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PS4 PRO: for best IQ (Native 4k + HDR + 60 HZ + 4:4:4) 2160p-YUV420 or 2160p-RGB?
- Thread starter PLASTICA-MAN
- Start date
I'm just here to say that the 55" Hisense (model 55H8C) is a marvel for its price.
Read the reviews on rtings.com and reviewed.com... it's well-received even by the techies.
It works with the Pro on the RGB setting and the 4K/HDR image looks astonishing for the $500 55" 4K HDR set.
I'm more than pleased right now to have a new 55" tv that can take advantage of the Pro and it cost me less than $1000 to buy both the tv and PS4 Pro.
guitarguy316
Member
So my receiver is a vsx45. I have to set it to 4:4:4 or 4:2:0. Which do I use?
![[Asmodean]](/data/avatars/m/123/123312.jpg?1526393694){kind=avatar}
[Asmodean]
Member
I'd love to know what wizardry rtings used to get 4k @ 60Hz @ 4:4:4 + HDR?
I though the current hdmi limit was 422 for 4k @ 60, no?
edit: I mean with HDR (assuming it requires 10-bit)
edit2: I wonder if they used PC mode to manage this. by either selecting PC as the input device, or renaming to PC on some tvs. On mine if I change the input type from 'game console' to 'pc' it switches modes.
Rbk_3
Member
[Asmodean];224041281 said:I'd love to know what wizardry rtings used to get 4k @ 60Hz @ 4:4:4 + HDR?
I though the current hdmi limit was 422 for 4k @ 60, no?
edit: I mean with HDR (assuming it requires 10-bit)
edit2: I wonder if they used PC mode to manage this. by either selecting PC as the input device, or renaming to PC on some tvs. On mine if I change the input type from 'game console' to 'pc' it switches modes.
No idea. I just want the lowest input lag lol
[Asmodean]
Member
it works. I completed removed the banding on my PS4 by changing my hdmi input to PC.
Obviously this needs more testing. But it's quite interesting that the banding was completely resolved by changing this.
For anyone else who actually notices banding can do the same and check?
Obviously this needs more testing. But it's quite interesting that the banding was completely resolved by changing this.
For anyone else who actually notices banding can do the same and check?
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Wouldn't something like a file read off a usb stick get around hdmi limitations?[Asmodean];224041281 said:I'd love to know what wizardry rtings used to get 4k @ 60Hz @ 4:4:4 + HDR?
I though the current hdmi limit was 422 for 4k @ 60, no?
BONKERS
Member
Fucking this.
The fact we've somehow gotten to this point....is well not surprising. it's as dumb as TVs still shipping with Overscan and console games having to design the UI to account for that.
We have been basically screwed by TV and Hollywood. Video content will never significantly be >30hz or even greater than 4:2:2. So why would they bother making HDMI2.0 support 4k60p-HDR10 4:4:4? Hollywood has no use for it.
I doubt the higher price per unit would be any worse than the shit they have to pay for HDMI licensing, displaying the HDMI logo, HDCP licensing,etc.
HDR is a bigger upgrade than 4k is IMO. (You are right about people over thinking it though. Just set it to Automatic and let it do it's thing.)
If 1080p HDR TVs were the next step in line so HDR Standards could mature. (Along with more real 4k content being made along the way to prepare for the step after 1080p HDR)
Then we wouldn't be having this issue honestly. (Because 1080p60-HDR10 4:4:4 would totally be possible. And then HDMI 2.5 could have come out for 4k sets to support the same thing)
4k continues to feel just a little premature. Too many things in flux. It's bad enough Sony is pretty much kicking it's own source of real true high quality 4k HDR non bit starved content. UHD Bluray to the curb.
family_guy
Member
The issue here with 12 bit YUV 4:2:2, is that while your TV may be able to accept it, it's still converting it down to 10 bit or 8 bit depending on the panel specs for your TV. There are no 12 bit TV panels. The conversion can cause the banding that people are seeing. The Samsung KS8000 doesn't seem to handle it well so to eliminate the banding you need to have the PS4 send 10 bit 4:2:0.
Try the 420 mode. It'll fix it.
You're searching for answers but the reality is that they used 8-bits for channel. That's it. You can do 8-bit HDR.[Asmodean];224041281 said:I'd love to know what wizardry rtings used to get 4k @ 60Hz @ 4:4:4 + HDR?
I though the current hdmi limit was 422 for 4k @ 60, no?
edit: I mean with HDR (assuming it requires 10-bit)
edit2: I wonder if they used PC mode to manage this. by either selecting PC as the input device, or renaming to PC on some tvs. On mine if I change the input type from 'game console' to 'pc' it switches modes.
I fixed the banding on my TV! (Samsung) Even in black/dark areas
I cranked the backlight to max and then lowered the brightness until it went away
Looks amazing now. Not sure if it's 'right' - I'm no pro calibrator, but looks hella HDR to me and the banding is gone.
Also: wow. Color is richer across the board not just HDR content. I've had the brightness way too high for a while
I cranked the backlight to max and then lowered the brightness until it went away
Looks amazing now. Not sure if it's 'right' - I'm no pro calibrator, but looks hella HDR to me and the banding is gone.
Also: wow. Color is richer across the board not just HDR content. I've had the brightness way too high for a while
[Asmodean];224041281 said:I'd love to know what wizardry rtings used to get 4k @ 60Hz @ 4:4:4 + HDR?
I though the current hdmi limit was 422 for 4k @ 60, no?
edit: I mean with HDR (assuming it requires 10-bit)
edit2: I wonder if they used PC mode to manage this. by either selecting PC as the input device, or renaming to PC on some tvs. On mine if I change the input type from 'game console' to 'pc' it switches modes.
Potentially it's just not hdr10
And this (also Amazon app and Netflix app would bypass hdmi)
Have you tried using the yuv420 setting ? Does it changer anything ?
byron_hinson
Member
Tried it. Reduces banding a bit but not completely. Still disappointing
Your tv supports hdr10 and 4k 4:4:4. Use rgb for non hdr games and yuv for hdr games (if you went hdr on that is) or just set it to auto and try ps4 will do the rest.
Best IQ is rgb but if you want hdr benefits in a game you can't use rgb with hdr.
Caayn
Member
Use 2160p RGB with RGB limited. The PS4 Pro will automatically turn to YUV 4:2:2 when playing HDR content and will use RGB for non-HDR content.
Aztechnology
Member
Does the KS8000 not support full range? I thought there were different variations of 4:2:0 that supported Full or limited respectively. I figured with a 10 bit HDR set they might actually support full range through J4:2:0?
TLZ
Banned
RGB limited why?
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
So PS4 PRO is out. Can anyone post screenhots or tell his impressions after switching between both modes?
Aztechnology
Member
A great TV even without HDR is going to show an incredible improvement for many. But HDR really is a marked notch above non HDR. The shadows, highlights and color saturation just makes everything pop. Shadows and highlights just have much more detail. As for colors the best way I can put it, is like a TV that has had its saturation cranked up but without the bleeding and unnatural colors that usually permeate when you make a non HDR set too vivid. Just none of the detail is lost but with so much more.
No honestly that's not even the correct way to put it. That's just for Ratchet and Clank which is my first real taste.
For some of the HDR downloaded nature cinematography and such... It's just hard for me to describe the accuracy of it. I'll have to think how to phrase it.
Thanks for the reply. But why RGB limited?
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
You have the KS8000 right?
Aztechnology
Member
Yea. I used to have a JS9000 a while back but there was no HDR content. Since then I've been on an IPS 144hz monitor that's amazing for gaming. But this is seriously making me debate switching most my gaming over to the TV even for the loss of input lag and upper framerate with my GTX 1070.
Caayn
Member
See my reply earlier in this thread: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=223938831&postcount=335
Aztechnology
Member
The same goes for a 10 bit color space?
Caayn
Member
Unsure, but I think that is uses a similar 'buffer'. The rec.2020 spec also describes 64 as black and 940 for white instead of 0 and 1023 when using 10 bit colour. Similar to how 16 and 235 is used for black and white instead of 0 and 255 with 8 bit colour.
This is why I find it strange that Sony doesn't disable the RGB range setting on the PS4 Pro when you have use the YUV colourspace.
You should be using the Limited color space on both console and TV whenever you're using a television, pretty much. Only use Full when using a computer monitor.
The main thing is that your source and your display must match or you'll obliterate your black levels. Just set them manually.
byron_hinson
Member
Problem you get then is the colour banding. So if you want to use HDR on a Samsung at least and have it look decent, you'd have to run resolution at YUV 4:2:0
Caayn
Member
Problem with Samsung TVs? I can't say that I noticed more banding in 4:2:2 than I did in 4:2:0 when I played around with it yesterday on my OLED.
Yes, you can leave it on auto. I tested that with R&C.
byron_hinson
Member
Yes likely a Samsung issue. Makes HDR next to useless in my eyes when you see so much colour banding, especially on skyboxes and such like
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
So can anyone with one of the newest TVs try NBA 2K17 and compare which mode has the best IQ and results whether YUV 420 with HDR10 but in Chroma 4:2:0 or RGB mode with Chroma 4:4:4 but no HDR10?
I have the Hisense 65M5500. Unbelievable value for money. Probably the best value you can buy at the moment for all the features it gives you and the picture quality is astonishing. Talk about value for money. I have the 65 inch. Never had a tv that big before. Nearly had a heart attack when it arrived.
Really folks the 55 or the 65 inch are unbelievable.
And people really are over thinking the whole RGB YUV options. Put it on auto and let the PRO do it's thing. If your set can do YUV 422 it will if not it will give you 420.
Sit down and start enjoying this great console and play some games. Because the difference in image quality this console gives you for the money is Amazing. Well done Sony.
You can leave it in Auto (or RGB probably) and it will do YUV422 10-bit with HDR.
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
You mean if you leave it in Auto or select RGB, the console chooses a special mode between RGB 4:4:4 and YUV 420 which is Chroma 4:2:2 + HDR10? Is this confirmed?
byron_hinson
Member
Does on my Samsung JS9000 - which causes the banding, so unsure if its the TV or the PS4 Pro forcing 4:2:2 instead of 4:2:0 for HDR
Yeah, I tested with Ratchet and Clank. It'll use YUV422 automatically.
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
What do you mean by banding? What happens exactly? Does using YUV 420 remedy this?
Auto seems fine from my testing, pretty sure most of this thread is worrying and confusing over nothing really. Let the PS4 deal with that, it can reliably be left to decide on its own.
byron_hinson
Member
basically this: The gradient should look like it does on the right - instead with HDR on the Samsung you get the left
Using 4:2:0 makes it a lot better but not perfect. Switching off HDR and just going Full RGB looks perfect.
Dzab
Member
Setting the KS8000 input to PC seems to remove the colour banding but Ratchet and Clank in HDR looks... dull, but not necessarily bad. It looks completely different to HDR on non PC input, which is colourful and punchy.
Edit: Tried again and the banding is still there when renaming the input to PC.
Edit: Tried again and the banding is still there when renaming the input to PC.
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
basically this: The gradient should look like it does on the right - instead with HDR on the Samsung you get the left
Using 4:2:0 makes it a lot better but not perfect. Switching off HDR and just going Full RGB looks perfect.
Hmm. I see. It seems Chroma 4:4:4 solves this but we will lose HDR10 advantage.
Chroma 4:4:4: with HDR10 TVs next year can't come any closer.
byron_hinson
Member
It shouldn't be happening with TV's even now - its a PS4 Pro or Samsung issue that needs to get fixed! Doesn't happen on the Xbox One S HDR