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Forbes column on PS4, Xbox 720, Wii 2 (next-gen systems)

Guy Legend

Member
An article with some interesting quotes about the console cycle and next gen.

http://www.forbes.com/2008/07/28/game-consoles-nextgen-tech-intel-cx_cm_0729consoles_print.html

PlayStation 4 And More
Chris Morris 07.29.08, 6:00 AM ET

Before we get started, let's get one thing straight: It's insanely early to start thinking about the next generation of videogame systems.

Developers are only just beginning to figure out what they can do with the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3. And you still can't even find a Wii on store shelves.

But the battle to lead the next generation is a never-ending one in the gaming industry. And while none of the major console manufacturers wants to talk specifics, developers in the know say Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo are already hard at work putting together their next systems.

Game machines typically are on the shelves for five or six years before a console manufacturer rolls out the next one. With the expense and success of this crop of systems--which have been out two to three years--it could be closer to eight years before we see the PlayStation 4, Xbox 720 and Nintendo "Us"--or whatever they end up being called.

"One of the things I like about this generation is we are still very early and there's still a lot of room for growth … as we move down those price curves," says Brian Farrell, CEO of THQ. "Those engines have a lot of steam left in them. We think it could be seven or eight years before new machines start to roll out."

Epic Games, maker of the hit "Gears of War" series, agrees. President Mike Capps recently said the company estimates new systems will not hit shelves until somewhere between 2012 and 2018.

Both hardware and software manufacturers are already gearing up. Work on Epic's "Unreal Engine 4," a graphics engine for next-gen games, has been under way for almost two years now under the guidance of founder Tim Sweeney. "It's not like there's anything to show today," notes Epic Vice President Mark Rein.

On the hardware side, the battle seems to be focusing on graphics. Nvidia, which powers the PlayStation 3 and fueled the original Xbox, is showing its plans for the next generation to the console makers in an attempt to woo them. Intel, meanwhile, is pushing its Larrabee graphics processing unit, which it believes will unseat Nvidia from its leadership position.

Nvidia has the advantage of a proven history, but developers are curious about Larrabee--and eager to see if it can live up to Intel's boasts. Meanwhile, Advanced Micro Devices, which bought graphics company ATI, is actively talking up its next-gen products with all three console makers as well.

While every developer has its preferences, they ultimately tend to be hardware agnostic--and will support whoever wins out. The general hope, though, is that the consoles end up using a shared architecture.

"The worst case is, Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo all pick a different interface," says id Software's John Carmack. "That's because you have to program so differently for [the different architectures]. … If we end up with a diverse set of GPUs [graphics processing units], it would make life difficult."

Laying odds on who will win the GPU battle is a fool's errand right now. Both Nvidia and Intel are still in the early stages of development and haven't shown proof of concept models for the advanced chips.

"The truth is, we just don't know," Carmack says. "No one has done the comparative programming to determine if one of these is better than the other. … If nothing else, we'll have games that are better than they are now, but radical shifts? It's too early to tell."

All of this presupposes, of course, that at least one of the console makers will go for the "more power" option and not follow Nintendo's lead from this generation. It's a pretty safe bet. After all, the thought of a next generation without a graphically spectacular "Halo," "Gran Turismo" or "Grand Theft Auto" is pretty difficult to imagine.

And, as Jack Tretton, president and CEO of Sony Computer Entertainment of America, points out, an advanced machine doesn't necessarily rule out a run at the mass market.

"As far as next generation is concerned, I think one of the distinct advantages that we have is we don't have to go in a specific direction," he says. "I don't think the fact that we have a high-end machine keeps us from doing bite-sized casual entertainment. I don't think we're relegated to PC shooters or youth-oriented casual games. We can span the gamut."

Nintendo, as you might expect, is approaching things a bit differently. President Satoru Iwata freely admits the company is already working on the Wii's successor (something Microsoft's Shane Kim refuses to concede). However, he adds that he doesn't view the hardware as particularly interesting.

"We are always preparing for the next hardware," Iwata says. "We are under development. … But the hardware is a kind of box that consumers reluctantly buy in order to play our games."

To that end, Nintendo will keep its development well under wraps until Wii sales dry up--in other words, not anytime soon--and developers run out of ways to utilize the system's interface (ditto).

Nintendo, though, is in an unusual position. With the company's huge success with the current-generation console, consumers are going to expect a lot from it whenever the successor to the Wii is unveiled.

"Every hardware needs some revolutionary features," Iwata says. "This time around, it happened to be we had a revolutionary user interface. Will it be the same for the next generation? I really can't tell.

"It's natural for the current customer to expect Nintendo is going to once again do something different," he continues. "If the people are expecting so many different things from Nintendo, it's going to be difficult for us to go beyond that expectation again."

Fortunately for them, they've got plenty of time to figure it out.
 

dankir

Member
Honestly, let them take their damn time.

I'm enjoying the fuck outta this current generation. I don't wanna upgrade for at least 3 - 4 more years.
 

camineet

Banned
LOL.

In 2018 we will probably have Xbox 4 and be close to having Wii 3 & PlayStation5! :D



2011/2012 = next-gen

2018-2020 = next-next-gen
 

duk

Banned
xbox 720 will be announced 2011 and arrive 2012-2013.

PS4 will be announced 2011 and come 2013 (prob 2014 in EU) :D

Wii HD will be announced 2010 and come 2012.
 
The quote from Iwata what I expected, though I would be extremely surprised if the WiiToo weren't comparable in power to both the NextBox or the PSQuatro. Motion controls will be the standard next gen and Nintendo will no longer be able to rely on them for success as they did this time around.

I predict all three boxes to be very similar in terms of hardware specs and controls but I predict that software will be the key differentiator. Nintendo will want to either mature the market they're gaining now or expand it even further. If it's the latter, WiiToo will need its very own Wii Sports, though I cannot imagine what that would look like.
 

whitehawk

Banned
duk said:
xbox 720 will be announced 2011 and arrive 2012-2013.

PS4 will be announced 2011 and come 2013 (prob 2014 in EU) :D

Wii HD will be announced 2010 and come 2012.
These dates are fine by me. 2012 at the earliest.
 

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
duk said:
xbox 720 will be announced 2011 and arrive 2012-2013.

PS4 will be announced 2011 and come 2013 (prob 2014 in EU) :D

Wii HD will be announced 2010 and come 2012.
PS4 - 2016.
 

duk

Banned
Seiken said:
PS4 - 2016.

if ps4 comes in 2016 expect even less developer support, sony can't be late to the ball game anymore, it needs to come out within 6 months of 720.
 

Deku

Banned
10-2 year plan!

stalin-post49.jpg
 

Danthrax

Batteries the CRISIS!
Iwata said:
But the hardware is a kind of box that consumers reluctantly buy in order to play our games.

See, this is what people are talking about when they say Nintendo is crowding out third parties. "In order to play our games," Iwata? It's attitudes like that which betray your "me first" agenda.
 

haunts

Bacon of Hope
Danthrax said:
See, this is what people are talking about when they say Nintendo is crowding out third parties. "In order to play our games," Iwata? It's attitudes like that which betray your "me first" agenda.

That's Nintendo though, for better or for worse.
 

Tanukid

Member
Great, 6 more years of the term "Next-gen". :p

Hopefully, we won't have to worry about moving to a new TV format while we're at it.
 
duk said:
xbox 720 will be announced 2011 and arrive 2012-2013.

PS4 will be announced 2011 and come 2013 (prob 2014 in EU) :D

Wii HD will be announced 2010 and come 2012.
I honestly don't know on what grounds you're expecting the market leader to have a shorter lifespan than the other two. Market leaders have typically had a vested interest in keeping a generation going for as long as possible.

In the case of this generation, the other two will want to keep the generation going for longer than usual too. This is mostly for profitability reasons. I believe that this current generation will be the last where a tech arms race will occur for a long time.

Mark my words: Nintendo will not announce its new system before Microsoft and Sony do.

Also, next gen will feature cheaper components and more modest specs in comparison high end PCs of their day than either the PS3 or Xbox 360 did when they launched. The generational leap may be comparable, but only because more time will have elapsed between the start and end of the generation.
 

Deku

Banned
Danthrax said:
See, this is what people are talking about when they say Nintendo is crowding out third parties. "In order to play our games," Iwata? It's attitudes like that which betray your "me first" agenda.

The analysis you're giving is out of date. The broader problem isnt that they're not making money on Nintendo hardware, they are, because Nintendo hardware isn't languishing in last place. The issue is that 3rd parties haven't had the smashing success that people assume they would on the other boxes.

A few lucky ones with marquee titles can sell a 6 million unit game. Everyone else has to settle for less in a more crowded field as well as Microsoft and Sony both ramp up their first party releases.
 
Tanukid said:
Great, 6 more years of the term "Next-gen". :p

Hopefully, we won't have to worry about moving to a new TV format while we're at it.

Yeah there is some new technology in TV's that will produce twice the colors of a standard HD TV which is about 10 years down the line.
 

Drkirby

Corporate Apologist
mckmas8808 said:
Give me the PS3 in 2012 and not a month earlier!!!
Fine, no PS3 for your till 2012 Sir *Contacts every store in the world not to sell a PS3 to you, and to repo any your currently own*
 
Considering how incredibly high all the console prices still are, how little HDTV proliferation is, how bad the US economy is, and how little of the consoles' potential they've utilized, I really hope there's a whole bunch of years before they even start talking about the next generation.
 

Agent Icebeezy

Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
Wow, they are already in a rush to get their analytical picks so fucking wrong again?! :lol
 

DrGAKMAN

Banned
Too many variables.
-world economy (disposable income)
-consolidating of developers/publishers
-new partnerships/aliances
-hostile actions (companies being taken over or dying out)
-hardware licencing
-new competitors (Apple?)
-broadband providers trying to put a cap on online usage/digital distribution
-mass piracy
-next-gen physical media formats
-newer wireless/internet/interface technologies
-heavier competition in the processor/semi-conductor feilds
-new developement API's, engines & middleware

Just too many variables before we even talk about each hardware manufacturer's plans/goals!
 

indie85

Banned
viciouskillersquirrel said:
Motion controls will be the standard next gen and Nintendo will no longer be able to rely on them for success as they did this time around.
Fuck no, you can keep the waggle.
 

Danthrax

Batteries the CRISIS!
Deku said:
The analysis you're giving is out of date. The broader problem isnt that they're not making money on Nintendo hardware, they are, because Nintendo hardware isn't languishing in last place. The issue is that 3rd parties haven't had the smashing success that people assume they would on the other boxes.

A few lucky ones with marquee titles can sell a 6 million unit game. Everyone else has to settle for less in a more crowded field as well as Microsoft and Sony both ramp up their first party releases.

fishing-live-bait.gif

Mmm, fresh 'n tasty



=P
 
Danthrax said:
See, this is what people are talking about when they say Nintendo is crowding out third parties. "In order to play our games," Iwata? It's attitudes like that which betray your "me first" agenda.
?

You're not really playing a semantic game with something that was almost assuredly translated, are you?
 
Zero_Phoenix said:
Considering how incredibly high all the console prices still are, how little HDTV proliferation is, how bad the US economy is, and how little of the consoles' potential they've utilized, I really hope there's a whole bunch of years before they even start talking about the next generation.


I could see the Wii getting a new console in 2 years. It will be the same thing as the Wii except:

-Wiimotion Plus would be standard,
-Hard Drive included
-High Def.
-Near PS3/360 graphics ( it won't surpass them still )
-DVD drive
-BC with original Wii games
 
next gen won't start until hd is 90% widespread. there's no reason for sony or ms to put anything out before 2012. until they are profiting on this gen, hd is in every home and broadband is in just about every home (digital distribution) they will lag. too much change happening right now.
 

Kadey

Mrs. Harvey
They can't even get half of the stuff right in this generation. There are only a few examples in my opinion of games that actually belong in this generation. All this HD hype and many of the games aren't even 720p native.
 

Kuramu

Member
What really excites me is speculation about the systems that come out after I die. I can't wait to not play those!
 
indie85 said:
Fuck no, you can keep the waggle.
It's inevitable. Don't tell me when you saw the Wiimote for the first time, you didn't see the future staring back at you with a grin.

It'll be far more refined than what we have now, I'd expect. Think WiiMotion++.
 

camineet

Banned
Oh yeah, and as if it needs to be said, there will be NO 'one console future'
or even 'one standard console architecture'.
 

camineet

Banned
We know as much about Xbox Next, PlayStation4, Wii 2 now as we did about Saturn, PlayStation, Nintendo 64 in 1992.
re: next to nothing.
 

Kuramu

Member
One thing that I find interesting... Every gen has had a newcomer, save one.. this one. Sony Nintendo MS, same as last time. Surely some company out there smells blood and is plotting a coup.
 
Kuramu said:
One thing that I find interesting... Every gen has had a newcomer, save one.. this one. Sony Nintendo MS, same as last time. Surely some company out there smells blood and is plotting a coup.
Who was the newcomer in the 16-bit generation?
 

camineet

Banned
AniHawk said:
SNK, NEC, and Phillips.


Konix, Namco and Taito were almost newcomers to the console wars too, but their 16-bit systems were all canceled.

Taito 'WOWOW'
wow.jpg


Konix 'Multi System'
konix19891284x1570963x11780uo.jpg


...No pic of the Namco console
 

ampere

Member
You know, I really hope it takes that long. Buying all three consoles killed my wallet and the graphics/processors are plenty good enough to last several more years.
 

camineet

Banned
I predict WebTV will break free of Microsoft and with the help of the 3DO engineers there, produce the M5 console for next-gen :D
 
BarrelMakingPenguin said:
Every time I hear the words "ps4", "xbox 720", or "wii 2"...I die just a little bit. I'm soooooooo not ready.

Yes! I'm still catching up on the PS1 era :(

viciouskillersquirrel said:
If it's the latter, WiiToo will need its very own Wii Sports, though I cannot imagine what that would look like.

I'm probably guessing wrong, but I think the next big step for Nintendo (beyond upgrading the hardware) is expanding the scope of it's online features. The big Nintendo game on their next console will probably have a large multiplayer focus.

*fantasizes Nintendo bringing Camelot in to make a Wii Sports game with extensive multiplayer*
 

bdouble

Member
perfectchaos007 said:
I could see the Wii getting a new console in 2 years. It will be the same thing as the Wii except:

-Wiimotion Plus would be standard,
-Hard Drive included
-High Def.
-Near PS3/360 graphics ( it won't surpass them still )
-DVD drive
-BC with original Wii games

That would fail miserably. If anything they would only release a Wii console with an upscale capability. Still that is even highly unlikely. This is Nintendo we are talking about. That is what core gamers want. Never ever going to happen and they probably aren't even thinking about it.

I don't see any of the big 3 hinting at a new console before 2010 release 2 or 3 years later. There are so many things going on with hardware right now (multi core, single chip gpu/cpu) it just doesn't seem right. Then you put in ray tracing and new rendering and things get real crazy.
 
Anything before 2014 can go and die. They better have low power consumption as well, because most disposable income will be going on utility bills by then since they seem to be going through the roof at the moment.
 
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