• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Xeno X, GTAV, Sunset Overdrive are leading examples of great open world design.

Warxard

Banned
Yesterday, a friend of mine surprised me with a Japanese copy of Xenoblade X (and his Wii-U!) to fiddle around in while I waited for Halo's new update to finish up. Initially, I wasn't impressed at all about how XenoX looked and played from the videos and had ultimately written it off for getting Mario Tennis instead. But after a good five hours into it, well after the Halo update had finished it really opened my eyes at how intriguing the world design was for an open world experience. Unlike other dull open world titles that I've played this year like The Witcher, Xeno's venues to explore felt less 'theme-park' like and more like sprawling worlds that are part of hub-based games. It's fun to dink around and adventure more than just killing things and doing stuff. The world design gel'd with me a lot that I started relating it to two other games: Grand Theft Auto V and Sunset Overdrive.

With GTAV, as someone who spent a sizable portion in the LA area driving through the world of Los Santos felt really familiar to me and almost nostalgic in how some of the avenues, expressways and underpasses were designed. Like the back of my head was screaming to me that everything was familiar. I've been here before, maybe. The environments are so delightfully varied and hits the tone so well with the LA aesthetic , that not even games with actual locations like Second Son, Watch_Dogs and AC could replicate.

Then there's Sunset Overdrive, which is wholly unconventional to its design compared to the other two. The game is designed entirely to it's traversal system so in that regard you see the building designs and layouts to compensate for that. That's when everything starts to get whacky enough to nail that 'Tony Hawk'/Jet Set Radio aesthetic: where everything is basically a ramp to do a trick on. No artificial parkour being plastered in to achieve little like in Assassin's Creed. The GDC talk explains the design better than I do

I think, along with other notable examples like Dying Light and Dark Souls/Bloodborne that more open world titles really should look into what these games settled in their open world design and apply it to theirs. It won't fix the issue with tedious quests sure, but at least we can reach a point where open world level design can be as engaging as linear level design.
 

Chumpion

Member
GTA V looks great for an open corridor game.

(EDIT: It's a jab at the emptiness of these so-called "open worlds".)
 

Neifirst

Member
I'm trying to keep a media blackout going, but the dribs and drabs I've read of Xenoblade Chronicles X impressions make it sound as though it's going to get a more positive reception than anticipated. Nothing was more rewarding than the experience bonuses you would get in the original Xenoblade Chronicles just for exploring the world.
 

Yarbskoo

Member
I can't comment on Sunset Overdrive or Xenoblade Chronicles X (other than that the world design is beautiful from what I've seen), but I really like GTAV's world. I just love wandering around and poking my head into any building or backyard I can enter. I'm not so much a fan of the wilderness areas, but the denser urban environments are such a joy to walk through, especially in first person. I wish Xenoblade had a first person camera perspective you could run around in.
 

Dunkley

Member
I feel like open world is unnecessary if you can't fill it reasons to explore it.

Reason why I love the GTA worlds so much is because there is almost always something interesting happening. You see people jogging, biking, just living their life. Someone might be fixing their car at the side of the road, the other time you go into the park and see a fitness group do their morning workout. It's fantastic how much attention to detail they put into those games.
 

-shadow-

Member
Just little over three weeks left. I can't wait! The world seems great and I can't wait to fly over it all and take it all in!
 

Warxard

Banned
I feel like open world is unnecessary if you can't fill it reasons to explore it.

I think the three I listed has very valid reasons to explore, but I can admit that a lot of everything else doesn't give me a reason to.

--

without spoiling anything, I really dig Xeno X and I feel really bummed bashing on its looks. It's great!

GTA V looks great for an open corridor game.

(EDIT: It's a jab at the emptiness of these so-called "open worlds".)
Well what do you mean by empty? Devoid of anything to do after the main game? Devoid of AI density? I mean, that's an issue that's universal with a lot of open world games and the only one I feel that really solved that is ...Crackdown I suppose.
 

Dunkley

Member
I think the three I listed has very valid reasons to explore, but I can admit that a lot of everything else doesn't give me a reason to.

--

without spoiling anything, I really dig Xeno X and I feel really bummed bashing on its looks. It's great!

Yeah, I edited my post to say a little bit about how much I appreciate GTA's worlds, although Xeno and Overdrive pull it off well too.

Reading over it I kinda realized it seemed more like an argument against these games while I wanted to say more about the games generally that don't manage to justify going open world. Basically I feel like these three games manage it well, but there are games out there that don't.
 
Dull? The Witcher 3 in my opinion is amazingly belivable open world from an RPG, where every part was handcrafted and feel different. With real populated cities and towns, with realistic number of people in them.
 

Ridley327

Member
Zero²;186034646 said:
You are lucky! Because X has it apparently. At least that's what gamexplain Q&A said.

Yeah, it offers up full camera control customization, up to being able to play it from first person. Probably less than ideal for combat, but it's certainly going to be something for the more breathtaking vistas.
 

Atwa

Banned
I think Witcher 3 has an amazing open world, so much stuff to find that is genuinely interesting. Much more so than in the sense that usual Ubisoft open worlds do, where its just the same few mechanics repeated over and over. Wticher 3 has stories, different types of enemies and a lot of interesting things going on.

On the other hand, Metal Gear Solid 5 I think is one of the worst open worlds in a long time. There is just nothing going on in the world, and just going around is just taking out camps of enemies to get new emblem parts.
 

Schlomo

Member
I think the point is that in an open world, it must not be too easy to get everywhere right from the start, otherwise it is boring. Xenoblade X really is very good in this regard. At first exploring new regions is daunting, but the more you level up, the more ways open up to you. In the end you can finally fly everywhere, which is all the more satisfying because of this.

Witcher 3 has the Pontar in Velen which is your big obstacle in the beginning, but apart from that it is much too trivial to just go anywhere you want.
 

openrob

Member
Initially, I wasn't impressed at all about how XenoX looked and played from the videos and had ultimately written it off for getting Mario Tennis instead.

105146-Ice-Cube-Friday-what-gif-dafuq-N9vG.gif

Bad decision man hahah
But yeah, totally agree with you, sick of 'open world' games that are just there for the sake of it, forgettable and ultimately add nothing to the gameplay. LA Noir is a classic example I can think of. Great game, but open world was wholly unnecessary.

Why I love Shenmue, as it's small size allows for meaningful interaction.
Similar to Life is Strage that I just got into. Really small, but everything is significant and actually gives a better sense of exploration.
 

Exile20

Member
Not sure why but i just never felt the need to explore tw3. I am just not gellung with that game.

I really liked lego city undercover also. Can't wait for x tho.
 

Amneisac

Member
Disagree.

Would you care to elucidate? I think what makes an open world fun is varied and meaningful content and interesting topography. I think Fallout 4 nails them both. There are so many awesome side quests that offer varied experiences and outcomes. So much better than the MMO-style filler sidequests in a lot of open world games.
 

KORNdoggy

Member
if you can't fill you're world with MEANINGFUL things to do in it (read: not the ubisoft approach), then it's a redundant element that may as well not be there. i'd need to see what exactly it is xeno x is doing differently before i consider it a success in that department. the witcher 3 is a tough one to beat though in that regard.
 

Kyoufu

Member
I played Xenoblade X and apart from going out to kill stuff there was no other reason for me to traverse that open space. The quests were all the same "kill X enemy" and "collect X from enemy". It felt like an MMO-lite although there are numerous MMOs out there with open spaces filled with varied quests so I'm not really sure what the deal with XX is.

I think Bethesda does a good job with their open worlds for the most part. Dungeons, meaningful locations and stuff in general that make me want to uncover all parts of the world map. I never felt any real incentive or intrigue with XX's large world once I realised each area is just a large arena filled with monsters to kill.
 

Skelter

Banned
As much as I like Sunset Overdrive there isn't much to do it. I finished the game and never went back. I'd say GTA V is a far better example because I can just go in fuck shit up and have a good time on my own or online. Sunset is fun but only if you do nothing else but fight the uhh, soda monsters while moving all over the place.
 

Warxard

Banned
Would you care to elucidate? I think what makes an open world fun is varied and meaningful content and interesting topography. I think Fallout 4 nails them both. There are so many awesome side quests that offer varied experiences and outcomes. So much better than the MMO-style filler sidequests in a lot of open world games.

Because I feel Fallout 4 is a much more emptier slate of environment in comparison to previous titles, especially New Vegas. The core thing of Fallout to make the open world appealing for me at least is the aspect of the role playing driving me to adventure out more, and the RP elements after coming off of New Vegas feel drastically diminished. I can't be this short spoken adventurer with a lust for pistols as easily as I can in New Vegas. The hurdles just throw me off.
 

Yarbskoo

Member
Zero²;186034646 said:
You are in luck! Because X has it apparently. At least that's what gamexplain Q&A said.

Yeah, it offers up full camera control customization, up to being able to play it from first person. Probably less than ideal for combat, but it's certainly going to be something for the more breathtaking vistas.

That's a selling point for me. I love exploring in first person. Maybe I'm just nostalgic from playing Myst and other first person exploration games as a kid, but it's just more much more immersive for me to play from a first person perspective.
 

GeeTeeCee

Member
Unlike other dull open world titles that I've played this year like The Witcher

Wow, I have the complete opposite reaction. The Witcher 3's world feels like CD Projekt spent the time making it feel like a real, living place - not just a barren open field littered with quest markers.

Everything I've seen of Xenoblade makes it look like a stock MMO-esque JRPG world in my opinion. Velen, Novigrad and Skellige have spoiled me for other open world RPGs.
 

Warxard

Banned
As much as I like Sunset Overdrive there isn't much to do it. I finished the game and never went back. I'd say GTA V is a far better example because I can just go in fuck shit up and have a good time on my own or online. Sunset is fun but only if you do nothing else but fight the uhh, soda monsters while moving all over the place.

Wait, Sunset has an online component too though? I don't understand this argument.

That's a new one.

it's not often one can precisely pinpoint the time at which an opinion was disregarded.

I didn't care for it, sorry.
 

KORNdoggy

Member
Wow, I have the complete opposite reaction. The Witcher 3's world feels like CD Projekt spent the time making it feel like a real, living place - not just a barren open field littered with quest markers.

Everything I've seen of Xenoblade makes it look like a stock MMO-esque JRPG world in my opinion. Velen, Novigrad and Skellige have spoiled me for other open world RPGs.

this. i'm yet to see what's so special about it? maybe Boo Boo'n can elaborate?

if anything it reminds me of white knight chronicles. which in itself felt like a boring MMO environment that you had to wander around in on your own.
 

tuxfool

Banned
Wow, I have the complete opposite reaction. The Witcher 3's world feels like CD Projekt spent the time making it feel like a real, living place - not just a barren open field littered with quest markers.

Everything I've seen of Xenoblade makes it look like a stock MMO-esque JRPG world in my opinion. Velen, Novigrad and Skellige have spoiled me for other open world RPGs.

Yes. This is very much the case, because shockingly they designed the world around the quests as opposed to making a world and populating it with quests.

The first Xenoblade was fairly MMOy from the combat system to a lot of the quests. It did have the advantage of a directed environment and story. From what I understand X doubles down on the MMOiness off the quests.
 
I Agree with Sunset Overdrive , but "dull open worlds like The Witcher" lol. I'm not sure you even understand what theme park design is because there are way better examples of that this year than TW3, in fact I'd argue that it's the exact opposite of theme park design where everything feels handcrafted, contextualized and realistically scaled. Also, Souls/Bloodborne are not open world.
 
this. i'm yet to see what's so special about it? maybe Boo Boo'n can elaborate?

if anything it reminds me of white knight chronicles. which in itself felt like a boring MMO environment that you had to wander around in on your own.

The aesthetics alone put it miles beyond WKC, which was just about the blandest, most generic world I've seen in a JRPG in a long time.
 

Warxard

Banned
I Agree with Sunset Overdrive , but "dull open worlds like The Witcher" lol. I'm not sure you even understand what theme park design is because there are way better examples of that this year than TW3, in fact I'd argue that it's the exact opposite of theme park design where everything feels handcrafted, contextualized and realistically scaled. Also, Souls/Bloodborne are not open world.

I don't recall saying that TW3's design was too theme-park ish. I just thought it was dull.

I said Xeno X felt less theme-park y. That's it.
 

roytheone

Member
Yeah, really disagree with your opinion on The Witcher 3. For me, it was one of the better realized open worlds in recent memory. Especially the fact that you can really see that there is a big war going on that influences everyone's lives really makes it believable IMHO. Compare that to the "civil war" in Skyrim that seem to impact almost nobody, the witcher 3 did it soooo much better.
 

tuxfool

Banned
Yeah, really disagree with your opinion on The Witcher 3. For me, it was one of the better realized open worlds in recent memory. Especially the fact that you can really see that there is a big war going on that influences everyone's lives really makes it believable IMHO. Compare that to the "civil war" in Skyrim that seem to impact almost nobody, the witcher 3 did it soooo much better.

I agree with everything here, but OP stated it was dull, maybe he prefers Theme Parks?
 

Warxard

Banned
I agree with everything here, but OP stated it was dull, maybe he prefers Theme Parks?

What? No, I never said I preferred that.

I simply said that The Witcher 3's open world is dull. It's boring. The game did little to convince me to continue exploring it's world. It's a fucking snore.
 
I would add MGSV to that list. I know a lot of people didn't like the different approach that it takes, but I find it really fun and rewarding.
 

SimonM7

Member
I think the OP is unnecessarily dismissive of other games, but I'll definitely agree that SO is a well designed open world game - especially from a gameplay perspective.

I think my only gripe with it is that the distictive artistic traits of the areas in the city aren't as obvious from an overviewing glance as they could be. I think it's hard to really get a feel for where in the city you are, and I hope- if it ever gets a sequel, that they have two layers of art direction, where one paints with broader strokes visible from afar, and the other lends personality to the nooks and crannies.

In SSX3, you have one large mountain that to a degree is an "open world", but it constantly breaks "reality" by having different lighting conditions in different areas. It's simply switched to night time when you come out of a tunnel at one point. Sunset Overdrive has a framing devise that could easily allow for different conditions in different areas of the city. Heck, it could be raining or snowing in certain districts. That would go a long way to distinguish them from one another from the rooftops and the air, where you spend much of your time.
 
Kinda stopped reading after you called The Witcher 3 full. Loved every part of that game. Very rare when you have a game and you can just walk around and find new stuff to do. My personal favorite moment in the game was when I was riding by a town and I could see a lot of peasants gathered around arguing about something. I had to make a choice then to either continue doing the mission I was doing or go see what the peasants were doing. I can't think of a game that actually pulled my attention away from what I was doing to do something more interesting. Fun stuff.
 

Berrigal

Neo Member
Not really open world, but I love the design choices and presentation of Mirror's Edge. Sure, you're pretty much railroaded most of the game but it feels way bigger than it really is and still looks and feels awesome today.
 

roytheone

Member
What? No, I never said I preferred that.

I simply said that The Witcher 3's open world is dull. It's boring. The game did little to convince me to continue exploring it's world. It's a fucking snore.

I guess The Witcher 3 is not your kind of game. For me, The Witcher was actually way MORE exciting and less dull then most other open worlds. The side quests and characters were so well done, I saw it like a sort of collection book filled with small little stories that were almost all interesting. There was way less boring busywork compared to most other open worlds.
 

Kyoufu

Member
I'd say The Witcher 3 and Xenoblade X are polar opposites of each other. TW3 has very strong world and quest design with great writing while Xenoblade X has fun combat. If you combined the two you'd have a complete game on paper.
 

KORNdoggy

Member
I would add MGSV to that list. I know a lot of people didn't like the different approach that it takes, but I find it really fun and rewarding.

i'd say that was an example of an open world that didn't need to exist. it was empty, and a total of about 5 missions even took place within it. the rest center around the numerous bases and outposts scattered around. combined with the corridor-like linear roads that separated them (felt more like ways to mask load times then anything) it was the very definition of poorly implemented open world design. almost felt as pointless as the worlds in LA noire and mafia 2.
 

Amneisac

Member
Because I feel Fallout 4 is a much more emptier slate of environment in comparison to previous titles, especially New Vegas. The core thing of Fallout to make the open world appealing for me at least is the aspect of the role playing driving me to adventure out more, and the RP elements after coming off of New Vegas feel drastically diminished. I can't be this short spoken adventurer with a lust for pistols as easily as I can in New Vegas. The hurdles just throw me off.

You might be disappointed after New Vegas because of the role playilability, but I think the world itself is way better in Fallout 4. It's kind of unfair to compare open worlds in games and ding Fallout 4 because you like what a predecessor did more with something not really related to the open world.

None of the other games lauded in the OP have any sort of "choose your own adventure" type of role playing so holding that against Falllout 4 seems doubly unfair.
 
Sure, Sunset Overdrive's is well designed in that it's fun to traverse but there's ultimately nothing to do it in but collect balloons and toilet paper. That's not what I think of when I think "great open world design". Great open world design keeps me invested in the world naturally, not by facilitating cheap collectathons.
 
Also I got to say I loved Sunset Overdrive but it's not a good example of a open world game. There isn't anything to do really once you've finished the main story. I tried playing side quest but all of those were extremely boring. Most of them I played went just like this: bad joke, go to this place and do this thing, end side quest with bad joke. Don't get me wrong the game is fun but man are the missions samey.
 

Corpekata

Banned
What does X do that the first didn't for the open world (beyond Mech traversal obviously)?

First game had a good sense of scale but there was often fuck all to do but kill some monsters and loot some miscellaneous random items on the ground.
 
Top Bottom