Look at that smug face. Don't you just want to sucker punch him and slap his robot?Official Taryon art has dropped...those boots though
I'm shocked he wasn't robbed blind and left bloodied in an alley before VM even found him.
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Critical Role: Voice Actors Playing D&D
- Thread starter Henchmen21
- Start date
I'm shocked he wasn't robbed blind and left bloodied in an alley before VM even found him.
Prithee Be Careful
Industry Professional
If he carries on the way he's going VM might very well beat him and leave him in an alley...
They all bonded after the hazing and some drinks.
Though if he ends up betraying the party somehow, I doubt things will go well for him.
Jest Chillin
Member
Kynen set his eyes on VM first, couldn't take a hint, then turned vengeful fedora when Vax shut him down completely. That's not on Vax in my eyes at all.
And honestly, Matt does comment on them all the time, it's usually just less noticable as a viewer because it's not as divisive a situation. When he really feels they're being fucked up, that's when alignment changes happen.
This event though, is completely in line with how the group acts when Pike isn't around. (It's also why Pike got an alignment change when she simply enjoyed killing a bad guy too much, letting them influence her instead of the other way around).
Migrant's mostly right down here:
But really, even with alignment shifts, they are more a reflection of characters changing their personality through actions, rather than a punishment for acting out of character. They have a few in-game effects (Pike's spells suffered when her alignment shifted until could attone for it and switch back) but it's primarily for flavor and to help players understand how to be their characters.
It's interesting how alignment change is usually seen as a punishment that people feel limited by. In reality, I think it's just the DM saying, "here's the alignment that describes your character's actions". You're defining your alignment, it shouldn't be defining you unless you're a Paladin or Cleric whose power comes from being virtuous in the name of a deity.
I guess that's why most people go with chaotic good. So you can get away with as much as possible while still feeling okay about your actions because you still have a heart of gold underneath it all and it still says "good" on your character sheet.
I guess that's why most people go with chaotic good. So you can get away with as much as possible while still feeling okay about your actions because you still have a heart of gold underneath it all and it still says "good" on your character sheet.
Calcium
Banned
Do you really not see a problem with how Vax "shut him down completely" by physically attacking him for no real reason? The kid shows up idolizing the world renowned Vox Machina and gets knocked out by one of them. Hell, the whole bringing Kynan back into the story thing was pretty much Matt saying "You shouldn't have done that to the boy!".
Alpha Centauri
Member
I feel you when it comes to the mechanics of alignment, but you could tell from previous interactions that their alignment matters to them. When Vex got bumped back up to good, you could see it on her and everyone else's face. So to hit them in alignment is akin to your parent saying "I'm disappointed in you." A lot of times that is repercussion enough to have them choose if they want to change or not. If they all got hit to neutral, you'd see them all actually strive to be better people instead of the lip service they tend to give.
I understand why people feel that way, I just think it's interesting. You would think if people were so hung up on being considered "good" that they would just behave virtuously all the time. But the reality is that people want to be told they're good while trying to push the boundary and get away with as much dubious behavior as possible. People want to act like chaotic neutral characters so they can feel free to do whatever they want, but the allure of being a good aligned character is too strong. Everybody wants to be considered a virtuous hero even if they don't feel like living up to that standard.
I'm sure there are hundreds (or thousands) of college papers that go into the psychology of alignment in rpgs.
Jest Chillin
Member
Vax is a rogue and former member of The Clasp. When Kynen couldn't take the hint, knocking him out WAS the kinder option.
With the exception of Pike, nome of these characters are Lawful Good, so why do so many in the community try to hold them to that standard?
And no, I don't have a problem with it because Vax likely saved his life then, just as he spared his life later. Kynen is a dumb kid with major issues who was determined to bite off more than he could chew, regardless of the cost. This is pretty clear characterization expressed through the storyline. Refusing him was necessary and the kid wouldn't take a soft no for an answer.
PeskyToaster
Member
Man this is pretty good. I kinda watched it when I saw it on twitch but I was also kind of lost in who was who and what was going on. Then I recently caught the bug and started from episode 1. It's pretty fun stuff. Hilarious when Scanlan blasted the monster with lightning and when Tiberius tried knocking on the arcane dwarf's door by shooting a fireball at it. My friends don't want to start a DnD game with me so maybe I'll start with the roundabout way of getting them hooked on Critical Role.
Jay Shadow
Member
Reminder that the whole cast minus Ashley is gonna be on Talks Machina tonight to discuss the last 2 episodes. Should be pretty good.
Pilgrimzero
Member
Watching the last episode, I think it's obvious they were told to to chill concerning Tary.
I hope they go longer on tonight's Talks Machina. They've got the (almost) full cast and missed a week so they'll have a lot to go over. I get the feeling half of it will be Laura yelling at Sam while he does his happy shimmy dance, though.
Possibly. Or they all just read the room after and adjusted themselves accordingly.
Jest Chillin
Member
Interestingly enough, rewatched the episode again today and it's even more obvious to me that they were just hazing him.
They mentioned multiple times that they intended on roughing him up and Matt never warned them away through DM decisions. Matt also declared before any of the surprise round rolls that immediately after that round, they would take a break so they could devote the time and attention necessary to the fight (which he commonly does when combat is going to happen near break or the end of a cast). Everyone was laughing through the whole thing. Grog never attacks Tary. Vax only hits him once (and heals him once). Keyleth heals him once and goes overboard on her spell cast. Percy never attacks but after that Prismatic Spray, clearly held his attack for Tary to grab another deadly gem so he could use his Grit to disarm him if necessary.
Basically, VM were being jerks but not at all moreso than they usually are. In fact, they were a bit nicer than they usually are. I'd say in most cases they would've taken an NPC down to zero or threatened to kill them outright more often than not.
They mentioned multiple times that they intended on roughing him up and Matt never warned them away through DM decisions. Matt also declared before any of the surprise round rolls that immediately after that round, they would take a break so they could devote the time and attention necessary to the fight (which he commonly does when combat is going to happen near break or the end of a cast). Everyone was laughing through the whole thing. Grog never attacks Tary. Vax only hits him once (and heals him once). Keyleth heals him once and goes overboard on her spell cast. Percy never attacks but after that Prismatic Spray, clearly held his attack for Tary to grab another deadly gem so he could use his Grit to disarm him if necessary.
Basically, VM were being jerks but not at all moreso than they usually are. In fact, they were a bit nicer than they usually are. I'd say in most cases they would've taken an NPC down to zero or threatened to kill them outright more often than not.
Zod the Bear
Member
They've alluded to auditioning their Grayskull NPC guards before, but it was amusing to find out the audition was the same ambush they pulled on Tary.
They have always been assholes it seems haha.
Alpha Centauri
Member
When he saved her in the ocean, Keyleth and Tary should have kissed lol
Calcium
Banned
I'd be all for that. It'd be a hell of a lot better than Vax/Keyleth. Their relationship is basically Vax constantly validating the questionable decisions Keyleth makes and then she whines to him about something. That's pretty much it. It's even more evident now that Percy/Vex is a thing and they actually seem like a good couple.
What is Keyleth's intelligence score? I assume she is smarter than Grog, but some of her decisions last episode really make you wonder.
Throwing the fish monster into the water, sinking the boat for little reason, immediately thinking a small child is the leader of the Druids, bowing while she is knee deep in water, etc.
Matt is amazing. Telling Vox Machina not
to kill the Kraken
Alpha Centauri
Member
Her intelligence is 14, which is well-above average. 22 wisdom as well. Unfortunately, it is still highly believable that Kiki would do something like that. Each and everyone of Vox Machina have grown save Keyleth. The purpose of her joining Vox Machina was to become more of an assertive leader. In character,
she has completed 3 parts of her aramente, killed dragons, et. al. However, she is no different from episode 1 to episode 86 except she is getting dick now.
The worst part was meeting Yulon (iirc?). "Oh I am in such awe of you leader!" to a little boy while funny... But seriously? Just goes to show how far she has to go before she can rule with any type of authority. She is being bred to lead all of them. What is wrong with her? It could be that she just isn't capable of leadership, or her growth has been severely stunted by being with Vox Machina. In character, you would think she would do some self-reflection with her 22 wisdom to identify what her biggest barrier is.
Note this is all criticism of Keyleth, not Marisha. She is free to roleplay her character as she sees fit. It's often-times humorous but her character despite her magical power is a joke.
Calcium
Banned
Yep, I agree with pretty much everything you said. I'd like Keyleth a lot more if Marisha would at least attempt some character development, but like you said she has made no progress whatsoever. I'm hoping they don't dwell on the Aramente stuff for too long, because I just don't care about it as a result of Keyleth being poorly developed.
Alpha Centauri
Member
A couple turns into this encounter...
edit:
Keyleth...
They have no clue how close to a TPK they are. They are still joking around. They really don't know...
edit:
Keyleth unconscious. Faces pretty serious now. This is getting rough. How the hell are they going to get away without someone dying????
Keyleth...
I've never seen Matt this mad. "Fuck it" -Matt
Matt was super merciful. I've never seen him literally tell a player what to do. That would have been the end of Keyleth for sure had he not though.
Jay Shadow
Member
Free hugs for everyone
Rockin' Ranger
Member
This seems like the kind of encounter where Scanlan would have saved everyone an hour ago if he were with them.
Alpha Centauri
Member
Hell yeah. Dimension door, Otuluk's Sphere, Bigsby's hand, and even the mansion if used curiously would have been huge. Plus his healing!
I miss that little guy
Jay Shadow
Member
Whelp, Keyleth, what will it be? Your boyfriend or your Aramnete?
Alpha Centauri
Member
Holy shit this just got real.
Alpha Centauri
Member
[edited for response]
Yeah, there is no way
he is getting out of this. There is no way for grog to get out of this now either. They could have cut loose when Vax was eaten, but it makes sense for Grog to attack after. Always bring a dedicated healer.
edit: Grog is clutch. Nevermind! OMG there is a sliver of hope!
edit: Grog is clutch. Nevermind! OMG there is a sliver of hope!
Rockin' Ranger
Member
"That's 48 health."
Laura saying how my mind always interprets hearing, "4d4+4."
Laura saying how my mind always interprets hearing, "4d4+4."
Jay Shadow
Member
He'd be more clutch if he didn't drink his last potion when he didn't find Vax in the stomach. Although he probably wouldn't have gotten it to him in time anyways.
Alpha Centauri
Member
very true.
Jay Shadow
Member
OH SHIT
Alpha Centauri
Member
Fuck that. Matt. Come on..
edit: Grog is a feisty motherfucker
edit: Grog is a feisty motherfucker
Jay Shadow
Member
Luckily
Oh shit, no idea he was that low
Grog is a 1 man regurgitation machine.
Oh shit, no idea he was that low
Alpha Centauri
Member
i missed the amount. how much health was left?
Jay Shadow
Member
That was amazing.
I love how fair Matt is as a DM. He roleplays the enemies Vox Machina fights perfectly and doesn't hold back from what an intelligent adversary would do
. It can sometimes feel cruel that he doesn't let up when the guys clearly care so much about their characters but then you remember that's exactly how it needs to be, so that if they win, they've really earned it and any drama has its full weight. Bravo.
I can't wait for the next episode.
I love how fair Matt is as a DM. He roleplays the enemies Vox Machina fights perfectly and doesn't hold back from what an intelligent adversary would do
(Like going after Keyleth on her last death saving throw. Only a low roll saved her!)
That fight felt truly desperate, and generated so many great character moments. Vax focused on protecting Keyleth. Percy's frustration at being useless. Tary, out of his depth in the depths, moving towards the Kraken at the end, rather than fleeing; perhaps finding his courage or is he desperately trying to impress the others? Then Grog, who doesn't like him, not giving a fuck and abandoning him. Percy being pragmatic as usual and manipulating Grog to go back because Tary has the stone. Keyleth, with great indecision throughout the whole fight, somehow making lucky/wise choices all along, then being a great leader and knowing when to retreat to save Vex and Vax, and relying on the others to be capable of escaping themselves.
I can't wait for the next episode.
And I'm glad Tary didn't die. Sam has been killing it with him.
Didn't it take a turn in there to get acid damage because it was the stomach acid, so they had to get to the stomach first?
That's possible, but for the first
swallowing
acid damage was given on the start of the Kraken's turn for each creature swallowed
Last episode was fantastic. It felt like a proper boss fight and everyone was out of their element. I enjoyed Percy trying to completely over design a solution and just ended up being useless the whole fight. Rather than trying to make brave new advances in un-pop-able bubble technology in an hour, just ask for a crossbow, dude, I'm sure they had them.
Grog continues to be the best.
Not the least bit surprised that Reddit was apparently a shit show afterwords and needed Matt to come in and calm all the children down. It's always either a sycophantic cult or the Children of the Corn over there.
Grog continues to be the best.
Not the least bit surprised that Reddit was apparently a shit show afterwords and needed Matt to come in and calm all the children down. It's always either a sycophantic cult or the Children of the Corn over there.
Rockin' Ranger
Member
As much as I'd like to see them save Vax tonight it would also be kinda fun to see one of the party final die and then have Vex blame Scanlan for not being there to save her brother should be return.
What were they upset about this time?
Alpha Centauri
Member
It's almost like America in the 60's spending millions of dollars to develop an inkpen that would write in space. Or you could use pencils for 20 cents each. Atleast in America's case there were risks to using pencils. Percy has no excuse lol
I don't think she would blame Scanlan. But it would be some good drama and crazy development if she did. I don't think Scanlan would ever apologize for leaving Vox to be with his daughter. If they expect that they can kick rocks lol
It's been 88 episodes, but it is finally time to see baby Keyleth grow up!
Jay Shadow
Member
Lot of interesting possibilities tonight and going forward.
First of all the Plane Shift might not have hit the target if they're doing a roll for it, so there may be some travel with a corpse involved. They might even be dumped in the ocean.
If the res succeeds Matt could possibly work in some Raven Queen stuff into it.
If it doesn't, then we see if the blame game starts. Keyleth is obviously gonna blame herself anyways cause that's what she'd do. Does Vex end up being understanding or does she blame her too? Does Grog blame her for the no kill order that he was obviously not a fan of.
Does Marisha change her mind and have Keyleth learn true resurrection when possible, and what kinda consequences would Matt have for that.
And even with Vax gone would he still be used later as some kinda spectral servant of the Raven Queen.
Most importantly, does Vex loot his armor so she can have wings?
If the res succeeds Matt could possibly work in some Raven Queen stuff into it.
If it doesn't, then we see if the blame game starts. Keyleth is obviously gonna blame herself anyways cause that's what she'd do. Does Vex end up being understanding or does she blame her too? Does Grog blame her for the no kill order that he was obviously not a fan of.
Does Marisha change her mind and have Keyleth learn true resurrection when possible, and what kinda consequences would Matt have for that.
And even with Vax gone would he still be used later as some kinda spectral servant of the Raven Queen.
Most importantly, does Vex loot his armor so she can have wings?
I want them to do something unique with tonight's resurrection involving the Raven Queen. Maybe she just revives Vax herself, but then gives him a more specific task that he has to accomplish. I saw someone mention Vax being brought back as a revenant, which are people brought back with a single minded ambition to complete some task. Doesn't really seem like the RQ's style, but maybe.
Whatever happens, I just don't want Matt's cool homebrewed resurrection rituals to become rote or tedious over time. The group's rituals are pretty formulaic at this point.
Whatever happens, I just don't want Matt's cool homebrewed resurrection rituals to become rote or tedious over time. The group's rituals are pretty formulaic at this point.
Also, Ashley was on at the end of Talks Machina this week so hopefully she'll be on the show.
Poor girl always shows up to revive her dead friends and then flies out again.
I didn't really do a deep dive, and just saw people talking about it second hand. It seemed like mostly people complaining about how badly the group played last week, backseat driving and getting rude to specific players. And then the opposite where anyone who politely critiqued the group's actions was met with vitriol and downvotes. Matt had to come in and tell everyone basically, "Hey it's alright to disagree, we actually want discussion, everyone on both sides should stop being dicks".
Henchmen21
Banned
Laura is SERIOUS about her donuts
Alpha Centauri
Member
Druids are OP as fuck.
Jest Chillin
Member
They really aren't. I don't have my PHB handy but I don't recall anything like that for Druids. I think it's a custom thing Matt came up with for the Aramente.
Nope, this is a standard
9th level spell-shapechange