun with it. I also wish they let human players be part of a team. 3 v 3 would have been amazing.
Is there anyway to buy this legit these days with all the dlc?
Is there anyway to buy this legit these days with all the dlc?
Etrian Oddity
Member
Goddamn that was such a hilarious moment. Yipes rarely cracks up when he's in character but even he lost it at that.whatever happened with it, it still gave us the best FGC gif :
No.
You'd be surprised how messy this stuff gets legally-speaking. Marvel has rules that are very specific about how their characters are portrayed (here's an example for Spiderman)
Now extrapolate that to over a dozen characters which have to interact with over a dozen more from a completely separate company, and can do things like have the canonical "good guys" teaming up with "bad guys" to fight more "good guys", and throw in Disney lawyers. It's obviously "surmountable" if demand is there, but the licensing is about as far from trivial as you can get.
Thats my point entirely , MvC2 didn't have as much competition since there weren't as many Fighting games being released back then. Apart from the 3D fighters , the 2D fighting games were mainly MvC,CvS,SF3 and GG. All of which were released fairly around the same time.
Even with the collapse of MvC3 , I think MvC3 now is still just as big as MvC2 after 5-6 years.
SneakersSO
Member
MvC3's problem lay in a few areas, areas that would've actually affected Marvel 2 had it come out at the same era Marvel 3 had been released.
No Arcade release for MvC3 meant that, whenever the game stopped being produced or sold digitally, it meant the game had a hard and immediate half life. The game no longer being available meant that the influx of new players was going to drastically slow down & end very soon.
Marvel 2 persisted during an age where no new fighting games were being released or supported. This is the same reason why SF3:3rd strike found a resurgence during those pre-'08 years. This is why things such as an imbalanced roster were tolerated - there was literally no other recourse, nor other games to play. Marvel 3 has some very serious balance issues that need to be addressed, which has dominated the competitive face of the game for years now. Due to expired license agreement between Capcom & Marvel, Capcom can't update the game, much less introduce anything new to it. Competitive games need to be support nowadays, thats just how it works now.
CountBlack
Member
top right of the picture in the OP
You'd be surprised how messy this stuff gets legally-speaking. Marvel has rules that are very specific about how their characters are portrayed (here's an example for Spiderman)
Now extrapolate that to over a dozen characters which have to interact with over a dozen more from a completely separate company, and can do things like have the canonical "good guys" teaming up with "bad guys" to fight more "good guys", and throw in Disney lawyers. It's obviously "surmountable" if demand is there, but the licensing is about as far from trivial as you can get.
That doesn't look difficult at all. There is no killing or drug using or sex in MvC. Lol @ the age thing though, I guess it's cool for him to bone a 16 yo but not to drop an F bomb.
Ivan Amiibo
Banned
I'm not sure in which universe MVC3 did worse than MVC2 going by any metric, but why it lost steam is simple: no patches and Capcom couldn't promote it. They let the community support it while they focused on bolstering SFIV and 5 to eventually take Marvel's place. Players knew there was a shelf life on Marvel, Ultra SFIV came out, 5 was announced, the Pro Tournament put a bunch of $$$ on the line, and that signaled to players to focus their efforts on SF.
There are some people who are outspoken about MVC2 being a better game, but really, it's just a different kind of broken insanity. Think ChrisG was on too much of a hot streak at his high point? Try Jwong's 5 year MVC2 streak. Think too much of the MVC3 cast isn't viable? MVC2 is also worse in that regard. There's some golden age syndrome about MVC2 and some people who try to hop on that train to make it sound like they know what they're talking about, but people really don't know what they're wishing for in a Marvel game lol
They're both extremely fun garbage in different ways
Closer to 2002-2008:
SFEX3 - 2000/2001
Project Justice - 2001
CvS2 - 2001
CvS2Pro - 2002
What did Nintendo contribute in that time frame other than Melee in 2002 and Brawl in 2008? Their output was as meagre as Capcom's.
That list in and of itself is fine for Spiderman MvC but every Marvel Hero/Villain likely has similar restrictions which could contradict one-another. Is Wolverine teaming up with Magneto OK? Disney might not think so, they'll definitely have to ponder the question (and legally there's more to it than just handwaving it as an "Earth 2" thing). IP restrictions can get completely weird and self-contradictory and, unfortunately, don't always make a whole lot of sense. Hell, Disney could refuse simply because "we have a new Avengers movie coming and don't want people getting confused". And if you clear the issues with 23 characters but the remaining 2 are still legally problematic you're still in trouble for a straight UMvC3 reissue.
At the end of the day, even considering a reissue of UMvC3 would require what is likely a fairly costly negotiation with Disney, and was probably decided a while back that, at least at the time, wasn't worth the trouble of even trying, and I don't think we've reached a time where the answer is different.
Drilbit777
Member
Marvel is far from dead, it's still featured at tons of majors and is played regularly but its popularity has dwindled down compared to 2011/2012 due to the fact that it isn't getting any updates.