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Polygon: Xbox Scorpio will be a ~6 TFLOP system (v PS4K's 4.14), unveil soon, Fall 17
- Thread starter BUNTING1243
- Start date
SneakersSO
Member
Except the product at the end of the 12 months is still highly dependent on the X1 still maintaining a strong growth in its marketshare, at least something that keeps up in somewhat relative pace with the PS4. Remember, these are iterative consoles, not a new generation; the base X1 & PS4 are still a part of their respective marketshares. And the games released & developed for these upgrades will need to maintain forward compatibility with their predecessor.
MaulerX
Member
Honest question here. If Scorpio is the only Xbox model that does VR (Rift), doesn't that mean that devs can exploit that hardware to the max for that purpose? If VR devs have to deal with the least common denominator for PSVR (PS4) then how do you expect multiplatform VR games to perform on the PS4? PS4 to Scorpio is a massive gap in power. Going into the future I would imagine that as far as VR is concerned, the PS4 would be the last thing you'd want.
Before Neo SDK leak DF posted article in which they speculated about 3 possible hardware upgrades paths PS4K could go with.
They also have their own sources, so they could just "confirm" again what Kotaku/Polygon have said about Scorpio.
SneakersSO
Member
PSVR comes with an external processing unit that plugs into the PS4. The tech upgrade of the Neo, in theory, brings that processing power into a singular boxed product.
Expect a Neo + PSVR headset only bundle to launch sometime at the end of next year, with a new VR focused controller solution that I also imagine Sony will launch next year.
VR devs developing for consoles will aim for the largest console install base, and that will be the PS4.
For any multiplatform console VR game, the base PS4 model will likely be the target spec.
Is this not like a new console? Normally a console provides 5 to 10x more power in going from one cycle to next cycle.
Also I think it makes no sense to keep the backward compatibility as it will restrict the developers by tying them tu small user base but if they don't keep backward compatibility they might alienate the existing user
Also I think it makes no sense to keep the backward compatibility as it will restrict the developers by tying them tu small user base but if they don't keep backward compatibility they might alienate the existing user
MaulerX
Member
Maximilian Kolbe
Member
Well when developers make a game for Rift, it's for "Rift" not for "Xbox Scorpio", because Rift is VR for PC since beginning, so they can just simply port the game to Scorpio.
Oculus Rift VR is a platform; Scorpio will be able to use that platform.
Devs that make multiplat console VR games (using PSVR and OR) will target the lowest common denominator, which will be PS4 specs.
MaulerX
Member
Well all of a sudden I'm not that excited for VR on consoles going forward tbh. At least for multiplatform games. Will be looking forward to the exclusive stuff on Scorpio thou. Such a massive gap in power only to be bottlenecked by the least common denominator is somewhat disappointing. But I guess that's the way it'll be.
What is scorpio vr? PC vr? It is only compatible with a known vr system, not made for it.
Oculus has a way bigger install base like all other pc vr systems have. Scorpio is also only another system compatible with Oculus.
I think that it's time to stop the old way of thinking ms vs Sony. They are drifting apart.
Or they will leave it out at some point as ps4k would make sense but Sony forbids to make only games for that.
The ps4 would be a really low low for future vr games, with the possibility to become an obstacle for many games.
Releasing a next version in 2018 would be a big FU to people who bought the ps4k.
This will happen for a couple years until the "phasing out" process begins in preparation for the next wave of iterative consoles, whereby Sony starts loosening base-PS4 model support requirements.
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
It would sure shut up the folks that went all "MS is getting out of the console business" not so long ago. Cause if this stuff is all true and will be announced at E3, it's a clear sign MS isn't going anywhere. It however won't just be a console only anymore, but neither was last gen and this gen. The only difference will be that most if not all will be playable on Windows 10 as well, which I am fine with. And if we're going to be getting new systems each three or four year, I think I am OK with that.
Though I personally never cared for Xbox hardware, I'd be happy to support MS's PC initiatives, so long as they are reasonably priced.
Hoping they put Scalebound on the Windows Store someday.
Cynn
Member
The PSVR breakout box is simply a frame doubler and signal splitter. There is no complex processing done there.
Obscuritas
Member
I'll just add that, even if Neo/Scorpio were also designed to improve/enable the PSVR/Oculus experience, I find laughable the idea that VR had the biggest role behind the making of these upgraded/iterative consoles.
We're talking about a ~700/800$ entry barriers for the PSVR/Neo combo and only god knows how much for the Scorpio/Oculus one, and that's sufficient for keeping them away from the mass market in the next years. So why do we keep overestimating them? For what it's worth I'm a VR-believer too, but I still think that they will cater to a niche audience in order to be succesfull, and this iterative concept is just a bigger shift change than gaming VR.
Unfortunately the forum's users tend to distort reality forgetting the average consumer's priorities.
CalamityPixel
Member
Wait a sec isn't the jump from OG Xbox to Xbox 360 the exact amount of time as xbone to scorpio in North America?
If its Fall 2017, yeah pretty much
DragoonKain
Neighbours from Hell
I'm personally interested in the redesigned controller, because they already designed their elite controller based off that same basic format and comfort. I wonder how different it is.
I think they'll want something to make sharing action menu quicker and easier then maybe a mic for Cortana commands. The extra rubber grips they've done in a few controllers as well. I don't expect the paddles. Less clickey shoulder buttons would be nice.
Nope! lol
The article I quoted was written on the 21st of May 2013, the day the Xbox One was revealed.
http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/xbox-one-does-not-target-high-end-graphics/0115918
They had a different roadmap back then with different goals and having a machine capable of high end graphics wasn't one of them.
Don't worry though, looks like the times they are a changing
Did you read what i wrote? AFTER the reveal? Doesn't matter if it is a 30 min., an hour, 3 hours, 10 hours. VIDEO CAME OUT AFTER Xbone reveal. And yes, even before PS4 conference in February that year, there was a doubt that Xbone would be more powerful. And then 8 GB happened.
Leyasu
Banned
The leap if true is pretty much a new gen imo, and Microsoft I imagine will market it as one. Of course they will talk about compatibility, but they will drop the "one" name, and then eventually bury the thing as well. I don't think that it will hurt them as much as people think. They buried the OG Xbox after 4 years.
Yeah but it also kills the Xbone the sales will plummet. Unlike PS4 and NEO where PS4 seems like a good price of entry with VR etc. the Scorpio makes Xbone look obsolete.
... not that big of a difference I'd wager. At least not here in Germany. I thought about selling mine but I'd get something like 150 for it on eBay. I think I'll wait and hope MS has some kind of upgrade path for OG Xbox One users. Something. Anything.
Yeah I guess the console is a huge failure in MS eyes they want to get away from it as fast as possible. I just thought they would ride it out till 2018 and then release a new generation Xbox.
Obscuritas
Member
A "new generation" made of cross gen games (X1/X1 Slim, PS4, Neo, Scorpio) with lesser differences among all versions. It doesn't scream "new generation" at all.
Brad Grenz
Member
For all we know Scorpio is a home theater PC being given the Surface treatment and is simply a Windows 10 PC with largely off the shelf components in which case it would clearly signal MS wants out of the closed box console space, and compatibility with existing Xbox One/360 software will be a feature extended to any Win 10 PC that meets a minimum spec.
Maximilian E.
AKA MS-Evangelist
Closed box/open box does not matter, as long as the Xbox brand is used. It will still compete over the same consumers, in the same market, as Sony and Nintendo.
Requirements to publish VR games on their respective platform don't change. Mind you, that's assuming marketshares of each of the devices remain relevant enough for people to even care, and with the current userbases being quite-tiny across released hardware (even compared to what people consider failed gaming-devices), it's way too early to predict anything regarding what market-share will look like in 2 years.MaulerX said:
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
All this stuff is just so odd and unusual. Earlier this year it seemed only Nintendo would introduce new hardware at E3, now it's actually Ninty who won't show shit at E3, lol and it's Sony and MS that will likely show their new hardware. As if that's not enough, MS is probably showing VR stuff as well, whereas at first it seemed only Sony really cared about it. Strange times, but interesting too.
Bits N Pieces
Member
Okay, provide me with links where Microsoft talk about the Xbox One's power output prior to launch, detailing how powerful it will be. Just don't pull up a GAF thread from around that time as much like this thread it is all baseless speculation with no clarification from the manufacturers'.
You seem to be hell bent on a particular narrative which is based on nothing more than forum rumours lol.
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
Scorpio is pretty much a new generation, just after four years instead of five because it makes no sense to keep a loser around. Just like they did with OG Xbox and 360. If Scorpio does well they will keep it until 2022. If it does not, they won't. That's the beauty for them in having stopped selling hardware at a loss, they can stop fixed cycles and just release new hardware whenever they want to. I expect Microsoft will require for all Scorpio games released until late 2018 to be playable (with lower settings) on Xbox One and then phase out that support. So Xbox One will have five years of software support, after that it's up to publishers.
If PS5 comes in 2020 it will be much much more expensive than Scorpio. Like double. And Scorpio will have at least a 30 million userbase. At that point it doesn't matter that it is a low end SKU. And like can't be stated often enough: Power doesn't determine what sells, it's price per power.
Sad Affleck
Member
It doesn't matter, it will still be an Xbox console for the living room. Compatibility with PC is a quite clever way of expanding the platform's userbase.
It matters for the core-segment that already house multiple consoles and PC. They're banking on UWP umbrella bringing in more users than that will lose them(which hinges on taking users from other PC store-fronts) - but it's a bit difficult to predict where it goes.Sad Affleck said:
If it's as powerful as evertone is saying, I think they should jump straight to eight. Especially as it rhymes!
Leyasu
Banned
Perhaps you could share your crystal ball. It will play out like this gen with the first 18 months being stacked with cross gen, before they get dropped imo.
"Exploiting to the max" isn't a useful criteria for multiplatform development. They all get basically the same graphics are different resolutions, antialiasing etc and maybe differences in the lighting. Neo and Scorpio are in the same ballpark for VR performance if you account for the 25% resolution difference in the headsets. So just like Xbox to Ps4 now you can expect the best experience on Scorpio but it won't deliver a fundamentally different experience.
Plus the VR market needs to be big enough to warrant AAA graphics in the first place. VR could still be more a competition for public mindshare and stay sell relatively little units.
It's a good point. This complaint about "lower spec holding back the newer hardware" is not something we're going to be absolved of by sticking with a traditional console cycle.
The Real Napsta
Member
Best experience on Xbox? #weback
#webacksoon
Brad Grenz
Member
We can't say that when we have no idea what it will look like in practice. What if it's priced like a premium product and not a loss leader? What if they dramatically reduce their first party software output and marketing spend? The only thing we really know for sure is that they've found the traditional console model disagreeable and want to blow it up. That could easily mean no more $300 Xboxes going forward. It could be a really compelling product for some, and even a boon for PC gaming but the "console war" would no longer be between Sony and MS as it has existed since the turn of the century.
Can't remember his name now but an executive had an account here on GAF and kept talking up Xbox 1 power and claimed ps4 wouldn't have a graphics advantage. And digital foundry did a series of articles/fluff pieces based off interviews of engineers from MS prior to launch.
OT: Hope they don't reveal this at E3 if it's not coming till next fall. Gives them time to make changes if needed before reveal.
LukasTaves
Member
Ps4 by itself clearly is. That's why they have a separate box. And assuming ps4k will also need the box makes sense for them to not upgrade the cpu or even the gpu by all that much (the gpu it's seemingly a big upgrade on flop count, but other areas such as memory saw way more modest upgrades.
Since MS approach to VR is going to be using the rift, they can't use a similar processing box, so they need a beefier console for it, oculus itself has higher requirements than the psvr for instance, like resolution.
boredandlazy
Member
How many times to people need to be told that the external breakout box does nothing except act as a video splitter and process the binaural audio?
The Neo's CPU is a bottleneck for sure, what a piece of crap that is.