Support NeoGAF

[TheChewyWaffles]

Just saw the movie a second time in IMAX. It was more immersive in IMAX vs Dolby Cinema despite not being shot in the format. I liked it quite a bit more the second time around. It didn't drag as much and I picked up on a lot of subtle details that escaped me on first viewing. Ether Snake really needs to chill with the messiah plot accusations lol. There is no messiah plot.

Also I have a question: the Tears in Rain musical cue is what tips off the audience that K is going to die. I wonder if a viewer who had not seen the original and was not familiar with that cue would have put that together

I’m not sure how that would be possible. Clearly a callback to BR.

Yo kill it for me is Deckerd replicant or human?

It’s never stated.

 

[Gunslinger]

Yo kill it for me is Deckerd replicant or human?

 

[Farside]

Yo kill it for me is Deckerd replicant or human?

Man, you just started some shit.

 

[NewDust]

That sucks, but some here would say the movie is better that way .

Can't say I disagree. Felt like some extra flourish, but particularly that scene wasn't needed.

Yo kill it for me is Deckerd replicant or human?

It's better not knowing.

 

[Farside]

Nevermind

 

[robotrock]

Yo kill it for me is Deckerd replicant or human?

Don't ask this. Every time I bring it up the thread gets mad at me

 

[Ether_Snake]

Can't say I disagree. Felt like some extra flourish, but particularly that scene wasn't needed.



It's better not knowing.

I think a lot of people at that point had no idea who the daughter was. People seemed really confused about a lot that was being said throughout, and it was sometimes literally difficult to understand what a character mumbled.

 

[NewDust]

Nevermind

I somehow related it more to K 'dying' (I think he's dead). Somehow she knew.

I think a lot of people at that point had no idea who the daughter was. People seemed really confused about a lot that was being said throughout, and it was sometimes literally difficult to understand what a character mumbled.

Really? I immediately knew she was at least the daughter, but still was ambivalent to K's role. Was he her brother or not. Obviously he wasn't, but it took longer to reveal that, than her being the 'one part of the puzzle'.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

People care too much about Deckard being a replicant, especially since in the book the entire point was that he was human yet acted more emotionless than the replicants

 

[Elwood Blues]

Everybody knows Deckard is human except Ridley Scott.

 

[Farside]

I somehow related it more to K 'dying' (I think he's dead). Somehow she knew.

Hahaha. Yeah, the snow/rain thing made me delete the post. lol

 

[MisterAnderson]

Is there some sci-fi explanation as to how Joi is being projected from...everywhere? I thought for a while the upgrade he got as a gift might have been linked to K's brain as a sort of augmented reality where he was the only one seeing her, but that clearly wasn't there case. I just don't see how she could suddenly be projected anywhere.

 

[TONX]

Yo kill it for me is Deckerd replicant or human?

He knows whats real.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

People are actually thinking that K is still alive at the end? He clearly died...like there's not even a question if you're paying attention. xD

Was a beautiful scene, too. Loved the movie.

These people probably still think

Spoiler

a certain person is alive

in Cowboy Bebop

 

[Farside]

Is there some sci-fi explanation as to how Joi is being projected from...everywhere? I thought for a while the upgrade he got as a gift might have been linked to K's brain as a sort of augmented reality where he was the only one seeing her, but that clearly wasn't there case. I just don't see how she could suddenly be projected anywhere.

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." lol

 

[More_Badass]

It would have been much better with no rebels. Just have Joe looking for the child, starting to question the idea of killing her, slowly getting away from his "baseline" and then running off when his boss realizes (or rather thinks) he's the child, he's hunted down by the cops and Wallace's, and ultimately helps Deckard find his daughter. Cops find him dead, so they think the child is dead, Deckard is gone with his daughter, a bit like with Rachel at the end of the first movie. Done.

Simple plot, fairly inconsequential as a whole, more emotional.

Of course instead we got a plot written to support branching content beyond because this is how things work now.

The original ended similarly. The creator and founder of the world’s most crucial corporation is dead. That alone offered huge repercussions to explore. Deckard and Rachel are on the run/escaping to an unknown fate. The Final Cut’s ending is quite abrupt as well

And the rebellion makes perfect sense. Replicants have been rebelling for decades. The original movie was about a Replicant revolt. It only makes sense that such isolated acts of rebellion by an oppressed race would rise up and grow to what we see here.

Plus the rebellion is a sad thing too because they thought Rachel was special, that Replicants could reproduce, when it was all design rather than a miracle or biological evolution. And Rachel being able to reproduce doesn’t mean her daughter can.

 

[Maddness]

I hope the film has a better overall weekend. I need to go see it again soon. I've been listening to the soundtrack on Spotify and I've been thinking about the movie a lot.

 

[MisterAnderson]

These people probably still think

Spoiler

Spike is alive

in Cowboy Bebop

Not sure why the hell I clicked on that spoiler...still haven't watched the rest of Cowboy Bebop and for some odd reason I associated the title Cowboy Bebop with Ghost in the Shell.

 

[LegendofDragoonLives]

Not sure why the hell I clicked on that spoiler...still haven't watched the rest of Cowboy Bebop and for some odd reason I associated the title Cowboy Bebop with Ghost in the Shell.

FUCKKKKK I hate that it's spoiled for you dude. It's one of the most iconic moments in anime. Ever.


Anyway, saw the movie. One of the best movies of the year. Don't think it's a masterpiece though, Valle has only made 1 so far that completely blew me away. Still need to see 2 of his other films, but every film he's made ranges from great to amazing, with one masterpiece.

 

[The Technomancer]

So wait why did her memories get implanted into Joe?

 

[More_Badass]

So wait why did her memories get implanted into Joe?

She crafts memories for replicants and she uses her own for the best ones. Many other Replicants have that memory, not just him

Again, showing how he’s not special or unique, tearing away his hopes for a great purpose and identity and self even more

 

[Good Job Bob]

So wait why did her memories get implanted into Joe?

Her memories got implanted in tons of replicants.

 

[MisterAnderson]

FUCKKKKK I hate that it's spoiled for you dude. It's one of the most iconic moments in anime. Ever.

Yeah...I'm pretty bummed about it. I'm usually good about avoiding spoilers (I don't even watch trailers to movies I'm excited about or previews to "next week's episode" for shows), but had a major brain fart.

 

[jett]

Yo kill it for me is Deckerd replicant or human?

Ask him.

 

[Sub_Level]

Is there some sci-fi explanation as to how Joi is being projected from...everywhere? I thought for a while the upgrade he got as a gift might have been linked to K's brain as a sort of augmented reality where he was the only one seeing her, but that clearly wasn't there case. I just don't see how she could suddenly be projected anywhere.

The emanator has microscopic flying nanomachines which are tiny reflective panels that act in sync and are able to float via tiny atom-sized engine thrusters.

 

[Bronetta]

So wait why did her memories get implanted into Joe?

She makes memories for Replicants. Without memories Replicants are like toddlers without any experiences.

It helps give them a past, a personality, and a sense of identity.

That's my understanding at least, will need someone who wasnt smoked out of their mind during the movie to elaborate.

 

[jett]

All you keep saying is that it's "predictable" from Zimmer, as if a composer having an identifiable style is a bad thing, and that it's "not interesting" without actually offering a point as to why it didn't succeed at evoking the atmosphere the film was trying to evoke. It took tunes and notes from Vangelis and made it more oppressive and unfriendly, but then mixed in extreme highs as if to symbolize hope breaking through the clouds. I thought it was beautiful.

I'm just trying to say how someone could find it predictable, and for some predictable isn't good. Particularly in regards to a Blade Runner sequel. The music in the original is anything but standard. You're right though, it absolutely works at further establishing the extremely bleak nature of 2049. But is that actually good? Do we need to feel even more depressed already when watching 2049? Now there's a question.

The score has grown on me, been listening to it over the weekend, even if it's still a far cry from Vangelis. His work on Blade Runner is by quite a distance my favorite movie soundtrack, period. You liked the music in 2049 a good deal more than me. That's fair.

The emanator has microscopic flying nanomachines which are tiny reflective panels that act in sync and are able to float via tiny atom-sized engine thrusters.

Is what what it is or are you just guessing?

 

[The Technomancer]

She makes memories for Replicants. Without memories Replicants are like toddlers without any experiences.

It helps give them a past, a personality, and a sense of identity.

Thays my understanding at least, will need someone who wasnt smoked out of their mind during the movie to elaborate.

Sure I know that part but I didnt know why that specific memory was in his head. As the others said I guess a lot of replicants have it

 

[Ether_Snake]

Movie was too focused on the depth of its own plot. The first scene of the movie was great, right away it got rid of my apprehensions toward Gosling being the lead, because first it didn't make him into a good guy, and second it gets rid of the "is he a replicant?" thing right away (for a time anyway). Things start to go down once Wallace comes into the picture.

I really wish we had stuck to Gosling being a detective, and more in-city interactions with people. I liked when he got the wooden horse analyzed, when he met Gaff, when he searched for the horse when checking on whether or not his memory was real. Him being a detective. I think him looking for the child and increasingly thinking it might be himself while mowing down replicants in cold blood would have been so much better. I really liked the oppressive feel when the system checks on him still being "on the line".

It really should have kept things simple. The movie was really at its best when the character was being cold, killer-like, humanity-less, and questioning himself not as a result of talking with others but just as a result of looking for the child.

Get rid of the digital girlfriend focus, make her backdrop comic relief he doesn't actually have feelings for, just a dumb personal assistant he got himself, a little quirk about his own character. Her saying let's read this book, and then saying let's not was what this character should have been all about. Just a dumb program to have a bit of humor. Heck have Joi report him when she realizes he's not going back to work, reading him his user license agreement while the cops are trying to bash the door open or something.

Wallace was such a sore point. Tyrell had so much less screen time yet remained so much more interesting and less stereotypical.

The original ended similarly. The creator and founder of the world's most crucial corporation is dead. That alone offered huge repercussions to explore. Deckard and Rachel are on the run/escaping to an unknown fate. The Final Cut's ending is quite abrupt as well

And the rebellion makes perfect sense. Replicants have been rebelling for decades. The original movie was about a Replicant revolt. It only makes sense that such isolated acts of rebellion by an oppressed race would rise up and grow to what we see here.

Plus the rebellion is a sad thing too because they thought Rachel was special, that Replicants could reproduce, when it was all design rather than a miracle or biological evolution. And Rachel being able to reproduce doesn't mean her daughter can.

It never says they think Rachel is special in a way that they too might be. For all we know they just want to find out how a way to reproduce, I mean really they can't really imagine it takes a secret kamasutra position to get it to work, otherwise they would focus on Deckard too. It never negates their ideals at all, and the movie repeatedly barged in K's head that he must die for a cause because that's the human thing to do. Rachel was special, both sides want the child to figure out the same thing.

So wait why did her memories get implanted into Joe?

He was a decoy. Gaff makes a bull, he's a "red heifer", something Wallace and co. are trying to get but can't get their hands on the real one.

 

[Radogol]

People care too much about Deckard being a replicant, especially since in the book the entire point was that he was human yet acted more emotionless than the replicants

Yeah, that's bullshit. In the book, androids are inhumanly cruel while Deckard is unambiguously human, continuously questioning his job. I mean, there is some doubt but it's resolved by the end of the book.

I do agree that people care too much about movie Deckard's nature though.

 

[Borgnine]

I live in San Diego, my theater got visibly upset when they saw our city ended up a garbage dump lol.

 

[Sub_Level]

Is what what it is or are you just guessing?

Just a guess. Someone could kinda bullshit that the device is able to project through K's clothing but there were too many angles that she was projected at independent of K's position for that to explain it.

 

[thebigmachine]

She crafts memories for replicants and she uses her own for the best ones. Many other Replicants have that memory, not just him

Again, showing how he’s not special or unique, tearing away his hopes for a great purpose and identity and self even more

Her memories got implanted in tons of replicants.

The line that the one eye lady says about others thinking they are the chosen one now make more sense to me.

 

[robotrock]

I live in San Diego, my theater got visibly upset when they saw our city ended up a garbage dump lol.

lmao

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Movie was too focused on the depth of its own plot. The first scene of the movie was great, right away it got rid of my apprehensions toward Gosling being the lead, because first it didn't make him into a good guy, and second it gets rid of the "is he a replicant?" thing right away (for a time anyway). Things start to go down once Wallace comes into the picture.

I really wish we had stuck to Gosling being a detective, and more in-city interactions with people. I liked when he got the wooden horse analyzed, when he met Gaff, when he searched for the horse when checking on whether or not his memory was real. Him being a detective. I think him looking for the child and increasingly thinking it might be himself while mowing down replicants in cold blood would have been so much better. I really liked the oppressive feel when the system checks on him still being "on the line".

It really should have kept things simple. The movie was really at its best when the character was being cold, killer-like, humanity-less, and questioning himself not as a result of talking with others but just as a result of looking for the child.

Get rid of the digital girlfriend focus, make her backdrop comic relief he doesn't actually have feelings for, just a dumb personal assistant he got himself, a little quirk about his own character. Her saying let's read this book, and then saying let's not was what this character should have been all about. Just a dumb program to have a bit of humor. Heck have Joi report him when she realizes he's not going back to work, reading him his user license agreement while the cops are trying to bash the door open or something.

Wallace was such a sore point. Tyrell had so much less screen time yet remained so much more interesting and less stereotypical.

Your suggestions sound like a bad anime. The movie actually wasn't too complex. It essentially came down to the question of what makes something human/intelligent/alive/free and how that line is blurred across different characters.

 

[Farside]

Ask him.

Fuck, this is great...

 

[Spine_Ripper]

I live in San Diego, my theater got visibly upset when they saw our city ended up a garbage dump lol.

LMAO, I live in SD county and immediately the whole room goes OCEANSIDE?!? CARLSBAD?!? VISTA?!?

I thought it was great lol

 

[More_Badass]

Get rid of the digital girlfriend focus, make her backdrop comic relief he doesn't actually have feelings for, just a dumb personal assistant he got himself, a little quirk about his own character. Her saying let's read this book, and then saying let's not was what this character should have been all about. Just a dumb program to have a bit of humor. Heck have Joi report him when she realizes he's not going back to work, reading him his user license agreement while the cops are trying to bash the door open or something

The AI is important because it further explores the question of humanity by offering a second foil to compare Replicants against. Replicants versus humans, and now Replicants versus the programmed nature of an AI. In a film where new Replicants are programmed to obey.

Luv and Joi are mirror images, both programmed to obey their orders. And yet Luv cries with guilt and humanity whenever she’s forced to obey her programming.

 

[Jarmel]

I live in San Diego, my theater got visibly upset when they saw our city ended up a garbage dump lol.

Should have been New Jersey.

 

[darkwing-buck]

Ryan Gosling likes 2D-Girls.

 

[Einchy]

Ryan Gosling likes 2D-Girls.

This movie is proof that 3D-hologram girls are best girls.

 

[edgefusion]

Movie was too focused on the depth of its own plot. The first scene of the movie was great, right away it got rid of my apprehensions toward Gosling being the lead, because first it didn't make him into a good guy, and second it gets rid of the "is he a replicant?" thing right away (for a time anyway). Things start to go down once Wallace comes into the picture.

I really wish we had stuck to Gosling being a detective, and more in-city interactions with people. I liked when he got the wooden horse analyzed, when he met Gaff, when he searched for the horse when checking on whether or not his memory was real. Him being a detective. I think him looking for the child and increasingly thinking it might be himself while mowing down replicants in cold blood would have been so much better. I really liked the oppressive feel when the system checks on him still being "on the line".

It really should have kept things simple. The movie was really at its best when the character was being cold, killer-like, humanity-less, and questioning himself not as a result of talking with others but just as a result of looking for the child.

Get rid of the digital girlfriend focus, make her backdrop comic relief he doesn't actually have feelings for, just a dumb personal assistant he got himself, a little quirk about his own character. Her saying let's read this book, and then saying let's not was what this character should have been all about. Just a dumb program to have a bit of humor. Heck have Joi report him when she realizes he's not going back to work, reading him his user license agreement while the cops are trying to bash the door open or something.

Wallace was such a sore point. Tyrell had so much less screen time yet remained so much more interesting and less stereotypical.



It never says they think Rachel is special in a way that they too might be. For all we know they just want to find out how a way to reproduce, I mean really they can't really imagine it takes a secret kamasutra position to get it to work, otherwise they would focus on Deckard too. It never negates their ideals at all, and the movie repeatedly barged in K's head that he must die for a cause because that's the human thing to do. Rachel was special, both sides want the child to figure out the same thing.



He was a decoy. Gaff makes a bull, he's a "red heifer", something Wallace and co. are trying to get but can't get their hands on the real one.

I’m sorry but that all sounds terrible, and once again misses the point of the movie.

 

[Ether_Snake]

The AI is important because it further explores the question of humanity by offering a second foil to compare Replicants against. Replicants versus humans, and now Replicants versus the programmed nature of an AI. In a film where new Replicants are programmed to obey.

Luv and Joi are mirror images, both programmed to obey their orders. And yet Luv cries with guilt and humanity whenever she’s forced to obey her programming.

It was completely unnecessary, there's enough about replicants and humans, no need to add AI rights to the mix.

 

[LegendofDragoonLives]

Yeah...I'm pretty bummed about it. I'm usually good about avoiding spoilers (I don't even watch trailers to movies I'm excited about or previews to "next week's episode" for shows), but had a major brain fart.

It's a shame, but you will still enjoy the moment. It's just brilliantly made.

 

[NewDust]

This movie is proof that 3D-hologram girls are best girls.

This movie definitely proofs 3D-hologram lovers are severely lacking... Even for replicants.

 

[More_Badass]

It was completely unnecessary, there's enough about replicants and humans, no need to add AI rights to the mix.

You’re completely missing/overthinking things

It has nothing to do with AI rights. It’s about presenting an even further controlled/limited facsimile of humanity, only to show its seeming humanity and emotions is nothing but programming, simultaneously acting as character development for K and presenting a foil for Replicants in terms of their humanity

 

[Ether_Snake]

You're completely missing/overthinking things

There's nothing about AI rights. It's about presenting an even further controlled/limited facsimile of humanity, only to show its seeming humanity and emotions is nothing but programming, simultaneously acting as character development for K and presenting a foil for Replicants in terms of their humanity

I'm saying it's unnecessary, there is already a plot about this with humans and replicants.

Ok, just saw this. Probably shouldn't have though as I haven't seen the original so many things didn't mean much to me or I just didn't understand it. So because of that I don't think the movie is great and therefore was a waste of time and money for me to see it. Also from all the hype and advertising I thought Harrison Ford and Ryan gosling were the two main players in the film but Harrison was hardly in it at all.

What annoyed me most though is what happened to the dog? For whatever reason the writers decided to have one that lived with Harrison ford's character, and it followed him around. Thankfully they then show it survived the explosion on the building and was still shown when Ryan gosling's character was rescued from there, but then I didn't see it anymore. Did those other people who rescued Ryan rescue the dog too? Did they leave the dog behind? Why wasn't Harrison ford's character shown wanting to get the dog back by the end? I just don't know why they bothered to include a dog in the film but don't show where it ended up.

The dog was there for people who were bored. The only time people laughed was when Deckard gives him whiskey. I could tell the girl next to me was bored out of her mind but was really happy with the dog being there.

 

[Poona]

Ok, just saw this. Probably shouldn't have though as I haven't seen the original so many things didn't mean much to me or I just didn't understand it. So because of that I don't think the movie is great and therefore was a waste of time and money for me to see it. Also from all the hype and advertising I thought Harrison Ford and Ryan gosling were the two main players in the film but Harrison was hardly in it at all.

What annoyed me most though is what happened to the dog? For whatever reason the writers decided to have one that lived with Harrison ford's character, and it followed him around. Thankfully they then show it survived the explosion on the building and was still shown when Ryan gosling's character was rescued from there, but then I didn't see it anymore. Did those other people who rescued Ryan rescue the dog too? Did they leave the dog behind? Why wasn't Harrison ford's character shown wanting to get the dog back by the end? I just don't know why they bothered to include a dog in the film but don't show where it ended up.

 

[jack_package_200]

I have been listening to the soundtrack on Amazon. Its good shit.

 

[Jarmel]

Get rid of the digital girlfriend focus, make her backdrop comic relief he doesn't actually have feelings for, just a dumb personal assistant he got himself, a little quirk about his own character. Her saying let's read this book, and then saying let's not was what this character should have been all about. Just a dumb program to have a bit of humor. Heck have Joi report him when she realizes he's not going back to work, reading him his user license agreement while the cops are trying to bash the door open or something.

What in the fuck.

You want to take out one of the elements in the movie having to do with the line between reality and artificial and just reduce it to comedy? Joi is one of the most interesting elements in the movie as you can argue about how much of her perceived feelings were real or fake. On top of that it adds depth to K’s character in that he knows she’s fake but loves her anyway because that’s all he has.