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[Council Pop]

Can't really agree with any of this. The only truly bad element of the 3DS is the very flimsy Circle Pad, which actually broke for me (and not through strenuous play either), I got a free replacement from Nintendo.

My first 3DS was a N3DS XL which I bought on release. I thought £150 was an excellent price considering how many great games there are on the system. The 3D works really well and really adds something IMO. The OS is ANCIENT but I appreciate the fact that it's from early 2011. The EShop regularly has great sales, and the Virtual Console stuff is excellent. I don't find the console cramped, nor the older 3DS. The big problem I found with the original 3DS was the absolutely tiny screen.

I much prefer the 3DS to the DS tbh- I think it has better games, the touch screen is used in a more subtle way, and the overall aesthetic of the games is much better (the spindly text and sprites on DS games genuinely make me wanna vom, I accept that's a slightly OTT reaction though).

3DS is my favourite handheld since the Gameboy Color.

 

[old manatee]

The 2ds is fine for the price. I was shocked by the build quality on the 3ds xl, though.

 

[Kysen]

I've spent hundreds of hours playing Monster Hunter on a 3DS XL, and this is the thing that bothers me the most. A Vita will last a week in sleep mode, but it feels like a 3DS needs to be charged every single day.

It does, I have 2 of them. Both will die guaranteed without a daily charge. Its like Nintendo sourced the cheapest batteries they could find just like the WiiU gamepad.

 

[Anth0ny]

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

when it sells (wii), it's BIG money.

when it bombs (wii u), they don't get fucked toooooo badly (like sony with PS3, for instance)

 

[dan2026]

The gameboy advance was a great machine.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

I dunno but the games continue to be fucking incredible. *strokes 3DS*

 

[Starwolf_UK]

A few scattered thoughts:
The design team changing (or rather people at the top retiring) might play a part (though I'm still shocked at how they managed to fuck up clamshell design).

I think the OP could benefit from some examples of portable devices with good ergonomics as I fell that generally the two conditions contradict each other.

The last two points are the worst though. Premium price for shoddy quality. Part of me wonders if it is the technology gap being much smaller than it used to be or having to use more specialised components. Wasn't Game Boy basically early 80s technology in late 80s/early 90s?

It's always been odd how despite Nintendo's reputation for building TV consoles like tanks, handhelds have been going downhill. The SP already had issues with dust under the screen, and then the hinges problem with the ds.

I suppose that 2ds should be far more solid than the rest, given its design.

It's not just the handhelds though you had a few disc read errors on gamecubes (just open the thing up and twiddle the laser resistance a big), quite a bit more disc read errors on Wiis (probably wanting higher yield so some drives simply not being up to reading DVD-9) not to mention frying the GPU via pointless wiiconnect24 (let's have it always on with no fan; what could possibly go wrong) and gamecube memory cards being liable to corruption (something to do with that part of the wii getting very hot).

Maybe that is a bit of "back in my day..." as generally the more complicated the system the easier it can beak and many of them problems listed above are due to optical media.

And the 3DS bombed at first leading to Nintendo cutting its cost quite aggressively, being the fastest Nintendo has ever cut the price on a device. That brought its price down to $169.99. This was only 5 months after release.

Well technically speaking the N64 in the UK still has it beat (£100 less within 2 months; something the Xbox later went on to do) but $150 hardware being sold for £250 was really trying it on (the equivalent of $407 in March 1997) so it isn't a fair comparison really.

No charger included blew my mind when I realized it. What portable electronic device comes without charger?
3DS battery life is terrible. The vita lasts weeks in sleep mode and even if it runs out it still saves your state.
3DS barely lasts overnight and if you didn't save the joke's on you.
It's really jarring for someone who regularly uses both.
I constantly need to put them down at the drop of a hat and with the 3DS I always need to make sure I save before stopping at the risk of having it die on me.
If the game doesn't allow me to save at that point and I don't have my charger I'm probably screwed.

Just to jump on this point. Vita also has crap sleep mode life if you turn on all the wireless features.

In the past people have tested the 3DS. It was found that you can turn the wireless switch off for a big improvement in sleep mode life (the thing is constantly beaming out wireless signals looking for streetpasses etc). Not as big as it should be (it goes from like barely a day to nearly a week) probably due to some background processes like the all important pedometer and the play coins it gives...

 

[The_Lump]

Whilst I agree Nintendo Handhelds are usually very 'unergonomic', I don't agree that the competition is much better. I can't play anything on PSP or Vita for more than 20 mins without my hands cramping up either. Good ergonomics do not lend themselves to contemporary handheld consumer electronics. Modern Smartphones, for example, are absolutely terrible to hold but they look great. WiiU Gamepad on the other hand is about as butt ugly as you could ever make a handheld controller.....but it's comfortable to hold for extended periods for many people.

Bottom line for handhelds is; Comfy wouldn't sell.

My guess is Nintendo had a choice between making a fully fledged butt-ugly handheld that is really comfortable to hold and making a marginally better looking handheld that gives you carpal tunnel syndrome. They settled on the latter and made 3DS (ie the worst of both worlds).

Sony on the other hand went all in on looks, and to my mind made an even less comfortable handheld than 3DS.

 

[KojiKnight]

So... What does OP consider an ergonomic handheld? I think the form factor on handhelds honestly keeps any from being ergonomic while still being truly portable.

 

[muteki]

People buy it anyway.

If it were important to the public at large the Vita would have done better.

 

[phanphare]

I don't know, the regular New 3DS is pretty awesome, the 2DS is pretty awesome, the various DS updates were pretty awesome (DSi, DS Lite, DSi XL), the GBA micro was pretty awesome, the GBA SP was pretty awesome, the OG GBA was pretty awesome.

for your first point I've owned a 3DS XL and it was incredibly uncomfortable to play games that use the shoulder buttons. the regular was much more comfortable for me. I also have pretty big hands which is weird because you'd figure the XL model would be better but ::shrugs::

I only had battery issues with my OG 3DS. my New 3DS has been really solid, though I don't use the 3D much.

I love the buttons on pretty much every 3DS. never had a problem with the circle pad, the face buttons are nice. the only thing that bugged me was the placement of the dpad on my 3DS XL. for the OG and New I've got no complaints.

never had any build quality issues for the 3DS line. in fact the New 3DS that I got might be the best built Nintendo handheld that I've used since at least the GBA era.

price point is fine, from the 2DS to the OG to the New line the prices are all reasonable

basically get yourself a vanilla New 3DS OP, the XL model was always junk

 

[SliceSabre]

I figure the hardware was poor because they felt like they could get away with it.

But the fact that the 3DS can actually damage its own screen by simply closing it was/is absolutely absurd and unforgivable. The fact that Nintendo denied it constantly was even worse.

It didn't realize how bad the 3DS screen/resolution was until I got a Vita. Afterward it made it hard to go from playing a game on the Vita and then back to a 3DS when their screens are so starkly different than each other.

 

[GinoFelino]

Bad OP. You can't use stuff wrong with the original 3DS as an argument that it's 'still' terrible.

Besides, my Nokia 3310 has better battery life than my Galaxy S7. Doesn't mean my S7 is terrible.

It's the Nintendo UX that's terrible

 

[mr_chun]

For me, the weakest element of the 3DS is the screen resolution / pixel density.

In a time (even 2011) where small, high resolution screens are produced in the kajillions, it makes no sense to have such a terrible screen on a handheld game system. But the plan for autostereoscopic forced them to compromise, and voila.

I really don't have a problem with the system otherwise, and I still logged hundreds of hours into some of the games despite the fact that they looked kinda poo.

 

[GifGafIsTheBestGaf]

it wouldnt be bad if they included the charger in the outrageous price tag

still i wanted to play Dragon Ball so bad i caved in

 

[BDGAME]

The first DS had a good ergometry. But people don't buy it. So Nintendo made it worse to hold, but beaut and looking more like a smartphone. After that it sells like a hot cake.

About the power, it helps. For example, with the money need to make one PSP game, a company can made several DS games.

What happens next is 3DS trying to imitate the DS, but don't truly understand why that machine make success.

 

[LordRaptor]

The WiiU gamepad is very ergonomic, and people fucking hate it on sight as fisher price babbys first tablet

 

[atbigelow]

I'm honestly hoping the NX has a shared library so I don't have to use their handheld hardware anymore. I'm tired of bad ergonomics cramping my hands. The last and only comfortable handheld Nintendo made was the original GBA.

 

[10k]

1) People are still buying it
2) It has a good variety of software
3) Developers are still making games for it
4) It's relatively cheap and doesn't require expensive proprietary memory

 

[Malakai]

For me, the weakest element of the 3DS is the screen resolution / pixel density.

In a time (even 2011) where small, high resolution screens are produced in the kajillions, it makes no sense to have such a terrible screen on a handheld game system. But the plan for autostereoscopic forced them to compromise, and voila.

I really don't have a problem with the system otherwise, and I still logged hundreds of hours into some of the games despite the fact that they looked kinda poo.

Not remotely true for phones with in the retail price range of the 3DS when it was released. Heck most phones on the market (I'm not talking about the $500 and plus phones that everybody loves to compare the original 3DS to for some reason) had less resolution/pixel density especially when the 3D effect is taken into account.

 

[Gattsu25]

Nintendo has been doing handhelds since the advent of portable gaming, yet their hardware is still cheaply made, unergonomic and overpriced. Each new revision they introduce, while improving certain things, still has glaring issues.
Reading up on the Best way to play DS games? thread made me realize just how bad the situation for the n3DS/3DS actually is.

Some context: I have been playing Monster Hunter Generations on my n3DS XL the past couple days and can't stop beeing annoyed at how terrible the n3DS hardware is:

1. The handheld is an unergonomic mess that I personally can't use without a third party grip. Without grip I can play for about 10 minutes before my hands/fingers start cramping up.

1. Picking up a grip is the single best upgrade anyone can do on a 3DS family handheld. I found Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate hard to get into just due to the ergonomics but recently picked up this grip (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00UJ9LB6Y/?tag=neogaf0e-20) and I can actually play the game (and Generations!) for an entire mission now without my hand feeling like someone took a bloody hammer to it.

 

[GinoFelino]

Picking up a grip is the single best upgrade anyone can do on a 3DS family handheld. I found Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate hard to get into just due to the ergonomics but recently picked up this grip (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00UJ9LB6Y/?tag=neogaf0e-20) and I can actually play the game (and Generations!) for an entire mission now without my hand feeling like someone took a bloody hammer to it.

After looking at that, my eyes feel like someone took a hammer to them. But noted, I'll look into it. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Macka]

I can't disagree with many of the listed points, but none have been issues for me. I haven't had any serious quality issues, battery life has always been enough to get me through my commutes, and my above-average sized man hands have never cramped up while playing any handheld, let alone my n3DS XL.

If the next handheld is region locked though...ugh. I bought a launch 3DS while in America, and it's been a nightmare. Did you know that some games can't be played in local multiplayer with systems from different regions? I couldn't play MARIO KART 7 locally with my friends back home, among other games.

For a handheld device, that's a complete joke.

 

[Gattsu25]

After looking at that, my eyes feel like someone took a hammer to them. But noted, I'll look into it. Thanks for the advice.

Yeah, I've never seen a grip for a handheld system that looked good. They're all terrible looking down to the very last one.

They make a huge difference is usability, however.

 

[MightyKAC]

Nintendo doesn't change because Nintendo doesn't HAVE to change.

As long as it has a diehard fan base that will support it's hardware and business decisions it will continue along the same path it always has.

Now this may not exactly be a good strategy to draw in new customer growth for the future given what it's competing against for the average gaming dollar, unless it sees a significant loss in revenue and customer base, Nintendo will have no real reason to stop being Nintendo.

 

[Peltz]

While OP's complaints are legitimate, none of that stuff has prevented me from enjoying the stellar library of software on 3DS. People have never cared about the quality of handheld hardware for games in my humble opinion.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

the 3DS is basically the worst gaming hardware I have ever owned. its fucking awful.

I still play it regularly enough because I there are games I want to play, but there is always a grudge with the hardware in my mind while I'm using it.

At this point the most obnoxious thing is when I'm lying down the screen always tilts forward at me, I end up having to keep my pointer fingers on the side of the screen to keep it in position. Add in the general lack of comfort, horrible screens, horrible speakers, and bad circle pad and its just terrible hardware.

Bravely Second is a lot of fun though

 

[Griss]

I've been playing fire emblem fates for the past month and it really does bug me how shit the screen is. I'd like more battery life and a better industrial design, too. The DS Lite was their last beautiful handheld.

But they get away with all of it for me because the games are there. After you get into a game the hardware tends to fade away and all that's left is the game in your nind, so to speak.

 

[GinoFelino]

Yeah, I've never seen a grip for a handheld system that looked good. They're all terrible looking down to the very last one.

They make a huge difference is usability, however.

That's absolutely true. But why the shit would the grip need to flank the screen like a pair of shitty rubber batwings?

 

[Bolivar687]

Nintendo is style over substance.

 

[Peltz]

Nintendo is style over substance.

In hardware, perhaps. But definitely not in software.

 

[Gilby]

I really wish Nintendo would realize that the DS' success had nothing to do with the second screen and finally get rid of that in their next machine. I think thy finally learned that lesson with the wiiU, but only time will tell...

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

It's because Nintendo can get away with it as long as the good games keep coming and they know it. Also, profit.

 

[Dingens]

The battery life is abysmal for a portable device. Even in sleep mode it guzzles battery.

because it's designed for street pass and will constantly look for other people to connect to. If you want true sleep mode, turn of wifi and your standby-time will quadruple

[...]
Of course, but I can't help to feel that for example Sony put a lot more thought into the Vita hardware design than Nintendo did for the different 3DS revisions. Now don't misunderstand me, the Vita has quite a few problems of its own but overall it is a much more well designed handheld in terms of ergonomics and build quality. And it is beeing sold at a similar pricepoint.

the vita is a typical sony "design". just take the most impressive numbers and throw them at a wall and see what sticks. That's why the vita has a plethora of features that are just there because they look good on paper. A dedicated gaming device that isn't even strong enough to power it's own screen at native resolution is far from what I would call good design. Their is absolutely no balance to all the components.

As said before, usability (having to use quite a bit of pressure) feels odd when everything else just requires a touch. Especially when there are on-screen buttons which need to be pressed with your fingers. [...]

you can also just turn around your finger and tap with your fingernail... no force needed at all.

 

[phanphare]

I really wish Nintendo would realize that the DS' success had nothing to do with the second screen

well that's a silly thing to say

maybe you meant the 3DS? the second screen had essentially nothing to do with its success but the second screen was integral to the DS' success, as evidenced by the software responsible for its success.

 

[Dreamwriter]

In a time (even 2011) where small, high resolution screens are produced in the kajillions, it makes no sense to have such a terrible screen on a handheld game system. But the plan for autostereoscopic forced them to compromise, and voila.

Actually, that's not true. Every other device that came out with Sharp's auto-stereoscopic screens at the time of the 3DS launch had double the 3DS resolution, 400x480 in 3D. For some crazy reason Nintendo chose to have a special one made for them that was half resolution.

 

[LewieP]

Actually, that's not true. Every other device that came out with Sharp's auto-stereoscopic screens at the time of the 3DS launch had double the 3DS resolution, 400x480 in 3D. For some crazy reason Nintendo chose to have a special one made for them that was half resolution.

The decision for the screen did not occur in a vacuum. It had to be balanced against rendering capability of the hardware, battery life, and cost.

They could have switched it out for a higher resolution screen, but if they didn't change anything else, the battery life would have been (even more) terrible and games would be far less detailed.

 

[Dreamwriter]

As long as it has a diehard fan base that will support it's hardware and business decisions it will continue along the same path it always has.

The "diehard fan base" is a myth, and 3DS is proof of that. In its first year the 3DS flopped hard - it was a disaster for Nintendo. If this mythical fan base existed, that wouldn't have happened. Even after Nintendo dropped the 3DS price, system sales were still in the dump. Sales didn't pick up until the 3DS started getting great AAA games like Mario Kart and Mario 3D Land.

 

[mr_chun]

Not remotely true for phones with in the retail price range of the 3DS when it was released. Heck most phones on the market (I'm not talking about the $500 and plus phones that everybody loves to compare the original 3DS to for some reason) had less resolution/pixel density especially when the 3D effect is taken into account.

My point was that the 3D screen itself was a waste in terms of price to resolution. To our eyes, that 3D panel is nothing more than a 400x240 display, a resolution well behind even second tier smartphones of the same time period.

If they hadn't pursued 3D, we'd either have ended up with a cheaper system or a higher resolution screen.

Actually, that's not true. Every other device that came out with Sharp's auto-stereoscopic screens at the time of the 3DS launch had double the 3DS resolution, 400x480 in 3D. For some crazy reason Nintendo chose to have a special one made for them that was half resolution.

I wonder why? Parity with the touch screen? That's interesting, though. I wonder what kind of deal they had with Sharp. Still couldn't see it being cheaper than a higher resolution normal screen.

 

[Malakai]

Actually, that's not true. Every other device that came out with Sharp's auto-stereoscopic screens at the time of the 3DS launch had double the 3DS resolution, 400x480 in 3D. For some crazy reason Nintendo chose to have a special one made for them that was half resolution.

Was there any tech that could have had drove games at that resolution when considering that the Vita games don't even run at its native resolution? Heck the Xbox 360 and PS3 didn't even run games at 1080p most of the time and initially they had very high power consumption.

 

[Shiggy]

you can also just turn around your finger and tap with your fingernail... no force needed at all.

Not really, that's a feature of capacitive touch screens. And unless you have magical hands, I wonder how you can twist your thumb that way while holding the 3DS with both your hands (for all other games there's the stylus).

 

[Malakai]

My point was that the 3D screen itself was a waste in terms of price to resolution. To our eyes, that 3D panel is nothing more than a 400x240 display, a resolution well behind even second tier smartphones of the same time period.

If they hadn't pursued 3D, we'd either have ended up with a cheaper system or a higher resolution screen.

If Nintendo went with a 360p screen no 3D effect people would still be complaining that it is crap. Never mind there wasn't any tech was remotely close to being available to drive games any higher resolution.

 

[DrROBschiz]

My big beef with 3ds is the loss of resources to run the 3d effect

Is such a weak machine anyways but now you have this low res screen rendered twice

Its even more an issue now since certain games are hitting the limits of the system thats fucking old as balls now

 

[Dr. Worm]

I love my OG 3DS to bits, but it's hard for me to want to use it in 2016 when it wasn't even that great back in 2011.

The sooner Nintendo pushes out a successor, the better.

 

[Dreamwriter]

The decision for the screen did not occur in a vacuum. It had to be balanced against rendering capability of the hardware, battery life, and cost.

They could have switched it out for a higher resolution screen, but if they didn't change anything else, the battery life would have been (even more) terrible and games would be far less detailed.

Resolution wouldn't have directly affected battery life, higher resolution screens only make a noticeable difference in electricity needs if they have to do something special to reach the high resolution. For example, iPad 3 was the "Retina display" iPad, its screen resolution quadrupled over iPad 2, battery life stayed the same. Yes, they used a battery that was almost twice as powerful, but that's because the CPU/GPU were twice as powerful.

For rendering ability, sure it would have used a bit more power (not double, pixel fill rate isn't the only thing GPUs do), but 400x480 isn't that much even with stereoscopic rendering. If Nintendo had designed 3DS with that in mind, they could easily have clocked the GPU a little faster, doubled its video ram, and made the device slightly larger so it could hold a bigger battery (they probably should have done that anyway). Sure it would have been more pricey to manufacture, but Nintendo showed us they had plenty of room to play with, when they dropped the price by $80 in the first year.

 

[Dreamwriter]

Was there any tech that could have had drove games at that resolution when considering that the Vita games don't even run at its native resolution? Heck the Xbox 360 and PS3 didn't even run games at 1080p most of the time and initially they had very high power consumption.

Vita had almost 3 times the pixels as a theoretical 400x480 3DS screen, and its GPU was also doing quite a lot more things than 3DS' GPU, so it had reasons for its performance issues. But also, many great Vita games run at native resolution, it's the developers that really want to push console-quality graphics that end up having to make sacrifices. Rayman, for example, runs at native resolution on Vita, and looks gorgeous. 3DS isn't designed for console-quality graphics, it wasn't marketed as a portable console, so wouldn't have that problem.

 

[Shig]

My big beef with 3ds is the loss of resources to run the 3d effect

Is such a weak machine anyways but now you have this low res screen rendered twice

Its even more an issue now since certain games are hitting the limits of the system thats fucking old as balls now

Int. scene: Man shows up at a 5-year-old's birthday party.
MAN: Yo kid, you're fucking old as balls now!

 

[KatamariOnTheRocks]

All Nintendo hardware since the wii has been terrible.

People want Nintendo games and happen to be willing to put up with Nintendo Hardware.

Nintendo would be seeing Pokemon GO levels of success with all of their IP if they were just willing to make them available to people, but Nintendo hates making games that are guaranteed to sell well so they do everything in their power to avoid it.

 

[Hatty]

I'm fine with the hardware
What I'm not fine with is how we've gone through two iterations and they still haven't solved the screen scratching problem

 

[MacTag]

One thing I will say the 3DS screen is great for is retrogames. Low res, really bright and XL models even boast natural "scanlines". It makes me wish the 3DS VC was as diverse and well supported as Wii VC was, but even with the way things are now 3DS makes a fantastic homebrew machine for most stuff from the 1980s and early 1990s.