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All Russian/Brazillian (or similar) games on Steam now have regional activation locks
- Thread starter Salsa
- Start date
GhostTrick
Banned
Okay first of all:
I never said it was okay, but understandable.
Spin it the way you want but I doubt that UK sell games and blurays for 80% cheaper. And I know that REALLY well since I live in France and imported games from UK at times.
Games weren't locked when it was about 50% cheaper.
There's a huge difference in that. A currency just crashed HARD. The point here is to not crash the market too. If people are too much to exploit a system... it just burns.
I'm not defending anyone, I'm just explaining the logic behind this.
Say you're a publisher, selling your game at 50. Now currency in a country crash so hard that your 50 product drops to 5 times less its value. People buys it a lot for that price and the market is flooded with keys at this price.
What will the publisher do ? Ignoring the plateform next time.
About outsourced jobs... where the heck did I said this was totally fine ?
lashman
Steam-GAF's Official Ambassador to Gaming-GAF
... like poland for example ... a EU2-tier country (according to valve) where the average wage is around 400 per month and new games on steam cost 60 ... that sounds totally fair
Yeah It's our fault for not born in USA or 1st Tier Euro countries.
Same situation happened in Indonesia as well.
The dirt cheap living cost makes original games like a luxury in comparison.
speculawyer
Member
Seems like a prudent move by Valve.
not_so_special
Banned
yeah..monopolies like prudent things
lashman
Steam-GAF's Official Ambassador to Gaming-GAF
problem is - living cost here isn't dirt-cheap by any means ... ever heard the expression "eastern wages, western prices"? that's poland in a nutshell ...
justsomeguy
Member
Huh. Odd move after all this time.
OminoMichelin
Member
Good job valve, once again pirates win.
The guys at Valve agree with you that it's not. I imagine that has a lot to do with using euros rather than PLN.
lashman
Steam-GAF's Official Ambassador to Gaming-GAF
great ... so what's stopping them from adding PLN to steam? nothing, it's their store after all ... and yet - here we are ...
It just means I won't be buying as much, which means less money for Valve/Publishers.
The conversion rates on Steam are ridiculous for the UK(Europe and Australia, as well, and it isn't just because of VAT, the markup is higher than 20%), the only reason I started buying a lot again was because of cheaper prices through trading. I probably spent over twice, or even triple the amount of money I used to on Steam over the last year because I felt more inclined to buy stuff at a cheaper price. Games that were "That looks good, but £40 is too expensive, will wait for a super cheap sale" were now "Oh that's only £15? That's cheap enough to justify getting it early".
I'll just be going back to what I used to, wait for sales, buy less games, and buy through third partys(GMG and so on) or get a retail copy. Since those places actually have reasonable prices in pounds.
I'm all for poorer regions having prices that are better for them, but I'm sick of it happening the other way as well. The countries getting screwed aren't 'richer'.
The conversion rates on Steam are ridiculous for the UK(Europe and Australia, as well, and it isn't just because of VAT, the markup is higher than 20%), the only reason I started buying a lot again was because of cheaper prices through trading. I probably spent over twice, or even triple the amount of money I used to on Steam over the last year because I felt more inclined to buy stuff at a cheaper price. Games that were "That looks good, but £40 is too expensive, will wait for a super cheap sale" were now "Oh that's only £15? That's cheap enough to justify getting it early".
I'll just be going back to what I used to, wait for sales, buy less games, and buy through third partys(GMG and so on) or get a retail copy. Since those places actually have reasonable prices in pounds.
I'm all for poorer regions having prices that are better for them, but I'm sick of it happening the other way as well. The countries getting screwed aren't 'richer'.
Why? Pirates have always been able to get games cheaper than you.
That's fair enough.
I've taken advantage of a few great deals from the Russian store, but I certainly don't feel entitled that I should always be able to.
I've taken advantage of a few great deals from the Russian store, but I certainly don't feel entitled that I should always be able to.
I haven't found this to always be the case. Lots of games have a straight conversion from US $, or near enough to it.
Well in a lot of cases, yea, they are. They earn far more money, even at the bottom end of the wage structure.
I'm saying that those people should get paid the same for the same amount of work. Which they aren't. But that's totally fine, because multinational companies saving costs by screwing over workers in all sorts of countries is something completely different than customers getting the best deal possible.
You either go globalisation, or you don't.
Those companies don't care about people in developing nations. They simply ask for a way lower price, because they know that they wouldn't sell many high priced copies. That's all there is to it. If those companies can't afford that price, then it makes no sense to lower the price that much. We are talking about digital games here. 9EUR for something that is just some bits and bytes and that you can't even resell.
I never said that they should ask for 60EUR, but effectively they shouldn't ask for 60EUR anywhere.
not_so_special
Banned
a lot of people dont pirate if they found a decent price ( not the 9 euros of wticher 3) but 20 or 30 euros instead of 60
Well, this sucks. I only started to get into trading a week ago with the release of Blazblue:CSE. Which is still not available where I live.
Region Locking is always bullshit.
Pretty much what I've been doing.
Region Locking is always bullshit.
Pretty much what I've been doing.
I know that Valve used let you change region at least once. There were a couple of games that I bought when I was living in India such as Left 4 Dead, Counter Strike Source and Team Fortress 2. They stopped working when I came to UK, but I contacted steam support and they were able to change the region...at least that's what I remember. Also now I can play them when I go back to India as well.
Also why are people flipping out? These games were priced low for a reason. The reason being lower income in these countries, which meant they had to price them lower to combat piracy as these countries were also notorious for Piracy and because of the low prices they have been able to tackle it decently so far.
Also why are people flipping out? These games were priced low for a reason. The reason being lower income in these countries, which meant they had to price them lower to combat piracy as these countries were also notorious for Piracy and because of the low prices they have been able to tackle it decently so far.
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
Surprised it took them this long to do something about this. When I bought my Witcher 3 for $18 off someone in the B/S/T thread, I thought to myself "Soon..."
Yeah, but in your case you changed regions in real life. Those who took advantage of cross-region trading for cheaper prices don't have an option to continue doing so short of following in your footsteps somewhat and moving to Russia.
I'm not happy, but i get why buying at russian prices, with the currency in freefall right now, is not sustainable for anyone.
Charging the same everywhere just means developping countries won't be able to afford games.
What solution do you suggest?
A bit off topic, but I just tried viewing Russian PSN store through Russian proxy, and all the prices were in $, but I swear it used to be in rubles
I don't have a RU PSN account and the prices might switch to rubles once I log in, can anyone confirm?
If so, can you give some sample prices for games in rubles right now?
I don't have a RU PSN account and the prices might switch to rubles once I log in, can anyone confirm?
If so, can you give some sample prices for games in rubles right now?
Did you guys arguing against this know that because of people in the wester countries buying games from Indian origin store for cheap EA has ended up pricing an awful lot of their games for full western price ? This negatively affects the people in India, and it's a shit solution. What Valve is doing is much better.
Not all of them are like it, it depends what the publisher sets. I've never seen any games with a straight conversion. It has gotten a bit better recently, with more games having only a 15% increase over the US price(could argue whether that's acceptable with VAT). There's still some that's ridiculous, like the Ubisoft games which were briefly available for £50(Not a Steam issue, it's a Ubisoft issue, all digital places are charging that ridiculous price), and Namco Bandai games which I noticed when I was interested in Dragon Ball Xenoverse that has a fantastic markup of 26% over the US price.
There's an argument for some European countries sure, and even Australia(though not enough for Australia to be paying $100 per game). It's why Europe shouldn't really be banded together.
Well, you still can find good deals on a lot of games without using Russian keys. I've never bought a russian keys because I think that was unfair and people only were taking advantage of the unlock situation.
So I took the time to read through the whole thread and as I thought, it's just ACRTAG for all packages now (thanks Jase). Not too much of a deal for the grey market as they've started locking recent releases per default and a lot of AAA games have been locked by the publishers before.
Obviously sucks for games that aren't available in the respective countries but retail keys + VPN are still a possibility.
Obviously sucks for games that aren't available in the respective countries but retail keys + VPN are still a possibility.
??? If thats true is because of the state of the ruble right now... it's a shitty situation all around.
We've been gaming the system for a long time now but the ruble sank and now they're closing a loophole to stop us getting incredibly cheap games.
I get it. Fair enough.
I can't believe how many people here feel entitled to keep getting games at those prices.
They're only that cheap in Russia because people can't afford to pay what we pay, so if they aren't cheaper then everyone will just pirate. (as they historically did in huge numbers)
It's not a perfect system but you can hardly blame Valve for putting this restriction in place.
Hopefully now they follow it up by reviewing prices by territory so places like Poland can find their Steam store more realistically priced based on their economy.
(I'm fully aware that last part is a pipe dream)
I get it. Fair enough.
I can't believe how many people here feel entitled to keep getting games at those prices.
They're only that cheap in Russia because people can't afford to pay what we pay, so if they aren't cheaper then everyone will just pirate. (as they historically did in huge numbers)
It's not a perfect system but you can hardly blame Valve for putting this restriction in place.
Hopefully now they follow it up by reviewing prices by territory so places like Poland can find their Steam store more realistically priced based on their economy.
(I'm fully aware that last part is a pipe dream)
Why does this matter? People can get games + BluRays from UK for cheaper, that's a fact. So why not simply introduce region locking for all countries in Europe?
It's the exact same argument.
Then simply close down your shop when you can't afford those prices anymore. Otherwise it simply makes no sense to sell them at such low prices. Sell them in those countries, when they are on sale everywhere else. Problem solved.
Or well just look at average salaries.
In Germany it's around 2000EUR (and I doubt that is actually the case). In US it's around 3750$, which is around 3000EUR. Then why are the prices $60 in US and 60EUR in Europe? They should be around 35EUR at best.
In Russia average salary is around 28000 RUB, which is around 430EUR (!).
In UK prices are normally around 35-40pounds, which is around 43EUR. And that's even worst case. I bought plenty of games for 30pounds or even less within release week (which is in fact around 35EUR).
And don't get me started on prices in Switzerland.
Anyway, using that logic, you could also sell games depending on the income of the buyer as well. That's what Steam is effectively somewhat doing. Let's say a millionaire pays $1000. And some poor guy with a job at McDonalds could pay $20. It's the same logic as those super low prices in Russia.
So? Then you can simply close down the store in case you can't afford it.
When you are selling copies for 1EUR, then you are either a moron and will go broke in a short time or you can afford those prices. And like I said we are talking about digital delivery here, games without the ability to sell them. No physical items to be found anywhere.
Steam could sell 1 billion copies or 1 million, it doesn't really matter. No discs are getting pressed. Nothing is shipped anywhere.
I'm also pretty sure that there are quite a few people, who will buy it day 1 at that price and wouldn't buy it until it's on super sale otherwise. How many people in Japan are importing games from Europe or US? Not many I guess, although game prices in Japan are simply insane. Why can PS3 afford to be almost region free?
They won't. Steam is a somewhat monopoly. When you want to sell PC games, you go Steam. That's (sadly) the case.
Hamster Plugin
Member
Can American keys still be used in Europe?
European Steam is terrible, you can get retail PC copies at launch for 25% off the Steam price - at least in Finland. It's the same problem that exists in console digital downloads.
European Steam is terrible, you can get retail PC copies at launch for 25% off the Steam price - at least in Finland. It's the same problem that exists in console digital downloads.
Yes. Nothing has changed with regard to region-locking measures outside of the regions listed in the post I linked to in, uh, the post I just linked to -- that's still entirely up to the publisher's discretion.
I wonder how long it will take to see results of this decision. Sure Region pricing was there to lower piracy in countries with low income but i am sure it helped many indie devs or maybe AAA devs to sell more games and earn more money even if buyers were outside that region.
It is always better to sell something for 30-40% lower price than not to sell it at all.
It is always better to sell something for 30-40% lower price than not to sell it at all.
Derpcrawler
Member
That's weird. Isn't Baltic countries pretty much have same pricing as Russia? I mean I know how it feels, in Russia console games did cost exactly 65-70EUR, even with currency plummet prices came down just to 50-55USD for console games, which still is much higher than PC games.
Prophet Steve
Member
Hahaha, all the people being outraged at this decision and pretend it is a stupid one.
I enjoy buying cheap steam games, but they are not in the wrong here especially with the currency going down the shitter.
Of course Steam's prices are completely unreasonable otherwise. It isn't even like they are locking out all countries just the ones with waaaaaay lower incomes.
I doubt this will earn them less money as much as many of you like to pretend. There is still a demand for the games, people will buy it. These aren't all sales that wouldn't be made otherwise.
I enjoy buying cheap steam games, but they are not in the wrong here especially with the currency going down the shitter.
Of course Steam's prices are completely unreasonable otherwise. It isn't even like they are locking out all countries just the ones with waaaaaay lower incomes.
I doubt this will earn them less money as much as many of you like to pretend. There is still a demand for the games, people will buy it. These aren't all sales that wouldn't be made otherwise.
GhostTrick
Banned
Oh, then your answer is to not let Russians buy cheaper games for themselves, just because you want to pay 9 ?
Sir, you seems to be a generous person !
It's not about income of a person, but of a country.
60 isn't the same thing in France and in Russia. That's a fact. So your answer, to not make feel you bad, is to not let Russians buy games, or buy it the same price as you ?
How fair !
Yeah ! Steam is a monopoly... hence why you can buy games on Amazon, GMG or any other sites without Steam getting any money on it.
I'm sure that 1 billion people downloading are the same as 1 million of course.
Sir, that's a pretty high level of ignorance here.
FeiRR
Banned
Well, to be fair it's the lowest salary, not average. Average is around 1000. I agree about Steam prices though. I wrote a post about it yesterday before this was known. Valve doesn't care about poorer countries. Even Microsoft adjusts prices accordingly.
Fortunately not the case in Eastern Europe. Our retail and digital prices for PC games from other vendors are usually 30 to 50% cheaper than Steam. Check www.muve.pl, www.cdp.pl or www.gram.pl.
ehhhh i guess i can't game the system anymore for cheap keys for bigger games. can't particularly fault valve for implementing this considering the rouble crashed and how publishers have been putting pressure on them to do this for a while anyway.
honestly it beats the alternative of a price hike in those regions, because it'd basically make games unaffordable for people there and just bump piracy numbers back up.
GMG's 25% off code is about to become my holy grail of digital discounts
honestly it beats the alternative of a price hike in those regions, because it'd basically make games unaffordable for people there and just bump piracy numbers back up.
GMG's 25% off code is about to become my holy grail of digital discounts
michaelius
Banned
You should thank all the preuso businesses that sold russian or brazilian keys in western markets. Same people who destroyed Humble Bundle
I don't think anyone cared when it was done by gifting from person to person.
I don't think anyone cared when it was done by gifting from person to person.
OminoMichelin
Member
Except that paying for games on the cheap was better than piracy. Valve will just lose money from places that have lower-than-average wages but average costs. Poland was an example but there's also South Italy for example, where the average wage is 800/mo but games cost the same as everywhere else. Things like that is why piracy exists.
Not to mention people that made a living off selling keys. Not valves responsibility but still shitty overall. As a manager I can understand, but as a consumer, I don't like this one bit.
Mr. Luchador
Member
I hope this means that Valve are going to have words with Publishers about them charging +25% and up on the base price of their games in the EU/UK regions. I'm sure they'll do that, they're good guys after all...
https://steamdb.info/app/213670/
https://steamdb.info/app/213670/
GOG having a client isn't going to change the landscape much. Modern "AAA" games are multi-million-dollar investments and publishers want assurance that they're protected against piracy to some degree. That's (partly) why Steamworks is so popular -- it protects against the worst kind (pre-release leaks) without frustrating the user.
Bwhahahahaha.
GoodCoffeeJoey
Banned
It was only a matter of time before they clamped down on this.
Rather than region locking, how about pricing everything to the lower prices to begin with for everyone? I don't understand, if you want to stop people pirating you should just offer a fair price in the first place rather than overcharging.
People seem to think that just because you live in the UK for example you have more money than someone in Russia. While it's true for some people, the living costs of being in the UK and the fact that not everyone can even get a job means it's unreasonable to expect everyone can even afford the stupid high prices of the UK store.
this too :/
People seem to think that just because you live in the UK for example you have more money than someone in Russia. While it's true for some people, the living costs of being in the UK and the fact that not everyone can even get a job means it's unreasonable to expect everyone can even afford the stupid high prices of the UK store.
this too :/
Brerlappin
Member
I havent done key trading either so this doesnt really affect me. I have one RUS game, Borderlands 2, and even at that i dont know why, because i have a ROW version and the RUS version just came with it.
As long as you can still buy relatively cheap keys online i dont see it being the end of the world for Steam
As long as you can still buy relatively cheap keys online i dont see it being the end of the world for Steam
Chance Hale
Member
Well, at least I'll slow down on buying games I'll never play