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[1-D_FTW]

If we want to really start a fire here, I want you to consider what's coming:

A tablet that easily hooks up to a PS3/360 controller and also to your television. That may not happen this year, or next, but it seems like an obvious and natural evolution of the tablet, and tablets are progressing at a torrid pace today similar to PCs in the 80s and 90s.

People are discussing phones eating in to handheld sales today, and I think we can all agree it's happening -- we just aren't sure of the extent yet. And yet, many people seem to think the danger ends there, and obviously consoles are safe and can't be similarly coopted; I would argue they are clearly not safe, and the dangers handheld systems are experiencing are just around the corner for consoles, too.

There's my fire spewing for the day.

That's not fire, that's inevitable. A couple more years, wireless HDMI, and consoles are even more irrelevant than dedicated handhelds. Which goes back to my point about Sony and Nintendo needing to merge their assets into a competing platform all the more valid. Right now the iOS is light years beyond anyone. People need to start chipping away now, not letting the lead get bigger and bigger. Because this is the foundation the tablet/consoles of the future will be built on too.

 

[BurntPork]

Hey, whatever happened to the "... will save 3DS!" blackboard?

 

[Zoramon089]

Very early build, but it looks impressive visually:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TGlA5uihtA

Android as well, with 360/PS3 controller support for a non-ass control scheme.

So you're stuck with crappy touch controls unless you want to carry around a controller as well? Also, if people were having trouble with using the stylus for DS shooters I don't see how this will be much easier for them...I'm hoping those same people who complained about that aren't praising this

 

[Deku]

Hey, whatever happened to the "... will save 3DS!" blackboard?

Nintendo had a good conference, we're not sure if 3DS is saved yet.

 

[Seraphinianus]

Because I want to be able to play Super Mario 3D Land on my lunch break...and FUCK having to carry around a TV and my Wii whenever I want to get my Mario fix.

you actually answered that seriously...lol

 

[guek]

That's not fire, that's inevitable. A couple more years, wireless HDMI, and consoles are even more irrelevant than dedicated handhelds. Which goes back to my point about Sony and Nintendo needing to merge their assets into a competing platform all the more valid. Right now the iOS is light years beyond anyone. People need to start chipping away now, not letting the lead get bigger and bigger. Because this is the foundation the tablet/consoles of the future will be built on too.

I think nintendo should just license android on the 3DS. Not as a full fledged OS but just to give it access to the android marketplace.

Course, that's almost definitely harder than it sounds and may in fact be impossible to do.

 

[Sipowicz]

Vita will sell like shit. Biggest franchise in japan is on another handheld now. 90% of the games are multiplatform or shit copies of PS3 games (because games from the worst selling console of the generation are worth ripping off). It'll be lucky to sell 40 million

I would have said 3DS was in a similar boat a month ago, but nintendo seem to have gotten wise to the rubbishness of the hardware and the software lineup is hundred of times better than the one on the vita. Depending on the redesign i can easily see it selling GBA or PSP levels, probably more.

Smarthphones will continue going strong, but be limited by their interface making games like NBA Jam and dead space on iphone unplayable shit

 

[AbsoluteZero]

you actually answered that seriously...lol

What, was I just supposed to let it go?

 

[kinggroin]

But it's just...if you have to carry around a controller the game isn't portable anymore.

If you have to use a controller at home...why not just on the goddamn console that controller is actually meant for?

So you admit, you didn't read.

First, it's optional. You can dock the thing, and play it like it was a laptop.

Or just go at it with touch screen only controls when on the go. The game will probably suck either ways, but at least folks have the option to control it better.

Second, I don't care for tablet/mobile gaming.

 

[Fantastical]

I'm a little confused. Before TGS I thought the main opinion was "woo Vita is doing everything right and has plenty of games and a good price point, etc."

Then suddenly not many new games get announced for Vita and apparently a handful of new games get announced for 3DS along with footage of previously announced games. Then the internet goes "Vita is too expensive, has no games! 3DS is doing everything right now."

Is this how fickle the internet can be? I'm not trying to be a fanboy about the situation, even though it looks like I'm favoring the Vita in my post, I'm just going off of what I've seen. To be completely transparent though I was planning on probably getting a Vita sometime and only getting a 3DS if it comes out with a must-play game for me.

It's the fact that the Vita is nearly a year behind the 3DS, I think. This holiday season is going to be big for the 3DS, especially in Japan, and 2012 looks pretty stacked for the 3DS. By the time Vita comes out 3DS will have a number of good titles (especially in Japan).

Plus GAF was riding a wave of extreme 3DS negativity while good news of the Vita was coming out. When the price at E3 2011 came out, a lot of people turned against the 3DS.

Any missteps and GAF won't let you forget it. The 3DS hype was almost unprecedented coming out of E3 2010. By launch it had slowed considerably and after launch GAF the 3DS launch games and price left a bad taste in many people's mouths.

 

[Gamecocks625]

While I'll never own another dedicated handheld gaming system again, you better believe I'd love some Mario and other Nintendo franchises on an iPad.

If not the traditional Mario platformers, at least some games that can work with a touch screen like Mario Party or Mario Golf.

 

[AbsoluteZero]

So you admit, you didn't read.

First, it's optional. You can dock the thing, and play it like it was a laptop.

Or just go at it with touch screen only controls when on the go. The game will probably suck either ways, but at least folks have the option to control it better.

Second, I don't care for tablet/mobile gaming.

Wait, what? I read every damn word of your post. I was just saying it'd be terrible either way, like you yourself are claiming.

 

[snap0212]

If we want to really start a fire here, I want you to consider what's likely coming around the bend:

A tablet that easily hooks up to a PS3/360 controller and also to your television. That may not happen this year, or next, but it seems like an obvious and natural evolution of the tablet, and tablets are progressing at a torrid pace today similar to PCs in the 80s and 90s.

People are discussing phones eating in to handheld sales today, and I think we can all agree it's happening -- we just aren't sure of the extent yet. And yet, many people seem to think the danger ends there, and obviously consoles are safe and can't be similarly coopted; I would argue they are clearly not safe, and the dangers handheld systems are experiencing are just around the corner for consoles, too. Why buy a console that only sits under your TV, when you can buy a tablet that you can use all day, then dock it at your TV in the evening to play games at home?

There's my fire spewing for the day.

Isn't it more likely that all of our content will be saved in some kind of cloud and that our TVs will be able to access that content via the internet without the need to hook up anything to it?

OnLive shows that it's possible and it seems like services like OnLive will be able to do even more in the future. I don't think out tablets in five years will be hooked up to anything. They'll just be there and everything else will be able to do what our tablet does now. I expect TVs with OnLive functionality. The next really big step won't be a new device I can connect to my TV, it will be my TV receiving data via the internet. We can already connect iPads to TVs, can't we?

 

[StuBurns]

Vita will sell like shit. Biggest franchise in japan is on another handheld now. 90% of the games are multiplatform or shit copies of PS3 games (because games from the worst selling console of the generation are worth ripping off). It'll be lucky to sell 40 million

Those are the same franchises that won the generation before.

Everytime I read 'they have Mario' or whatever, I wonder how short minded people are. They had Mario when Sony destroyed them two times over.

I have no idea what dictates which platform is going to win, but it is not Mario, or Gran Turismo, or Halo.

 

[AranhaHunter]

I'm a little confused. Before TGS I thought the main opinion was "woo Vita is doing everything right and has plenty of games and a good price point, etc."

Then suddenly not many new games get announced for Vita and apparently a handful of new games get announced for 3DS along with footage of previously announced games. Then the internet goes "Vita is too expensive, has no games! 3DS is doing everything right now."

Is this how fickle the internet can be? I'm not trying to be a fanboy about the situation, even though it looks like I'm favoring the Vita in my post, I'm just going off of what I've seen. To be completely transparent though I was planning on probably getting a Vita sometime and only getting a 3DS if it comes out with a must-play game for me.

What happened is the 3DS took the biggest PSP exclusive, arguably what made the PSP sell as much as it did in Japan, and took it exclusively shooting the Vita's kneecaps out. Sony, in return, announced a 10 year old port.

3DS then added a frankenstein add on that is ridiculous and further shoves a 12 inch dick up early adopter's assholes.

While I'll never own another dedicated handheld gaming system again, you better believe I'd love some Mario and other Nintendo franchises on an iPad.

If not the traditional Mario platformers, at least some games that can work with a touch screen like Mario Party or Mario Golf.

If (when) 3DS and Vita flop, you might get your wish in 5 years or so. I'm kind of hoping that the Bioshock Vita get an iOS port, really interested in how that game will turn out. I wouldn't mind RE:Revelations on the device either.

 

[LJ11]

Japan is clueless, pretty much sums up my feelings.

 

[walking fiend]

Those are the same franchises that won the generation before.

Everytime I read 'they have Mario' or whatever, I wonder how short minded people are. They had Mario when Sony destroyed them two times over.

I have no idea what dictates which platform is going to win, but it is not Mario, or Gran Turismo, or Halo.

2D Mario.

 

[LProtag]

Does everything really hinge on Monster Hunter? Truly it can't be that important to completely save one system and cripple another.

 

[StuBurns]

2D Mario.

I doubt it.

 

[kinggroin]

Does everything really hinge on Monster Hunter? Truly it can't be that important to completely save one system and cripple another.

Maybe not. But at least for one region, it can be the start of a very crippling generation.

 

[Josh7289]

Japan is clueless, pretty much sums up my feelings.

The portable game market is confusing in general at the moment. I don't think anyone can predict what's going to happen.

 

[SmokyDave]

Does everything really hinge on Monster Hunter? Truly it can't be that important to completely save one system and cripple another.

That's what I don't get. If the entire dedicated handheld industry rests on one game then that industry is fucked.

 

[AranhaHunter]

Does everything really hinge on Monster Hunter? Truly it can't be that important to completely save one system and cripple another.

In Japan? Yes and no. If Sony had gotten MH exclusively, it wouldn't kill the 3DS off as Nintendo still got 2D Mario, Pokemon, Mario Kart. Nintendo getting MH exclusively pretty much kills the Vita in Japan IMO. Sony got Gran Turismo (declining franchise, doesn't sell on handhelds) and Minna No Golf (not a huge system seller).

 

[StuBurns]

Maybe not. But at least for one region, it can be the start of a very crippling generation.

This is true. It'd be stupid to suggest the same thing couldn't happen again, a new franchise that's the biggest in the Japanese handheld market becoming PSV exclusive, but out of the gate it's certainly looking bad for Sony. But it was always going to be.

 

[EvilMario]

Monster Hunter only helps. The DS managed to succeed without a Monster Hunter in Japan, because there are other IPs that do sell systems (Pokemon, Dragon Quest, Mario). It's a significant win for the 3DS, but it doesn't decide the end game.

 

[Callibretto]

I'll stand by you Vita, to the death!

 

[Tiktaalik]

Honestly both the 3DS and Vita conferences have been massively underwhelming and the linesups for both these platforms is pretty garbage and very uninspiring. This is not good for the health of the games industry at all.

 

[Deku]

That's what I don't get. If the entire dedicated handheld industry rests on one game then that industry is fucked.

To be fair consoles often seem that way, the ecosystem effect is often not apparent, especially for superfans that don't care about shovelware.

The fact of the matter is, tons and tons of shovelware sell on gaming platforms.

I really think there is a place for dedicated games portable platforms, I think it's a fair question to ask how Nintendo can evolve to maintain their leadership as Sony has very clearly illustrated they aren't interested in that position at the moment.

Next few years will be fun. I still think we'll see a stand-alone Nintendo App store soon that will plug in to a variety of platforms starting with their own. That will be my Pachteresque prophecy.

 

[BurntPork]

Nintendo had a good conference, we're not sure if 3DS is saved yet.

Did I say it was?

It's saved in Japan, though. We know that.

 

[Zoramon089]

That's what I don't get. If the entire dedicated handheld industry rests on one game then that industry is fucked.

It's not, it's Sony handhelds in Japan that rest on it

 

[Auto_aim1]

Does everything really hinge on Monster Hunter? Truly it can't be that important to completely save one system and cripple another.

Well it worked for the PSP.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

Does everything really hinge on Monster Hunter? Truly it can't be that important to completely save one system and cripple another.

No, but it does pretty much dictate what will happen this holiday season and throughout 2012.
Basically Sony have cemented a stunted Vita launch, which is a shame following the success of the PSP in Japan

 

[StuBurns]

Honestly both the 3DS and Vita conferences have been massively underwhelming and the linesups for both these platforms is pretty garbage and very uninspiring. This is not good for the health of the games industry at all.

Well there is still a PSV conference to go, maybe it'll redeem it all...

Spoiler

lol

 

[GaussTek]

I guess it's ok if you people want to play while covering half the screen with your hands.

 

[radioheadrule83]

I think nintendo should just license android on the 3DS. Not as a full fledged OS but just to give it access to the android marketplace.

Course, that's almost definitely harder than it sounds and may in fact be impossible to do.

I was curious as to whether it would actually be possible. Its not going to happen, but it *is* possible. Current requirements for 2.3.3 (gingerbread) are...

• Screens must be at least 2.5" in size. Check.
• Density must be at least 100dpi. Check.
• The aspect ratio MUST be between 1.333 (4:3) and 1.779 (16:9). Check.
• The display technology used consists of square pixels. Check.
• Open GL ES 1.0+ support. That could be implemented.

Things android hardware should have - ie. they're not mandatory:
• 3 axis accelerometer. Check.
• 3 axis magnetometer (compass. Fail.
• GPS. Fail.
• Gryoscope. Check.

They can also have things like thermometers, barometers, near field communications equipment etc.

Android 2.3.3 (Gingerbread) requires 128MB of RAM - to be made available to the Kernel and Userspace... the 3DS has 128MB of RAM, but some of that is used by the 3DS operating system, effectively meaning there is only 96 left to play with. Nintendo would have to write their Android implementation into their own OS in order to be compliant with the RAM requirements -- or use a version earlier than Gingerbread.

It also requires 150MB of non-volatile storage (storage that doesn't require power to maintain). I don't think the internal memory is known, but according to the photo app you can store about 300 pictures without a memory card, so it maybe has between 150 and 200MB of internal memory. This is expandable with SD cards, which are non-volatile, and the latest Android implementations allow storage of Apps2SD etc.

USB is a must-have requirement for Android devices, if you don't include a USB port, you have to provide the means of making it use a USB cable. This would be a problem on the current 3DS model.

Source: http://static.googleusercontent.com...m/en//compatibility/2.3/android-2.3.3-cdd.pdf

 

[Ulairi]

My problem with iOS people is that they always point to a game with pretty graphics as an example that iOS gaming competes with the Vita and 3DS. Like the game listed above, it isn’t in the same category that we’ll see on the Vita or 3DS. It looks “ok” but I have an iPad 2 and none of the touch screen control joysticks aren’t very good and the games aren’t very deep. Infinity Blade isn’t deep. GameDev Story is shallow as hell which all goes to prove my point that the biggest proponents of iOS gaming view portable gaming as some disposal distraction. People don’t expect deep engaging games like Mario 3d, Monster Hunter, Uncharted, etc etc.

 

[Einbroch]

The only thing holding me back from a 3DS, and yes I am completely serious, is the lack of a username and achievement/trophy system.

 

[LightofRohan]

I'm sorry, but smartphones suck for games. I don't get why people think it's the end all be all. I love it for dumb time wasters - but it control's terribly. Is that the point? Just for dumb throwaway games?

 

[BurntPork]

I was curious as to whether it would actually be possible. Its not going to happen, but it *is* possible. Current requirements for 2.3.3 (gingerbread) are...

• Screens must be at least 2.5" in size. Check.
• Density must be at least 100dpi. Check.
• The aspect ratio MUST be between 1.333 (4:3) and 1.779 (16:9). Check.
• The display technology used consists of square pixels. Check.
• Open GL ES 1.0+ support. That could be implemented.

Things android hardware should have - ie. they're not mandatory:
• 3 axis accelerometer. Check.
• 3 axis magnetometer (compass. Fail.
• GPS. Fail.
• Gryoscope. Check.

They can also have things like thermometers, barometers, near field communications equipment etc.

Android 2.3.3 (Gingerbread) requires 128MB of RAM - to be made available to the Kernel and Userspace... the 3DS has 128MB of RAM, but some of that is used by the 3DS operating system, effectively meaning there is only 96 left to play with. Nintendo would have to write their Android implementation into their own OS in order to be compliant with the RAM requirements -- or use a version earlier than Gingerbread.

It also requires 150MB of non-volatile storage (storage that doesn't require power to maintain). I don't think the internal memory is known, but according to the photo app you can store about 300 pictures without a memory card, so it maybe has between 150 and 200MB of internal memory. This is expandable with SD cards, which are non-volatile, and the latest Android implementations allow storage of Apps2SD etc.

USB is a must-have requirement for Android devices, if you don't include a USB port, you have to provide the means of making it use a USB cable. This would be a problem on the current 3DS model.

Source: http://static.googleusercontent.com...m/en//compatibility/2.3/android-2.3.3-cdd.pdf

It has 2GB built-in.

 

[Ulairi]

I'm sorry, but smartphones suck for games. I don't get why people think it's the end all be all. I love it for dumb time wasters - but it control's terribly. Is that the point? Just for dumb throwaway games?

The games are cheap and people don't consider handheld gaming to be real. If I never cared about handheld gaming much, iPhone gaming would be amazing. For $2 I can get a game and spend a few minutes with it to a few hours, it's a great value. But, when I can play Dragon Quest IX on my DS I'm not going to settle for Quest on my iPhone.

 

[Kyoufu]

I don't get the negativity surrounding Vita on this forum atm. Yeah, I know it doesn't have a new MonHun announced...

But still, looks like an amazing piece of kit. One that will cost me a fortune to import

 

[Sky Chief]

If we want to really start a fire here, I want you to consider what's likely coming around the bend:

A tablet that easily hooks up to a PS3/360 controller and also to your television. That may not happen this year, or next, but it seems like an obvious and natural evolution of the tablet, and tablets are progressing at a torrid pace today similar to PCs in the 80s and 90s.

People are discussing phones eating in to handheld sales today, and I think we can all agree it's happening -- we just aren't sure of the extent yet. And yet, many people seem to think the danger ends there, and obviously consoles are safe and can't be similarly coopted; I would argue they are clearly not safe, and the dangers handheld systems are experiencing are just around the corner for consoles, too.

Why buy a console that only sits under your TV, when you can buy a tablet that you can use all day, then dock it at your TV in the evening to play games at home?
There's my fire spewing for the day.

The fact that the recently announced Sony tablets do not already allow you to connect a DS3 and play PSX games on your TV seems like a huge oversight to me.

 

[BurntPork]

I don't get the negativity surrounding Vita on this forum atm. Yeah, I know it doesn't have a new MonHun announced...

But still, looks like an amazing piece of kit. One that will cost me a fortune to import

You could, you know, wait 2-3 months. Seriously, we're adults here. We can wait for things.

 

[Fantastical]

You could, you know, wait 2-3 months. Seriously, we're adults here. We can wait for things.

Don't care how... I want it now.

 

[hatchx]

Honestly both the 3DS and Vita conferences have been massively underwhelming and the linesups for both these platforms is pretty garbage and very uninspiring. This is not good for the health of the games industry at all.

With Kid Icarus, Mario, Mario Kart, Luigi's Mansion, Mario Tennis, Fire Emblem, Resident Evil: Revelations, MGS3D (even though superior versions exist), Monster Hunter 3/4, Animal Crossing, Four Sword+ (for free), Kingdom Hearts 3D, FFtherythm, Tekken 3D, Ace Combat, Bravely Default, Smash Bros...

...I simply don't understand these sentiments. This is the best lineup on a Nintendo console ever, in my opinion.

 

[StuBurns]

I don't get the negativity surrounding Vita on this forum atm. Yeah, I know it doesn't have a new MonHun announced...

But still, looks like an amazing piece of kit. One that will cost me a fortune to import

It's the question of long term support. It's really not a question at all, it will get it, but a lot of people are pretty much living in the instant, reacting to any single piece of news as if it will change everything.

Nothing either of them have done this week has been the death note for either system.

 

[Amir0x]

3DS is never going to maintain the kind of upward trajectory the DS had because Nintendo is out of fresh ideas.

Vita is still going to be dominated by 3DS because it's $249.99 and the vast majority of consumers don't want to pay for a 249.99 gaming dedicated handheld which has lots of PS3 ports when they already have a 360 or a PS3. So it will fail and Nintendo will win by default since Sony still doesn't get it.

In the end, it's going to be a sort of middling handheld generation until the next set when the balance is finally struck with a $169.99 launch system with Vita's power and capabilities and the lame 3D thrown out. And, of course, Mario, Pokemon and Monster Hunter. So I guess Sony is still shit out of luck.

 

[guek]

I don't get the negativity surrounding Vita on this forum atm. Yeah, I know it doesn't have a new MonHun announced...

But still, looks like an amazing piece of kit. One that will cost me a fortune to import

I think in the end, whether people are upfront about it or not, price is what's really determining reception. It's got good games at launch and great games in the pipeline (presumably), but $250 is not cheap, especially when you're almost certainly going to have to tack on an extra $50 for a memory card.

If the thing cost $200, it'd be the handheld of the forever, but that'd ruin sony

 

[EvilMario]

I don't get the negativity surrounding Vita on this forum atm. Yeah, I know it doesn't have a new MonHun announced...

But still, looks like an amazing piece of kit. One that will cost me a fortune to import

Doom and gloom mostly because success in Japan at launch is so very unlikely, as the Vita releases pretty late in the season after every other console.. including MHT3G on the 3DS.. has their product out. Not to mention the price of the Vita over the 3DS is a gigantic point. Especially when you consider Sony is forcing consumers to buy into their new memory format for the Vita, and not including a small bundled card.

Vita's software lineup doesn't seem appeal to a Japanese market place as much as it might for North America, so maybe it'll find more success here. Personally, I feel the same way about most of the software on Vita. I don't care about it. But the hardware itself looks lovely.

 

[DjangoReinhardt]

There's precisely one game I want for Vita and one game for 3DS. I plan to wait until at least the first hardware revision for each.