Spyder_Monkey
Banned
Maybe NX isn't as big of a deal to Nintendo as we think it is.
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Gaming Bolt: Unravel dev: Nintendo is very secretive about NX, Unravel port talk.
- Thread starter BY2K
- Start date
A few months ago. He said he heard it was awesome and surprising and had really tight NDAs.
Oh it is alright but Nintendo think they don't really need indy devs, nor do they need Western AAA. Handheld, Japanese centric all the way.
Like WiiU? Even Nintendo couldn't figure out how to demo what the separate screen added, other than off TV play.
Milly Osworth
Member
The only good idea the WiiU has is inventory and typing on the touchscreen. But since it ruins battery life and makes the controller expensive, I guess that's why noone copies that.
Asynchronous multiplayer
I'm still not seeing why you need to know the hardware for an idea pitch for a game. We hear from developers all the time that "we need to differentiate our games to meet (insert Nintendo's newest hardware tat)" and contort their game concepts into horrid messes doing it. Perhaps Nintendo doesn't want them to conceive of their games based solely around the hardware itself? It's not a terrible idea, considering some of the ideas born from their previous hardware concepts at launch. They clearly want compelling software, not software that fits the hardware narrative.
It doesn't matter if its Sony, Microsoft or Nintendo when it comes to the earliest devkits. They go to preferred partners and expand out from there. All 3 remain extremely selective especially when the device itself hasn't even gone public yet.
The Unravel Dev frankly based on their own development history really hasn't made anything that would move them to the front of anyone's line.
PlayStation Move Fitness, Ski-Doo Challenge, Freakout, Skiracing 2005,20006
The Unravel Dev frankly based on their own development history really hasn't made anything that would move them to the front of anyone's line.
PlayStation Move Fitness, Ski-Doo Challenge, Freakout, Skiracing 2005,20006
Welp.. there it is.
Now let's just wait till all this secrecy bites Nintendo in the ass.
Should be fun.
DaSorcerer7
Member
Exactly, a few months ago the WSJ reported that SDKs were being distributed to third-party devs, people acting like no one knows what this thing is or no games are being developed for it.
I think who they want to have kits have them. Everyone else has to wait until they're ready to open the environment to more people. I honestly don't see what the problem is with these guys not getting a kit. It's obvious they're out in the wild as EA apparently has some. Ubisoft probably does, too. Indie devs will get them when they're ready to roll out that phase of development.
It most certainly is. Their profit margins as a company still, as of now, completely banks on the success of their hardware and software. They are attempting to spread that out with amiibo, theme parks, movies, and health - but reality is that those are still, profit wise, secondary - and some of that only stays as relevant as Nintendo's platforms and games stay relevant.
So the NX is massively important for the future of the entire company. Nintendo knows that.
Nintendo is being intentionally selective. They will unleash the ability for everyone to have a kit after they announce the platform. A game like unravel can probably already run on Wii U if the developer really wanted it to, and Nintendo has an entire team in NoA that deals just with indie titles - so they most definitely care about their indie success. The Wii U itself has a really good indie library. IT's one of the best aspects of the console.
I am mostly glad to hear the rumored report that EA has had a dev kit for some time. Not because lol EA, but because it means Nintendo is at least ATTEMPTING to reach out to major western devs at an earlier stage. It could crash and burn like it did with the Wii U, but they are trying and that matters.
We'll see if the NX delivers. I would also love to see Nintendo working WITH 3rd parties more for marketing reasons. SOny and Xbox do this a lot - and it would really attract 3rd parties knowing Nintendo will help promote your product to their fans.
KratosEnergyDrink
Member
It seems some indie developers already got NX kits. This developer seems a bit ... unprofessional. What is so hard about making a pitch? It's every developers bread & butter.
The way he complains now public about this, seems it was a wise move not give him a dev kit.
People who likes to go public with such things are obviously not the right choice for dev kits, that should be keep secret until launch.
The way he complains now public about this, seems it was a wise move not give him a dev kit.
People who likes to go public with such things are obviously not the right choice for dev kits, that should be keep secret until launch.
Oh shit.....
This is the fourth time I'm hearing this but coming from you that about seals it for me. We got another Nintendo box people. NX will be good for Nintendo games only.
Im not sure what exactly this means but when i hear that term i think of l4d and evolve.
So, when WSJ says dev kits are getting distributed, it's false. When you get DQXI announced basically, it's false. When you have rumours about EA among the first to get dev kits, it's false. But only negative rumours can be believed here as the dogma. Why?
Snark aside, I think (again) it's a matter of scheduling. There are "key partners" that have been working with dev kits for a while (at first, I thought mainly from Japan, but now we're getting more rumours from the West, maybe - not just referring to Trev's source), it also depends on what departments / teams in major devs received the dev kits (EA being among the first to get dev kits and Arkam report which was 90% about a team inside EA can be coherent stories between each other if dev kits were first distributed to developers related mainly to EA's engines, as Thraktor said). If we believe Trev's source (the third party developer trying to get their game on NX), there's a date for "public dev kit distribution" incoming, and there's also the possibility of Early Access to those kits, but it implies intricate bureucratic iter. I suppose the vast majority of indie developers and publishers outside of key partners are among this group that has yet to get dev kits. I said "vast majority of indie developers" because I have a feeling there are some of them (mostly, indie developers with a long and successful history on Nintendo consoles) who could be ranked among "key partners". And let's not forget the much tighter NDAs, which could even result in developers lying about wheter they know about NX or not (it's extreme, but given recent rumours and how many times it has been stated that NDAs are much tighter than in the past, it's not that impossible IMHO).
Not that there aren't sincere stories of developers who really have to get a look inside NX (it fits with the schedule and the Ori's dev who posted here about not getting answers from Nintendo when he asked about NX dev kits), but I suppose there's a mix of plenty of things going on behind the curtains, and not going on yet.
Doczu
Member
So that's why he's omitted in the Smash roster...
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
For everyone freaking out:
If I'm not mistaken, it is standard for specific publishers/devs to get devkits first and then, once things are solidified, it spreads further. Why is everyone on edge about this?
If I'm not mistaken, it is standard for specific publishers/devs to get devkits first and then, once things are solidified, it spreads further. Why is everyone on edge about this?
Because the spreading further part should've happened already if you want them to port software in time for launch.
I'm going to attempt a rational explanation, rather than going for Option 1) "Looool Nintendo are dumb" or Option 2) "Pffft, Who cares they're only Indies"
Honestly, imo this just boils down to what type of developer you are.
Nintendo likely doesn't currently want to put it in the hands of smaller devs/Indies who will rely on really good engine support from the get go (ie UE4, Unity etc all up and running perfectly) because that support isn't there yet. Maybe the environment is just not suitable for them yet because the engine they require does not currently have mature support on NX. This has been a problem before and maybe Nintendo want to avoid that this time.
(This sentiment was expressed by Ori Dev Thomas Mahler in this very thread, quote below
So it kind of makes sense that only the 'big boys' of development (EA at al) probably have had their hands on it for some time. They will be the ones who are essentially helping Nintendo build those tools and develop that engine support. Once its a more functional platform, it will be much more useable to smaller developers.
Honestly, imo this just boils down to what type of developer you are.
Nintendo likely doesn't currently want to put it in the hands of smaller devs/Indies who will rely on really good engine support from the get go (ie UE4, Unity etc all up and running perfectly) because that support isn't there yet. Maybe the environment is just not suitable for them yet because the engine they require does not currently have mature support on NX. This has been a problem before and maybe Nintendo want to avoid that this time.
(This sentiment was expressed by Ori Dev Thomas Mahler in this very thread, quote below
Mahler said:
So it kind of makes sense that only the 'big boys' of development (EA at al) probably have had their hands on it for some time. They will be the ones who are essentially helping Nintendo build those tools and develop that engine support. Once its a more functional platform, it will be much more useable to smaller developers.
Didnt we just get someone in that ea/nintendo thread say a huge 3rd party game is being developed for nx right now? Lets not jump to any big conclusions based on the unravel dev. Im sure there's more nuance going on here and it isnt just black or white. Its like everyone is looking to confirm their narrative but we really have no clue whats going on and we def don't have the details. Lets be honest though, if it was Nintendo's intention to keep this console a secret, the people that should have devkits probably have them and cant say anything. They probably made a good call being cautious with this guy, I'd say the professional thing to do is to know blast Nintendo while while being interviewed on your game. Devs like this will get their chance because we know one thing Nintendo nailed with the Wii U is indies and I dont think that will suddenly stop.
lwilliams3
Member
It was a person from one of the old NX threads. I will have to look it up.
Hmm, I noticed that you used the word, "a lot", instead of saying something like, "all the devs I know," so that is something.
As for the current secrecy, I guess that fiasco with Wii U's leaks has got them even more paranoid than before. In either case, I hope that Nintendo will be more open to details for devs ASAP.
Firstly, maybe it has happened, just not for this dev.
Secondly, why do they necessarily have to be ready for launch? We've no idea how many games are already well into development for the launch period.
Thirdly - that's a fairly broad statement to make either way. If the platform is as mature and bug free as possible - maybe it will be that easy to get your game up and running bewteen now and the rumoured launch window (Q4 2016)? Who knows.
Did Sony hand PS4 dev kit to indie devs that didn't work closely with Sony in the past before the PS4 was announced?
Got wind about it from one of the engine providers.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
The problem is he doesnt know a thing about NX, therefore he cant pitch anything. He have no idea if its a handheld or a console, how many buttons it have, what other input methods it have, its limitations and stuffs.
What if he pitch a fighting game which require bunch of buttons but the NX ended up only have a touch screen just for example? What if he create a game demo prototype with a game engine only to find its not compatible with the NX?
Well murphy's law. Nintendo should be preparing for the worst case scenarios and try to get every single devs on board early, in case of unforeseen circumstances like delays of some other launch titles.
DaSorcerer7
Member
There you go.
Herb Alpert
Banned
I hope this is true. It certainly makes sense.
Because it gives people a cheap story that follows a narrative they already believe. Without caring about the details, all they hear is "UH OH NINTENDO ISNT GONNA HAVE 3RD PARTIES AGAIN, THEY DONT CARE ABOUT 3RD PARTY DEVS".
Handing out undercooked Devkits* and having unstable development environments has bitten Nintendo in the a$$ quite recently (early WiiU devkits with their rapidly moving specs, missing engine support etc).
The other more simple answer is: We are much, much earlier on in the NX development cycle than we think we are.
*Obviously they are constantly evolving and progressing; that's not what i'm talking about.
You should edit your quote, considering M3d1on edited his own post already. Let's keep people safe
DaSorcerer7
Member
You should edit your quote, considering M3d1on edited his own post already. Let's keep people safe
Done.
Interesting to note the dramatic turnaround in Sony's marketing nouse and skills in between the PS3 and PS4 launch. The launch of the PS3 was muted and the years afterwards were a succession of mistakes and bad communication - with developers as well as consumers. They absolutely learnt from that though for the PS4 launch
I wonder if Nintendo can do the same?
lwilliams3
Member
Interesting, M3d10n. What we are hearing appears to match up with the other rumors and talks.
The more I read thomasmahler's comment the more he seems to be kind of contradicting himself (unless I'm misunderstanding?)...
On one hand he's rightly asking for Engine support (UE4, Unity etc I presume) to be ready "waaaaay before release". But on the other hand, he's complaining his company doesn't have early access to a devkit.
For engine support to be mature enough to keep him and other smaller devs happy, there has to be a period where other developers (read: those developing said engine support) have devkits and he doesn't.
He can't have both early access to the devkit AND a devkit with mature support for game development engines. Seems like it's one or the other and maybe that's why Nintendo are picking and choosing who gets one right now.
On one hand he's rightly asking for Engine support (UE4, Unity etc I presume) to be ready "waaaaay before release". But on the other hand, he's complaining his company doesn't have early access to a devkit.
For engine support to be mature enough to keep him and other smaller devs happy, there has to be a period where other developers (read: those developing said engine support) have devkits and he doesn't.
He can't have both early access to the devkit AND a devkit with mature support for game development engines. Seems like it's one or the other and maybe that's why Nintendo are picking and choosing who gets one right now.
...Ok, where's the source for that. That would change the conversation over here quite a bit.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
i think its better than not handling anything out at all. Handing out early dev kits allows the devs to have a basic idea about the platform, time for R&D for the new platform also and start the pre production at the very least, and Nintendo can update them with newer dev kits every several months for them to build and update their games.
Its never too early to have the devs make games for the platform.
Graphics Horse
Member
It's not like PS4 had a whole host of indie games from day one. What was there, Contrast? Trine 2 if that counts, but that one hit Wii U launch too!
Herb Alpert
Banned
Really? Can you confirm, it could stop some Nintendoomed talks here.