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Capcom wants to keep working with Ninja Theory, lock them down

jett

D-Member
Being intentionally dishonest as usual, I see.

I don't think it's dishonest to imply that most of the people hating on DmC and Ninja Theory are actually unable to fully grasp the mechanics of the series.

No there is severe ignorance on the Ninja Theory side as well. More so I would argue.

"Not sure why there are so many people down on Ninja Theory, because they changed dante's hair color? Get over it already. "

Ignorance of what drives people to mindlessly hate is a bit different.

Just watch Jett for a few minutes

Now, what the fuck is this? You're gonna have to expand on that now, buddy.
 

Fantasmo

Member
God Hand is way too niche, this coming from someone who loved God Hand. It's too strange to have a marketable hit. The definition of something that works in practice but doesn't sound hot on paper or ads.

I hope the combination of Capcom and NT upgrades Capcom's characterization and relevance, and upgrades NT's gameplay skills. Ono has been their hot ticket, but he's obviously overworked as all hell.
 

dan2026

Member
I really, really hope DmC turns out to be a good game.

If only to shut up all the whiners and moaners who start frothing at the mouth every time Ninja Theory is mentioned.

Hell I don't even like the company much. But all this 'If Ninja Theory made Monster Hunter/Onimusha/Video Game X, I would just die!' is pathetic.
 

jett

D-Member
I really, really hope DmC turns out to be a good game.

If only to shut up all the whiners and moaners who start frothing at the mouth every time Ninja Theory is mentioned.

Hell I don't even like the company much. But all this 'If Ninja Theory made Monster Hunter/Onimusha/Video Game X, I would just die!' is pathetic.

I personally have never given two fucks about Ninja Theory, but I gave the demo a chance(actually several chances) and I've grown to really, really like it. I've gone from the usual DmC troll when it was first announced to a supporter after actually playing the thing. It's not perfect, but it's really fun. Too bad not everyone is able to give it a fair shot. Several people seem to actually refuse to try the demo.
 
Give me that Ninja Theory Viewtiful Joe, Capcom.

Give it to me.

I can't wait for Viewtiful Joe: Vj.

From the best gaming storytellers, Ninja Theory, comes:

Viewtiful Joe: Vj


On a world were movies are prohibited a man continues watching them in secret. In that world were freedom, justice and love were erased from the people and they live a subjugated existence as a mere working assets, Joe is the only one who can save them. And when his girlfriend Silvia is kidnapped to work as a prostitute for the high rulers, Joe has no other option that become a super hero thanks to the power of his demented mind. And save the world. Is time to Henfucking a go-go bitch!
 
I personally have never given two fucks about Ninja Theory, but I gave the demo a chance(actually several chances) and I've grown to really, really like it. I've gone from the usual DmC troll when it was first announced to a supporter after actually playing the thing. It's not perfect, but it's really fun. Too bad not everyone is able to give it a fair shot. Several people seem to actually refuse to try the demo.

A lot of people tried the demo it's not good.
 

Glass Rebel

Member
I don't think it's dishonest to imply that most of the people hating on DmC and Ninja Theory are actually unable to fully grasp the mechanics of the series.

The demo and tons of footage have been out for a while now. "Most people" aren't ignorant about what they like. You repeating over and over again that people just don't know better and putting down the other games at every chance you get doesn't change that.
 

Carbonox

Member
I really, really hope DmC turns out to be a good game.

If only to shut up all the whiners and moaners who start frothing at the mouth every time Ninja Theory is mentioned.

Hell I don't even like the company much. But all this 'If Ninja Theory made Monster Hunter/Onimusha/Video Game X, I would just die!' is pathetic.

I think it will be a good game. In the most general term at the very least. It will be a very fun action title going by the demo.

Unfortunately it will always have Devil May Cry hanging over it, for better or worse. Honestly, I'd love to see the two universes live side by side but not even Capcom could pull that off successfully. DmC offers enough to be a really cool alternative.
 
R

Retro_

Unconfirmed Member
Now, what the fuck is this? You're gonna have to expand on that now, buddy.

You're extremely combative in these threads often for no reason and tend to make large assumptions about the perspectives and opinions of a large group of people on the opposite side of the argument as you, instead of properly addressing people in front of you and the actual real opinions they hold

Pretty much this:

I don't think it's dishonest to imply that most of the people hating on DmC and Ninja Theory are actually unable to fully grasp the mechanics of the series.

Like I said only had to watch him for a few minutes
 
They should have chased after a good dev capable of creating interesting new IPs and doing justice to existing ones. Someone like, I dunno, Platinum? Oh wait, that's right...
 

Fantasmo

Member
This. Especially after RE6 and Spark doing Lost planet 3? What?!

Spark actually has lots of film industry talent. Capcom has gameplay talent.

"Oguro (Lost Planet franchise director) wanted to make up for some of those missed opportunities by making Lost Planet 3 a more cinematic, story-driven experience, which led Capcom to decide that it wanted a Western studio to develop the title. "It's not that [Capcom's] internal team couldn't do [that kind of game]," said Szymanski, "but it's not necessarily playing to their strengths."

All is explained here: http://www.polygon.com/2012/10/19/3528210/lost-planet-3-capcom-spark-unlimited-cinematic-direction
 
I think if that after being delayed for months, 3 years in the making and Capcom over their necks so the combat system don't totally sucks, NT couldn't have made a decent game they should have quit making them altogether.

Most developers don't get as much time as NT. See how DMC4 was rushed, for instance.

Spark actually has lots of film talent. Capcom has gameplay talent.

"Oguro (Lost Planet franchise director) wanted to make up for some of those missed opportunities by making Lost Planet 3 a more cinematic, story-driven experience, which led Capcom to decide that it wanted a Western studio to develop the title. "It's not that [Capcom's] internal team couldn't do [that kind of game]," said Szymanski, "but it's not necessarily playing to their strengths."

All is explained here: http://www.polygon.com/2012/10/19/3528210/lost-planet-3-capcom-spark-unlimited-cinematic-direction

Personally I think they're making lots of good decisions.

BUUUUUUUUUUUULLLSHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITTTT!!

Legendary has film talent? And LP3 is shaping like a disaster of incredible big proportions. Most western endeavours by Capcom ended in critical failures with poor sales, how is that making good decisions?
 

jett

D-Member
You're extremely combative in these threads often for no reason and tend to make large assumptions about the perspectives and opinions of a large group of people on the opposite side of the argument as you, instead of properly addressing people in front of you and the actual real opinions they hold

Pretty much this:



Like I said only had to watch him for a few minutes

I call it as I see it. And I'd say I've actually addressed opinions and talked about mechanics of the DMC games in these threads more than most. And what I see now is that you're annoyed I don't bow down to your sacred cows. And you haven't explained how I'm ignorant, either.
 
R

Retro_

Unconfirmed Member
They should have chased after a good dev capable of creating interesting new IPs and doing justice to existing ones. Someone like, I dunno, Platinum? Oh wait, that's right...

Why would they chase after a studio majorly composed of former employees who left the company to be independent?

More importantly why would Platinum want to go back to working under a company they already resigned from to form an independent studio?

I call it as I see it. And I'd say I've actually addressed opinions and talked about mechanics of the DMC games in these threads more than most. And what I see now is that you're annoyed I don't bow down to your sacred cows. And you haven't explained how I'm ignorant, either.

I think suggesting that the majority of the people who disagree with you aren't knowledgeable enough to reasonably hold the opinion that they do is pretty ignorant

It's really no different than the "elitists" you complain about suggesting that only casuals could enjoy this game or something

Of course you won't see it that way though.
 

Fantasmo

Member
BUUUUUUUUUUUULLLSHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITTTT!!

Legendary has film talent? And LP3 is shaping like a disaster of incredible big proportions. Most western endeavours by Capcom ended in critical failures with poor sales, how is that making good decisions?

When you stop frothing at the mouth, read the article.
There's also an included video. Capcom decided it couldn't compete with the US and Japan isn't saving them with customers. So they're trying to stay relevant BEFORE they go under.
 

abadguy

Banned
I don't see a problem. They have the potential to make better games than anyone at Capcom right now.


Eh? I thought you hated when devs constantly dumb down the gameplay for the "lowest common denominator" as you like to put it?

I feel like i woke up in the Bizarro-verse this morning where Ninja Theory doesn't routinely make games plagued with shallow combat, input lag, crappy non-platforming( Enslaved) and glitches. Not to mention putting presentation and story as priority over good gameplay. People actually have the nerve to ask why some are down on NT. Capcom should have went after Vigil instead.
 
Why would they chase after a studio majorly composed of former employees who left the company to be independent?

More importantly why would Platinum want to go back to working under a company they already resigned from to form an independent studio?

I think Kamiya expresed once that he wanted to work with Kobayashi again. Seems like the problem they had was with Inafune mostly rather than the company as a whole.
 

Noi

Member
"Oguro (Lost Planet franchise director) wanted to make up for some of those missed opportunities by making Lost Planet 3 a more cinematic, story-driven experience, which led Capcom to decide that it wanted a Western studio to develop the title. "It's not that [Capcom's] internal team couldn't do [that kind of game]," said Szymanski, "but it's not necessarily playing to their strengths."

Those words are almost toxic to me at this point. I'm so sick of devs/pubs wanting to turn every IP into an interactive movie, Capcom being the biggest offender.
 
When you stop frothing at the mouth, read the article.
There's also an included video.

I don't care for PR explanations. I care for the actual work of the developers and Spark work sucks balls. And most of the previews we have on LP3 are less than stellar. And they are previews, which most of the time are positive....

LP3 looks like an incredible deriative work that could pass as a DS spin-off.

Also you don't try to stay relevant using a c-rate developer like Spark or Slant-six, that's calling for a disaster.
 

Fantasmo

Member
Those words are almost toxic to me at this point. I'm so sick of devs/pubs wanting to turn every IP into an interactive movie, Capcom being the biggest offender.

But... it sells? Oh and by the way, I don't think I've ever played a Capcom game with actual BAD gameplay. Maybe I have but it doesn't exactly stick out like a sore thumb. But their stories and characters HAVE made me cringe. I've actually been embarassed with some of their cutscenes with other people in the room. I'm sorry if that offends you. Well, not really.
 
R

Retro_

Unconfirmed Member
I think Kamiya expresed once that he wanted to work with Kobayashi again. Seems like the problem they had was with Inafune mostly rather than the company as a whole.

Oh for some reason I thought he was suggesting that Capcom should have bought Platinum instead. Which is dumb since I don't even think they're buying Ninja Theory here.

My bad.

I don't know shit about how the industry works, but I always figured the thing keeping Capcom and Platinum from working together is that Platinum is basically a studio composed of a bunch of former employees who took a good chunk of their work force with them when they resigned.
 

Fantasmo

Member
I don't care for PR explanations. I care for the actual work of the developers and Spark work sucks balls. And most of the previews we have on LP3 are less than stellar. And they are previews, which most of the time are positive....

LP3 looks like an incredible deriative work that could pass as a DS spin-off.

Also you don't try to stay relevant using a c-rate developer like Spark or Slant-six, that's calling for a disaster.

You still haven't stopped frothing. It's not a PR explanation, the explanation is coming from the series director. HE didn't think he could pull off his vision without the help of Spark. HE wanted to make it happen. And it actually looks like it might end up pretty damn cool. But you're taking it so personally you won't even check it out. Talk about blind hate.
 
Wait, people actually have to explain the cynicism surrounding this project? All of Ninja Theory's action games have been balls so far, and the brooding antiauthoritarian tween aestetic is laughable, and not in a cheeky self referential way like 1&3. If they pull off a miracle and the game is better than passable, great, but lets not pretend like their pedigree should dispel all doubt.
 

Derrick01

Banned
Eh? I thought you hated when devs constantly dumb down the gameplay for the "lowest common denominator" as you like to put it?

I feel like i woke up in the Bizarro-verse this morning where Ninja Theory doesn't routinely make games plagued with shallow combat, input lag, crappy non-platforming( Enslaved) and glitches. Not to mention putting presentation and story as priority over good gameplay. People actually have the nerve to ask why some are down on NT. Capcom should have went after Vigil instead.

They're still better than the crap Capcom makes now. And I'm probably not going to play this game until it gets a cheap steam sale, but I doubt it could be more boring than 4 was.
 
You still haven't stopped frothing. It's not a PR explanation, the explanation is coming from the series director. HE didn't think he could pull off his vision without the help of Spark. HE wanted to make it happen. But you're taking it so personally you won't even check it out. Talk about blind hate.

Again that's PR talk made by PR people. Capcom has the assets to make way more cinematic games than Spark could ever pull of.

His words aren't diferent that the ones we found in other cases like Front Mission Evolved and other IP's that were relegated to third rate studios.

Is basically a plead to the fans to not get angry because otherwise they couldn't make the game and realize his vision. Of course Spark is a great studio...in PR talk, but if we see their games we could see that any other mid-tier developer in Japan could have pulled it off....
 
R

Retro_

Unconfirmed Member
Eh? I thought you hated when devs constantly dumb down the gameplay for the "lowest common denominator" as you like to put it?

It's fine as long as it happens to a genre Derrick01 doesn't understand/care enough about to notice I guess.

Well I guess that's normal for anyone really. I can't say I care much about the simplification of RPGs/JRPGs
 

abadguy

Banned
They're still better than the crap Capcom makes now. And I'm probably not going to play this game until it gets a cheap steam sale, but I doubt it could be more boring than 4 was.

Dragon's Dogma alone pretty much craps on everything NT has made up to this point.
 

Fantasmo

Member
Again that's PR talk made by PR people. Capcom has the assets to make way more cinematic games than Spark could ever pull of.

His words aren't diferent that the ones we found in other cases like Front Mission Evolved and other IP's that were relegated to third rate studios.

Is basically a plead to the fans to not get angry because otherwise they couldn't make the game and realize his vision. Of course Spark is a great studio...in PR talk, but if we see their games we could see that any other mid-tier developer in Japan could have pulled it off....

From the article:

Oguro wanted to make up for some of those missed opportunities by making Lost Planet 3 a more cinematic, story-driven experience, which led Capcom to decide that it wanted a Western studio to develop the title. "It's not that [Capcom's] internal team couldn't do [that kind of game]," said Szymanski, "but it's not necessarily playing to their strengths."

According to Szymanski, the first concept meetings for Lost Planet 3 took place in February 2010. At the time, its developers drew up plans for the usual development process on a game like this: hand-animated character models to which voice-over was added later. But the stylized art design that pipeline produced was insufficient to convey the subtleties of emotion that Capcom wanted to bring to the table.

It was then that Spark proposed performance capture, a technique used in games such as Team Bondi's L.A. Noire. The studio told Capcom, "We can try it, but it's sort of uncharted territory. It involves scrapping everything we've done and implementing an entirely new character pipeline."

Capcom agreed, and the developers threw out nearly a year of work — after the concept phase, they had spent nine months putting together a prototype using the original character models. Here, said Szymanski, Capcom pushed Spark to "develop new tools that they were familiar with from the film world, but had never actually implemented themselves."

Many of the studio's employees have experience in filmmaking: Lead producer Kevin Scharff, for example, worked on the 2009 CG-animated movie Astro Boy. Spark had established a performance-capture pipeline for film, but it had to be reworked to interface with the Lost Planet 3 game engine. "That's where most of the work had to go," said Szymanski.
 
Wait, people actually have to explain the cynicism surrounding this project? All of Ninja Theory's action games have been balls so far, and the brooding antiauthoritarian tween aestetic is laughable, and not in a cheeky self referential way like 1&3. If they pull off a miracle and the game is better than passable, great, but lets not pretend like their pedigree should dispel all doubt.

also this

I mean it's basically a fact that the game is ruined from this video alone.
 
It's kind of hilarious that this thread is turning into the opposite of that "dream platinum franchise reboot?" thread.

NT for Street Fighter 5 plz
 

abadguy

Banned
Dragon's Dogma is the definition of the modern Capcom game. Doesn't know what it wants to do and can't execute on anything it's promising it can do.

And yet somehow it actually ends up being fun to play. Isn't completely broken tries it's damnedest to be a movie and fails hard.(like the average NT game) No it's not perfect, but much like the old Lost Planet games , had some great ideas that could be fully realized, more polished with sequels.
 

jett

D-Member
Why would they chase after a studio majorly composed of former employees who left the company to be independent?

More importantly why would Platinum want to go back to working under a company they already resigned from to form an independent studio?



I think suggesting that the majority of the people who disagree with you aren't knowledgeable enough to reasonably hold the opinion that they do is pretty ignorant

It's really no different than the "elitists" you complain about suggesting that only casuals could enjoy this game or something

Of course you won't see it that way though.

I obviously don't count the people that display DMC knowledge among that lot, but those with drive-by hate posts or those that just parrot what others say or those that just straight-up say wrong shit? Yes.
 
R

Retro_

Unconfirmed Member
I obviously don't count the people that display DMC knowledge among that lot, but those with drive-by hate posts or those that just parrot what others say or those that just straight-up say wrong shit? Yes.

Call those people out individually when they do it then.

Don't make sweeping generalizations about the other side of the argument whenever the opportunity presents itself.

Just makes you look foolish to the people who don't like the category you lump them in. (hi)
 

Midou

Member
Dragon's Dogma is the definition of the modern Capcom game. Doesn't know what it wants to do and can't execute on anything it's promising it can do.

Most of the problems I have with it could have been solved with a PC version. Like horrid load times, framerate issues and screen tearing. I can't even stand that shit long enough to see if the game is good.

I do agree though, that modern Capcom doesn't know what the fuck its doing anymore. DMC4 wasn't terrible, but it was only half a game, copy pasted onto itself.
 
No more DmC games please. We want REAL Devil May Cry games again. Not the abomination that is the reboot. Whoever decided to reboot the series should lose their job and not be let back in the industry. They don't deserve their career. Well, unless they decide to wisen up and give us what we want that is. You know, good games.

That would be Inafune.
 

Mesoian

Member
Dragon's Dogma is the definition of the modern Capcom game. Doesn't know what it wants to do and can't execute on anything it's promising it can do.

Now now, DD does capitalize on the one thing they promised. Combat. The combat in that game is fantastic.

It's everything else it fails at, and honestly, if you look at their track record, everything that DD doesn't have is everything that has made NT games prior to DMC shine. It might be in their best interest.

But I don't want NT to become the DMC developer. They have other games that are pretty damn good, I don't want that track record to go away because Capcom thinks it's a cheap easy solution to what to do with Devil May Cry.
 

Fantasmo

Member
Now now, DD does capitalize on the one thing they promised. Combat. The combat in that game is fantastic.

It's everything else it fails at, and honestly, if you look at their track record, everything that DD doesn't have is everything that has made NT games prior to DMC shine. It might be in their best interest.

But I don't want NT to become the DMC developer. They have other games that are pretty damn good, I don't want that track record to go away because Capcom thinks it's a cheap easy solution to what to do with Devil May Cry.

Yes. NT excels at what Capcom doesn't and vice versa. If they combine properly they benefit each other. Capcom's latest decisions, DLC notwithstanding, are specifically to stay in the game and stay a relevant Eastern developer.

I still say MT Framework is bonkers. Very versatile and stunning. Its just too bad that it wasn't well documented or translated. Capcom's an awesome awesome Eastern developer and with a little help their games won't be embarassing to play.
 
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