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Sony is Building a Hostage Crisis!!!!! (List of Games to Kickstarter)
- Thread starter Immaculate
- Start date
Principate
Saint Titanfall
No your just moving goal posts on an argument that was flimsy at best. I never even stated or words to that effect that all of kick-starter was a scam. I stated Sony was taking advantage of backers I have stated my reasons to believe this.
Newtype-001
Member
Im not denying pre orders can have said affects but i thought your point was all pre order money was being put back into development?
texhnolyze
Banned
Skies of Arcadia remake, of course. Or a sequel.
Was there some weird backlash in the tech community when Pebble kickstarted the Pebble Time and got like $10 million after they had already kickstarted the original Pebble and gained success as a company?
People wanted the new Pebble and pledged for the kickstarter.
The video games industry sure is weird.
People wanted the new Pebble and pledged for the kickstarter.
The video games industry sure is weird.
Melchiah
Member
Sony's "Building the List" initiative has existed long before this year's E3. It started as a Twitter campaign, where people tweeted games they wanted on the PS4. I tweeted Amnesia and we got SOMA, which was most likely unrelated to that, but still nice addition to the library. I think the next step from the Twitter campaign was the announcement of Grim Fandango.
Hypereides
Member
Some people here don't think this is fine
Likely, because they believe some corporations are - if not all - sinister and greedy capitalists.
Some of those corporations thrive by succeeding in selling a desirable product to a crowd that demands it. Their sustainability depends on it.
I'm not specifically speaking for Sony, but, not every corporation out there is looking to scam people out of their hard earned money the quickest and most shortsighted way possible.
test_account
XP-39C²
You cant really say that this is extortion because you dont own the property. That would like saying that for example Nintendo is kidnapping or imprisoning Mother 3 because they refuse to localize it (they can easily afford it, but they wont do it (at least not yet)). Or saying that "give us $60 for that game on the shelf there or you wont get it" is extortion because you wont get the game if you dont pay (it doesnt really matter if they can afford to give it away for free or not because extortion isnt only possible if you dont have money to afford something. A billionaire that can afford to buy anything can also do extortion). If it was extortion, it would mean that us gamers owned the game/property, and that someone is taken it away from us, trying to get money, so that we can get it back. Its not extortion at all.
Those who own the IP can do whatever they want with it, its not our property. Its definitelly fair enough to disagree with business models, but saying that its extortion or anything like that looks like you're saying that you're owning the property, that you're entitled to it and have a right to have it, and others are trying to push you for money so you can get it back. I also think it makes it sound like the game is some living entity and the publisher is holding it hostage with malicious intense, which isnt the case of course.You have to keep in mind that games are products that are made to make money. Its not a living entity or anything like that that the gaming community owns and are entitled to. I agree that it sucks if IPs that i like arent made anymore, but i cant demand that people should invest their money into something which have a risk, only so that i can get the end product. I can wish for it, no doubt, but i cant demand it in any way.
EDIT: I added some text.
My wallet would not be able to handle the sheer amount of money I would drop on kickstarting that.
alexandros
Banned
Precisely. In my opinion, the PR departments of these giant companies have noticed that the term 'help' sounds a lot better to the ears of the core gamer. Again, in my opinion, you can only actually claim that you are helping someone when you don't have a personal stake on the matter. Otherwise it is simply an investment, pure and simple. That is not to say that the investment or funding itself isn't worthy of praise in some situations, for instance Nintendo's Bayonetta 2 investment or Sony's Shenmue investment. But it is a business decision, an investment. It's not 'help'.
Chocolate & Vanilla
Fuck Strawberry
Won't somebody think of the children!
Investment and help can co-exist. It doesn't have to be separated.
for good example see this website.
http://www.kiva.org/
HORRORSHØW
Member
lmao @ title change. fucking sorny. terrorists win
texhnolyze
Banned
I'd love to become a hostage.
Newtype-001
Member
Lmao.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
This is why buildings can't have nice things.
MS helping a game which will come out even without their help.
Sony revived a 14 years old dead franchise
Totally different.
People seem to just ignore this fact.
Ghost Slayer
Member
I agree what you said but in business you can't go out and say "Hey, we will fund this game but in exchange it won't come to platform X because it's our money"
Ghost Slayer
Member
I am making a joke >.<
Ardenyal
Member
That's the stockholm syndrome talking, snap out of it!
alexandros
Banned
I don't doubt it. Certainly the extra funds help developers make better games and put food on the table, but I think it is important for everyone to understand that the motives are not altruistic. Companies exist to make money and they will make decisions in order to further that goal. Noone is 'nice' for the sake of it.
ShogunDarius
Member
Suikoden, Panzer Dragoon, Azure Dreams, Vandal Hearts, Bomberman, Bubble Bobble, Guardian Heroes, Dragon Force, Psychic Force, Breath of Fire, Legend of Legaia, Alundra, Wild Arms, Arc the Lad, Rival Schools. I could name so many more, i'd back all of them.
...I get people being excited for this, I really do...but this really REALLY leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Mainly because I can see this backfiring in so many ways.
1. A Sony-back game doesn't "deliver" (either through actually not delivering or because of insane fan hype creating unrealistic expectations of the game) and leads to a kickstarter backlash. I think this will eventually happen because Sony is cashing in on hype and sometimes rose-colored glasses are stronger than any logic or reality.
2. These Sony-backed games take up the kickstarter page completely and drive many smaller studios and projects into obscurity. Alright, this one I'm not sure about but I am worried if people are so focused on Sony-backed titles, Kickstarter will slowly stop being used as its original purpose.
3. The realities of showing a game to be kickstarted means a large wait time and possible delays and cancellations. Thought the wait time of those three games were insufferable? Well, be prepared to wait even longer as game development takes time. It would not surprise me if Shenmue takes longer than 2 years to fully develop simply because that's the reality of the game. That's a long time to hold a promise and creates some ungodly expectations, sometimes expectations that no one can achieve.
It's weird, I do get some people thinking Sony is being shady (and I kind of agree) but my main worry is fan over-hype and over-reaction to things. Well maybe just that in general. I don't really like kickstarter much as a concept anyways because it really epitomes that gamers are more excited by the promise of a game more than the reality of a game. I do hope Sony can deliver on these promises because I can see fan backlash so bad it'd make the current Nintendo backlash like a mild disagreement.
1. A Sony-back game doesn't "deliver" (either through actually not delivering or because of insane fan hype creating unrealistic expectations of the game) and leads to a kickstarter backlash. I think this will eventually happen because Sony is cashing in on hype and sometimes rose-colored glasses are stronger than any logic or reality.
2. These Sony-backed games take up the kickstarter page completely and drive many smaller studios and projects into obscurity. Alright, this one I'm not sure about but I am worried if people are so focused on Sony-backed titles, Kickstarter will slowly stop being used as its original purpose.
3. The realities of showing a game to be kickstarted means a large wait time and possible delays and cancellations. Thought the wait time of those three games were insufferable? Well, be prepared to wait even longer as game development takes time. It would not surprise me if Shenmue takes longer than 2 years to fully develop simply because that's the reality of the game. That's a long time to hold a promise and creates some ungodly expectations, sometimes expectations that no one can achieve.
It's weird, I do get some people thinking Sony is being shady (and I kind of agree) but my main worry is fan over-hype and over-reaction to things. Well maybe just that in general. I don't really like kickstarter much as a concept anyways because it really epitomes that gamers are more excited by the promise of a game more than the reality of a game. I do hope Sony can deliver on these promises because I can see fan backlash so bad it'd make the current Nintendo backlash like a mild disagreement.
nelsonroyale
Member
Terrifying! Now I must go away and fund Shenmue 3
If a Kickstarter is the last resort for beloved games that wouldn't be made otherwise - that's an excellent opportunity for fans to make it come to life; just like Shenmue 3.
No one is forcing anyone to fund and it's egregious to police how other people ought to spend their money.
No one is forcing anyone to fund and it's egregious to police how other people ought to spend their money.
Stilton Disco
Member
This is a fucking brilliant idea, since it'll put the decision of what games get developed in the hands of the customers, rather than shareholders, analysts and marketing execs.
I mean look at the Survival horror genre. That died of for years purely because it didn't pull in COD numbers, and the people holding the purse strings decided the consumer didn't want them anymore.
This is the best possible hope we have for a return of mid tier, niche games from the big producers, and that's fantastic.
I mean look at the Survival horror genre. That died of for years purely because it didn't pull in COD numbers, and the people holding the purse strings decided the consumer didn't want them anymore.
This is the best possible hope we have for a return of mid tier, niche games from the big producers, and that's fantastic.
alexandros
Banned
Aren't they saying this exact thing when they proudly proclaim "Game X is coming exclusively on Xbox!" or, "Game Y is coming first on PS4!", or "Game Z has exclusive DLC for WiiU!"?
Do not negotiate with terrorists!
giancarlo123x
Banned
Give me games that I like and I'll pay good money.
Nikodemos
Member
Keyword. Lots of entitlement from concern trolls floating around.
The way I see it:
1) dev lauches crowdfund as leverage for pub negotiations. A successful crowdfund is a far stronger proof-of-concept than any other pitch. Backers represent a relevant segment (they are slightly above, numerically, what statistics considers a representative slice).
2) pub launches crowdfund for niche title and/or in niche genre and/or with niche mechanics. Given the aforementioned constants, conventional focus-testing is likely to produce inconsistent/muddled/negative results compared to people actually fronting their own money. Customers paying for the potential of a concept is a far stronger argument than any amount of focus test groups.
Does this risk turning Kickstarter/IndieGoGo into preorder sites, basically? No, because there's no 'risk'. That's a good bit of what they were from the very beginning.
Agreed! This allows a lot of mid tier games to make it on their own without being at the mercy of a publisher or being forced into another creative direction.
Seth Balmore
Member
I'm ready to negotiate with these kidnappers whenever they're willing to state their terms (aka LET'S SEE THAT LIST).
I honestly think the Kickstarter was more to prove to SEGA that there was a market for this and let Yu Suzuki have the license to make the game. Not necessarily proving to Sony that there was a market for it. Because obviously their whole building the list campaign told them that there was.