• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

The PC Engine is like an alternate reality

Kagoshima_Luke

Gold Member
PC Engine CD is one of the few systems that I never had growing up, but really want now. The others being the Jaguar and NeoGeo. One of these times when I go to a retro game convention, I'm going to end up with a system and sack full of games.
 

Syril

Member
The Super Famicom version is the only one currently available in English, and it's good, but the balance is wrecked by the addition of the dragon transformation system in battles, and the infinite item usage.

Yeah, I played the SFC version once a long time ago, and I remember wrecking every battle by having Atrushan transform on the first turn to wipe out most of the enemies, followed by Tamryn healing him immediately after.
 
I loved mine back in the day. I got introduced to the system right before they released the Turbo Duo and stores were doing clearance on the TGCD attachment. Mine came with Ys Book 1&2 and it was such an amazing experience. I remember getting frustrated because the Super CD upgrade cards were in low supply at the time and I ordered Macross 2036 (best macross game IMO) before I even bought the system. Thankfully it was one of a few SCD games that worked fine on the regular TGCD, although missing a few minor in-game dialog additions.

Some of the import PC Engine games I played through...

Xanadu 1&2- Great action RPG exclusives. The gameplay reminded me a lot of Ys with it's bump system. Loved the chiptunes so much that I recorded them onto cassette tapes. Debug mode in Xanadu 1 let me do only side scrolling scenes if I wanted to, because the overhead bits were often chocked full of trial and error because of the day/night system.

Tengai Makyou Kabukiden- One of my favorite JRPGs on the system. Most of the game suddenly takes place in London and you have to fight classic monsters like Vampires, Werewolves, etc. Bosses had musical anime scenes before fighting. Incredible final dungeon that I'm pretty sure the creators of FF VIII took influence from. You first enter it having all abilities but regular attacks blocked out. So you have to traverse this massive Tower of London labyrinth and for each boss defeated you will earn back an ability (item usage, magic, etc).

Emerald Dragon- I wasn't too keen on the combat but it was a satisfying journey. Some memorable full screen cinema scenes. Final act surprised me iirc.

Tengai Makyou Ziria- Rather primitive JRPG which felt a lot like Dragon Quest. Enemy sprites and battle BGs were amazing though.

Macross DYRL- Generic SRPG, but it let me fight wars with the mechs from Macross/Robotech. The CD songs restarting each time I went into a battle scene was obnoxious.

Macross 2036- The best Macross shooter I have ever played. Cool EXP system and currency earned by score. You could buy new special weapons and it reminded me of UN Squadron.

Dracula X- So good.

Ys IV- So good.

Algunos- One of the worst fighting games ever. Do not buy this clunky POS.

Monster Maker- Weird JRPG with a unique cartoon style. Was wowed by one of the shots during combat in an ad, but the game itself was rather clunky. Loadtimes were awful.

Princess Minerva- Mediocre JRPG with an all female cast. Some group bath scenes iirc.

Browning- This side scrolling mech game looks great but an absolute chore to control. Game is incredibly short too. Only thing I recall is that the game used hilarious english voice acting.

Genocide- Generic mech side scroller. Could have been a card game since little of it feels like it takes advantage of the CD hardware. Hit detection was clunky as heck too.

Kaze Kiri Ninja Action- Looked great, but got kinda boring after a couple stages. Hardly worth the high price paid.
 
It was a nice platform with a fair number of great games (half of them stuck in Japan), but it was released too late as a HuCard-based unit given the limitations of the format. In hindsight, I think it could have done much better against Genesis and Super Nintendo if introduced as the Duo in the US soon after its introduction in Japan from the start, skipping right to the CD format as standard and de-emphasizing the HuCard library. Third parties could have gone in a big way for less expensive game media versus competing cartridges of the time, but the core hardware would be really old and less competitive. In the end, it was never positioned well enough to succeed outside of the late '80s.
 
If anyone wants a good site with in-depth reviews of almost every PC Engine game then you should check out "Brothers Duomazov". Some very nice image galleries there too...

http://www.thebrothersduomazov.com/

Also, does anyone out there remember something called the "Turbo Mailing List" or something along those lines? I used to use it to set up import game purchases and meet fellow Turbo fans. There was a really good cheat list for tons of PC Engine games that was there but I haven't though of that place in 20 years or so. Would love it if someone has an archive somewhere....but I doubt it. Google hasn't turned up anything.
 
My modded TurboDuo is one of my favorite retro game relics, I dust it off every now and again. I also had the T-16 and the CD add-on back in the day.

Generally speaking it was a non-starter: underpowered and hobbled by the best games never making it to the States. But it is a fun console and if you can play imports it has a nice library.
 
I had a turbografx16 briefly when they started selling them for super cheap. What are the best localized games for the cd? This threads got me curious.
 

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
My modded TurboDuo is one of my favorite retro game relics, I dust it off every now and again. I also had the T-16 and the CD add-on back in the day.

Generally speaking it was a non-starter: underpowered and hobbled by the best games never making it to the States. But it is a fun console and if you can play imports it has a nice library.

The PC-Engine was 1987 remember, it was overpowered. R-Type took a dump on everything. Even bettering the 16-bit Amiga.

They completely screwed it up in the West. I think it would have found its niche, even against the SNES and MegaDrive, if they hadn't.
 

chunk3rvd

Member
It's not something I was particularly aware of growing up in the UK. Didn't really get any coverage in the gaming mags over here. I discovered it a few years later through emulation though and Andre Panza Kickboxing was my jam. I put a tonne of hours into that game!
 
The PC-Engine was 1987 remember, it was overpowered. R-Type took a dump on everything. Even bettering the 16-bit Amiga.

They completely screwed it up in the West. I think it would have found its niche, even against the SNES and MegaDrive, if they hadn't.

Well in the USA it didn't hit until 1989, a couple months before the more powerful Sega Genesis. I owned both in that era and can tell you it didn't compare favorably. I was the only kid I knew with a T16, everyone else either got a Genesis or was waiting for the SNES.

But like I said: not a bad console! Just not the one that was going to sweep the States.
 

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
Well in the USA it didn't hit until 1989, a couple months before the more powerful Sega Genesis. I owned both in that era and can tell you it didn't compare favorably. I was the only kid I knew with a T16, everyone else either got a Genesis or was waiting for the SNES.

But like I said: not a bad console! Just not the one that was going to sweep the States.

All valid points, but if they'd got it out 2 years earlier, not made it look butt ugly, not tried to market it as something it wasn't, and stuck R-Type in everyone's face it would have built up a dedicated following to at least weather the 16-bit storm.

And in my opinion Dracula X crushes anything on the SNES or MegaDrive. Not bad for a little 8-bit console, and the later games like that could have kept it chugging along as it did in Japan. MegaDrive was even below it there I think.
 

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
One of the most important things about the PC-Engine was it was cool.

That was never going to happen with what they did with it in the West.
 

Discomurf

Member
Loved that system - some of the best shooters ever. Not to mention Devils Crush which is the greatest vg pinball game ever.
 

Nuu

Banned
PC Engine was a fantastic system. Ti me it was tge REAL Super Nintendo, as its library was mostly souped up 8-bit style games.
 
Despite that though, when the TG16 finally released in the US, because of its very strong early lineup and NEC's size, a lot of people seem to have expected it to beat the Genesis... but then it didn't. It was competitive through the first year, but fell badly behind after that, both because Sega's games got better and the TG16 library in Japan thinned out as the system faded.

Anecdotally, I was working at Software Etc. in 1990 and there was next to no interest in the TG16. A very small percentage of customers compared to the Genesis. I just don't think it could compete with the brand recognition of Sega, compounded by the lack of a pack-in game. Though to be fair, it had more interest than the Atari Lynx and Neo Geo.
 

Fularu

Banned
Anecdotally, I was working at Software Etc. in 1990 and there was next to no interest in the TG16. A very small percentage of customers compared to the Genesis. I just don't think it could compete with the brand recognition of Sega, compounded by the lack of a pack-in game. Though to be fair, it had more interest than the Atari Lynx and Neo Geo.
Keith Courage was a packin game

Also while R-Type is prety the game plays like ass because of the constant up and down scrolling (R-Type wasn't designed around it, unlike Gradius).

I vastly prefer the SMS version to this day (or the incredible c64 conversion)
 

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
bomberman-94-japan.png


Greatest Bomberman.

Note: The MegaDrive port looked worse and was only 4-players.
 

Laws00

Member
never really paid attention to the thing. all i knew was bonk

learned all about it with my friend in early 2000s thanks to my friend
 

Indelible

Member
The Turbo Graphx/PC Engine is the only retro system that I regret not playing back in the day. So many great games that I will never play because of how expensive they are.
 
Anecdotally, I was working at Software Etc. in 1990 and there was next to no interest in the TG16. A very small percentage of customers compared to the Genesis. I just don't think it could compete with the brand recognition of Sega, compounded by the lack of a pack-in game. Though to be fair, it had more interest than the Atari Lynx and Neo Geo.
Well, it has always been said that NEC focused on some large urban areas with the TG16, so where you are has a big impact on this. People in the Chicago or New York areas are more likely to have seen the system than someone like me; I only remember actually seeing a TG16 in a playable store demo one time, and it was at the one chain that did push the system nationwide, Toys R Us.

But besides that, think about it. When the Genesis and TG16 both released in August 1989, NEC had three major advantages over Sega:

- Sega was not exactly well thought of in the US as a home console manufacturer. The Master System had some good games, but few people bought it and it finished third that generation here, behind even the Atari 7800. By the time the Genesis and TG16 released in the US, the SMS had already been discontinued in Japan and was dying quickly in the US. Sure, it was still selling fine in Europe and Brazil, but on the home console side those were smaller markets before the Playstation, and that didn't help the system here, anyway.

- Sega itself was a relatively small company as well, dwarfed by the size of an NEC or a Sony and smaller than Nintendo as well. NEC should have been able to afford a lot more marketing presence than Sega.

- The TG16/PCE was the #1 4th-gen console in 1989 thanks to its success up to that point in Japan, and as a result the TG16 had a far better game library in '89 than the Genesis did.

Really, Sega's only advantage was that they were well known as one of the best arcade game developers, but being great at arcade games didn't mean you would necessarily be successful as a home console maker, so while that was crucial to their early success I'd definitely give NEC the advantage in early (eg pre-SNES and pre-Sonic) game libraries.


But despite those advantages, NEC managed to blow it through poor decision-making, from NEC Japan wanting complete control, poor marketing, different market conditions, their too-late release date, etc. Sega outsold NEC from the start, and though in '89 the TG16 sold decently as well you're right, it fell off fast after that.

(Here's one example of another bad decision of NEC's I read about from an interview -- so, NEC had ~700,000 TurboGrafx-16 consoles made for launch... which was far, far too many, and that expensive unsold inventory dragged down NEC US for years; indeed, they may never have made more TG16s after that as a result. This was one factor that helped drag down the system, once it failed to take off as they thought it would.)

Keith Courage was a packin game
Keith Courage isn't the best game, but at least it's better than Altered Beast!

(Really though, if they were going for a 1989 release the pack-in probably should have been Legendary Axe or R-Type. Probably Legendary Axe, since platformers were #1. I'm not a big fan Legendary Axe -- graphics aside I might like Keith Courage more -- but it was very highly regarded, something Keith Courage isn't.)

Also while R-Type is prety the game plays like ass because of the constant up and down scrolling (R-Type wasn't designed around it, unlike Gradius).

I vastly prefer the SMS version to this day (or the incredible c64 conversion)
R-Type for the TG16 is an amazing game, still one of the better versions of the game for sure; it is very difficult, but the slight amount of up and down scrolling doesn't hurt the game much... but it's not the best shmup released on the system that year, Blazing Lazers is even better.
 

GuyKazama

Member
Keith Courage is not a bad game. I didn't understand the concept of grinding at the time, so I kept going into the Alpha Zone underpowered. Once I figured out how to equip the proper weapons, I really enjoyed the experience.
 

Nuu

Banned
Out of curiosity how do you feel "8-bit style games" differ from what was on the SNES?

Once the Super Nintendo was fully established, the games on it began to focus much more on presentation and layered level design. RPGs began dominating the system, games began to focus more on storyline and heavy variety in level design, etc. In layman's terms, console gaming went from being "arcade game with a home flavor", to "games developed ground up to being played in your living room". That really showed up in the game design. Mind you this isn't a bad thing, but I find that the NEC system philosophy was much closer in mind to the former. It's similar to how the Mega-Drive games were often "different" from the SNES games, because they followed a different school of thought.
 

cireza

Member
Note: The MegaDrive port looked worse

This was definitely done on purpose, because the console could handle the colors of the PC-Engine version. The game was pretty, but there was nothing special that the Genesis could not handle.

Genesis version is like 16 colors on screen lol. A bit exaggerating here.
 
That's not a PC Engine!

THIS is a PC Engine in all its awesome glory

NEC_PC_Engine_01.jpg


The original console is so tiny and the game cards just blew everyone's minds back in the late 80's. I have one, had it when it was still supported and it's a great console.

My very first import from PC Engine supplies, took 8 weeks to get to me but I needed Heavy Unit, Gunhed and Mr Heli so badly - and they were all worth it. An amazing machine.

I sold my colour Amstrad CPC 128 to fund it (bye bye Ikari Warriors) but it was very much worth it, it felt like science fiction in my hands and on my TV - I also had to be an Scart RGB60 compatible TV as well, it was an expensive time for someone on £35 a week!
 

D.Lo

Member
Because they thought american people wouldn't buy a small console.

In Europe we got RGB modified versions of the japanese systems distributed by Sodipeng (which was owned by Yves Guillemot's brother ;-))
That must be some grey/unofficial Japanese import. The official PAL release was a US style Turbografx (no 16 at the end) with a PAL modulator attachment.

 

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
This was definitely done on purpose, because the console could handle the colors of the PC-Engine version. The game was pretty, but there was nothing special that the Genesis could not handle.

Genesis version is like 16 colors on screen lol. A bit exaggerating here.

It couldn't actually.

MegaDrive is playfields, with a certain amount of colours for each one. The PC-Engine could throw every colour it wanted on the screen, but only had one playfield. It also arguably had better sprite handling from what it could do with them. It's a lot more capable machine than most people give it credit for, but then that's mainly down to them trying to sell it as a 16-bit machine.

When you think of it as the 8-bit machine it is, it's a BEAST.

Never played any of the PCE bomberman games

What makes '94 better then Saturn Bomberman?

Much better battle stages, kangaroos which aren't broken, and just feels polished to perfection.

Saturn one looked really good, but Hi-Ten mode was the best thing about it which got rid of a lot of the Saturn stuff and was an unreleased PC-Engine game that ran on two linked-up consoles.
 
One of the systems that I regret never owning when I had the chance years ago, I've been trying to get hold of one but eBay is 90% junk at insane prices.
 

D.Lo

Member
Those game cards were really interesting, and I don't think there was anything with a very similar form factor until DS, right? With the smaller size, did those cards have significantly different production costs? Capacities? I'm curious why this less bulky medium didn't take off.
Well, Sega gets the credit there, they used cards first from 1984 on the SG1000, later Mark III, and they were almost identical.

Mark III and Master System had the card reader built in. They were a cheaper format, possibly just because of less plastic.

I believe Hudson first used cards in 1985 on MSX in their BeeCard format, they were also budget games.
 

120v

Member
i always admired the PC Engine from afar as a kid. just seemed like a dream console as somebody with budding interest in anything anime/rpg (back when such things were super niche in NA) but my parents broke the bank just trying to get me an snes so i never even considered owning one. to this day it remains some distant historical curiosity... never got around to playing most of those games, one day i'll fix that
 
Top Bottom