Sure, naughty dog seems to be one of the exceptions. But to be honest, their games have the best story-telling, visuals but not much in gameplay. Same as the GOW series. I am really interested/confused why sony discontinued series such as patapon and locoroco. They are fun to play and visually unique. That might also reflects the lack of product management for sony.
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Has Sony mismanaged the Gran Turismo franchise? If so, why?
- Thread starter Kralamoonard
- Start date
Sure, naughty dog seems to be one of the exceptions. But to be honest, their games have the best story-telling, visuals but not much in gameplay. Same as the GOW series. I am really interested/confused why sony discontinued series such as patapon and locoroco. They are fun to play and visually unique. That might also reflects the lack of product management for sony.
But does this really matter? Would it objectively lead to more sales (over GT) for Forza?
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I think one possible question would be - if Sony pushed Polyphony to pump out more GTs, would it result in sales fatigue for audiences? Would it hurt the studio to work in that fashion? Would it be "Sony-like" to do so?
Theonik
Member
Or maybe the people posting on forums are a vocal minority.
Reading GAF threads tells me this is the case. Lots of 'But muh wireless future' posters there!
Does. This. Matter?
This. GT is probably the better game objectively, but Forza, as a series is more successful.
I think that's a rather silly way to look at it. People just won't buy it if the single player content isn't very good, and that's what they play them for.
Focusing mostly on the online in a series which in the past, has set a precedence for good single player content isn't a good look. Street Fighter V got blasted for it. Course it depends how robust said online content is.
bitbydeath
Member
If PD's name is stamped on the box, then probably yes. If another dev then probably not.
BigEmil
Junior Member
You're right also about Patapon and Locoroco they had potential to be big and also those games likely are much cheaper to make can be made with less budget and less time so it was a no brainer
It still sells well, that means you're wrong.
Don't people argue the opposite? That Forza is more "critically acclaimed" but GT is more successful, sales-wise?
Daffy Duck
Member
Yes they have.
It no longer symbolises 'The Real Driving Simulator' to me at all.
It no longer symbolises 'The Real Driving Simulator' to me at all.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
I think it's pretty far-fetched to assume that GT is not near the top the pile in terms of development and marketing budget in this industry.
Polyphony rarely having things ready to go on the timetable of E3/TGS/console release is an issue, sure, but it hasn't dramatically reduced the sales or prestige of the series. If anything, design decisions, consumer taste, and competition have done more in that regard.
Polyphony rarely having things ready to go on the timetable of E3/TGS/console release is an issue, sure, but it hasn't dramatically reduced the sales or prestige of the series. If anything, design decisions, consumer taste, and competition have done more in that regard.
GlamFM
Banned
Until just recently GT5 had sold more then the entire Forza franchise by itself. GT6 is considered the worst GT and sold better then any Forza game. So no GT is the more successful series.
As someone else said above Forza is probably the better rated game because of the faster turnaround and fan feedback well except for the micro transaction crap in 5 but they fixed that.
5,170,000 copies sold is shit, huh.
xrnzaaas
Member
GTS will be a proper test especially with how the market has evolved over the last four years. Also GT6 was a pretty unique case with being released at the very end of PS3's cycle (and not getting any kind of port for the PS4).
Kralamoonard
Member
I think that's one of my points - the fact it still sold relatively well but could have pulled in such greater numbers as a main line GT game if it was at least cross gen.
They really dropped the ball there.
sems4arsenal
Member
It did get several conference showing though. I do agree its omission at TGS was weird. But they did say they intentionally didn't show any 2017 releases at this year's E3.
I'm sure it will ramp up eventually. There was also rumors of a 2nd beta.
LukasTaves
Member
Quite the opposite for me, Forza despite launching more frequently doesn't match GT series sales, but they are keeping a consistent schedule and improvements on each version delivering better games for a while now.
just wait two months and you'll see why Kaz is still CEO of Polyphony Digital
I think you got the names mixed up there... GT still sells a lot more than Forza (GT brand name is still really big at least in Europe) but Forza has higher quality releases.
street fighter is also a game within a, lets be honest here, dead genre. racing games aren't faring much better these days, but i can guarantee GTS's faults will fall by the wayside and it'll still sell really well. 10 -15 million like some of their releases? no. but then i can't imagine sony has that in their expectations either, i think 5 million sales ala GT5 prologue seems reasonable though..that was pretty stripped back in regards to content, way more-so than GTS seems to be.
and you forget the views of forum dwelling gamers don't reflect that of the general population. a ton of people will see a GTS ad and buy it BECAUSE it's GT. will they be disappointed? will they trade it in? who cares, doesn't matter, at that point they're a tally mark on a road to success for the title, and ultimately that's all that matters for polyphony and for sony, and it's reason we will continue to get sequels.
sems4arsenal
Member
I feel Gran Turismo is the perfect franchise to test the waters for an online focused racer. They've also done well to remove most of the series' major complaints.
I personally prefer offline more, but the beta convinced me that this idea can work. I still need the Arcade Mode to have decent customization and have seasonal events back, but I'm excited.
Azure Phoenix
Member
In what respect? GT6 sold poorly in comparison to GT5 and it has been 4 years since then without a single release, until GTS comes out we don't have numbers. 4 years is an awful lot of time when your major competitor is putting out yearly releases and you have 2 more newcomers to compete against.
Bits N Pieces
Member
It appears to be a bit of a mess they have got themselves into with GTS.
It'll still sell like crazy though, as people will just lap up the GT brand.
They can't keep doing it though as it will bite them on the arse eventually.
It'll still sell like crazy though, as people will just lap up the GT brand.
They can't keep doing it though as it will bite them on the arse eventually.
Hey, didn't GT6 sell below that?
Laws00
Member
THIS right here
And you are 100% right. But people will never admit it.
This works for other racing games as well - the real fun is online.
tbh they dropped that tagline
It'll be shown sunday at TGS
Online population goes a long way on multiplayer-centric titles. Especially if they have DLC plans ready. Let's not pretend Sony doesn't care if people trade it in after a week lol
Laplasakos
Member
I think that not releasing GT6 as a PS4 launch game and making it PS3 exclusive really hurt the franchise.
Also the delays and long development circles.
Also the delays and long development circles.
AbandonedTrolley
Member
I agree that they dropped the ball regarding GT6 but those figures still eclipse most other franchise sales. Which means that even on a dying system GT sells.
GT Sport will sell bucket loads as well, it's fine, it's just not ideal.
ScaryShark
Banned
Used to be a series that I was excited for and purchased without question. Now I would have to convince myself that I want it for GTS. Going by how Sony is marketing it, I don't really have any expectations for it at this point.
Bolivar687
Banned
Well, you don't see what I see. Show me a PS3 game that sold > 5 million copies after PS4 launch. I can name only 1-2 games GTA V and maybe Minecraft. That's it.
Rellik
Member
The features are definitely bare bones and I think that's acknowledged in the name being GT: Sport and not Gran Turismo 7.
But names can sell a product on its own. I'm European so I'm in the thick of GT land and we have already seen Sony start to pump out special editions of their consoles and controllers covered in GT logos. And you can guarantee it's going to be all over TV here including one of the most watched sporting competitions on the planet in Champions League football which is sponsored by Sony PlayStation. I don't think marketing is going to be any less than any other GT game.
But sales? I really have no idea and I'll wait and see. And not immediate sales either because GT games are known to have long legs.
DISSESHOWEDO
Banned
You must love MS system then!?!
On topic, got the steelbook edition pre ordered and will be there day one. As someone suggested let's wait and see the final product.
UpUpDownDown
Member
PS4 is a sales monster, game is going to be absolutely huge.
Don't worry.
Don't worry.
I think there is a middle ground between annual releases and being completely absent during the first years of the console and then releasing a game severely lacking on many aspects.
GT6 was literally released after the PS4 launch. GTAV was released before in September. Don't know about Minecraft. GT6 sold well for a videogame, but poorly for a GT main entry.
Not really. I don't have so much time on gaming. I just dislike how Sony treats their games. But still, I feel switching from arcade to real-life sim RAC for the GT series is a wise move.
davidwhangchoi
Member
yes.
give me car damage.
and environmental mapping of opponent cars.
give me car damage.
and environmental mapping of opponent cars.
nature boy
Member
This
Duxxy3
Member
Sony and Polyphony have bungled the franchise. There have been signs of incompetence since GT4 when it didn't have online play like planned. And then we got GT HD. Which was a quick port for PS3 fans. And that was actually nice because we got it so quickly. Little did we know how long it would take til GT5, proper, would be released. After that we got an extended paid demo in prologue. GT5 came out and I couldn't get over how incredibly slow the load times were. Apparently it was fixed later at some point, but it was too late for me.
And then GT6 happened on PS3 years later. AFTER the PS4 was released. Who the hell thought that was a good idea? Forza 5 launched with the XB1 and since then the XB1 has been the default driving game console. Microsoft will have released 3 full Forza games before Polyphony finishes their half-baked Gran Turismo Sport.
It also seems like Polyphony had no input on the Dualshock 4, as that controller is just awful for racing games compared to the XB1 controller. Maybe not mismanagement, but a lost opportunity. The trigggers and rumble triggers are incredible in forza. The DS4 doesn't even have proper triggers.
And then GT6 happened on PS3 years later. AFTER the PS4 was released. Who the hell thought that was a good idea? Forza 5 launched with the XB1 and since then the XB1 has been the default driving game console. Microsoft will have released 3 full Forza games before Polyphony finishes their half-baked Gran Turismo Sport.
It also seems like Polyphony had no input on the Dualshock 4, as that controller is just awful for racing games compared to the XB1 controller. Maybe not mismanagement, but a lost opportunity. The trigggers and rumble triggers are incredible in forza. The DS4 doesn't even have proper triggers.
Shambalakan
Member
These are everything I wanted to say:
Always loved and praised Kaz for making amazing games, but after lots of mistakes in GT5 (really loved that game though) and then repeating them in GT6 (still loved it), I thought he'll make next GT something like GT3/4. But now 4 years (yes, 4 years!!) after GT6, we'll have a game with less than 200 cars, without real career mode and maybe (maybe) without good cosmetic damage and weather.
It's GT, so it'll still sell amazing and I'm not happy with this, as an old "single player" GT fan. Because that means next GT games will be online too.
Always loved and praised Kaz for making amazing games, but after lots of mistakes in GT5 (really loved that game though) and then repeating them in GT6 (still loved it), I thought he'll make next GT something like GT3/4. But now 4 years (yes, 4 years!!) after GT6, we'll have a game with less than 200 cars, without real career mode and maybe (maybe) without good cosmetic damage and weather.
It's GT, so it'll still sell amazing and I'm not happy with this, as an old "single player" GT fan. Because that means next GT games will be online too.
Yes, I know. I mean since Dec 2013, not LTD.
rochellepaws
Member
The notion of "they should follow the Forza model" seems a little bit out of touch considering how this year has been filled with complaints from Xbox owners at the overuse of the Forza/Halo/Gears brands at the expense of more variety.
The Gran Turismo brand has survived a long time probably because they release games so sparingly which never allows the property to become stale or boring.
The Gran Turismo brand has survived a long time probably because they release games so sparingly which never allows the property to become stale or boring.
funkystudent
Member
Oh I think they had pressure on them to come outside their bubble.
I think they just learned the wrong things and totally took just about all the wrong steps to correct course with GTS.
GT6 the worst? GT6 shits all over GT5
it does not go to the heights of GT2, but nothing does
Miniature Kaiju
Member
Kinda. Big mistake was not having a GT game ready within a year of the PS4 launch. That said, I don't want more frequent releases. GT should be a once-per-gen thing, an evergreen game released with a new console that then gets constantly updated with new stuff.
I thought Sport didn't have much of a campaign mode, hence it isn't a mainline sequel.
Azure Phoenix
Member
GT6's sales figures cannot be attributed solely to the PS4 launch, there weren't anywhere near enough systems in the hands of gamers, the mishandling of GT5 also has a part in it. And not releasing GT6 on the PS4 as well is itself due to mismanagement. The sales figures themselves are less relevant than the percentage drop.
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