A Sony rep told Eurogamer that the patent had nothing to do with PS4 at all. Of course, maybe he was lying or simply misinformed, but it seems to go along with everything else Sony is saying on the matter.
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Sony PS4 does not require an internet connection. Ever. Seriously. Listen. Read.
- Thread starter Amir0x
- Start date
A Sony rep told Eurogamer that the patent had nothing to do with PS4 at all. Of course, maybe he was lying or simply misinformed, but it seems to go along with everything else Sony is saying on the matter.
The last quote in your OP is the wriggle room.
The system isn't online required, but Sony have left the doors open for publishers to state that their games are and thus have Xbox One style DRM.
Sony appear to be playing the clever PR game, but if they allow publishers to use Anti-used game DRM/online check requirements etc, they will, I think we all know that. The difference is that Sony will then just hand wave and (rightly) blame publishers. Of course on a practical level that is a meaningless difference.
So yes, PS4 "Doesn't require online" is true, with a massive * next to it, probably.
skeptic =/= cynic
Uno Venova
Banned
So probably EA games will have a similar check in like the Xbox one console, personally that's easily avoidable for me, and not as bad as the whole console or it's exclusives needing internet connections.
Ploid 3.0
Member
It's the same freedom sony gives devs for PS3 games. Like not having to use PSN for their online games which Konami tried to take advantage of with MGS4 and MGO (konami online account). PSN grew so it was better to just use PSN than to have their own service. Also that freedom kinda had Valve interested with their Portal 2 stuff. Is Diablo 3 confirmed for xbox yet? Maybe there's something with the freedom Sony gives devs that had them look at PS for D3. Xbox is strict.
H_Prestige
Banned
They don't. MS did because they wanted to make money off used games. It's that simple.
Very much so, you've made it even more entertaining please carry on.
Manmademan
Member
As others have pointed out, this is the same system the ps3 uses. publishers are free to require online for that system.
HOWEVER, Sony has clarified they will NOT use that for their own first party titles, nor require it for anyone else. The result there is that DRM online only games would be competing for shelf space with similar DRM free games from first and third parties. The result being publishers are unlikely to go that route unless EVERYONE does.
dragonbane
Member
Unlike last gen though, we're going into a generation where publishers will be assuming that more people will have internet connections, and of course we already know Xbox One will be using a DRM platform.
I fear a situation where MS basically makes it harder for publishers making games for both PS4 and Xbox One while intending on leaving the PS4 version DRM free. I can't see them allowing marketing of a competing version wide open like that and as EA especially seem to love DRM, it's clear that battle wont be hard for some.
It'll be interesting either way, but just as importantly, I don't think Joe Public really understand what DRM is, meaning outside of GAF/people who actually have a clue about tech, MS/EA especially may get away with this because of lack of consumer knowledge/indifference to anti-consumer acts.
It would be laudable if Sony actually spoke up against online checks and DRM and put pressure on publishers to avoid it, but as a platform holder I can see them being laissez faire, which isn't much better, in my honest view.
Seems pretty clear to me though I suppose they could spin it in some way where you do need a connection in some kind of sense. Cerny's answer seemed to explain it best, as in you can play without any connection needed but if you do have one it can enhance the experience in various ways.
The Share button for instance would seem an example of this.
The Share button for instance would seem an example of this.
Knux-Future
Banned
I get the hesitant nature of many to just go with it.
They don't want that last minute switch.
so they don't believe...
They don't want that last minute switch.
so they don't believe...
And he was right. Game sharing was the most forward thinking DRM scheme for digital content that could overcome the drawback of the non-lendable nature of that form of content. It was great.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
yea with RFID/NFC IIRC. they weren't working on it. A patent doesn't mean that much
This still works, albeit only for 2 consoles.
jonscrambler
Member
I don't know why people think Sony games won't have online DRM when the exact quote is
When asked if Sony, as a publisher, would require games to be registered online, Yoshida said, "we are not talking about that plan."
When asked if Sony, as a publisher, would require games to be registered online, Yoshida said, "we are not talking about that plan."
Brad Grenz
Member
The only reporting on the subject from Eurogamer I've seen cites an anonymous source. There's been no official denial.
As far as I can see, nobody has asked them directly about the patent.
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
Sweet, nice post, Ami.
I love you again gaf. All is forgiven.
Beermeister
Banned
I can hear Mark Cerny's soothing voice as I read his answers. <3
fallingdove
Member
God Sendou, you are on a mission. Robust meaning if you have shitty Internet, you aren't going to be able to do things like party stream, make use of the share button, download games and play them via Gaikai while they are downloading etc. geez, just drop it.
Rogue_Ledr
Banned
I am sorry but where are people getting this EA/M$ love fest from? I haven't heard anything about it except unsubstantiated rumors.
GAF threads are now providing enlightenment, no GAF gold required!
BruiserBear
Banned
You can try and suggest the policies are similar all you want, but that doesn't make it so.
I actually believe a large number of PS4 games won't require online checks.
it's not just because MS is, it's because there was a rumor stating that sony had a DRM plan similar to microsoft's
this is the one i remeber seeing right before the mass twitter outcry
http://kotaku.com/rumor-the-ps4-has-used-games-drm-509969406
they even made a follow up story shortly after about this outcry
It is highly amusing that Diablo III is only confirmed right now for the console that doesn't require the game to be online all the time.
Another reason why #PS4NoDRM is so great. These guys are gonna get grilled.
darkistheway
Member
I think it's clear that the publishers want DRM, even though it doesn't fucking work at all.
Microsoft has bowed down, and are implementing a scheme that allows them to profit from every transaction.
Sony is being more cautious. Sony has been down the DRM road before with their Walkman digital fiasco. They are probably not that interested but are 'listening' to the big publishers.
Microsoft has bowed down, and are implementing a scheme that allows them to profit from every transaction.
Sony is being more cautious. Sony has been down the DRM road before with their Walkman digital fiasco. They are probably not that interested but are 'listening' to the big publishers.
Rogue_Ledr
Banned
M$ bowed down? Ummmmm yeah I don't think so! M$ clearly want DRM too as it has found a way to cash in on it by ripping off gamers. Just like the way they cash in by ripping off gamers with paying for multiplayer.
well obviously it works because it would bring them more revenue. but the main problems are that it is anti-consumer and essentially a red herring for that their poor business decisions resulted in huge losses (not used games)
BRocknRolla
Member
Ok, I've got to admit, I see plenty of wiggle room here. Not for Sony, because it appears Sony is going to remain hands off, but that doesn't mean there won't be DRM on the PS4 through a publisher. Your suggestion that you never need an internet connection may be correct for everything Sony promises you, but a publisher could make their own game nonfunctional without an internet connection.
Some publishers may well require you to register your game online with a code through the PS4 or sign in through some type of online portal in order for you to play. That isn't Sony's mandate, but that doesn't mean it won't still happen through the publisher's desires. Short of Sony saying, "You can't use that system," publishers have free reign to do what they please. Presumably Sony won't do this kind of thing for first party games, but others like EA may well choose to take that approach.
Don't get me wrong, I think this is the right approach for a console maker; create the platform and don't get involved in locking people into additional agreements because it isn't your place. But DRM will likely still exist; it will just be publisher driven on Sony's platform.
Some publishers may well require you to register your game online with a code through the PS4 or sign in through some type of online portal in order for you to play. That isn't Sony's mandate, but that doesn't mean it won't still happen through the publisher's desires. Short of Sony saying, "You can't use that system," publishers have free reign to do what they please. Presumably Sony won't do this kind of thing for first party games, but others like EA may well choose to take that approach.
Don't get me wrong, I think this is the right approach for a console maker; create the platform and don't get involved in locking people into additional agreements because it isn't your place. But DRM will likely still exist; it will just be publisher driven on Sony's platform.
Squidofman
Member
Read those quotes again. Carefully. They're distancing Sony from an ALWAYS-ON connection. There's plenty of room there for a PS4 to require SOME sort of connection, even if only for setting it up.
darkistheway
Member
If you think EA and the others aren't pushing for this....
Look at the music industry, the consumers rejected DRM and the companies had to follow. Arguably, DRM is more entrenched in other industries but it is opposed.
Any increased revenue is hypothetical at this point; if the consumer base rejects the Xbone then DRM won't be worth shit all.
Neuromancer
Member
Welp looks like I'm getting a PS4 then, if MS decides to continue down the road of insanity. Thanks for putting everything together into one thread Amir0x.
Could be like old school PC drm before required internet.. lol
BRocknRolla
Member
This, people. This!
Sony seems to be stepping back out of the debate and firestorm by saying, "We're not getting involved," but that doesn't mean a publisher can't require you to sign in every time you want to play a game. They've had these connections going on current gen consoles for years, particularly on EA titles, and all EA would have to do is only make starting the game possible if you can login.
Sony's approach is still admirable, but I think we're dreaming if we think there won't be plenty of titles that have DRM regardless of what console you're on.
On the one hand, we shouldn't trust either MS or Sony, of course... But on the other, Sony's been damn clear about this topic. Sony's current policy is to not require Always Online DRM. Now that could change and they could use that RFID patent, but I sincerely doubt that Sony will implement system-level always online DRM for the mere fact that if they did it they know the first question that will come out of everyone's mouth is "How will you prevent something like the month-long PSN Outage from making our console into a brick?" Hell, Nintendo's still worried about epilepsy and still won't feature Porygon or its evolutions in the Pokemon anime after the whole Electric Soilder Porygon incident. People remember stuff like that.
Ploid 3.0
Member
They would be killing their chances in their own country. Japan won't accept all disk games being locked to a account.
Again (this is stated for the past few pages), the PS3 is capable of this and Sony give the developers the freedom to implement it in their own games. They rarely do it for PSN games (require you to be online to play Single Player games, capcom) and never do it for disk games outside of online pass. PS2 had a drm disk game, ps3 didn't as far as I know.
Xbox 1 might cause devs to get confident in trying to implement disk drm for PS4 but they will most likely go back to not having it when they realize they will be lowering their sales potential worldwide which is where Playstation is stronger.
touche, i was purely analyzing that in a hypothetical stance. i agree that DRM could decrease game sales, gaming popularity, etc blah blah. i realize there is a lot of other factors/effects of the policy that should be considered.
BRocknRolla
Member
I agree, it's bad business, and hopefully we'll see the tide turn on it. (Thought I doubt it, as once people start getting used to it, there's typically no hope of going back.) I hope you're right though that publishers will see the error in this, but I'd all but put money on the idea that at least for the first few years, games like Watch_Dogs and many EA titles will require you to sign onto the internet in order to play their games even on the PS4. It will all be publisher run, but it will still exist.