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[Laughing Banana]

That big hole thing is fuckin hilarious XD

 

[MoonFrog]

Was thinking about getting this game somewhere down the line. The horrible translation was actually in the "pro" column .

IDK. I really liked Ys I&II and liked OiF and Origin less. Adding in party play and upping the talkiness don't sound innately appealing to me, but I also want to see if I like where Ys is now or not.

 

[Holundrian]

Would love to give them props for the apology but the timing is too convenient when it happens right after complaints about the bad localization was picked up by Japanese game media + we don't even know what the end result will be. They had plenty of time to do this apology without hurting initial sales before people had to complain to Falcom directly. I'm going to import now either way though. They had their chance.

 

[preta]

Maybe I didn't pay much attention because as opposed to LoH series, Ys was never about the story so it didnt jump at me.

TX on the other hand has about as much dialogue as LoH so I noticed lots of these mistakes.

Curious. Which game you think came out worse - Ys VIII or TX?

They have different issues, for the most part. Except for a few parts, VIII's translation doesn't usually screw up meaning, it's just that it's overly stiff and literal, very poorly (barely?) edited, homogenizes character speech styles, has English names that are worse than the pre-existing ones in the JP version, and generally reads like crap.

TX has a number of cases of names and terms being translated or romanized multiple different ways and then all of them being used interchangeably, which is incredibly sloppy - and some of those ways aren't always even correct or synonymous with the others. Aksys also forgot to insert the true ending credits theme, which means that it's just 5 minutes of dead silence over the final part of the ending and the credits instead. I will say, though, that aside from the aforementioned sloppiness, it does feel like they actually tried with the editing, unlike NISA. It has personality, although I think it might actually be slightly overdone at times.

Both localizations screw up references to other Falcom games - Ys VIII mistranslates the name of an item returning from Ys II and misromanizes the name of a character who's obviously a walking Trails reference, and TX misromanizes the names of a location from Trails of Cold Steel II (it's referenced in an in-universe arcade game) and Falcom's own mascot, Mishy. (As "Michy".)

 

[Thoraxes]

I will say, though, that aside from the aforementioned sloppiness, it does feel like they actually tried with the editing, unlike NISA. It has personality, although I think it might actually be slightly overdone at times.

Some sample NPC banter I liked from near the beginning:

It definitely feels more lively.

 

[Opa-Pa]

Jesus, those examples are both amazing and awful, haha.

Pretty nice that they're acknowledging it and working to fix it... But it's embarrassing that they allowed it to happen in the first place, what the hell, NISA.

Now, how do we get Atlus USA to do the same for P5? Do we let Atlus Japan kn- ah, nah, that'd require them to give a shit about the western market for anything that isn't piracy and sharing features in the first place.

 

[joe2187]

Have we all talked about Dana's Big Hole yet?

 

[Grim Patron]

At least they're trying to fix their translation mistakes on all versions including Vita. Bandai Namco, on the other hand, never fixed their terrible Google translation for SAO on Vita.

Sao Games deserve that translation anyway

 

[chaosblade]

I'm not sure about the bit of theorizing that Falcom was involved in this. Prior to XSEED's localizations it seems like they were basically okay with whatever the licensee wanted to do and were pretty hands off. Unless they had a change of heart and actually care more about their image since they have a somewhat significant fanbase in the west now, it just doesn't seem like Falcom to encourage NISA to fix it.

 

[Dragoon En Regalia]

I'm not sure about the bit of theorizing that Falcom was involved in this. Prior to XSEED's localizations it seems like they were basically okay with whatever the licensee wanted to do and were pretty hands off. Unless they had a change of heart and actually care more about their image since they have a somewhat significant fanbase in the west now, it just doesn't seem like Falcom to encourage NISA to fix it.

Kondo's said he's indifferent to how localization really works outside Japan (I don't know if he had much involvement with Falcom's own localizations of Korean CRPGs like Arcturus), but that he's open to knowing more if and when relevant. The fact that this news reached Hachima Blog made it hard to ignore, and probably caught Falcom by surprise if they really had intended to let NISA do their own thing so long as it didn't lead to trouble. I definitely think playing up the "disappointed fans" angle in the Japanese letter helped; apparently Japanese commenters were more sympathetic than usual, including those who have a grudge against Falcom for unrelated issues.

Anyway, we might get Ys VIII in a better state soon, and hopefully by mid-December according to NISAAlex on the Steam forum. I'm just glad the PC delay will likely help Zwei: Ilvard Insurrection get more attention in the meantime.

 

[Eusis]

Kondo's said he's indifferent to how localization really works outside Japan (I don't know if he had much involvement with Falcom's own localizations of Korean CRPGs like Arcturus), but that he's open to knowing more if and when relevant. The fact that this news reached Hachima Blog made it hard to ignore, and probably caught Falcom by surprise if they really had intended to let NISA do their own thing so long as it didn't lead to trouble. I definitely think playing up the "disappointed fans" angle in the Japanese letter helped; apparently Japanese commenters were more sympathetic than usual, including those who have a grudge against Falcom for unrelated issues.

Anyway, we might get Ys VIII in a better state soon, and hopefully by mid-December according to NISAAlex on the Steam forum. I'm just glad the PC delay will likely help Zwei: Ilvard Insurrection get more attention in the meantime.

It could help Tokyo Xanadu on PC too. Playing the Japanese demo it definitely feels like some sort of proto-Ys VIII, so that right after Ys VIII can be a little jarring.

 

[Toth]

What is the term for Ancient Species in the Japanese version anyway.

 

[Danny Dudekisser]

Wow. I'm honestly really surprised.

I guess it's kind of, somehow, a good thing that the PC version was delayed till mid-December... between that port actually working, and the localization getting fixed, sounds like it might be worth the wait.

 

[Theswweet]

What is the term for Ancient Species in the Japanese version anyway.

古代種

 

[Burning Justice]

...I don't think I've ever seen a company apologize for a localization before.

I haven't played Ys 8 yet, but some of the example screens I've seen posted are pretty bad...

 

[PsionBolt]

Not sure why NISA is getting kudos for releasing a subpar product, saying nothing about plainly obvious problems with its' script prior to its' release and then announcing a bandaid when it became clear that people weren't willing to settle as they did with something like Persona 5. A month and a half is not enough time to go through this game's script, re-translate it, edit it, and proofread it without compromising heavily on at least a couple of those things. In reality, more like just a month since this translation patch presumably has to be certified to ensure it doesn't introduce more problems.

The worst part is that they talk about the game's translation like it's some great mystery how it was so undercooked and how they'd be 'investigating' the causes as though they weren't obvious to anyone with a realistic impression of how long high quality localization work really takes. The expected turnaround time for the script was insanely low, it's no surprise that the translators and editors couldn't turn in something acceptable when they were working under such insane deadlines on such a massive project. It's pretty obvious to me that the core of Ys VIII's problems stemmed from the very premise of how soon they promised it'd be accomplished. I imagine it had to have been a key factor in securing their bid for the title and considering everything that came after I can't imagine they gave a single thought about how they'd actually accomplish this until it showed up on their desks.

So they're okay with throwing the people who worked under it under the bus and do absolutely zero self-reflection on their actual localization practices. They broke basically every promise and low balled nearly every standard of acceptable localization because they couldn't see beyond the dollar signs in their eyes. I don't think they deserve a round of applause for that. Or the slightest bit of understanding. This has been an embarrassing story from start to finish.

Yeah... This is super odd to see. It's disappointing that lackluster localization is still as common as it is today, and while fixing it post-launch is better than not fixing it, having to fix it in the first place is hardly a good look. Not to mention the time schedule for the patch doesn't exactly inspire confidence -- if we end up with a script version 1.01 that makes only minor changes, I imagine the further backlash will be greater than any goodwill they earn.

古代種

So it's 100% literal, then.
I'd usually expect a term like that to be jazzed up a bit in localization; maybe "Primevals" or something (without knowing the context at all, as I haven't played the game).

 

[Theswweet]

So it's 100% literal, then.
I'd usually expect a term like that to be jazzed up a bit in localization; maybe "Primevals" or something (without knowing the context at all, as I haven't played the game).

Primeval was actually what the fan-edit was thinking of going with, yeah.

 

[Pepboy]

another one in the "customers complaining works" category.

Didn't work for persona 5, sadly. They still won't patch it.

 

[Opa-Pa]

Didn't work for persona 5, sadly. They still won't patch it.

It would have had more chances of working if for every fan complaining about its quality there hadn't been 5 claiming the localization was fine. Maybe.

 

[Ascheroth]

It pains me every time I read someone say "It's just Ys, who cares about story or writing, lol."
I mean when you consistently 'translate' existing English into something worse, it isn't even debatable anymore.
And you don't need to have English as your native language to notice that the writing is just... very awkward and stilted.

And reading that once again, I'm doubtful about how much of an improvement this can realistically be.
1-2 months aren't really much, even more so when you bring in entirely new staff...
I'm hoping for the best, but not entirely convinced fixing issues caused by unrealistic deadlines can be solved with more strict deadlines..

It could help Tokyo Xanadu on PC too. Playing the Japanese demo it definitely feels like some sort of proto-Ys VIII, so that right after Ys VIII can be a little jarring.

We don't have a date for TX yet though. There also hasn't been a beta yet, unless Ghostlight is doing it behind closed doors this time.

 

[BumblebeeCody]

Not sure why NISA is getting kudos for releasing a subpar product, saying nothing about plainly obvious problems with its' script prior to its' release and then announcing a bandaid when it became clear that people weren't willing to settle as they did with something like Persona 5. A month and a half is not enough time to go through this game's script, re-translate it, edit it, and proofread it without compromising heavily on at least a couple of those things. In reality, more like just a month since this translation patch presumably has to be certified to ensure it doesn't introduce more problems.

The worst part is that they talk about the game's translation like it's some great mystery how it was so undercooked and how they'd be 'investigating' the causes as though they weren't obvious to anyone with a realistic impression of how long high quality localization work really takes. The expected turnaround time for the script was insanely low, it's no surprise that the translators and editors couldn't turn in something acceptable when they were working under such insane deadlines on such a massive project. It's pretty obvious to me that the core of Ys VIII's problems stemmed from the very premise of how soon they promised it'd be accomplished. I imagine it had to have been a key factor in securing their bid for the title and considering everything that came after I can't imagine they gave a single thought about how they'd actually accomplish this until it showed up on their desks.

So they're okay with throwing the people who worked under it under the bus and do absolutely zero self-reflection on their actual localization practices. They broke basically every promise and low balled nearly every standard of acceptable localization because they couldn't see beyond the dollar signs in their eyes. I don't think they deserve a round of applause for that. Or the slightest bit of understanding. This has been an embarrassing story from start to finish.

Plus, if no-one , kicked up a stink about it....they would've let it, sit.

 

[Dice//]

Not sure why NISA is getting kudos for releasing a subpar product, saying nothing about plainly obvious problems with its' script prior to its' release and then announcing a bandaid when it became clear that people weren't willing to settle as they did with something like Persona 5. A month and a half is not enough time to go through this game's script, re-translate it, edit it, and proofread it without compromising heavily on at least a couple of those things. In reality, more like just a month since this translation patch presumably has to be certified to ensure it doesn't introduce more problems.

The worst part is that they talk about the game's translation like it's some great mystery how it was so undercooked and how they'd be 'investigating' the causes as though they weren't obvious to anyone with a realistic impression of how long high quality localization work really takes. The expected turnaround time for the script was insanely low, it's no surprise that the translators and editors couldn't turn in something acceptable when they were working under such insane deadlines on such a massive project. It's pretty obvious to me that the core of Ys VIII's problems stemmed from the very premise of how soon they promised it'd be accomplished. I imagine it had to have been a key factor in securing their bid for the title and considering everything that came after I can't imagine they gave a single thought about how they'd actually accomplish this until it showed up on their desks.

So they're okay with throwing the people who worked under it under the bus and do absolutely zero self-reflection on their actual localization practices. They broke basically every promise and low balled nearly every standard of acceptable localization because they couldn't see beyond the dollar signs in their eyes. I don't think they deserve a round of applause for that. Or the slightest bit of understanding. This has been an embarrassing story from start to finish.

I try not to think about it too hard, there's enough vitriol in the industry already and they're trying to rectify it. It sucks, but at the end of the day I got bills to pay and some dumb grammatical errors for a videogame aren't the hill i'm going to die on. I'm glad they're working on it.

If I DID have an issue it's that way too many NISA games seem to skip the proofread part of their script. Again I don't care and it won't be the deciding factor for why I get a game of theirs, but time and time again it just looks...a little bad on a professional level.

 

[vkrili]

If you've got bills to pay doesn't that mean you should be buying less video games and try to be more critical before your purchases?

Either way I don't think it's vitriol to be upset at a company that time and again fails to produce the level of quality that should be expected of them. It's disrespectful to you and your time and money if NISA or any other company pushes out a subpar product.

 

[Pepboy]

It would have had more chances of working if for every fan complaining about its quality there hadn't been 5 claiming the localization was fine. Maybe.

I'm sure you're right, but I think "fine" isn't a high bar and 1/6 is still a sizeable chunk. Atlus USA used to have a higher standard in my mind at least.

 

[Theswweet]

The harder I think about the logistics of a patch releasing 1 1/2 months from now, the harder I find it to believe this is going to fix a thing... That's hardly any time at all, if you account for sending/receiving files from Falcom, QA, submitting the patch to Sony...

You're only going to have a few weeks, max, on the translation.

 

[Ascheroth]

If you've got bills to pay doesn't that mean you should be buying less video games and try to be more critical before your purchases?

Either way I don't think it's vitriol to be upset at a company that time and again fails to produce the level of quality that should be expected of them. It's disrespectful to you and your time and money if NISA or any other company pushes out a subpar product.

Yeah, this "be glad what anything at all and I don't care because it's not that terrible"-mindset is really weird.

I mean, you're paying money. 60-70$ if you buy it at release. Expecting and demanding a quality product shouldn't be anything debatable, it should be the norm.

 

[Kain-Nosgoth]

what's the big hole joke? What did i miss?

 

[Korigama]

...I don't think I've ever seen a company apologize for a localization before.

The first Gunvolt comes to mind (it too received a second localization that was patched in later, which also restored the huge chunks of voice acting that the original one had cut).

 

[Ascheroth]

what's the big hole joke? What did i miss?

They translated a lot of things that already were in English in the japanese version into Engrish. "Crevice of the Archeozoic Era" became "Archeozoic Big Hole". Alongside other instances.

 

[Kain-Nosgoth]

They translated a lot of things that already were in English in the japanese version into Engrish. "Crevice of the Archeozoic Era" became "Archeozoic Big Hole". Alongside other instances.

lol, didn't even noticed it, and i did both version (vita on japanese and ps4 translated)

that's really stupid

 

[Refyref]

The first Gunvolt comes to mind (it too received a second localization that was patched in later, which also restored the huge chunks of voice acting that the original one had cut).

That was a weird case in which the first localization was the better one, but dialogue cuts that showed up in the middle of gameplay and voice acting. The latter localization had the parts missing in the first one, but was a bit colder and direct of a localization, probably to stay more in line with the voice lines. I also don't remember if it was patched in later or only included as an option in later releases of the game.

 

[ZoddGutts]

Tokyo Xanadu had some cringe lines added to the translation.

 

[Kain-Nosgoth]

now all is left is praying that NISA doesn't touch any kiseki games...

 

[Thud]

They translated a lot of things that already were in English in the japanese version into Engrish. "Crevice of the Archeozoic Era" became "Archeozoic Big Hole". Alongside other instances.

As a result the OT title of Ys VIII became 'Two Systems, Two Heroes, One BIG HOLE'

 

[MKIL65]

But I've already played through the game... TWICE

Plus it's been a month since the game came out!

 

[Bladenic]

They have different issues, for the most part. Except for a few parts, VIII's translation doesn't usually screw up meaning, it's just that it's overly stiff and literal, very poorly (barely?) edited, homogenizes character speech styles, has English names that are worse than the pre-existing ones in the JP version, and generally reads like crap.

TX has a number of cases of names and terms being translated or romanized multiple different ways and then all of them being used interchangeably, which is incredibly sloppy - and some of those ways aren't always even correct or synonymous with the others. Aksys also forgot to insert the true ending credits theme, which means that it's just 5 minutes of dead silence over the final part of the ending and the credits instead. I will say, though, that aside from the aforementioned sloppiness, it does feel like they actually tried with the editing, unlike NISA. It has personality, although I think it might actually be slightly overdone at times.

Both localizations screw up references to other Falcom games - Ys VIII mistranslates the name of an item returning from Ys II and misromanizes the name of a character who's obviously a walking Trails reference, and TX misromanizes the names of a location from Trails of Cold Steel II (it's referenced in an in-universe arcade game) and Falcom's own mascot, Mishy. (As "Michy".)

What were the references specifically? The Trails reference in particular?

 

[StereoVsn]

So is Ys VIII a December release now? Xanadu Ex+ also seems to be December release. Xenoblade 2 is December release. Isn't Cold Steel 2 scheduled for December on Steam as well?!

That's a lot of JRPGs all in one month.

 

[Ascheroth]

So is Ys VIII a December release now? Xanadu Ex+ also seems to be December release. Xenoblade 2 is December release. Isn't Cold Steel 2 scheduled for December on Steam as well?!

That's a lot of JRPGs all in one month.

Cold Steel 2 is December at the very very very earliest. As in, sooner than December is impossible. Which means it's probably going to be a Q1 2018 release.

 

[Korigama]

That was a weird case in which the first localization was the better one, but dialogue cuts that showed up in the middle of gameplay and voice acting. The latter localization had the parts missing in the first one, but was a bit colder and direct of a localization, probably to stay more in line with the voice lines. I also don't remember if it was patched in later or only included as an option in later releases of the game.

I have the original 3DS digital version, it was patched in later for that one, included by default for the Gunvolt 1+2 Striker Pack. Though the original that 8-4 did before their closer second attempt had more flavor, the trade-off was the amount of worldbuilding and characterization that was sacrificed in the progress as a result of the amount of dialogue (during missions and with Joule between missions) omitted.

Either way, the option to disable dialogue during missions was available, as was being able to switch between the old and new localizations.

now all is left is praying that NISA doesn't touch any kiseki games...

Between word of NISA's incompetency reaching Japan and XSeed going out of their way to make PC versions of the first two Cold Steel games that didn't even exist previously, with much more voice acting and a turbo feature that Falcom have already mimicked in Sen III at that, I'm less inclined to be concerned with them specifically. Aksys may or may not remain a potential obstacle.

 

[MaximumSpider]

I bought it day one and still haven’t left the ship in the beginning so this is great news.
I wish Altus would do the same with P5.

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

yeeesh, when the raw version of a game has better engllish than the translation....

This was exactly what I was worried about when NISA acquired YsVIII. XSeed wouldn't have let this happen. It's good that NISA is actually revising the script, but there's no excuse for this to happen in the first place.

 

[preta]

What were the references specifically? The Trails reference in particular?

In Ys 8, the "Cruberry" returns from Ys II as a healing item (localized as "Wall Nut" in VIII), and (Ys VIII and Trails in the Sky FC spoilers)

Spoiler

there's an evil doctor hiding in plain sight whose last name is Weissmann, romanized in Ys VIII as "Viceman" because NISA apparently doesn't understand how to romanize Germanic names.

In TX, the location in question is "Yumir" instead of Ymir, and as I had said before, "Michy" instead of Mishy.

 

[Refyref]

I have the original 3DS digital version, it was patched in later for that one, included by default for the Gunvolt 1+2 Striker Pack. Though the original that 8-4 did before their closer second attempt had more flavor, the trade-off was the amount of worldbuilding and characterization that was sacrificed in the progress as a result of the amount of dialogue (during missions and with Joule between missions) omitted.

Either way, the option to disable dialogue during missions was available, as was being able to switch between the old and new localizations.

I have the digital 3DS version, just didn't return to it after the update, so I want sure. I'm going through the second attempt right now via the Switch collection, and it's basically like that. Extra lines from characters help world/character-building, but I do believe that for the main dialogue/cutscenes, the original localization was better. But both localizations are good at the end of the day, so it's not exactly the same situation as this thread.

 

[I3rand0]

The fact that they got called out on this back at E3, didn't delay the game, and are now doing this damage control is amusing.

 

[preta]

a turbo feature that Falcom have already mimicked in Sen III

What are you referring to? I'm 100 hours into Sen III and am not aware of any such thing.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

Some sample NPC banter I liked from near the beginning:



It definitely feels more lively.

Have we yelled at Aksys for that kerning yet? Because god damn that fucking kerning.

 

[Bladenic]

In Ys 8, the "Cruberry" returns from Ys II as a healing item (localized as "Wall Nut" in VIII), and (Ys VIII and Trails in the Sky FC spoilers)

Spoiler

there's an evil doctor hiding in plain sight whose last name is Weissmann, romanized in Ys VIII as "Viceman" because NISA apparently doesn't understand how to romanize Germanic names.

In TX, the location in question is "Yumir" instead of Ymir, and as I had said before, "Michy" instead of Mishy.

Yeah, I never made the Doctor connection because of that.

 

[Het_Nkik]

i genuinely hadn't even noticed as I'm playing but this

is hilarious. Why would anybody want it patched?

I just started Justice Chronicles on 3DS and

 

[Korigama]

What are you referring to? I'm 100 hours into Sen III and am not aware of any such thing.

Ah, seems I've confused that with the option to speed up cutscenes then (which would've been helpful for replays in the previous two, but wasn't there before). Sorry about that.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

Ah, seems I've confused that with the option to speed up cutscenes then (which would've been helpful for replays in the previous two, but wasn't there before). Sorry about that.

you can fast forward cutscenes in Sen 1 and 2