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Wired play through all of Too Human

Shins

Banned
SPEA said:
You were always able to. There are 4 different camera options you can chose from I believe. Iso is the "Diablo style" camera. There is also a close up one and a few others.
Really? I haven't read anything in-depth on the game in a while, but I thought one of the cornerstones of the game design was to remove the need for players to think about the camera. I'm actually a lot happier to have some form of control though, because my brain is used to isometric perspective for these kinds of games.

Is there a link to a preview detailing these different camera types?
 

Kydd BlaZe

Member
That wired preview actually sounds good. I am turned off, though, at the short length and the cliffhanger. Other than that, this game sounds like it'd make for a solid rental. Looking forward to it.
 

eve241

Member
Mifune said:
Yeah, Kohler's opinion is important to me because he's such a big fan of Eternal Darkness. I don't really care about epic loot or character customization. I'm in this for the world and story.

If he's not loving it, I'm concerned. No fault of the game's really, but maybe it just isn't for me.

As someone who is also in this for the world and story, I don't understand how you can trust on someone else's judgment, specially someone you don't even know (do you?), on something so subjective. Like I said on a previous post "cliff hanger ending" is subjective and as far as the rest goes I don't see how where he says the story is bad. Quite the opposite. If you are talking about the ED's comparisons : those are just that - comparisons.
 

pulga

Banned
Oh wow, those videos. Did I say "for" last time? Is is too late to cross over to the other side of the digital line?
 

Kittonwy

Banned
CowboyAstronaut said:
My impression on the Too Human videos.



When I really stop and take a look at the combat and accept it for what it is, it suddenly seems like a much more appealing game.

I think of Too Human in the same way that I first forced myself to get into turn-based rpgs many many years ago. Sure battles would never take place in such a fashion if we were watching an anime or something and that is understood, but the player is expected to use their imagination and view it in the best possible of lights.

With Too Human, one has to use their imagination more so in this game than we would have to for a game like Metal Gear Solid, God of War or Resident Evil. Not comparing the games just saying that I feel in those games the developer really managed to express what they wanted to in the best looking way possible. With some games, using your imagination in hopes of making it easier for you to accept it is damn near impossible. Haze, Lair comes to mind.

Doing that isn't an impossible thing with Too Human, but at times it DOES seem harder than it should be. I wouldn't be surprised if even SK quietly believes that it's harder to do than it should be. Which means, as much as I want this game, there are things I'm clearly not comfortable about when I see it in action. The real test though is when I get it in my own hands. I feel I would like it a lot more when I'm actually hands on with it.

The mounting of bigger enemies comes off as trying too hard to look cool and this is without a doubt one of the areas that would've benefited from a nicely scripted animation, but it looks a bit stiff, but that doesn't mean I can't learn to accept it and have fun with the game.

These very opinions now are ones that I've always had even before I saw these newest videos, but even so, I still have high hopes for the game because I simply don't expect it to be a bad game or even an average game. I expect a very good game that could've done more to achieve greatness.

Now the rest is up to me getting my hands on it and playing and judging the quality of the story. Yea, I might seem like a person that defends this game a lot, which I definitely do, but it isn't like I can't also see where it needs improving.

The game clearly doesn't look as bad as Lair as some have said. Lair was a total disaster in every way imaginable. This game doesn't look as appealing as it should, but it looks like a very good game with some solid foundations to work from, but fine-tuning it's presentation needs to be a top priority for a sequel. That's what turns people away. It isn't so much a problem with what the game is doing, it's how looks while it's doing it.

Oh and the music is crazy epic. Love the music.

So even if it turns out to be bad you're going to force yourself to learn to like it?
Indifferent2.gif


I don't think the game only has a problem with how everything looks, it doesn't seem like they're doing anything particularly ambitious or novel, yet for things like co-op it's lacking things like 4-player and one look at Diablo 3 even at this stage you can see alot more distinction in classes and skills.
 
Azih said:
All you haters just aren't *imaginative* enough.


I take it this means you didn't understand what I mean by using your imagination? :p

It's what I do and I'm sure many others do with any game they play whether they realize it or not.

Lets take a tales of title for example. Regardless of how cool the action may look while you are taking on a human sized boss of some kind, it doesn't change the realization that at the end of that boss fight that maybe if you were watching an anime of some kind it would've looked a lot more fluid and realistic (in the sense of what's considered realistic in that game universe) than the actual gameplay fight you just had.

We know that in a turn based rpg, in their game world, the characters aren't really standing around in orderly lines waiting patiently for their turn to attack. We imagine the rest as we play any game. Some games are so well done that you don't have to do as much imagining because the game really gets the message across that you are kicking the crap out of this guy. Sorta like a certain fight in MGS4. You guys know what I mean. In Metal Gear Solid on the PS1 when you fight liquid in the end the way you did, a lot of what was happening in that fight had to left to the imagination. In MGS4? Well people that have played it know what I'm trying to say here and that example, most of all, should really convey what I'm trying to say about players using their imagination to help enhance the effectiveness or impact of a videogame.

Well Kittowny, I see what you're saying, but I decided long ago, even with those very same opinions, that I would buy this game regardless because I have faith in it, even if it doesn't end up setting the industry on fire. I bought Naruto Rise of a Ninja knowing full well that I wouldn't be getting some truly incredible RPG game in the Naruto Universe, but I bought it anyway because I knew that I would be capable of finding enjoyment in it.

Based on what I already know and have seen from Too Human and even with all the opinions, positive and negative, that I hold for what I've seen, I'm still entirely convinced that it will be one of the more enjoyable games for me this generation. I'm convinced it will be worthwhile. The only way that changes is if upon buying it, I end up being disappointed with the story or the game itself.

I wouldn't be buying it at all if I seriously thought there was a strong chance that this game would be bad. Some are already convinced it will be, but I'm still extremely optimistic about the prospects for this game.
 

SPEA

Member
Shins said:
Really? I haven't read anything in-depth on the game in a while, but I thought one of the cornerstones of the game design was to remove the need for players to think about the camera. I'm actually a lot happier to have some form of control though, because my brain is used to isometric perspective for these kinds of games.

Is there a link to a preview detailing these different camera types?
Why yes there is! Well kinda. This shows the 'Close' and 'Iso' cameras. Denis also mentions there are 6 or 7 different types of perspectives, not 4, like I said before.

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/30783.html
 

Mifune

Mehmber
Endow said:
As someone who is also in this for the world and story, I don't understand how you can trust on someone else's judgment, specially someone you don't even know (do you?), on something so subjective. Like I said on a previous post "cliff hanger ending" is subjective and as far as the rest goes I don't see how where he says the story is bad. Quite the opposite. If you are talking about the ED's comparisons : those are just that - comparisons.

I was just expecting Kohler's impressions to be more positive, since he has been pretty excited about Too Human in the past. The fact that they aren't has me worried.

But whatever. I'm not writing the game off because of his preview. More rides on the demo, though.
 

Kittonwy

Banned
Endow said:
As someone who is also in this for the world and story, I don't understand how you can trust on someone else's judgment, specially someone you don't even know (do you?), on something so subjective. Like I said on a previous post "cliff hanger ending" is subjective and as far as the rest goes I don't see how where he says the story is bad. Quite the opposite. If you are talking about the ED's comparisons : those are just that - comparisons.

Or he can wait for reviews to come out and see if he still wants to get the game, otherwise he would have to throw money at a game without knowing whether he's getting a good game or not, in this case it's more of a question mark at this point.
 

Mamesj

Banned
Has there been any game with a notoriously long dev time that has lived up to the [banned meme?] it took to develop?

Even if the game is solid but not amazing, it'll get torn up. Add in Dyack and you have a recipe for serious meltdowns even if it gets 8's and 8.5's.


I just wonder how they knocked out Twin Snakes in record time...(and what the story behind Konami choosing them instead of an internal team is.)
 

Kittonwy

Banned
Mifune said:
I was just expecting Kohler's impressions to be more positive, since he has been pretty excited about Too Human in the past. The fact that they aren't has me worried.

But whatever. I'm not writing the game off because of his preview. More rides on the demo, though.

I agree, I think people should try out the demo to judge it for themselves.
 

SPEA

Member
Mamesj said:
Has there been any game with a notoriously long dev time that has lived up to the 10+ years it took to develop?

Even if the game is solid but not amazing, it'll get torn up. Add in Dyack and you have a recipe for serious meltdowns even if it gets 8's and 8.5's.


I just wonder how they knocked out Twin Snakes in record time...(and what the story behind Konami choosing them instead of an internal team is.)
For the last time, it didn't take 10 years to develop. Too Human, as we know it, has been in development for about 3-4 years.
 

BlueTsunami

there is joy in sucking dick
Dyack's "God Complex" is gonna explode in his face

But, fortunately for him he'll mainly be shamed on the Internet, where it ultimately doesn't even matter.
 
I say all problems would've been avoided had SK started this entire process only having faith in an internally developed engine and not one from a third party source.

That works for some developers, but it clearly didn't for SK. I think it's a lesson that they will forever have learned from.

At least I hope it is.
 

Azih

Member
CowboyAstronaut said:
I take it this means you didn't understand what I mean by using your imagination? :p
Take it as a comment that you're trying to convince yourself that you like the game and rationalising some pretty glaring issues.
 

Monocle

Member
purg3 said:
Q: How many players will co-op support?

A: Too Human will support 2 players over Xbox Live. There is NO co-op on the same console or system-link.
Oh. Goodbye interest. Guess I won't be getting this game after all.

Amir0x said:
Sounds awesome, definitely better than Lair or Haze.
2nsautk.gif
 

watership

Member
1up.com had a pretty positive preview just today, yet it's being ignored. People don't care if this game is good or not anymore.
 
Azih said:
Take it as a comment that you're trying to convince yourself that you like the game and rationalising some pretty glaring issues.


So to actually like a game you have to be in denial about where it needs improving? That's certainly a new one on me. That works for some people, but not for me sorry.

Oh and I'm pretty impressed that you are able to tell which games I like from which games I don't.

Bravo.
 

pn18

Banned
watership said:
1up.com had a pretty positive preview just today, yet it's being ignored. People don't care if this game is good or not anymore.
Did you see the latest gameplay videos?
 

Zenith

Banned
CowboyAstronaut said:
I say all problems would've been avoided had SK started this entire process only having faith in an internally developed engine and not one from a third party source.

That works for some developers, but it clearly didn't for SK. I think it's a lesson that they will forever have learned from.

At least I hope it is.

Right, it's Epic's fault...
 

dominuece

Member
Jeez Dyack, after posting on GAF and taunting us in general...I would have thought this game would convert everyone to your idealistic vision. Oh well, guess I have to play it first. This is supposed to be a trilogy right? Ha...that doesn't bode well.
 

Reave

Member
I'll have to agree with the surprise at this game, with an unbelievable amount of development time, takes just ten hours to beat. Not good.
 

Doel

Member
watership said:
1up.com had a pretty positive preview just today, yet it's being ignored. People don't care if this game is good or not anymore.
If 1up.com would take less than 5min to load a page today, I might be able to read it.
 

eve241

Member
Mifune said:
I was just expecting Kohler's impressions to be more positive, since he has been pretty excited about Too Human in the past. The fact that they aren't has me worried.

But whatever. I'm not writing the game off because of his preview. More rides on the demo, though.

Well I know I'm probably different from everybody else here in that regard but I don't usually play demos anyway. And from the ones I did play only two sold me a game in the end - Nights and Panzer Dragoon Zwei (both on the Sega Flash cd 2).

TH's demo will tell you a lot but it probably won't say much about the story or the mythos.

Kittonwy said:
Or he can wait for reviews to come out and see if he still wants to get the game, otherwise he would have to throw money at a game without knowing whether he's getting a good game or not, in this case it's more of a question mark at this point.

Yes he can wait. Each person has his/her way to judge whether or not to buy a game.

Still, I wonder how this topic would have panned out if the preview in question was Gamespy's for example (which is generally speaking very positive). And if the reaction was indeed different than it's really a shame to see that people's opinion is so volatile.
 
Zenith said:
Right, it's Epic's fault...


Where did I say it was Epic's fault exactly? If anything it's more that SK shares a lot of the blame for not going with their own engine. I was never convinced that the UE3 engine, knowing Epic's roots, would fit with what SK were saying they wanted to achieve and I was right.

I'm stunned to this day that Lost Odyssey pulled what it did on that engine, but then again, Lost Odyssey's challenge was more in the area of art and overall look. Too Human had far bigger obstacles to overcome.

Tom_Cody... :lol


When will people learn that how fast someone else finishes a game has no bearing on how fast it will take YOU to finish it. Mass Effect can probably be over in one or two sittings or it can last some people months.

For some speaking about reviews being the ultimate decider. I don't work like that. If I did, I wouldn't have bought Blue Dragon, I wouldn't have bought Lost Odyssey. I wouldn't have gotten Rise of a Ninja and I would've definitely fell in line with what was being said about Assassin's Creed and yet I loved that game. Too Human doesn't look perfect, but based on what I know and what I've seen, I have more than enough confidence to put down money for it and find out just how right or wrong I was.
 

eve241

Member
watership said:
1up.com had a pretty positive preview just today, yet it's being ignored. People don't care if this game is good or not anymore.

Exactly my point. I would have thought that would at least make people give it the benefit of the doubt. I guess people need their mangods to come forth and choose for them... the preview was by "1up staff".
 
10 hours? Hahahahah...oh boy. I hope it's an amazing ten hours.

Also, Cowboy Astronaut, you sure have typed...a lot...in this thread. :lol Too Human apologist confirmed.
 

WrikaWrek

Banned
watership said:
1up.com had a pretty positive preview just today, yet it's being ignored. People don't care if this game is good or not anymore.

Yeah. I love when certain games have nice previews then 1 month later they get crap reviews "Oh but the devs told us they would fix everything in the last month of development, you can't blame us for taking their word for it."
 

tanod

when is my burrito
Y2Kev said:
That's as polite as he can possibly say, "This game gon' get some 5s."

If it turns out remotely decent, I'll pick it up when it gets its first price drop. It can't be worse than Dynasty Warriors, can it?
 
This isn't bad news for me at all. Sometimes, games are better off a little on the shorter side. Kind of the Jaffe action game design philosophy. Ten action-packed hours of epicness is nine times out of ten, better than a slightly more stretched out twenty hour action game. And besides, Too Human is the dungeon crawler type. It's about building your characters, and such, not a 40-hour journey. I'm looking forward to Too Human A LOT, and can't wait to play it.
 
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