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[Clarkus Darkus]

Where them games at doe.

In truth it's all well and good having the most powerful console, But the exclusive aspect of Xbox is crap. How many Forza's do you need to play.

If new games accompany the new console then i'll take it more seriously.

And do i really need to switch back too Xbox after switching too the PS4 from the 360, I don't need 2 consoles anymore to play anymore when my gaming time isnt that high.

Gonna be interesting though, I said too friends that MS will learn from the x1 and go all out with there next and maybe final console. Unleash the power MS.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

I've been wondering whether the secrecy that still surrounds Polaris/Vega (info/leaks have been almost entirely locked down) has anything to do with the possibility it will feature in Scorpio and Neo?

Probably not but still...

 

[Chris1]

Where them games at doe.

In truth it's all well and good having the most powerful console, But the exclusive aspect of Xbox is crap. How many Forza's do you need to play.

If new games accompany the new console then i'll take it more seriously.

And do i really need to switch back too Xbox after switching too the PS4 from the 360, I don't need 2 consoles anymore to play anymore when my gaming time isnt that high.

Gonna be interesting though, I said too friends that MS will learn from the x1 and go all out with there next and maybe final console. Unleash the power MS.

I don't get the exclusive argument, it might've made sense in 2012 but now? it's just silly.

Quantum Break, Recore, Sea of Thieves, Scalebound, Crackdown 3, Halo Wars 2, Forza Horizon 3, Gears 4 in 2016/early 2017 and probably a few surprises there too.

 

[HighResTomato]

Where them games at doe.

In truth it's all well and good having the most powerful console, But the exclusive aspect of Xbox is crap. How many Forza's do you need to play.

If new games accompany the new console then i'll take it more seriously.

And do i really need to switch back too Xbox after switching too the PS4 from the 360, I don't need 2 consoles anymore to play anymore when my gaming time isnt that high.

Gonna be interesting though, I said too friends that MS will learn from the x1 and go all out with there next and maybe final console. Unleash the power MS.

3rd party games will always look better on the more powerful hardware. Also please, that Foza Hurdur Halo argument is getting old now.

 

[Bitch Pudding]

Also please, that Foza Hurdur Halo argument is getting old now.

The what, please?

 

[sankt-Antonio]

Imo, Scorpio is going to be a MS branded "steam machine". A 6TFlop PC that'll have W10 on it, but any capable W10 PC will run XBOX games. With the decision to have all XBOX games on W10, XBOX will become a service/brand down the road.
No more MS consoles as we know it.

 

[Zedox]

Imo, Scorpio is going to be a MS branded "steam machine". A 6TFlop PC that'll have W10 on it, but any capable W10 PC will run XBOX games. With the decision to have all XBOX games on W10, XBOX will become a service/brand down the road.
No more MS consoles as we know it.

You do realize that the Xbox One is basically that right now.

 

[DaleinCalgary]

You do realize that the Xbox One is basically that right now.

This will have many more flops.

 

[Zedox]

This will have many more flops.

And your point is?

 

[Outrun]

Where them games at doe.

In truth it's all well and good having the most powerful console, But the exclusive aspect of Xbox is crap. How many Forza's do you need to play.

If new games accompany the new console then i'll take it more seriously.

And do i really need to switch back too Xbox after switching too the PS4 from the 360, I don't need 2 consoles anymore to play anymore when my gaming time isnt that high.

Gonna be interesting though, I said too friends that MS will learn from the x1 and go all out with there next and maybe final console. Unleash the power MS.

This idea that Xbox has no games is almost as bad as the PS4 has no games narrative.

 

[JaggedSac]

I've said this a couple of times: Mary Jo Foley (longtime MS reporter only rivaled by Paul Thurrott, granted they are friends) has reported that we should look at Computex. There, Microsoft "may" talk about how Windows 10 works with VR "officially". Think about how Google has announced "Daydream" for Android VR, Microsoft may already have their version ready for Windows 10. How does that link to Xbox? Well, Xbox is nothing more than a Windows 10 device. This may be the reason why Rift may work with Xbox Scorpio, and could be a reason why Vive may work with it as well.

The only thing that we don't know or can figure out is how the Windows Store fits within this. Microsoft could make it where those devices could run their own stores and just have Xbox as the platform it runs on, or have it where the manufacturers worry about selling the devices and developers just use the Windows Store. There's other ways to do it but those are the two obvious ways. Computex is the next thing I'm looking forward to, and I think others should as well. It is before E3. I think it's either this week or next week.

I can't see anything of interest coming out of Computex.

 

[jdmonmou]

A more powerful Xbox One will not translate to more sales. They will still be a distant second to Sony.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

I nearly forgot about this, and it makes a lot more sense now.

(July 2014)

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=852430

Microsoft job posts: Xbox industrial designer for next gen + software engineer





Those jobs were posted almost two years ago, and less than a year after XB1/PS4 launched.It's pretty obvious that was for Scorpio.

__

Also, lets go back (way back) - The leaked Xbox 360 system diagram from spring 2004 when it was still known only as Xenon.

Biggest thing that changed was the RAM doubled from 256MB to 512MB. The CPU clock wasn't quite that high. Shows 3.5 GHz, ended up 3.2 GHz.

I hope the equivalent for Scorpio also leaks, and soon -- If Microsoft doesn't tell all at E3.

There's very little evidence on either to suggest they are definitely scorpio related.

 

[Mikey Jr.]

I feel like this is Ms being forced their hand. Like, who the shit reveals hardware a year out when they have another product out. What are they saying here? There is a better box coming in 1 year?

 

[c0de]

A more powerful Xbox One will not translate to more sales. They will still be a distant second to Sony.

A less powerful Xbox One is also no guarantee for sales though.

 

[gamz]

I feel like this is Ms being forced their hand. Like, who the shit reveals hardware a year out when they have another product out. What are they saying here? There is a better box coming in 1 year?

They haven't tho.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

I nearly forgot about this, and it makes a lot more sense now.

(July 2014)

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=852430

Microsoft job posts: Xbox industrial designer for next gen + software engineer





Those jobs were posted almost two years ago, and less than a year after XB1/PS4 launched.It's pretty obvious that was for Scorpio.



__

Also, lets go back (way back) - The leaked Xbox 360 system diagram from spring 2004 when it was still known only as Xenon.

Biggest thing that changed was the RAM doubled from 256MB to 512MB. The CPU clock wasn't quite that high. Shows 3.5 GHz, ended up 3.2 GHz.

I hope the equivalent for Scorpio also leaks, and soon -- If Microsoft doesn't tell all at E3.

Yep, I felt they were dropping xone for a long time and I'm sure as each change they made that failed, price drops, Kinectless etc only pushed them harder and faster.

No surprised by this at all. If Microsoft would have ever had the wii u it would have been scrapped even earlier

I also believe ones is and overall games have suffered cause of this but ms doesn't care cause they were looking at it as a failure and always lookinf into thier next box. Now they just try to keep the base viable basically.


They definitely want to do something with pc together day one. They want the steam sales while thing a box into it for the living room as well.

This is always their plan, to get thier box, software on homes. Thier plan has never changed. They want control of most homes in the world but in the end I just have to say why

Is money and self care really that important? I just feel they and companies with this mind set is wrong. Money just isn't that important. I nean billions and billions just so your investors can buy more homes and boats.

Hope microsoft stops that but they won't, just make good things as a team is good enough

 

[Obscuritas]

A more powerful Xbox One will not translate to more sales. They will still be a distant second to Sony.

I also do think that they won't compete anymore in the hardware-sales war and that they are embracing the idea of a Windows10/Xbox Machine, even if I still have a lot of doubts about how this would pan out for them.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

The issue here is how much effort are developers willing to put to make the neo/ scorpion versions look better. Like the argument would be they make the games run on the base versions and then use the extra resources to make the game run/look better. But they wouldn't likely use all they have at their disposal to optimize these two new consoles when they have to worry about optimization in the base consoles

 

[AmyS]

Scorpio would launch 4 years after Xbox One. Same amount of time between OG XBox (2001) and Xbox 360 (2005) and half the amount of time between Xbox 360 and Xbox One ( 8 years).

Assuming Microsoft would balance Scorpio's GPU with a good CPU (like Zen), those things alone make Scorpio as close to a nextgen console as we can reasonably expect these days -- Given how the industry is moving toward incremental upgrades, given it is much harder to make huge leaps in chip technology (architecture, performance and manufacturing process, etc). -- How much more powerful than Scorpio could a PS5 be, in 2020? More powerful, sure, but how much? Diminishing returns, at least in silicon. Games haven't caught up yet, given that most PC games are designed to have PS4/Xbox One as the baseline.

 

[Odorono]

You do realize that the Xbox One is basically that right now.

Nah there's still way too many limitations for it to be a PC.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

They haven't tho.

This seems like a very deliberate leak. Too much info came out in one day for this not be planned.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

The issue here is how much effort are developers willing to put to make the neo/ scorpion versions look better. Like the argument would be they make the games run on the base versions and then use the extra resources to make the game run/look better. But they wouldn't likely use all they have at their disposal to optimize these two new consoles when they have to worry about optimization in the base consoles

Of systems are coming out in the next two years don't expect xone ports. Microsoft won't give a shit about it, they don't care about it right now honestly. It's not windows to them.

They have proven to drop support for consoles before with Xbox and 360 even when games would have still sold on the 369. The last two or three major years of 360 were heavily neglected for the most part by them.

We have been on that state with xone already with them.

Hell, wouldn't be surprised if games like crackdown start making thier way off xone.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

Scorpio would launch 4 years after Xbox One. Same amount of time between OG XBox (2001) and Xbox 360 (2005) and half the amount of time between Xbox 360 and Xbox One ( 8 years).

Assuming Microsoft would balance Scorpio's GPU with a good CPU (like Zen), those things alone make Scorpio as close to a nextgen console as we can reasonably expect these days -- Given how the industry is moving toward incremental upgrades, given it is much harder to make huge leaps in chip technology (architecture, performance and manufacturing process, etc). -- How much more powerful than Scorpio could a PS5 be, in 2020? More powerful, sure, but how much? Diminishing returns, at least in silicon. Games haven't caught up yet, given that most PC games are designed to have PS4/Xbox One as the baseline.

That's assuming this is their next console and a generation jump. Which would mean they'd likely have something ready for when ps5 gets announced.

 

[Bgamer90]

A more powerful Xbox One will not translate to more sales. They will still be a distant second to Sony.

Being in 2nd =/= no increase in sales.

 

[etta]

Being in 2nd =/= no increase in sales.

If you're not number 1, your sales don't count.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

Being in 2nd =/= no increase in sales.

It isn't what they want they never wanted to be a sub 100 million seller either. They have always wanted to transition the box like windows. I mean as far as sales and number of people using it.

They believe they can do it but I don't see it working.

Xone was meant to be that box that isn't just games but it failed pretty hard at thiwe goal. Now they believe integration with windows is the way to do it.

I don't think the Xbox can do what they need it to on this way

I've said it for years but people ignore what they really want to do.

 

[gamz]

This seems like a very deliberate leak. Too much info came out in one day for this not be planned.

Huh? Seem's silly and why not just announce it then? That doesn't make much sense.

So let's deliberately leak some vague information on it because....

 

[AmyS]

That's assuming this is their next console and a generation jump. Which would mean they'd likely have something ready for when ps5 gets announced.

True, I think we both (and most of us) expect that.
I didn't mean to imply Microsoft wouldn't have an answer to PS5, they will, but I'm just wondering how much more powerful could PS5 and XB5 be (lets just call them that) over PS4 Neo and Xbox Scorpio.

PS4 Neo - Xbox Scorpio: In the 4-6 Tflop range

PS5 - XB5: 10~12 Tflop or 6-20 Tflops?

 

[Jack The Nipper]

True, I think we both (and most of us) expect that.
I didn't mean to imply Microsoft wouldn't have an answer to PS5, they will, but I'm just wondering how much more powerful could PS5 and XB5 be (lets just call them that) over PS4 Neo and Xbox Scorpio.

Why would you think Scorpio isn't treated as the next Xbox? It is just won't be completely advertised like that not to pass off one owners but it's still that and they make it that. One support won't last long after its released by them.

 

[Bsigg12]

This seems like a very deliberate leak. Too much info came out in one day for this not be planned.

Microsoft had a dev event a couple weeks ago and it seems like this is where a lot of this is coming out of.

Why would you think Scorpio isn't treated as the next Xbox? It is just won't be completely advertised like that not to pass off one owners but it's still that and they make it that. One support won't last long after its released by them.

I'm expecting at least 2 more years of game support once the Scorpio releases.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Huh? Seem's silly and why not just announce it then? That doesn't make much sense.

So let's deliberately leak some vague information on it because....

To gauge the response and potential backlash. Same thing I think Sony did with the Neo.

Only this was a bad move if accurate because it gives Sony enough time to make changes to the Neo and even delay it if need be to make sure it competitive power wise with Scorpio.

 

[thuway]

The issue here is how much effort are developers willing to put to make the neo/ scorpion versions look better. Like the argument would be they make the games run on the base versions and then use the extra resources to make the game run/look better. But they wouldn't likely use all they have at their disposal to optimize these two new consoles when they have to worry about optimization in the base consoles

If all the machines have 8 GB of memory, I think it's a pretty good expectation to expect better framerates, higher resolutions, and more amplified effects across the board. Essentially a modern day PC Ultra/High setting in a fixed box.

The problems start coming around when you begin designing a game with an ambition that ultimately is too much for the predecessor machines. Right now we are seeing 900p/1080p titles but I suspect as the years go by 720p will become a norm for the PS4 and Xbox One; while Neo and Scorpio handle the big boy resolutions and framerates.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

If all the machines have 8 GB of memory, I think it's a pretty good expectation to expect better framerates, higher resolutions, and more amplified effects across the board. Essentially a modern day PC Ultra/High setting in a fixed box.

The problems start coming around when you begin designing a game with an ambition that ultimately is too much for the predecessor machines. Right now we are seeing 900p/1080p titles but I suspect as the years go by 720p will become a norm for the PS4 and Xbox One; while Neo and Scorpio handle the big boy resolutions and framerates.

You mean the new systems only having 8? No way


Even neo will probably have 4 more or double in the end. And Scorpio will definitely have more. Is foot prints also won't get smaller with all the add in

Neo will drop and the big new change will happen in 18 for Sony.

I really believe neo is a small increase for vr. Expect a new headset and system near 2018 from Sony as well.

If vr fails then no vr at that point

 

[Bsigg12]

To gauge the response and potential backlash. Same thing I think Sony did with the Neo.

Only this was a bad move if accurate because it gives Sony enough time to make changes to the Neo and even delay it if need be to make sure it competitive power wise with Scorpio.

If the Neo is supposed to drop this year, then I don't believe it does. They would be getting ready to start production on those. Also it's very possible that the reason the Scorpio is rumored for Fall 2017 is so that the Polaris and Zen architectures are mature enough to be used in an APU design without being overly expensive like a lot of people think it will be.

 

[Obscuritas]

Of systems are coming out in the next two years don't expect xone ports. Microsoft won't give a shit about it, they don't care about it right now honestly. It's not windows to them.

They have proven to drop support for consoles before with Xbox and 360 even when games would have still sold on the 369. The last two or three major years of 360 were heavily neglected for the most part by them.

We have been on that state with xone already with them.

Hell, wouldn't be surprised if games like crackdown start making thier way off xone.

Good luck telling the developers that they should ignore a 20/30M userbase (80+ with PS4) and sell their games only on a newborn console without any guaranteee of success. Also giving the middle finger to anyone who bought the Slim model too.


So yeah, that's not gonna happen either.

 

[gamz]

To gauge the response and potential backlash. Same thing I think Sony did with the Neo.

Only this was a bad move if accurate because it gives Sony enough time to make changes to the Neo and even delay] it if need be to make sure it competitive power wise with Scorpio.

Still doesn't make sense. Let's spend oodles of money on R&D (and close to production ready), but wait, let's gauge the public by a vague leak. If there's a backlash we are scrapping it. That's silly...

 

[JonathanPower]

The issue here is how much effort are developers willing to put to make the neo/ scorpion versions look better. Like the argument would be they make the games run on the base versions and then use the extra resources to make the game run/look better. But they wouldn't likely use all they have at their disposal to optimize these two new consoles when they have to worry about optimization in the base consoles

This would get even worse for MS because while the PS4 Neo will basically use the same design with just more powerful hw components, I highly doubt that Scorpio will retain the same design using ESRAM, making the power gap between Xbox One and Scorpio much, much worse.

 

[ClearData]

Do we have any rumored projections for what the APU and / or the CPU will be? I'm really interested in how they balanced the price and performance of Scorpio. If it is four times and power of the regular box and sold at a competitive price it will be something to behold for me.

I look forward to E3 and the fireworks!

 

[StrongBlackVine]

If the Neo is supposed to drop this year, then I don't believe it does. They would be getting ready to start production on those.

NX was supposed to release this Fall and now it is not. I doubt they are past the point of no return.

 

[slade]

This idea that Xbox has no games is almost as bad as the PS4 has no games narrative.

Ironic thing that it was started by Xbox fans before everything they counted as exclusives wound up on the PC. 'Tit for tat' in the console wars bites you hard in the ass sometimes.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Still doesn't make sense. Let's spend oodles of money on R&D (and close to production ready), but wait, let's gauge the public by a vague leak. If there's a backlash we are scrapping it. That's silly...

Was it silly when they did exactly that with DRM and Kinect soon after?

 

[Jack The Nipper]

Good luck telling the developers that they should ignore a 20/30M userbase (80+ with PS4) and sell their games only on a newborn console without any guaranteee of success. Also giving the middle finger to anyone who bought the Slim model too.


So yeah, that's not gonna happen either.

You don't need that to get good sales. How many did other games sale on sub 15 million bases. You sure about that.

Watch dogs and gta sold how much?

User bases like that are not important to sell games. Your just wrong here.

Some games can sell more in a 5 million base than a 80 million base like gt 6 imo


Plus they have data themselves that back all this up. People like new games on new hardware.

Sure cod and other such games will hit xone but bigger better games will be exclusive to drive sales

 

[gamz]

Was it silly when they did exactly that with DRM and Kinect soon after?

That's a totally different situation. Wouldn't Sony and MS leak when this was an idea before they got to a production ready point?

 

[etta]

Do we have any rumored projections for what the APU and / or the CPU will be? I'm really interested in how they balanced the price and performance of Scorpio. If it is four times and power of the regular box and sold at a competitive price it will be something to behold for me.

I look forward to E3 and the fireworks!

Zen Vega HBM 2 is the most likely the combo. Only Vega can meet the minimum requirements for Oculus at console type TDP. Zen is likely because Jaguar is probably too old to use. HBM2 for overcoming ESRAM.

 

[Bits N Pieces]

To gauge the response and potential backlash. Same thing I think Sony did with the Neo.

Only this was a bad move if accurate because it gives Sony enough time to make changes to the Neo and even delay it if need be to make sure it competitive power wise with Scorpio.

Back to the drawing board on hardware scheduled to come out in the next 6/12 months if the rumours are to be believed. You think they would do that? What about if they both just continually delay the machines cause someone keeps leaking the specs 12 months out lol.

 

[JonathanPower]

If all the machines have 8 GB of memory, I think it's a pretty good expectation to expect better framerates, higher resolutions, and more amplified effects across the board. Essentially a modern day PC Ultra/High setting in a fixed box.

The problems start coming around when you begin designing a game with an ambition that ultimately is too much for the predecessor machines. Right now we are seeing 900p/1080p titles but I suspect as the years go by 720p will become a norm for the PS4 and Xbox One; while Neo and Scorpio handle the big boy resolutions and framerates.

I do not expect 1080p to be a problem for PS4 games in the future. It's more likely to have a situation were Neo will run games at 60fps with more effects enabled.

 

[gamz]

Back to the drawing board on hardware scheduled to come out in the next 6/12 months if the rumours are to be believed. You think they would do that? What about if they both just continually delay the machines cause someone keeps leaking the specs 12 months out lol.

lol Yeah, that makes zero sense.

 

[Shifty Capone1]

I also do think that they won't compete anymore in the hardware-sales war and that they are embracing the idea of a Windows10/Xbox Machine, even if I still have a lot of doubts about how this would pan out for them.

I don't see how anyone has any negativity towards Microaoft for doing this. It just benefits everyone. You want a console style, plug and play? Here it is for X price and it will play all these games. You're an enthusiast PC gamer (already on Windows), here are Xbox branded first party games that run better. With Microsofts windows market share it would be almost dumb for them not to do it.

The issue here is how much effort are developers willing to put to make the neo/ scorpion versions look better. Like the argument would be they make the games run on the base versions and then use the extra resources to make the game run/look better. But they wouldn't likely use all they have at their disposal to optimize these two new consoles when they have to worry about optimization in the base consoles

It will look better though and probably play better on Scorpio/Neo. Some devs will use all that extra horsepower in the new ones, some wont, but no matter what it games will take advantage of the new hardware a little bit and run better. Isn't that the point? Being in Gaf kind of skews perceptions. Majority of people won't care how much better, or how much of the hardware they use, they will just care that it is better.

 

[Ushay]

There was rumours of Sony delaying until 2017 for Neo so you could be right. I don't know though. Time will tell...

Source?