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[Baconsammy]

The biggest complaint he had was that he found the pawn AI lacking and since you barely have any command over them besides the basic Help and Come commands, he found that what could have been a good strategic combat system boils down into your pawns whacking the enemies over and over. He said that multiplayer would have fixed this issue.

Yeah, just finished reading it. He hated far more about the game than the pawn system. Calls it one huge clunky, bland affair with some incredibly bad difficulty spikes.

Seems like they couldn't handle the difficulty...

I don't get that impression. He likes the difficulty of Dark Souls, because it's fair. It's hard as hell at times, but it's fair. This apparently, has moments that are simply bullshit. And if its true, I also would call that bad game design.

 

[MagicWithEarvin]

Remember that enemies have set levels in certain areas, so he probably ventured way off the beaten path and got punished for it.

 

[Anteater]

He's probably talking about the level if it's anything related to unfair

I can't speak for the pawn system since they're built by players, so they're kind of dynamic, the thing is that other reviews were praising it on how the pawn system is decent because it shows how they're different depend on how the player built it.

Unless he's talking about his main pawn which he could adjust himself.

 

[ironcreed]

Yep, this is going to be a love it/hate it game to hell and back. He basically hated it because it combined elements of other games and because it was not co-op. Seems to have hated the hard difficulty and gameplay in general as well.

I admit I was not expecting reviews this low, but have been expecting it to get mixed reactions. Even hardline old EDGE gave it a 7. Which is more than generous coming from them. Anyway, I know I am going to love the game. The only reason I am even keeping up with reviews is because I would like to see it do well. We need interesting new IPs to succeed.

 

[MMaRsu]

Remember that enemies have set levels in certain areas, so he probably ventured way off the beaten path and got punished for it.

Maybe he tried to rush through the story?

 

[Anteater]

At least I was right about polarizing reviews

 

[Boogybro]

DMC developers made this right? Surely that would explain the difficulty.

 

[Baconsammy]

Maybe he tried to rush through the story?

The review doesn't say the game is too hard. It's that it has unfair spikes. I imagine if he rushed, he would have found the entire game to be too hard, which he doesn't state. He's big on making comparisons to games he thinks do the same things, but better. His complaint about the vocal pawns is fair, and hopefully there's a way to shut them up completely. Based on the demo, he's also right that pawns will act stupidly in fights and start looting instead of fighting. And based on the demo, he's right that commands you can give your pawns are incredibly limited. If they're stupid, that's a huge problem. If the AI is good, it's not. He seems to the think the AI is stupid.

Kind of wish he had also reviewed Amalur so I could get a relative baseline on how my opinion matches up with his.

DMC developers made this right? Surely that would explain the difficulty.

He's not saying the game is too hard.

 

[Santiako]

At this point I don't really care about reviews. I loved the demo and I have already decided that I'll buy it.

 

[ironcreed]

Here is a preview from Robert Cram before the review from MSXboxworld. He says it is a "damn good game" and that "it is very easy to get into, unless you push yourself." He also says that balancing your party and changing them out frequently is a must and they will compliment you very well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ex-xn37jTA

 

[Anteater]

The review doesn't say the game is too hard. It's that it has unfair spikes. I imagine if he rushed, he would have found the entire game to be too hard, which he doesn't state. He's big on making comparisons to games he thinks do the same things, but better. His complaint about the vocal pawns is fair, and hopefully there's a way to shut them up completely. Based on the demo, he's also right that pawns will act stupidly in fights and start looting instead of fighting. And based on the demo, he's right that commands you can give your pawns are incredibly limited. If they're stupid, that's a huge problem. If the AI is good, it's not. He seems to the think the AI is stupid.

Well remember the developers said pawns are based on how the players raised them, so they're all different with different knowledge, it was mainly the point of it, as far as if they've done a good job on executing that idea, that's a different story, but pawns could be stupid and smart.

 

[abundant]

Based on the demo, he's also right that pawns will act stupidly in fights and start looting instead of fighting. And based on the demo, he's right that commands you can give your pawns are incredibly limited. If they're stupid, that's a huge problem. If the AI is good, it's not. He seems to the think the AI is stupid.

You can alter AI behavior through potions sold through the Rift Shop. Stuff like "Attack the strongest enemy" or "Protect the main player". You can only do this with your pawn though.

 

[Dresden]

"Unfair" spikes, huh. Funny how we haven't heard much about that elsewhere. Almost like . . . but I guess that would be unfair before I play it myself.

 

[RevolverFox44]

"Unfair" spikes, huh. Funny how we haven't heard much about that elsewhere. Almost like . . . but I guess that would be unfair before I play it myself.

Sounds to me like he's gotten soft from all the level scaling garbage that has infected modern WRPGs. I'm looking forward to getting my ass handed to me, experimenting with strategies, swapping hired pawns, and if necessary going to grind a few sidequests before coming back stronger with better gear. I want to be afraid to enter every cave, ruin and dark forest.

 

[Riposte]

Never ever take a journo's word on "fairness". Most of the time is him being a scrub.

 

[MagicWithEarvin]

Sounds to me like he's gotten soft from all the level scaling garbage that has infected modern WRPGs. I'm looking forward to getting my ass handed to me, experimenting with strategies, swapping hired pawns, and if necessary going to grind a few sidequests before coming back stronger with better gear. I want to be afraid to enter every cave, ruin and dark forest.

Preach on, brotha.

 

[KO Traveling Hobo]

The biggest complaint he had was that he found the pawn AI lacking and since you barely have any command over them besides the basic Help and Come commands, he found that what could have been a good strategic combat system boils down into your pawns whacking the enemies over and over. He said that multiplayer would have fixed this issue.

The .hack games were painfully bad, but one thing they did a really good job with was the party control interface. They gave you a list of behaviors and commands you could choose from on the fly, as well as the ability to make the AI use specific spells/skills on whoever you want.

I wish Dragon's Dogma had something like that.

 

[Baconsammy]

Here is a preview from Robert Cram before the review from MSXboxworld. He says it is a "damn good game" and that "it is very easy to get into, unless you push yourself." He also says that balancing your party and changing them out frequently is a must and they will compliment you very well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ex-xn37jTA

He says the game comes out also on PC in May. He as some of the same complaints as the Play review, but wasn't as bothered apparently.

. They gave you a list of behaviors and commands you could choose from on the fly, as well as the ability to make the AI use specific spells/skills on whoever you want.

I wish Dragon's Dogma had something like that.

Me too. Not a big fan of setting one type of behavior and that's how they'll always act until you manually change it again later outside of battle.

 

[ironcreed]

Sounds to me like he's gotten soft from all the level scaling garbage that has infected modern WRPGs. I'm looking forward to getting my ass handed to me, experimenting with strategies, swapping hired pawns, and if necessary going to grind a few sidequests before coming back stronger with better gear. I want to be afraid to enter every cave, ruin and dark forest.

Indeed, that is what it is all about. You venture out and find out for yourself. If you get killed in one shot from trying to be a badass when you are not ready, go back, level up and come back later to reap the rewards. Even the Gametrailers preview said that this was how the game was designed, as well as the video I just posted above from MSXboxworld. That is GREAT design because it has pacing and lets you appreciate and earn your growth based on your own decisions.

 

[ironcreed]

He says the game comes out also on PC in May. He as some of the same complaints as the Play review, but wasn't as bothered apparently.

LOL, I'll forgive him the slip of the tongue about there being a PC version. That does not invalidate his opinion in any way, though. He has played the game and the preview overall was very positive.

 

[Dresden]

PC . . . if that's true I'm waiting for that.

 

[Anteater]

Anyone really going to switch out the pawns frequently? I think I'm going to be lazy and stick with the low level ones until I'm having trouble

 

[ironcreed]

Anyone really going to switch out the pawns frequently? I think I'm going to be lazy and stick with the low level ones until I'm having trouble

I will be, especially if I get into a situation where I feel I need different support. Not to mention that it will keep the game fresh. I think it is going to be addictive checking out and rating characters that other people made.

 

[Lucent]

Anyone really going to switch out the pawns frequently? I think I'm going to be lazy and stick with the low level ones until I'm having trouble

I think it depends on how good the available in-game pawns are. If I find any I particularly like the look of and such. Maybe the 4th pawn will be reserved for using other people's pawns. But I'm not sure. I'll mess around with that when I get the game.

 

[Dresden]

I will relentlessly sacrifice my pawns (via chucking them off cliffs) to gain the favors of the underworld. BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD, SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE.

 

[The_Hitcher89]

I wanna make an Aragorn, a Legolas and a Gandalf, but I'm not sure which one I'll use, which one will be my pawn and which one will be left out. How useful are pawns that specialise in archery?

 

[ironcreed]

I will relentlessly sacrifice my pawns (via chucking them off cliffs) to gain the favors of the underworld. BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD, SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE.

LOL, it is going to be fun as hell messing with them. I tossed one in a puddle of water in the demo and he got up and brushed himself off while saying, "absolutely soaked!"

 

[Baconsammy]

He also makes a fair point that it's stupid you can raise your fallen pawns, but they can't raise you. I'll be surprised if even the healing class can't raise you.

 

[Boogybro]

I'm going to be playing this game as if it were the Golden Age arc of Berserk. Don't know who I'm going to main and pawn though.

 

[The_Hitcher89]

He also makes a fair point that it's stupid you can raise your fallen pawns, but they can't raise you. I'll be surprised if even the healing class can't raise you.

It makes sense from a gameplay perspective, even if they couldn't justify it story-wise.

Perhaps a ten second grace period would have been ideal in which you can only crawl around and hope that your main pawn can save you. It'd be too easy if any of the 3 could save you I think

 

[Dresden]

He also makes a fair point that it's stupid you can raise your fallen pawns, but they can't raise you. I'll be surprised if even the healing class can't raise you.

It's the main character getting killed . . . don't see the problem here.

 

[Data West]

He also makes a fair point that it's stupid you can raise your fallen pawns, but they can't raise you. I'll be surprised if even the healing class can't raise you.

Sounds like an RPG to me. This isn't Gears of War. If the MC dies in Persona, guess what? Game's over.

 

[Anteater]

He also makes a fair point that it's stupid you can raise your fallen pawns, but they can't raise you. I'll be surprised if even the healing class can't raise you.

That's how it was designed to begin with, if you die it's game over, until you have the skill that allows you to resurrect I think

 

[Baconsammy]

It's the main character getting killed . . . don't see the problem here.

I definitely see the problem there.

Sounds like an RPG to me. This isn't Gears of War. If the MC dies in Persona, guess what? Game's over.

Being an RPG automatically implies that party members can't res you?

 

[KO Traveling Hobo]

That's how it was designed to begin with, if you die it's game over, until you have the skill that allows you to resurrect I think

Jesus mode?

 

[Baconsammy]

Jesus mode?

Every day is Easter.

 

[RevolverFox44]

He also makes a fair point that it's stupid you can raise your fallen pawns, but they can't raise you. I'll be surprised if even the healing class can't raise you.

That IS lame although not surprising. I hated that about Persona and FFXIII as well. Your main pawn should be able revive you within a certain time limit before you bleed out. Not the hired ones though, that would make it too easy.

 

[Data West]

I definitely see the problem there.



Being an RPG automatically implies that party members can't res you?

Yeah? I don't see why games need to give you infinite retries. Don't screw up with the main character. That's party 101.

 

[Anteater]

Jesus mode?

Yeah, it's a continue or something, not sure if there's a limit, but I think you could use it on npc or yourself

 

[sublimit]

I called it about the reviewers in the previous thread.I said that most of them would not really get what the developers where aiming for with the Pawn system and unfortunatelly it seems i was right.
This was posted by one of the developers in a previous Famitsu (Anteater posted it in the other thread some time ago) :

* "It isn't that hard to make great AI. You just need to deal with a lot more factors. We have a wide range of Pawns, and some of them are very stupid. If a Pawn doesn't know how to fight a certain monster, it will fight really badly. If you just see that, you may well think "This game sucks!" Please don't! A Pawn with the correct knowledge will act totally dfferently. My request to the AI Supervisor was "make AI that lets the player have the most fun!" The first priority in making the game has always been "THE AI MUST BE INCREDIBLE!"

I think it makes total sense that not all pawns would be some uber badasses to get you out of the most difficult situations.They aimed for realism and like in real life not everyone will respond to every situation the same.You either need to find the right person for the right job or be patient and train them to become more efficient.

But like i said before this was a huge risk with the majority of reviewers.

 

[Baconsammy]

Yeah? I don't see why games need to give you infinite retries. Don't screw up with the main character. That's party 101.

I'm not as close-minded to good game design as you. A healing pawn should have the ability res people, but the difficulty in doing so should raise exponentially as more and more party members (yourself included) die.

 

[Data West]

I'm not as close-minded to good game design as you. A healing pawn should have the ability res people, but the difficulty in doing so should raise exponentially as more and more party members (yourself included) die.

'Good game design' = making the game easier. Nice.

 

[Baconsammy]

'Good game design' = making the game easier. Nice.

The game lets you save manually. That's poor game design since it makes it easier? You being able to res a fallen member during a fight is poor design since it makes the fight easier?

 

[branny]

Less than 10 days now.

Robert Cram has practically become my life support.

 

[Moofers]

I just went to Amazon and pre-ordered. Reviews don't matter when the awesome demo told me everything I need to know already. Can't wait to make a hot little fem-pawn to follow me around while I slay dragons, goblins, etc.

LET THIS BE THE ANTHEM TO OUR COUNTDOWN TOWARD RELEASE:

Across the seas through sands of time, Knight of the Templar.
A charging steed through lands unkind, A legend forever!

 

[Rubikant]

You can alter AI behavior through potions sold through the Rift Shop. Stuff like "Attack the strongest enemy" or "Protect the main player". You can only do this with your pawn though.

Actually I believe you have it backwards.

From what I've seen, you can change your main pawn's behavior all you want by talking to them at inns and such, as shown here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByyMXIoyPTM

It is my understanding that the potions are for changing rented sub-pawn behavior, since their behavior is normally determined by whatever player owns them and that player's preferences, the potions allow you to rent a pawn that you like otherwise but just wish their combat tactics were a bit different and change them to suit your needs. The change won't affect the owning player's copy of the pawn or any one else using that pawn. They also could likely be used for your main pawn if you want them to change tactics mid-way through a quest without having to go back to an inn.

 

[lunchtoast]

You guys are making me excited for this game. I made a Tiny Katniss type strider, and her Brienne of Tarth bodyguard.

 

[Anteater]

Was this posted? A finnish magazine Pelit gave it a 9.2

shit is all over the place

 

[Rubikant]

He also makes a fair point that it's stupid you can raise your fallen pawns, but they can't raise you. I'll be surprised if even the healing class can't raise you.

There actually is story explanation for this though. You are an Arisen, they are Pawns. Technically, they aren't even human. From what I've read about the lore, the ability to resurrect the dead is unique to the Arisen.

In fact, in an interview its mentioned that this unique ability can be used in interesting ways. In an example they gave, you could have a quest where an NPC wants you to kill another NPC. You can do the deed, get the quest XP, then go back and resurrect the NPC you killed and tell them to lay low or get out of town if you feel bad about killing them or need them for something else.

All that aside, technically you aren't even resurrecting the pawns - they are immortal. They are just disabled, shouting that they can't move and whatnot, and the Arisen has the ability to restore them, just like the Arisen has the unique ability to command them in the first place.

So, say what you will about the gameplay mechanics of it, but they totally address this in the story itself. Its not like you are in a party of 4 adventures and only the player-controlled one can revive others, which would make no sense - in this game your character is a completely different entity than the pawns.

 

[Marco1]

Are there many environment differences such as snow and mountains?
Thanks.