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tons of Atelier Rorona [PS3] pics

rykomatsu

rykomatsu

Member
Durante said:
Is there any information or guesses on who did the character design/art for this game? It certainly looks markedly different from tha AI1-3/MK style.

Yes!
Click to expand...

Kishida Mel is the 2D artist: http://maigo.jp/

And for people saying the graphics look bad...relatively speaking...
Last GUST PS2 game
m04.jpg

　　　　　　　　↓↓↓
First GUST PS3 game
rorona_54.jpg
 
H

Hunahan

Banned
Hm darn. I was sort of hoping for HD sprites.... but I guess it looks ok.

Atelier series has always been hit or miss for me anyway. I'm really not much into alchemy systems in games, though.

I'll probably give it a try.
 
D

Durante

Member
suffah said:
What's the combat been like in this series? Art is very nice, I can overlook the lolicon for gameplay.
Click to expand...
Well, in my opinion the battle system has been constantly improving throughout last gens Gust games with AI1<AI2<AI3~=MK1 (I don't know about MK2). And of course it improved greatly in the AT series as well. The most recent Gust battle systems I tried (MK1, AT2) are some of the most fun in all PS2 JRPGs I played (which are most of them). So unless their battle system design skills suddenly regressed I think it should be pretty awesome.


For the people wanting HD sprites:
Even in SD, considering modern 3D modeling/animation tools, doing equally detailed 2D animated sprites is really at least as much work as doing it in 3D. For HD, there is simply no comparison (3D artist work stays almost the same depending on level of detail, 2D multiplies, especially if you want smooth animation). And that's without getting into the issue of how much more versatile 3D models are (as long as you don't want to extract the very last bit of performance from a system you can reuse the exact same asset in exploration, battle and cutscenes, from all angles).
 
K

Kurosaki Ichigo

Member
Looks rough in some spots (and probably in other we can't 'see' right now like bugs, framerate, animation) but still better than expected for a Gust title. Can't say it didn't cross my mind that it'd look like crap because they didn't want to announce it until 3 months to release. Guess they were just waiting for Atelier Annie to be released.
 
G

gantz85

Banned
What I wonder is, if the Atelier series is facing declining sales, why wouldn't GUST make a whole new series and title it that way? So that they don't have to be burdened with the declining fortunes of the Atelier brand.
 
D

Durante

Member
Rykomatsu, thanks for the artist info!

gantz85 said:
What I wonder is, if the Atelier series is facing declining sales, why wouldn't GUST make a whole new series and title it that way? So that they don't have to be burdened with the declining fortunes of the Atelier brand.
Click to expand...
Yeah, because mid- to low-budget new franchise JRPGs sell like hot cakes in Japan in the past few years. No, those mostly have no chance even on DS so I doubt it would be a great idea to do the same thing on PS3 (though it might actually work slightly better on that system).

They did do something like that with Ar Tonelico, and it sold quite a bit better, but the games also had outstanding quality and probably quite a bit more budget than the average Atelier title.
 
rykomatsu

rykomatsu

Member
gantz85 said:
What I wonder is, if the Atelier series is facing declining sales, why wouldn't GUST make a whole new series and title it that way? So that they don't have to be burdened with the declining fortunes of the Atelier brand.
Click to expand...

Atelier hasn't been doing super well, but hasn't been doing super bad either for its main line titles (atelier lise, aptly nicknamed atelier freeze due to some major bugs, and atelier annie are considered side titles). They've dropped below 40k one or 2 times I believe, but in general it's sustained a pretty solid niche fan base.

Add to that, Atelier's known as the grand daddy (mommy?) of crafting games on consoles in Japan...considering this is another crafting game, as soon as it was announced, a lot of buzz/chatter started in regards to what the game would be like compared to previous series. Had it been a brand new title, I don't think much would have come from it, atleast at this point in time.

In addition to that, Atelier Marie and Elie are also on PSN-J, so it'd probably help boost sales of those 2 as well.
 
Y

Yazuka

Member
Omg! This game looks lovely. I'm so hyped for this.
Keeping every finger I have crossed that is comes to out in NA.
 
A

androvsky

Member
This looks awesome, I never thought Gust would make such a big step onto the PS3. Looks like they're set for graphics engines for another two console generations. :D

Hopefully this means a steady stream of Mana Khemia, Ar Tonelico and maybe a new series, all for the PS3.
 
G

gantz85

Banned
Coverly said:
9scephbear.jpg
Click to expand...

I just noticed the shop :lol :lol



Schopenhauer said:
The graphics don't look bad, but the game itself looks way too girlie.
Click to expand...

This. All the main characters seem to be female and the world is all curly and frilly.. is the Atelier series designed like this in general? It's even more girly than Eternal Sonata and there isn't a hint of EPIC in it at all.
 
S

Saiyar

Unconfirmed Member
gantz85 said:
This. All the main characters seem to be female and the world is all curly and frilly.. is the Atelier series designed like this in general? It's even more girly than Eternal Sonata and there isn't a hint of EPIC in it at all.
Click to expand...

I think the one in the green suit is a guy. Could be wrong though, it is hard to tell.
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Well the cell shading looks good the "realistic" textures look awful.



2ui7mlk.jpg

Looks at the road.

PIpwMJMHAXkF79kJ5SaHc88u9d7rkZEA.jpg

Looks at the brick textures.

ZHyJ41fjq378Q9JQ29tIKWBWTdP9a227.jpg

WTF? Grass Texture?


EDIT - Photobucket messed up the resolution but just go in the site and look at some of the pictures to see what I mean.

To me it's just a game with nice cell-shading and some extra bloom to hide the mediocre texture work. I'm not saying it looks like complete shit, but to say that this game looks "good" is really putting it at a stretch.

Seriously outside the cell-shading it looks on par with "Tales of Wii".
 
S

Schopenhauer

Member
gantz85 said:
This. All the main characters seem to be female and the world is all curly and frilly.. is the Atelier series designed like this in general? It's even more girly than Eternal Sonata and there isn't a hint of EPIC in it at all.
Click to expand...
The PS2 games that made it to NA weren't really like that, but I don't know about the prior games in the series.
 
M

madara

Member
Wow, what a shocker, that looks hot!
Abit of a Angels Present feel to it.
If a low tier developer can make a leap like this, I really want to see see the big guns use this style alot more. Impressive
 
B

B.K.

Member
gantz85 said:
This. All the main characters seem to be female and the world is all curly and frilly.. is the Atelier series designed like this in general? It's even more girly than Eternal Sonata and there isn't a hint of EPIC in it at all.
Click to expand...

I think all the main Atelier games are like that. The main games in the series all have a female main character and are named for her, like this one.
 
C

cruets

Member
my expectations were way low, disgaea 3 low, so um yeah looks good to me. if game play and story is fun i'll play it
 
S

SolidSnakex

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
To me it's just a game with nice cell-shading and some extra bloom to hide the mediocre texture work. I'm not saying it looks like complete shit, but to say that this game looks "good" is really putting it at a stretch.
Click to expand...

You can nitpick the texture work in most games, especially ground textures and textures that you're seeing upclose.
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
SolidSnakex said:
You can nitpick the texture work in most games, especially ground textures and textures that you're seeing upclose.
Click to expand...

To the point where they look like PS2 games? And how am I nitpicking if it's everything BUT the cellshading?

I mean I can understand if I'm saying stuff like "look at that latern" or "that pole". But when I say stuff like "look at the buildings" or "the ground" then that isn't nitpicking.
 
G

gantz85

Banned
Flying_Phoenix said:
To me it's just a game with nice cell-shading and some extra bloom to hide the mediocre texture work. I'm not saying it looks like complete shit, but to say that this game looks "good" is really putting it at a stretch.

Seriously outside the cell-shading it looks on par with "Tales of Wii".
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what you're getting at aside from technical details... Even stuff like saying "mediocre texture work" is strange.

Just show this to any gamer and they will more than likely find it aesthetically pleasing. It looks neat, the color contrasts are good, the character details are sufficient, the palette is suitably well-chosen etc. It LOOKS good.

Doesn't mean the engine powering the presentation is in any way a monster.
 
D

Durante

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
Seriously outside the cell-shading it looks on par with "Tales of Wii".
Click to expand...
No. no it doesn't. The difference will be particularly marked once you get beyond youtube resolution. Also, "outside the cel shading"? Really? The image quality and cleanness of that is the single most important factor to the style. Additionally, I'd argue that textures aren't really "realistic", more painterly, and I think the bricks (that you pointed out as lacking) at least work very well with the style.

I maintain that a developer of this size making a game that looks far better than anything with a similar artstyle released by anyone on previous gen consoles / Wii is more than commendable.

gantz85 said:
I'm not sure what you're getting at aside from technical details... Even stuff like saying "mediocre texture work" is strange.

Just show this to any gamer and they will more than likely find it aesthetically pleasing. It looks neat, the color contrasts are good, the character details are sufficient, the palette is suitably well-chosen etc. It LOOKS good.

Doesn't mean the engine powering the presentation is in any way a monster.
Click to expand...
Well said, I was getting at the same thing when I was talking about their smart choices earlier in the thread.
 
LiquidMetal14

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
This looks way better than I thought it would. What are the chances of it being localized this year or ever? I would buy day 1.
 
B

B.K.

Member
LiquidMetal14 said:
This looks way better than I thought it would. What are the chances of it being localized this year or ever? I would buy day 1.
Click to expand...

Probably not very good. NISA has never done a main Atelier game. They only do the spinoffs.
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Durante said:
No. no it doesn't. The difference will be particularly marked once you get beyond youtube resolution. Also, "outside the cel shading"? Really? The image quality and cleanness of that is the single most important factor to the style. Additionally, I'd argue that textures aren't really "realistic", more painterly, and I think the bricks (that you pointed out as lacking) at least work very well with the style.
Click to expand...

That still doesn't make it technically on par with most other PS3 games.

Durante said:
I maintain that a developer of this size making a game that looks far better than anything with a similar artstyle released by anyone on previous gen consoles / Wii is more than commendable.
Click to expand...

It still looks highly underpar, just look at other cell-shaded works on the PS3 and similar systems and the game truly pales.

gantz85 said:
I'm not sure what you're getting at aside from technical details... Even stuff like saying "mediocre texture work" is strange.

Just show this to any gamer and they will more than likely find it aesthetically pleasing. It looks neat, the color contrasts are good, the character details are sufficient, the palette is suitably well-chosen etc. It LOOKS good.

Doesn't mean the engine powering the presentation is in any way a monster.
Click to expand...

I never said that the game isn't visual pleasing, I'm just saying that I don't think it looks good technically by PS3 standards. And while it's visually pleasing it isn't an Okami.
 
D

Durante

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
That still doesn't make it technically on par with most other PS3 games.
Click to expand...
Not a single person in this whole thread claimed it was. I just checked.
In fact, earlier in the thread I was congratulating them on achieving such beautiful visuals without cutting edge technology or lots of art resources.

Flying_Phoenix said:
It still looks highly underpar, just look at other cell-shaded works on the PS3 and similar systems and the game truly pales.
Click to expand...
I've played Eternal Sonata and it looks comparable to that. Anyway, why should we care if it is somehow "underpar" technically? Even you admit that the game looks visually pleasing.
 
G

gantz85

Banned
Flying_Phoenix said:
That still doesn't make it technically on par with most other PS3 games.

It still looks highly underpar, just look at other cell-shaded works on the PS3 and similar systems and the game truly pales.

I never said that the game isn't visual pleasing, I'm just saying that I don't think it looks good technically by PS3 standards. And while it's visually pleasing it isn't an Okami.
Click to expand...


Hold it right there.. :lol

So right now you're saying that your comments are limited mostly to its technical underachievements (which none of us give a fuck about or gave a fuck about while commenting on its aesthetically pleasing presentation). But your post was:


To me it's just a game with nice cell-shading and some extra bloom to hide the mediocre texture work. I'm not saying it looks like complete shit, but to say that this game looks "good" is really putting it at a stretch.
Click to expand...

What else did you think we meant when posters were coming in and saying that this game "looked good"? That we thought it had excellent texture work and that the bricks looked photorealistic? That the leaves looked like they came out of Crysis?

Don't move the goalposts now that you've been caught out from your initial position :D


Dude, your technical complaints are understandable, but GUST is on a budget. The Atelier series hits about ~40k nowadays in sales, and a 40K game looking like this, to me, is a sign of excellence.
 
T

Tenks

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
It still looks highly underpar, just look at other cell-shaded works on the PS3 and similar systems and the game truly pales.
Click to expand...


I'm sorry but this game looks better than Vesperia from the limited screens we've been given. Ok maybe not better but certainly on par.
 
Y

Yazus

Member
Looks waaaaaaaaaay better than I tought. I exected graphics Disgaea 3 style :lol

GUST should license the engine to small devs as someone already said.
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Durante said:
Not a single person in this whole thread claimed it was. I just checked.
Click to expand...


When most people say it's "looking great" or "marvelous" I tend to think that they mean more then "visually pleasing".

Durante said:
I've played Eternal Sonata and it looks comparable to that.
Click to expand...

Eternal Sonata blows it by a country mile (IMO). I'd show screens but I don't want this thread to enter bandwith destory by linking to HD pics. Either way Sonata had far better texture work then this game. And that game was on the 360 not even a year after it released.


Durante said:
Anyway, why should we care if it is somehow "underpar"technically? Even you admit that the game looks visually pleasing.
Click to expand...

I'm just saying that while the game looks fine I don't think it looks "great" or "marvelous" especially when compared to other games that's all. I'm not saying it looks "terrible" just "not all that" especially when compared to other games.

gantz85 said:
Hold it right there.. :lol

So right now you're saying that your comments are limited mostly to its technical underachievements (which none of us give a fuck about or gave a fuck about while commenting on its aesthetically pleasing presentation). But your post was:




What else did you think we meant when posters were coming in and saying that this game "looked good"? That we thought it had excellent texture work and that the bricks looked photorealistic? That the leaves looked like they came out of Crysis?

Don't move the goalposts now that you've been caught out from your initial position :D
Click to expand...

:| I've already heavily implied that I was referring to it on a technical merit (which is true). When people usually said "this game looks nice" I thought it was for a game itself and not on its own merits. Being "visual pleasing" is anything but "good". Good means better then the average and "visually pleasing" just merely means "its passable".


gantz85 said:
Dude, your technical complaints are understandable, but GUST is on a budget. The Atelier series hits about ~40k nowadays in sales, and a 40K game looking like this, to me, is a sign of excellence.
Click to expand...

I've never said I didn't understand this, just that while the game looks passable it doesn't look "good" compared to other PS3 games it just looks on par with the average.
 
rykomatsu

rykomatsu

Member
Yazus said:
Looks waaaaaaaaaay better than I tought. I exected graphics Disgaea 3 style :lol

GUST should license the engine to small devs as someone already said.
Click to expand...

Is it possible that they're using a "lighter" version of say the ToV engine that NBGI licensed? I could see this as being, potentially, an experiment or laying the groundwork for AT3 which NBGI now owns the IP for...
 
D

Durante

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
When most people say it's "looking great" or "marvelous" I tend to think that they mean more then "visually pleasing".
Click to expand...
Well, personally, I mean "great" or "marvellous". I don't mean "technologically on par with Killzone 2".
Flying_Phoenix said:
I'm just saying that while the game looks fine I don't think it looks "great" or "marvelous" especially when compared to other games that's all. I'm not saying it looks "terrible" just "not all that" especially when compared to other games.
Click to expand...
So basically, instead of just expressing your opinion like all the other people in this thread, you set out to prove that we are somehow wrong to think that this looks great. Way to go.


rykomatsu said:
Is it possible that they're using a "lighter" version of say the ToV engine that NBGI licensed?
Click to expand...
It does look very close to ToV in terms of the whole aesthetics, so I guess it's a possibility.
rykomatsu said:
I could see this as being, potentially, an experiment or laying the groundwork for AT3 which NBGI now owns the IP for...
Click to expand...
I also had a faint hope that might be the case, but I don't want to jinx it.
 
G

gantz85

Banned
Flying_Phoenix said:
When most people say it's "looking great" or "marvelous" I tend to think that they mean more then "visually pleasing".
Click to expand...

:lol:lol

I'm so amused how you managed to maneuver yourself into a ridiculous position. It's good you left my other points unanswered, because you would've looked even more foolish.



Eternal Sonata blows it by a country mile (IMO). I'd show screens but I don't want this thread to enter bandwith destory by linking to HD pics. Either way Sonata had far better texture work then this game. And that game was on the 360 not even a year after it released.

I'm just saying that while the game looks fine I don't think it looks "great" or "marvelous" especially when compared to other games that's all. I'm not saying it looks "terrible" just "not all that" especially when compared to other games.
Click to expand...

No one is saying it looks "all that". It isn't even the thread consensus, which is more like "Wow, looks better than I thought." Quote a poster that proves your point, come on.



See, Tales of Vesperia sold 160K in Japan, and people are floating numbers out like 700K worldwide. Atelier Rorona doesn't even seem like a sure-fire guarantee for 150K worldwide, but it doesn't look like it's operating on a fifth of Vesperia's budget. It looks pleasing.

They've managed to hide that technical simplicity and present it as a VISUAL STYLE. That is exactly how Mario Galaxy manages to look so fantastic despite it being on a graphically weaker platform. In other words the world presented in the screenshots look cohesive as a whole style and I don't feel anything is out of place. As a long-time anime fan, the amount of detail in the screenshots FAR beats out any regular anime series (FMA, H&C etc) and so I really don't expect it to have detail like Steamboy.
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Durante said:
Well, personally, I mean "great" or "marvellous". I don't mean "technologically on par with Killzone 2".

So basically, instead of just expressing your opinion like all the other people in this thread, you set out to prove that we are somehow wrong to think that this looks great. Way to go.
Click to expand...


Jesus Christ. "Gust Defense Force" underway.

So me stating that my opinion of the game not looking all that hot and you claim that my post in this thread was to prove others wrong. Maybe because people wouldn't have agreed with me thus asking me why I think so, so I put my reasons in the post before hand. I mean I could understand if I was quoting people and directing telling them "it doesn't look good and here's why!" But no I just stated I didn't think the game looked so hot and listed some picks as comparison.

Durante said:
Well, I just read a bit of your post history and I think I can now tell what you truly find so objectionable about it. Have fun.
Click to expand...

Please tell me what you think I find "objectionable" about this.


gantz85 said:
:lol:lol

I'm so amused how you managed to maneuver yourself into a ridiculous position. It's good you left my other points unanswered, because you would've looked even more foolish.
Click to expand...

What have I "maneuvered"? I stated it didn't look "good" and even in my beginning post stated that "it didn't look like crap". The fact that you've stated "it looks visually pleasing and not on a technical level" support my point. I was saying it didn't look significantly better then most games (aka "good") not that it looked worse.





gantz85 said:
No one is saying it looks "all that". It isn't even the thread consensus, which is more like "Wow, looks better than I thought." Quote a poster that proves your point, come on.
Click to expand...

Umm how about "it looks marvelous", "it looks great", "Holy Shit! way better then I expected it looks really great!", "how can Gust pull that off?".

And you provide a quote from a SINGLE POSTER and I'm the one dodging and maneuvering?




gantz85 said:
See, Tales of Vesperia sold 160K in Japan, and people are floating numbers out like 700K worldwide. Atelier Rorona doesn't even seem like a sure-fire guarantee for 150K worldwide, but it doesn't look like it's operating on a fifth of Vesperia's budget. It looks pleasing.
Click to expand...

When have I ever objected to this? :|

gantz85 said:
They've managed to hide that technical simplicity and present it as a VISUAL STYLE. That is exactly how Mario Galaxy manages to look so fantastic despite it being on a graphically weaker platform.
Click to expand...

Why are you telling me this? I've stated that I comprehended this in my previous posts?


gantz85 said:
In other words the world presented in the screenshots look cohesive as a whole style and I don't feel anything is out of place. As a long-time anime fan, the amount of detail in the screenshots FAR beats out any regular anime series (FMA, H&C etc) and so I really don't expect it to have detail like Steamboy.
Click to expand...

Listen I have no idea for the reason of the backlash I'm getting. I just simply stated that I don't think this game looks that good and read the thread and thought that my opinion would be questioned so I posted some examples as of why. And for some reason despite me stating that I didn't think the game looked like crap I have people stating stuff like "it looks visually pleasing though!" which is exactly what my original post consisted of.

It doesn't look "good" (it's no Valkyria Chronicles) but it doesn't look like "crap" (it gets the job done. So which leads to it's passable or in other words "visually pleasing" or "works well enough for the eye". Yet I get posts about "Gust's budget" and "Super Mario Galaxy's ingenious texture work" which were things I've never even once argued.

It would be a very good idea to take a deep breath and step back to see what I was originally trying to get across.

If I was a little to harsh in my posts (though I don't see how) without knowing then I apologize yet I see no reason to laugh at me and claim that I have issues with the games style solely over an opinion as well as claiming that I never meant set out to enter this thread to share my opinion more so to attack others (these examples all aren't geared toward you) I have over a video game's visuals. :/
 
S

SolidSnakex

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
Jesus Christ. "Gust Defense Force" underway.

So me stating that my opinion of the game not looking all that hot and you claim that my post in this thread was to prove others wrong. Maybe because people wouldn't have agreed with me thus asking me why I think so, so I put my reasons in the post before hand. I mean I could understand if I was quoting people and directing telling them "it doesn't look good and here's why!" But no I just stated I didn't think the game looked so hot and listed some picks as comparison.
Click to expand...

What did you expect when you popped into thread and said "but to say that this game looks "good" is really putting it at a stretch"? If you don't think it looks good, that's fine. But throwing in the part about it being a stretch to suggest it looks good is obviously going to cause some negativity.
 
D

Durante

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
It doesn't look "good" (it's no Valkyria Chronicles)
Click to expand...
valkyria-chronicles-20080715104519998.jpg
Look at the ground texture!

Flying_Phoenix said:
So me stating that my opinion of the game not looking all that hot and you claim that my post in this thread was to prove others wrong.
Click to expand...
Flying_Phoenix said:
To me it's just a game with nice cell-shading and some extra bloom to hide the mediocre texture work. I'm not saying it looks like complete shit, but to say that this game looks "good" is really putting it at a stretch.
Click to expand...
Ah, that must have been another Flying_Phoenix.
 
rykomatsu

rykomatsu

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
It doesn't look "good" (it's no Valkyria Chronicles) but it doesn't look like "crap" (it gets the job done. So which leads to it's passable or in other words "visually pleasing" or "works well enough for the eye". Yet I get posts about "Gust's budget" and "Super Mario Galaxy's ingenious texture work" which were things I've never even once argued.
Click to expand...

I dunno...I relate the word "passable" with "mediocre", not "visually pleasing"...each person's descriptors are subjective so that sounds like where some of the hangup's coming from :p (btw, am i classified as part of the Gust Defense Force? :| ) lol
 
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