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[Rymuth]

This is a continuation on that one Reddit user who calculated how much money is needed to unlock everything in the game - go here http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=1353701

In a recent livestream, the director responded with the following:

"We never had an intention for you to unlock everything in the game,"

"That doesn't really make any sense. It's like in an RPG, in World of Warcraft, you would never try to unlock everything for all the characters. Same thing in any MOBA, you're not trying to unlock all the content for all the heroes."

"We don't expect a player to buy everything. We just expect them to buy the items they want right away."

Some in the FH subreddit are now calling Ubi the worst company since EA

Stab me in the back if old

 

[Savantcore]

Ha, I kinda like that actually. The implementation in the game is awful because real money is involved, but I like the idea that not everything can be unlocked.

 

[bombshell]

Title is everything that is wrong with (most of) today's AAA games in one sentence.

 

[R00bot]

Not very good pr.

 

[jacobeid]

Title is everything that is wrong with (most of) today's AAA games in one sentence.

Yup. Not a good look, Ubi.

 

[benzopil]

Everyone overreacted, what a surprise.

What's the point of playing if you unlock everything easily within first hours.

 

[FatalT]

Title is everything that is wrong with (most of) today's AAA games in one sentence.

This is indefensible. Holy fucking shot but at they're owning up to it.

 

[Lanrutcon]

World of Warcraft is a terrible comparison. It has 12 years of content updates and expansions' worth of stuff for each class. That and the two games are nothing alike on almost any level.

 

[wapplew]

MOBA have hundred of heroes, you got 12.

 

[Darkstorne]

Out of curiosity, why are people jumping so hard on For Honor for being a buy to play game with cosmetic unlocks that can be purchased with real world currency, and not the countless other games available that do the same thing? Overwatch, Call of Duty, Battlefield etc, all have similar systems in place. In many ways I consider For Honor BETTER for not having the cosmetics delivered in loot crates. At least you definitely get the cosmetic you want every single time in this game.

Is this simply a bandwagon scenario that has led to For Honor taking the brunt of this backlash over other games, or is there genuinely a good argument (which I've yet to see) for why this game's implementation of cosmetic unlocks is any worse than any other buy to play MP focused game?

 

[SatoAilDarko]

Aren't MOBAS usually free-to-play?

 

[Vincent Grayson]

Everyone overreacted, what a surprise.

What's the point of playing if you unlock everything easily within first hours.

Presumably, the point is playing a fun game. If a game can't stand on its own, and the only thing keeping players interested is the psychological effect of carrot and stick bullshit and/or minor progression, then it isn't a very good game in the first place.

I mean shit, do you guys remember when FPS games didn't have "unlocks"? Pro-tip: we still played the good ones for years and years.

 

[Hyun Sai]

Yeah, I don't really care, it's already pretty hard to master 2 characters at a high level, and I already unlocked what I wanted for the two I play without spending a cent.

 

[HighResTomato]

So glad I didn't buy For Honor, fuck Ubisoft and their MT ridden trash.

Selling people games and then say "We didn't intent for you to experience the whole game".

 

[benzopil]

Presumably, the point is playing a fun game. If a game can't stand on its own, and the only thing keeping players interested is the psychological effect of carrot and stick bullshit and/or minor progression, then it isn't a very good game in the first place.

I mean shit, do you guys remember when FPS games didn't have "unlocks"? Pro-tip: we still played the good ones for years and years.

You can play a fun game in 1v1 and 2v2 -- overpowered gear is not available there. When you unlock cool stuff, you can try 4v4.

 

[Nights Owl]

Everyone overreacted, what a surprise.

What's the point of playing if you unlock everything easily within first hours.

A few hours I can understand, but I believe the math was if you played 2 hours a day, every day for 2 years, you'd just have enough to unlock everything. That's way too fucking long.

Ha, I kinda like that actually. The implementation in the game is awful because real money is involved, but I like the idea that not everything can be unlocked.

... I'm sorry, but why? You like the idea of content you paid for already on the disc being unable to be unlocked? What kinda sense does that make?

... I just don't get the thought process here.

 

[Plum]

You can play a fun game in 1v1 and 2v2 -- overpowered gear is not available there. When you unlock cool stuff, you can try 4v4.

"There's a game mode for people who don't want to grind for/buy 'cool stuff', it's called 1v1."

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

Wait, what am I missing here? You can play all 12 characters in the game from the get go- there's no abilities that you need to unlock.

What's the outrage?

 

[epmode]

Everyone overreacted, what a surprise.

Fuck that. They know that a significant part of their audience is predisposed to want EVERYTHING, money be damned. It's similar to the way that F2P games are designed around whales in spite of what the developer claims.

Wait, what am I missing here? You can play all 12 characters in the game from the get go- there's no abilities that you need to unlock.

What's the outrage?

I'm pretty tired of people giving carte blanche to greedy practices if it only applies to cosmetics.

 

[Spukc]

Ubisoft makes EA look like

I avoid all ubisoft games these days.

 

[Heckler456]

Fuck that. They know that a significant part of their audience is predisposed to want EVERYTHING, money be damned. It's similar to the way that F2P games are designed around whales in spite of what the developer claims.

Ubisoft isn't responsible for having to protect people from themselves.

 

[Savantcore]

... I'm sorry, but why? You like the idea of content you paid for already on the disc being unable to be unlocked? What kinda sense does that make?

... I just don't get the thought process here.

Forces you to think about what kind of character you want to create and makes you commit to those choices. Sounds like an improvement to just ticking boxes until 100% complete like in most games.

Unless it's entire levels or other substantial content that you're locked out from, then yeah, I'd feel like I'm being ripped off. If it's cosmetic or 'X ability or Y ability' then I think it would be an interesting and fun mechanic. This is without microtransactions though.

 

[benzopil]

"There's a game mode for people who don't want to grind for/buy 'cool stuff', it's called 1v1."

The game was designed for 1v1 and 2v2, because it's a fighting game. But there are additional 4v4 modes if you want.

 

[Darkstorne]

So glad I didn't buy For Honor, fuck Ubisoft and their MT ridden trash.

Selling people games and then say "We didn't intent for you to experience the whole game".

Seriously, I'm getting so convinced this is nothing but bandwagoning, and that the majority of people complaining about this don't even play the game.

"The WHOLE game"? Really? The cosmetics are the important part in a game to you, and you also want all those cosmetics instantly without progression? That's worthy of a "fuck you" to the developers? Every single character is available to play right from the start, and not a single piece of content is gated behind any paywalls or even progression unlocks. The cosmetics are the only form of progression this game has beyond the steady development of player skill, so of course you're expected to unlock them at a slow and steady pace. It leads to players having unique looking characters, whether that be physical appearance, different emotes, different executions, and it's up to you which of those things you want to use to customize your favourite classes with. What's the problem with that?

 

[Alienfan]

Their response is fucked up, but I agree that not every item in a game needs to be 100% unlockable

 

[ISee]

"We never had an intention for you to unlock everything in the game, because we want you to buy most of it."

 

[jf DOOM]

The older I get the more I don't understand all these fiascos that crop up in gaming. People are really up in arms about having to play the game to unlock Coamwtics...? This is unbelievable, sit the controller down and go take a walk, you may need a break from video games for awhile.

 

[Plum]

The game was designed for 1v1 and 2v2, because it's a fighting game. But there are additional 4v4 modes if you want.

So people should have to intentionally limit their $60 purchase because they don't want to pay up or grind? That's what both of these posts are saying to me and it's why I referenced the infamous Don Mattrick "no online? It's called a 360" quote.

 

[wapplew]

Seriously, I'm getting so convinced this is nothing but bandwagoning, and that the majority of people complaining about this don't even play the game.

"The WHOLE game"? Really? The cosmetics are the important part in a game to you, and you also want all those cosmetics instantly without progression? That's worthy of a "fuck you" to the developers? Every single character is available to play right from the start, and not a single piece of content is gated behind any paywalls or even progression unlocks. The cosmetics are the only form of progression this game has beyond the steady development of player skill, so of course you're expected to unlock them at a slow and steady pace. It leads to players having unique looking characters, whether that be physical appearance, different emotes, different executions, and it's up to you which of those things you want to use to customize your favourite classes with. What's the problem with that?

Have you play the game? There is gears grind too, not just cosmetic.

 

[Linkstrikesback]

Everyone overreacted, what a surprise.

What's the point of playing if you unlock everything easily within first hours.

... For fun?

Like, the act of enjoying a good game can't be enough?

It's fine to have a game where you aren't expected to get through 100% of it. Like the korok seeds in BOTW. This, however is just a cheap moneygrab calculated by ubisoft to try and force more people to spend money. They don't care about you being able to unlock things. It's just part of an elaborate scheme to get as many people as possible to spend on microtransactions

 

[Heckler456]

Seriously, I'm getting so convinced this is nothing but bandwagoning, and that the majority of people complaining about this don't even play the game.

"The WHOLE game"? Really? The cosmetics are the important part in a game to you, and you also want all those cosmetics instantly without progression? That's worthy of a "fuck you" to the developers? Every single character is available to play right from the start, and not a single piece of content is gated behind any paywalls or even progression unlocks. The cosmetics are the only form of progression this game has beyond the steady development of player skill, so of course you're expected to unlock them at a slow and steady pace.

Fucking this. I don't get it, I thought cosmetic microtransactions were off limits from all this complaining? Like, didn't we collectively decide that this was the golden middleroad between pay to win and not allowing devs any other revenue stream other than the price of the game like an age ago?

 

[benzopil]

So people should have to intentionally limit their $60 purchase because they don't want to pay up or grind? That's what both of these posts are essentially saying and it's why I referenced the infamous Don Mattrick "no online? It's called a 360" quote

Well nobody forces you to limit yourself, I personally played 4v4 much more than other modes. Yes, sometimes you get destroyed, but most of the time you can perform just fine.

 

[sphinx]

"We never had an intention for you to unlock everything in the game, because we want you to buy most of it."

I don't think they mean that.

they mean "you shouldn't want to unlock everything, be it by buying or grinding"

 

[Darkstorne]

Have you play the game? There is gears grind too, not just cosmetic.

Yes, I do play the game. I haven't bought a single crate for gear because you get it for free at the end of most matches anyway. I've spent my steel on executions and emotes and am currently saving up for a mythic outfit for the flaming wings (only 5k to go). Most notable of all is that gear really doesn't make up for a lack of player skill and co-ordination in 4v4s, and in duels and brawls (the real skill-based matchups) gear stats are disabled anyway so again, they're just cosmetic.

EDIT: Furthermore, gear level is tied to player level, so a new player can't drop their entire credit card on the game and expect high end gear stats as a shortcut. It'll all be low level gear. There really isn't much of a shortcut you can take by buying anything.

 

[Plum]

Well nobody forces you to limit yourself, I personally played 4v4 much more than other modes. Yes, sometimes you get destroyed, but most of the time you can perform just fine.

Whether the "forcing" is literal or not, having to limit yourself to only two main modes because one has people who will "destroy" you because they paid up isn't right in a full-priced title.

 

[Nights Owl]

Seriously, I'm getting so convinced this is nothing but bandwagoning, and that the majority of people complaining about this don't even play the game.

"The WHOLE game"? Really? The cosmetics are the important part in a game to you, and you also want all those cosmetics instantly without progression? That's worthy of a "fuck you" to the developers? Every single character is available to play right from the start, and not a single piece of content is gated behind any paywalls or even progression unlocks. The cosmetics are the only form of progression this game has beyond the steady development of player skill, so of course you're expected to unlock them at a slow and steady pace. It leads to players having unique looking characters, whether that be physical appearance, different emotes, different executions, and it's up to you which of those things you want to use to customize your favourite classes with. What's the problem with that?

I'm sorry, but if you can't see how this isn't anti-consumer then I don't know what to tell you. I can understand putting in a *reasonable* amount of time to unlock everything. But the math points to 2 years at 2 hours a day for everything is absurd.

No, the "whole game" is not under a paywall, but a lot of things they allow you to unlock take extremely long to make progress on. It's slimy, and a big reason I *don't* like a lot of games nowadays. I don't like this shit in any game, and I tend to not buy them.

And just an FYI, I have played the game, I played the Beta enjoyed my time, and knew this was Ubisoft so they were going to fuck me over as a consumer if I bought their game. So I didn't.

Why do you people defend this disgusting shit? You already paid 60 dollars for the game, but only in the last decade has it became okay for devs to lock content (on the disc/download you paid for) behind a paywall, when it would have all just been there to unlock in a reasonable time in any other game before this became a thing.

 

[ClosingADoor]

They are right. In which games are you going around to unlock every cosmetic upgrade, even for characters you don't play as normally.

 

[Aselith]

Fuck that. They know that a significant part of their audience is predisposed to want EVERYTHING, money be damned. It's similar to the way that F2P games are designed around whales in spite of what the developer claims.

It's a pretty small part which is why most F2P audiences only monetize single digits.

 

[Darkstorne]

I'm sorry, but if you can't see how this isn't anti-consumer then I don't know what to tell you. I can understand putting in a *reasonable* amount of time to unlock everything. But the math points to 2 years at 2 hours a day for everything is absurd.

And how many hours would it take you to unlock absolutely everything in other buy-to-play MP focused games like Overwatch, Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc? My argument here has never been to say the complaint against cosmetics is wrong, but that singling out For Honor as though it's doing something worse than other far more popular buy-to-play games is wrong. If anything For Honor is better by not putting these cosmetics into gamble boxes. Only gear is available in gamble boxes, which is provided for free at the end of most matches anyway.

You're perfectly welcome to say this practice in general, across all games, is wrong. But the bandwagoning against For Honor is ridiculous.

 

[benzopil]

I'm sorry, but if you can't see how this isn't anti-consumer then I don't know what to tell you. I can understand putting in a *reasonable* amount of time to unlock everything. But the math points to 2 years at 2 hours a day for everything is absurd.

Again, why do you need to unlock everything?

I won't EVER believe anybody who says they play as every single character. You choose two, maybe three, maybe four or five but not twelve. Some characters are boring for you, some are poorly designed for you tastes, some of them are ugly or whatever. So why do you need everything?

 

[Calm Mind]

Ubisoft happens™

 

[Skux]

Well he's got a point.

You could buy everything in a game like League of Legends and spend tens of thousands of dollars.

No one at Riot expects anyone to do that.

 

[ISee]

I don't think they mean that.

they mean "you shouldn't want to unlock everything, be it by buying or grinding"

Systems like that exist to encourage spending money. Do they expect you to get everything? Of course not, but they build a system to tempt you into buying stuff, at least some of it.
Is this a bad thing? Well, I certainly buy cosmetics in certain games sometimes if I really like them and certainly don't care about all of it. But there are collectors and people who want to have everything, it's just the way they are and I understand that they are upset. The time and money needed to get all the stuff is ridiculous and seems at least a bit gridy. But to be fair this isn't a specific ubisoft problem you could also throw blizzard or valve into the same pot.

 

[Spukc]

Well he's got a point.

You could buy everything in a game like League of Legends and spend tens of thousands of dollars.

No one at Riot expects anyone to do that.

LoL is F2P

 

[PhaZZe]

its like overwatch?

 

[Unreal Champ]

Well he's got a point.

You could buy everything in a game like League of Legends and spend tens of thousands of dollars.

No one at Riot expects anyone to do that.

You didn't have to spend $60 + tax on League of Legends thou.

 

[Eumi]

Did Ubi get their internal thoughts and external voice mixed up?

Most devs: "we wish to stress that all cosmetics can be unlocked in game, and that micro transactions are only there for players that want to use them."

Ubi: "What? No. Of course you can't unlock everything. Give us more money."

 

[dex3108]

You didn't have to spend $60 + tax on League of Legends thou.

And what you get for 60$ in For Honor and what you get for free in LoL?

 

[danmaku]

I wonder if Rocked League players complain about not being able to unlock ALL items for ALL cars in a short time. Wait, RL is not by Ubisoft, problem solved.

 

[patapuf]

Ubisoft makes EA look like



I avoid all ubisoft games these days.

Lol, the EA that earns literally billions with Fifa Ultimate Team and has just as much crap to unlock on top of cosmetic loot boxes for battlefield and co?

I don't know any popular MP game where it's possible to get everything.

Even in stuff like Rocket league or Counter strike.