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Total War: Warhammer |OT| WAAAGHcraft 4

karnage10

Banned
a bit off topic but i'm eager for CA to explain, in detail, how the merge of the campaign maps will happen, how naval battles happen and what the old friend is.

Also i hope they release a trailer for each race; because I don't know much about warhammer, these trailers help me decide the order in which i'll pick factions.
 
Pretty sure everyone forgot about the High Elves because it's the most obvious first pick.

I will say that my High Elves playing buddy had this really cool idea for their faction. They could introduce some distinctiveness by incorporating the per-kingdom special units and making a huge % of their unit roster only available through special buildings, like how the Empire has the Chapterhouse of the Blazing Sun. So depending on where you start, your early-game army comp is gonna be dramatically different, and on defense, you've got to be really careful about which cities you let the enemy take.
 

NEO0MJ

Member
All right, managed to sit long enough today to feel I'm beginning to at least understand what I'm looking at. Unit upkeep will probably be the death of me. Is it worth keeping a Lord and a few units in a province to maintain order or did I misunderstand and that has no effect?
 
All right, managed to sit long enough today to feel I'm beginning to at least understand what I'm looking at. Unit upkeep will probably be the death of me. Is it worth keeping a Lord and a few units in a province to maintain order or did I misunderstand and that has no effect?

If you really need a quick order boost, sure. Although early on you'll probably be better off putting that extra money into your main army or infrastructure, rather than a secondary army that will be too weak to really beat anything.

Order buildings will be the main way you keep order in a large empire.
 
Honestly a lot of the time you can also ignore order. Once it reach -100, a small band of bandits or whatever will spawn and will keep reinforcing every turn, but if you're close you can just smash them down, get some xp/items and order will go back up from it too. And generally past the first few turns of capturing new territory where you have order penalties, it's very easy to maintain unless playing on legendary(even on very hard it isn't that bad).

While you can make armies for order, it's fairly cost inefficient, although if you're making a small defense army to defend from Chaos marauders or Beastmen as your main armies moves away, then you can use that to fix order.

Much less expensive however is making a hero that has order buff. Most(all?) armies have one, it gives a fair amount of order when you deploy him, so you can just rotate him in your new territories, deploy for a few turns.

You can also temporarily turn on the region buff for order in regions that need it, but generally it's better to use the growth one.
 
I started the VC campaign,my second campaign after the dwarves. Some notes:

-I took the mage instead of Manfred. The idea was to abuse his -15% reduction cost in Raise Dead (which is accumulative with another -7% trait you win after raising undead a few times and another -15% from one of the end skill trees). In fact for most of the campaign I've been raising dead, not using recruitment buildings. I have a pair of big battle points where in fact I can recruit some end-game units.
-I did a very good early game, I rushed and in just a few turns I defeated the two rival VC and had the 3 entire provinces.
-I've been using, and in good effect, armies composed of 3/4 cheap skellies/zombies and 1/4 of cavalry/monsters. In a way these cheap armies were needed because my economy sucked (har har suck, _vampires_)
-The exception are the sieges, which with this kind of army they are horrible. Cheap units are melted in the tough fight for the walls and cavalry can't flank. In fact I had one battle which I played directly and had 3 full armies vs 1 army + garrison in a city with upgraded walls and damn, I was utterly defeated. In fact I won that one by using the autobattle system, which clearly isn't accurate and let me win by sheer number of forces.
-In the mid game I found problems with lack of vampiric population, and therefore of public order. This slowed me greatly, the campaign would have gone in another direction without this problem. In fact I suppose VC are balanced because of that, they would be easy-peasy otherwise.
-In this campaign I barely played direct battles. Not by conscious choice, but because the battles happened to be mainly one sided affairs (not interesting then) or sieges (boring grind) or both. Mostly, I have been the aggressor and did 'blitzkrieg' on small nations, reaching their settlement and siege them before they could answer.
-Without a special long-term plan, I just attacked what it seemed my weakest neighbor, once at a time. This kind of strategy let me expand to the North, and then to the West, and then finally to the central Imperial provinces. Which it may have been a mistake. Because before I could take the Empire the Chaos horde appeared, and who is the dude at the North, taking all the brunt of their attacks, without no allies? Yep, that's me.
-My current status (lol):
ZB6oqs3.png

nGlgFVd.png

And because that isn't enough, I also have all northern chaos barbarians destroying my towns to the west near the coast.

I don't know if I should retreat and wait until they make the mistake of dividing up their armies, or try to hold in the city siege. I could even try to retreat to the South, sacking everything, and with that extra money hire even more armies (I have 5 right now) to finally beat Chaos.
 
Your VC strategy is similar to mine--I just attack the weakest neighbour, divide and conquer, and build up my territory. I don't build up giant summoned armies by choice, but by necessity; I can't spare the time or money to recruit better units. This only really becomes a problem against Dwarves or Chaos, with their high-armour armies, where even overwhelming numbers are not enough.

The main thing to beat Chaos (or any invader, really) is vampiric corruption. It will devastate their armies as they advance on your land. Just be sure to wall off and fortify every location so the sieges are drawn out as long as possible--although the besieger is immune to attrition, the two to four armies beside them are not. Second thing is Lightning Strike--you absolutely need one (anti-armour) army with this to ensure you finish off weak stacks first. It can be the difference between breaking a siege or being slowly crushed.

Also, the Vampire economy is kind of weird. They make a good amount of money from each province, but are geographically isolated from the big boosts human factions can get. So they'll make most of their money from a handful of high-level provinces, which makes any territorial losses devastating.

It can get real touch-and-go during the Chaos invasion.

Oh, and for Norsca, all you can really do is forebear them until you break Chaos. It's the price you pay for expanding North, and much worse if you have anything on that Northern coast. With the tight finances of the VCs, it's pretty much a lost cause to defend against them--it will inevitably cost you core territories during Chaos' crusade.
 
Any tips for bordeaux? I really dont want to fight against the welfs because I think they are way overpowered and I dont think its possible the amass the armies needed to overpower them. They never seem to accept non-agression pacts.
 

Carl7

Member
Expanding north as VC is the ideal strat. You can defend Praag quite easily and everyone will love you as long as you keep beating the chaos. Use that opportunity to ally with Bretonnia and the Dwarves and they will you join your war against the Empire after Age of Peace.
 
My god I will just give up bretonnia. Jesus does this faction sucks. Melee units cant defend against anyone. I just dont get this. Many times the balance of power is like 70% in my favor and I still get my ass handed to me. I have no idea what im doing wrong. Am I seriousy supposed to use only cavalry? I have like 12 stacks of foot squires and they get obliterated in every match. The cavalry doesnt seem strong enough to save them. Should just save money to get the pegasus knights asap?
 

karnage10

Banned
Your VC strategy is similar to mine--I just attack the weakest neighbour, divide and conquer, and build up my territory. I don't build up giant summoned armies by choice, but by necessity; I can't spare the time or money to recruit better units. This only really becomes a problem against Dwarves or Chaos, with their high-armour armies, where even overwhelming numbers are not enough.

The main thing to beat Chaos (or any invader, really) is vampiric corruption. It will devastate their armies as they advance on your land. Just be sure to wall off and fortify every location so the sieges are drawn out as long as possible--although the besieger is immune to attrition, the two to four armies beside them are not. Second thing is Lightning Strike--you absolutely need one (anti-armour) army with this to ensure you finish off weak stacks first. It can be the difference between breaking a siege or being slowly crushed.

Also, the Vampire economy is kind of weird. They make a good amount of money from each province,
but are geographically isolated from the big boosts human factions can get. So they'll make most of their money from a handful of high-level provinces, which makes any territorial losses devastating.

It can get real touch-and-go during the Chaos invasion.

Oh, and for Norsca, all you can really do is forebear them until you break Chaos. It's the price you pay for expanding North, and much worse if you have anything on that Northern coast. With the tight finances of the VCs, it's pretty much a lost cause to defend against them--it will inevitably cost you core territories during Chaos' crusade.

I disagree with the bolded.
I don't think lightning strike is really needed unless you mind losing an army or 2. By the time chaos arrives you can probably field 3-4 high AP armies + 1-2 scrap armies. You keep your high AP armies in your main cities near the border chaos attacks, if they force a defensive battle, that army + garrison should make short work of 3-4 chaos armies (remember they can only bring 40 units like yourself to a battle). If they ignore your main cities you go behind them in ambush stance, this will allow you to slowly sorround them by your elite armies, if they spot your ambush they will beat the army but will take heavy losses allowing your small cities to easily beat that stack.
By using agents, VC are the 2nd best economy in the game; while they don't make as much as the dwarves they make much more then the rest of the factions, if you get drakenhoff and wolfenburg with max goldmine + vampire crypts + necro libraries + >1 banshee+ > 1 necro you can "easily" get 20k from each city; with time the traits of the agents will boost that value skyhigh.

Sändersson;234420309 said:
My god I will just give up bretonnia. Jesus does this faction sucks. Melee units cant defend against anyone. I just dont get this. Many times the balance of power is like 70% in my favor and I still get my ass handed to me. I have no idea what im doing wrong. Am I seriousy supposed to use only cavalry? I have like 12 stacks of foot squires and they get obliterated in every match. The cavalry doesnt seem strong enough to save them. Should just save money to get the pegasus knights asap?

My brettonia line holds pretty well (i play on VH); my comp is:
line:
-> at center "men at arms" with anti infantry x2
-> at flanks "men at arms with charge defense against large" x4
-> behind the center archers x4
-> all units inside a damsel's are of influence
-> behind everyone 2 trebuchet
Flankers:
-> high charge bonus cavalry x3 (one for each side +1 for reserve)
-> high damage dealer cavalry x3 (one for each side +1 for reserve)
-> the lord (on the enemy strongest side)

The lord supports the line IF the he doesn't have the red skill that boosts MD and leadership with 3 points.

Basically i wait for the enemy to charge my infantry, use damsel to boost the infantry so that they don't die too fast. then i use my archers to either pick the enemy archers or move them to the flanks, at around the same time i'll move my cavalry which will focus on wiping the enemy flanking force; While all this is happening the reserve cavalry will either go around enemy flankers and hit the enemy units that are easy to rout or can't fight back or will reinforce the line like it was infantry. After a few mins you should have the control of the flanks, by this time your line should be flickering like hell, I then normally move the cavalry behind the enemy line and charge at them rightly from behind; this should turn the battle and your infantry units should stop flickering. the high charge bonus cavalry cycle charges a bit and it should be enough to rout most of the enemy army; allowing you to focus on the few elite units left.
That's how i use them.
 
Sändersson;234420309 said:
My god I will just give up bretonnia. Jesus does this faction sucks. Melee units cant defend against anyone. I just dont get this. Many times the balance of power is like 70% in my favor and I still get my ass handed to me. I have no idea what im doing wrong. Am I seriousy supposed to use only cavalry? I have like 12 stacks of foot squires and they get obliterated in every match. The cavalry doesnt seem strong enough to save them. Should just save money to get the pegasus knights asap?

You need to use cav as the main force and the inf as the support.The Brets are a cav heavy faction that have good support units.
 

Violet_0

Banned
cav are generally vulnerable "hammer" units that can't fight their way through infantry blocks on their own. Most of the time you want blocks of "anvil" units to bring numbers to the battlefield and get any units stuck in your formations. Squires and polearms are really solid generalist units, spearmen get a combat bonus against monsters and cavalry but they'll still die in droves 1v1. Get a grail reliquae and strategically place your heroes and general to give your army a huge moral boost

use your knights to wipe out any undefended ranged unit and artillery while their melee units engage your infantry blocks. You'll only need the cheap knights for this task, your elite knights should go kill their elite cav. When the infantry blocks are fighting, sneak your knights behind the enemy lines and rear charge them. Once they completed their charge, let them retreat a short distance then charge again. If an enemy unit breaks after a charge, it's often best to not pursue them but ride straight into the next unit. Use the fast movement command as often as necessary, cav units have a lot of stamina

magic wise, the lore of nature is always a great choice. Just spam the cheap healing spell but be aware that there's a limit to how much health a unit can heal during a battle. The area of effect armor buff is good too

oh, and I always bring 1-3 archer units to destroy their skirmishers and harpies and so on. They don't do much damage but will get rid of unarmored targets and mounted ranged units which are otherwise hard to deal with. The poison arrows are nearly always better but the fire arrows get a boost against the tree units
 

BibiMaghoo

Member
Sändersson;234420309 said:
My god I will just give up bretonnia. Jesus does this faction sucks. Melee units cant defend against anyone. I just dont get this. Many times the balance of power is like 70% in my favor and I still get my ass handed to me. I have no idea what im doing wrong. Am I seriousy supposed to use only cavalry? I have like 12 stacks of foot squires and they get obliterated in every match. The cavalry doesnt seem strong enough to save them. Should just save money to get the pegasus knights asap?

Bretonnian infantry are like goblins or zombies. Completely expendable and shit in a fight. Use them to hold up tough enemies then smash them either side with some knights. Use questing knights for heavily armoured enemies. They can hold their own well.
 
I can see why people hate anti piracy. My internet isn't working on my computer and I can't play this game in offline mode.

What a piece of shit.
 

Carl7

Member
There are not many things in gamming better than seeing Kolek Suneater charging and killing hundreds of enemies in a single battle.
 

karnage10

Banned
I can see why people hate anti piracy. My internet isn't working on my computer and I can't play this game in offline mode.

What a piece of shit.

As a student i had to go to azores which is an island near portugal (Iberia peninsula in europe) there for a couple of months i didn't had internet at home. Even trough i had a few hundred games on steam it was a nightmare to have a game that worked offline, and those that worked i had to go online every few weeks or they would stop working.
That was a few years ago but i don't think steam has improved much at this front. It is easier to download a crack then to make your official steam games to work.
 

prudislav

Member
Did you just pick it up? I think if you just purchased it it requires that one time activation.

Otherwise it should work fine in offline mode.
its Denuvo and that one requires periodical (last time i tried on TWWH it was about 10 days) reactivation, sometimes even after big windows updates

Even trough i had a few hundred games on steam it was a nightmare to have a game that worked offline, and those that worked i had to go online every few weeks or they would stop working.
That was a few years ago but i don't think steam has improved much at this front. It is easier to download a crack then to make your official steam games to work.
apart from titles with 3rd party DRMs it is all fine , in my experience Denuvo-protected titles are acting weirdly when you are offline for longer period of time as there is some periodical check (also in GTA5)
 

karnage10

Banned
its Denuvo and that one requires periodical (last time i tried on TWWH it was about 10 days) reactivation, sometimes even after big windows updates


apart from titles with 3rd party DRMs it is all fine , in my experience Denuvo-protected titles are acting weirdly when you are offline for longer period of time as there is some periodical check (also in GTA5)

Not really what happened to me. Most games need to be launched while you are online at least once (which was a pain at that time because i had to go to a library to download the games).
I remember to had problems with CIV IV/V, railroad tycoon 3, vampire the masquerade, alpha protocol, dawn of war 2, magic 2012 and a fallout. There were much more but i don't remember which had problems.
The only games that worked were "small" indie titles like binding of isaac, men of war, etc.
 

prudislav

Member
@karnage10: yeah few years ago uit was pain overall, but now its just the games with 3rd party DRMs (and there i still lot of those). everything based on steamworks alone should work fine (not sure if all CEG based games have it removed now thoigh ... will need o test Civ V) ,
As for Fallout, DoW2, Alpha protcol - they had securom iirc

But anyway this is bit offtopic... this is TW-WH topic and thats Denuvo which means i should be offline-able at least 10 days after initial launch (unless some fuckup)
 

Violet_0

Banned
For future reference, Rock, Paper, Shotgun has put up a mini-review/guide for each DLC. It's a quick and easy overview of what's really worth buying with sensible conclusions. It also goes over the free stuff, because why not.

but this culminated in the game's final piece of DLC: Bretonnia
well, we're still waiting for the Old Friend DLC so that part isn't completely true

if I had to pick the best DLC packs, it woud be WE and Bretonnia. At some point you'll probably want the race-specific DLCs for the new units as well, the Goblins and Dwarfs pack is obviously better because of their unique campaigns. The Beastmen are alright, Chaos really isn't that great - but everyone shoud just grab all the DLCs when they are on sale
 

karnage10

Banned
well, we're still waiting for the Old Friend DLC so that part isn't completely true

if I had to pick the best DLC packs, it woud be WE and Bretonnia. At some point you'll probably want the race-specific DLCs for the new units as well, the Goblins and Dwarfs pack is obviously better because of their unique campaigns. The Beastmen are alright, Chaos really isn't that great - but everyone shoud just grab all the DLCs when they are on sale

I completely agree that the DLCs are worth buying however if money is tight it might be wise to wait to see what the price of warhammer 2 will have; if CA prices warhammer 2 at 40 USD/euro it could be a better "deal" then the DLC.
The question is: will warhammer 2 be as fun as warhammer 1?
 

manfestival

Member
I completely agree that the DLCs are worth buying however if money is tight it might be wise to wait to see what the price of warhammer 2 will have; if CA prices warhammer 2 at 40 USD/euro it could be a better "deal" then the DLC.
The question is: will warhammer 2 be as fun as warhammer 1?

it wont
 

karnage10

Banned

I am hoping that CA gives a discount (15-20%) to all those who have the old game and pre-order the new one.
Realistically i get it they are probably going for "DLC bonuses" like unlocking skaven subfaction in the old world instead of discounting the game.

I wish CA announced a "timetable" on when the warhammer 2 is supposedly ready to launch, warhammer 2 price, the existance or not of pre-order DLC , when they are thinking of releasing the "old friend" DLC and most important of all is: How will both games interact with each other?
 
I am looking forward to paying full retail price for the expansion, because this is CA and the Warhammer license we're talking about.

...

I'll go cry in a corner now.
 

Lucifon

Junior Member
They really need to release a bundle with the DLC. We've been holding off since launch for buying it for that reason, and will continue to do so when there's no good value option on the game + dlc. Pointless getting the game for cheaper when you're forking out more than the game's asking price for a few bits of DLC. Or at least a big sale on the lot when 2 comes around would be nice.
 

Kalentan

Member
Finally got my new computer and I've been wanting to play this for a while now since getting in the monthly humble bundle!

The only Total War game I've played before this is Shogun II, but I never got too far in that.

I was thinking of playing the Empire.

Any advice?
 
Finally got my new computer and I've been wanting to play this for a while now since getting in the monthly humble bundle!

The only Total War game I've played before this is Shogun II, but I never got too far in that.

I was thinking of playing the Empire.

Any advice?
Play nice with the other Imperial factions if you can. Don't confederate until later in the game, the opinion penalty you get for doing so is pretty massive; best to wait until the Chaos invasion happens so you can subsumed it in that sweet diplomacy buff. One notable exception to that rule is Marienburg, which you'll want to take early for that massive economy buff.

Pay attention to the special buildings in each province, they can offer significant bonuses depending on how you build them out.

Tactically, Empire's strong suite is their artillery. You'll want at least 4 units of that in a full sized army.
 

karnage10

Banned
Finally got my new computer and I've been wanting to play this for a while now since getting in the monthly humble bundle!

The only Total War game I've played before this is Shogun II, but I never got too far in that.

I was thinking of playing the Empire.

Any advice?

i think empire is a bit hard for a beginner since you are surrounded by enemies on all sides with very few venues for expansion. Dwarfs and Vampire Counts (VC) are a much better place to start because they have a lot of money and their armies are a "one trick pony" which is really really strong.
For the empire the best strategy is to get marienburg and complete the province of reikland these 2 provinces will be your cash makers. After that you need to get one more complete province where you will build your army buildings. Then fortify those provinces until you are comfortable to pick a fight with someone near you (those 3 provinces should give you money for 2-3 complete armies) then fortify that province. Repeat this slowly until you win.
Every city should get walls and the money making building. Don't pick a fights against dwarfs and greenskins (because you can't conquer their territory).



I am looking forward to paying full retail price for the expansion, because this is CA and the Warhammer license we're talking about.

...

I'll go cry in a corner now.
quietly joins you

They really need to release a bundle with the DLC. We've been holding off since launch for buying it for that reason, and will continue to do so when there's no good value option on the game + dlc. Pointless getting the game for cheaper when you're forking out more than the game's asking price for a few bits of DLC. Or at least a big sale on the lot when 2 comes around would be nice.

While i have all DLC i really hope they make a complete pack for the old world edition.
 
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