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[Subtervotion]

Am a christian and i believe in God, do you see me saying "Thank Buddha?" the same can be said about you, you say you don't believe in anything but on more than one occasion am willing to bet that you have said "Thank God" and if you try to downplay it as a common thing to say then you will be playing back to the point i made earlier in the thread that "It's a built in tendency for us to believe in something, there is nothing like believing in nothing".




It's your belief, you tell me. Am not the one that believes in the Big Bang, if you say that there is evidence then provide the dam evidence. At this point is you that's being lazy not me.



I guess you haven't been reading the thread at all.

Have you ever said 'cat got your tongue?' Or anything that wasn't literally true, but was just a phrase? OF COURSE YOU HAVE.

 

[CornBurrito]

Guys our math clearly doesn't work in space! I won't believe it works until that math gets us to the fucking moon.

Ayayayai, if you do not believe in God then why "Thank God". If i didn't believe that you went to china but i went and told somebody that you went to china am i not contradicting myself. I don't care if it's a popular saying if you truly don't believe in anything there is no reason for you to utter such an expression. Is that so hard to understand, you are contradicting yourself.

Certain things become almost automatic. Like the Canadian "eh."

Are you really this dense?

When I say "thank god" I am not literally saying "thank god." In our culture those two words when used together in certain contexts have the meaning "I'm glad this outcome has occurred."

Meanwhile "jesus" in many contexts simply is a short word used to express exasperation.

 

[Orayn]

another question how come Scientists use the same mathematical equation that was created by man to measure outer space, is space supposed to conform to our equations. How do we know that our equations are the rightful equation for measuring outer space. An example if a flew a paper plane in a non windy condition and i flew another in a windy condition does the same rule apply to both of them? will they act the same way

Jut had to re-post it since many people were ignoring it.

You just argued in the wrong direction, my friend. A lot of scientists' favorite equations work marvelously well in distant, isolated regions of space because because it takes a lot of Earth-clutter out of the equation. Extremely low pressure an temperature, not very much interference, and a reference frame that's as close to non-inertial as you could hope for.

Putting that aside for a moment, scientists account for things. If altering a particular set of circumstances gets you a result that you didn't predict initially, it means your model needs work. We have been doing this for a very, very long time.

 

[ChoklitReign]

You might call me an agnostic theist. I don't believe in a personal god in the Christian sense (is that enough to make me an atheist?) but I definitely feel that there is a higher power omnipresent in the universe that is responsible for the ultimate cause and we feel it in all of ourselves as our personal self. I'm surprised how much I agree with Eastern religions, but I'm not sure which one is the best fit for me.

 

[GTP_Daverytimes]

I read it the first time, it a pretty weak argument. Of course the same rules don't apply. You have two completely different situations. You have to account for wind.

Why does math have to be different on other planets?

Because the rules out there does not apply down here, you answered it yourself.

 

[Subtervotion]

Ayayayai, if you do not believe in God then why "Thank God". If i didn't believe that you went to china but i went and told somebody that you went to china am i not contradicting myself. I don't care if it's a popular saying if you truly don't believe in anything there is no reason for you to utter such an expression. Is that so hard to understand, you are contradicting yourself.


Edit: I gotta say this is one man against a million, it's fun but note that i can't reply to all of you because i have a life outside of Gaf.

Only if you ACTUALLY believe it. You could say it as a joke.

 

[Kapura]

You might call me an agnostic theist. I don't believe in a personal god in the Christian sense (is that enough to make me an atheist?) but I definitely feel that there is a higher power omnipresent in the universe that is responsible for the ultimate cause and we feel it in all of ourselves as our personal self. I'm surprised how much I agree with Eastern religions, but I'm not sure which one is the best fit for me.

You shouldn't be forced to conform to a religion. Theistic religion is, at its core, a personal relationship with God. Figure out what that means to you, and then go from there.

 

[Orayn]

Edit: I gotta say this is one man against a million, it's fun but note that i can't reply to all of you because i have a life outside of Gaf.

Argumentum ad "Screw you guys, I'm going home!"

 

[Subtervotion]

Because the rules out there does not apply down here, you answered it yourself.

The fuck? The first statement is about the paper airplanes. The last statement is about math and space.

 

[GTP_Daverytimes]

Only if you ACTUALLY believe it. You could say it as a joke.

So he does "BELIEVE" that there is a higher power.

 

[CornBurrito]

Because the rules out there does not apply down here, you answered it yourself.

Do you believe the moon landing is a hoax?

 

[Dr. Malik]

How many times does it need to be said.

GOD DID IT

there I bolded it and everything the whole nine yards

/fixed

From reading all his post, I think thats the only answer he will take

 

[CriginsMcJuggs]

Ayayayai, if you do not believe in God then why "Thank God". If i didn't believe that you went to china but i went and told somebody that you went to china am i not contradicting myself. I don't care if it's a popular saying if you truly don't believe in anything there is no reason for you to utter such an expression. Is that so hard to understand, you are contradicting yourself.


Edit: I gotta say this is one man against a million, it's fun but note that i can't reply to all of you because i have a life outside of Gaf.

You still havent responded to the eating shit example.

The china shit you keep trying to pull makes no sense in this context, what does you randomly telling people Ive been to china have to do with common English phrases?

I'm not thanking god when I say "Thank God" I grew up with people all around me saying that when something fortuitous happened. Therefore it became part of my speech.



This is pissing me off. Do NOT respond to this unless you answer the "this tastes like shit" example.

 

[Kapura]

Because the rules out there does not apply down here, you answered it yourself.

Congratulations. Interplanetary mechanics work differently then terrestrial equations. This proves God is real and all atheists are going to hell. REPENT Y'ALL!

 

[Orayn]

The fuck? The first statement is about the paper airplanes. The last statement is about math and space.

Our atheistic math-planes are no match for GTP_Daverytimes' mighty space-god!

So he does "BELIEVE" that there is a higher power.

No, he's aware that people revere God/Buddha/whatever, so he's using the name to get a point across and be funny and/or insulting.

 

[Monocle]

While I agree with the sentiment here, I try not to say it this way because of the shock value.

However, in my time lurking, I've read many threads similar to this one, and you've been on the money very consistently in all of them.

Glad you think so.

While I agree my example is extreme, I think it's a realistic sample of the anarchy you'd expect to see in a society caught in a true moral vacuum. If nothing else, it drags forth the ugly insinuations that cling at the spine of the moral argument for theistic belief. When people say, "You can't be good without God," they're not telling you, "If God didn't exist we'd all be a little naughtier." Rather, that assertion positions the deity as the absolute gate between the temporal world and a shoreless ocean of hellish depravity. We are dealing with people to whom apocalyptic visions aren't scary thought experiments but plausible scenarios, if not literal prophecies.

It is not for any believer to tell me that I'd be a feral monster without a celestial overseer. I live my life with the assumption that there is no god, and I've acted on that assumption: By treating others as I hope for them to treat me, or as they wish to be treated. By doing my best to live as a decent citizen in a society that affords me fabulous privileges, like clean water to drink and the right to free speech. By trying to leave things a bit nicer than the way I found them. My behavior is no occasion for mystery; it's what you'd expect of anyone who values the fruits of civilization.

 

[Subtervotion]

So he does "BELIEVE" that there is a higher power.

Dude, you really love twisting my words.

It would only be contradictory IF he actually believed it.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

Nope. Never met him or heard from him. Did hear from a lot of people that worked for organisations tell me that I should though.

I'm also kind of skeptical of people that say they believe in god. especially successful men. Often it's just a way to do good business (especially in the US)

 

[that1dude24]

Ayayayai, if you do not believe in God then why "Thank God". If i didn't believe that you went to china but i went and told somebody that you went to china am i not contradicting myself. I don't care if it's a popular saying if you truly don't believe in anything there is no reason for you to utter such an expression. Is that so hard to understand, you are contradicting yourself.

Ever heard of "a slip of the tongue"? It's a phrase embedded in popular culture, it's likely to have been uttered and repeated hundreds of thousands of times through the course of ones lifetime, it's at the forefront of the mind and it's easily understood.

Edit: I gotta say this is one man against a million, it's fun but note that i can't reply to all of you because i have a life outside of Gaf.

You've spent just as much time as the others in this thread, it seems; you're just picking the arguments you can actually respond to.

 

[Atramental]

Hare Krishna Hare Krishna
Krishna Krishna Hare Hare
Hare Rama Hare Rama
Rama Rama Hare Hare

Now by GTP_Daverytimes's logic Krishna exists.

OM. ॐ

 

[DarthWoo]

I guess there must be a divine piece of detritus out there considering how many people use a certain exclamation on a daily basis.

Edit: I've figured it out!

GTP_Daverytimes=

 

[CornBurrito]

Suddenly I think linguistics should be taught in schools as part of the basic curriculum.

 

[NullPointer]

You might call me an agnostic theist. I don't believe in a personal god in the Christian sense (is that enough to make me an atheist?) but I definitely feel that there is a higher power omnipresent in the universe that is responsible for the ultimate cause and we feel it in all of ourselves as our personal self. I'm surprised how much I agree with Eastern religions, but I'm not sure which one is the best fit for me.

This is pretty much where I'm at as well. I believe, but can't prove in any way, that the universe is intelligent. That consciousness is all around us, and there are "smarts" behind some of the smallest processes in life and in the biggest of big picture phenomenon.

To go a bit further, I'm actually interested to see where the ideas behind intelligent design develop, once religious bias has been removed from the equation. I know just saying that is probably going to get me mocked by many here, but one of my interests right now is whether cells can be described as having some form of intelligence.

You shouldn't be forced to conform to a religion. Theistic religion is, at its core, a personal relationship with God. Figure out what that means to you, and then go from there.

The problem here is that the world's big religions are not just ideas, techniques and teachings to get you in touch with something greater than yourself, they are also products of their time, communal and political in nature. I think if one approaches religious tradition from the perspective of ancient politics you can gain all kinds of insights.

 

[Orayn]

Hare Krishna Hare Krishna
Krishna Krishna Hare Hare
Hare Rama Hare Rama
Rama Rama Hare Hare

Now by GTP_Daverytimes's logic Krishna exists.

OM. ॐ

Oh yeah? Well I'm gonna start my own religion, with root beer, and video games...
You know what? Forget the religion!

 

[Monocle]

Guys our math clearly doesn't work in space! I won't believe it works until that math gets us to the fucking moon.

Why we still got cell phones?

 

[Sharp]

Congratulations. Interplanetary mechanics work differently then terrestrial equations. This proves God is real and all atheists are going to hell. REPENT Y'ALL!

What's weird is, they really don't.

Also to answer the guy who was wondering if he thinks the Moon Landing is a hoax: he doesn't know whether it was a hoax, that's his point, scientists can't be trusted and he didn't see it so he doesn't know if it happened.

 

[Sibylus]

Agnostic atheist, formerly fundamentalist Christian. The branch in question was evangelistic, creationist, endorsed speaking in tongues and other "gifts of the spirit", all that good stuff. Exhausted justification for upholding the belief and as a result gave it up.

Am a christian and i believe in God, do you see me saying "Thank Buddha?" the same can be said about you, you say you don't believe in anything but on more than one occasion am willing to bet that you have said "Thank God" and if you try to downplay it as a common thing to say then you will be playing back to the point i made earlier in the thread that "It's a built in tendency for us to believe in something, there is nothing like believing in nothing".

Have you known someone to say something like "By Jove"?

Secret God of the British Isles!

 

[teh_pwn]

Terrestrial and planetary equations work the same. It's subatomic physics that's different. Top people are working on figuring out how to unify physics.

 

[Pixel Pete]

Ayayayai, if you do not believe in God then why "Thank God". If i didn't believe that you went to china but i went and told somebody that you went to china am i not contradicting myself. I don't care if it's a popular saying if you truly don't believe in anything there is no reason for you to utter such an expression. Is that so hard to understand, you are contradicting yourself.

I want to point out its a turn of phrase but I'm afraid you'll then ask me how one actually turns a phrase.

 

[Subtervotion]

Why we still got cell phones?

Wouldreadagain/10.

 

[wolfmat]

It's your belief, you tell me. Am not the one that believes in the Big Bang, if you say that there is evidence then provide the dam evidence. At this point is you that's being lazy not me.

To be honest, I think that stuff's a little over your head, mate. No offense meant.

 

[NullPointer]

I want to point out its a turn of phrase but I'm afraid you'll then ask me how one actually turns a phrase.

C'mon, give him the full nine yards.

Spoiler

I still have no idea what that even means.

 

[Atramental]

Suddenly I think linguistics should be taught in schools as part of the basic curriculum.

GTP_Daverytimes's first language is probably not English but if it is... be cool. stay in school.

 

[GTP_Daverytimes]

People, am beat. I have a lecture tomorrow and it's already 12:00 midnight here (Florida) so i am going to say abayo to everyone and this discussion will be continued tomorrow afternoon. Thanks for those who contributed. Although i would like more outside sources to contribute, the last few pages has been me against 7 to 9 people arguing over the same point. If you have to copy and paste the Big Bang theory explanation please do so (As i have done so before on a different subject) Since this is a thread that is dedicated to topics such as this i will welcome it if you posted the information in this thread.

Edit: and the last post's has been those same people simply poking fun at me

 

[CriginsMcJuggs]

C'mon, give him the full nine yards.

Spoiler

I still have no idea what that even means.

I can't be sure, but I think it means you believe in god

 

[Orayn]

I want to point out its a turn of phrase but I'm afraid you'll then ask me how one actually turns a phrase.

You'll turn the phrases he says you're turning, Grenth-dammit! We are but puppets on invisible strings, dancing to a tune only GTP_Daverytimes can hear.

To be honest, I think that stuff's a little over your head, mate. No offense meant.

To him, this is us admitting defeat.

EDIT: I'm swearing in new pantheons. Grenth is from Guild Wars.

 

[Lance Bone Path]

Ayayayai, if you do not believe in God then why "Thank God". If i didn't believe that you went to china but i went and told somebody that you went to china am i not contradicting myself. I don't care if it's a popular saying if you truly don't believe in anything there is no reason for you to utter such an expression. Is that so hard to understand, you are contradicting yourself.

Holy cow is all I can say.

 

[CornBurrito]

People, am beat. I have a lecture tomorrow and it's already 12:00 midnight here (Florida) so i am going to say abayo to everyone and this discussion will be continued tomorrow afternoon. Thanks for those who contributed. Although i would like more outside sources to contribute, the last few pages has been me against 7 to 9 people arguing over the same point. If you have to copy and paste the Big Bang theory explanation please do so (As i have done so before on a different subject) Since this is a thread that is dedicated to topics such as this i will welcome it if you posted the information in this thread.

Edit: and the last post's has been those same people simply poking fun at me

Why do we need to do that? Why can't you just click the links people have provided you with?

And no, the few last posts have been pointing out how uninformed your arguments have been.

I think you realize that the entire indepth description of the Big Bang, evidence and all, cannot fit in a single post, and would basically take up an entire forum page. So you basically won't click links to force people to spam your thread with pages worth of info about the Big Bang.

 

[wolfmat]

Holy cow is all I can say.

Wait what he says when you type "Holy shit".

 

[Monocle]

Holy cow is all I can say.

Well, well, well...looks to me like we've got ourselves a Hindu!

 

[GTP_Daverytimes]

Holy cow is all I can say.

Fuck is a popular saying yet there are people out there that avoid saying it because of their moral standing, why? Should they start uttering the word Fuck and forget about their moral standing just because its a popular saying? anyways the longer i stay here the more drowsy i get. i need some sleep i have been up since 5 in the morning.

 

[Orayn]

Edit: and the last post's has been those same people simply poking fun at me

People are complaining about your grammar and punctuation because they actively interfere with our attempts to understand your arguments. Nothing personal.

 

[Subtervotion]

People, am beat. I have a lecture tomorrow and it's already 12:00 midnight here (Florida) so i am going to say abayo to everyone and this discussion will be continued tomorrow afternoon. Thanks for those who contributed. Although i would like more outside sources to contribute, the last few pages has been me against 7 to 9 people arguing over the same point. If you have to copy and paste the Big Bang theory explanation please do so (As i have done so before on a different subject) Since this is a thread that is dedicated to topics such as this i will welcome it if you posted the information in this thread.

Edit: and the last post's has been those same people simply poking fun at me

You can't click the links provided and read about it? What your take on evolution?

Also, sometimes I say 'Thank Xenu' just for fun.

 

[TaeOH]

On your first point about random chance, I think it's an unjustified assumption to presume that if you're an Atheist you must believe it's random chance that we're here in our current capacity having this conversation. I know I'm not qualified to carry informed opinions about the ultimate randomness or purposefulness of any and all things - including us. I suspect you are also not qualified.

We may not be qualified, but we can trust others who are. Although to be honest I find the whole evolution v. creation debate to be a bore. Because I don't think I can understand either fully and I hate being confused.

On the other two points I believe you're actually wrong - and I'll appeal to fields of biology and philosophy respectively (regarding the 'cannot be explained' claim). And I have to pose to you - because I think this is a serious problem - how does postulating a God get you anywhere near explaining this? Aren't you just heaping on top of the problem an even bigger problem that requires even further explanation?

I am seriously not looking into the matter of the origin of life. And I am a believer, so if God's word says God created everything in seven days, I am ok with that answer as that is not my calling in life, to prove creation. Although I admit I find young earth creationists arguments fascinating because I appreciate the dedication.

Another false assumption on your part in a straw man form. I do not believe that "life just popped into being randomly and without cause." And I don't see how postulating a God gets you any closer to explaining the ultimate "why". Because I can just as easily ask "Why God?" or "How God". So now you have to explain everything I do, plus a supernatural deity as well.

My wording reflects my interest in the Kalam Cosmological argument, I think it is a strong logical argument for the existence of God.

"Whatever begins to exist has a cause.
The universe began to exist.
Therefore, the universe has a cause.
This cause is the God of Classical Theism, and is a personal being, because He chose to create the universe."

But ultimately you cannot even approach "why" without a creator. So I would like to know what your cause was as an atheist if you are not a naturalist.

Same problem. These are ultimately false dichotomies you're presenting to me - the assumption that Theism/God is necessary for 'good thing X'. Or at least that Atheism is necessarily devoid of it. I think you need to justify that implied claim.

I don't even see how we could define "good" or "evil" without some objective moral code. I don't see how that comes about naturally.

If you would allow me to ask you a question, I'd appreciate it. What if it is that case that the God of Abraham and resurrected man from Galilee is NOT the god you believe in, but just an additional entry in the long list of proposed Gods throughout history? My real question: what method would you use to go about determining this? It's the 'how'. How do you determine which god is/was the correct one, if any?

I don't know if I can completely answer this because I am not sure I fully understand the question as worded. But I will try.

If the Christian God is not the one true God, then I guess I am not going to hell no matter what I do. At my end, I will have lived a life hopefully worthy of other Gods. At least I hope so as I want God to be good, although if He is not there is not a damn thing I can do about it. Ultimately though, I have lived a life considering others more important than myself, hopefully humble, forgiving and generous. And that I have made others lives around me better for knowing me. I can see no other thing in life as worthy.

As for the second part, well I am still trying to determine the truth of it all. I am trying to do it in a way the does not compromise my rationality, or reason for I cannot blindly follow anything. I always ask why. So while I was brought up as a Christian, I am questioning everything I have come to believe these days.

Seriously, thanks for sharing your thoughts on this.

That is cool. I avoid these threads mostly, but they are so one-sided on GAF that I feel the need to speak up now and then. But I seriously have no desire to prove that God exists to anyone other than myself. I have doubts, but one thing I have learned in last year or so is that you cannot actually have faith without doubt, otherwise it would not be faith at all.

 

[Monocle]

Fuck is a popular saying yet there are people out there that avoid saying it because of their moral standing, why? Should they start uttering the word Fuck and forget about their moral standing just because its a popular saying? anyways the longer i stay here the more drowsy i get. i need some sleep i have been up since 5 in the morning.

How does saying the word "fuck" compromise one's moral standing?

 

[CornBurrito]

Fuck is a popular saying yet there are people out there that avoid saying it because of their moral standing, why? Should they start uttering the word Fuck and forget about their moral standing just because its a popular saying? anyways the longer i stay here the more drowsy i get. i need some sleep i have been up since 5 in the morning.

Fuck is considered offensive, and saying it can have negative consequences, especially during the early years of life. It is easy to refrain from it for those reasons.

"Thank god" is non-offensive, and everyone says it.

You can't click the links provided and read about it? What your take on evolution?

Also, sometimes I say 'Thank Xenu' just for fun.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=28793327&postcount=414

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=28799817&postcount=490

 

[Atramental]

Holy cow is all I can say.

And by GTP_Daverytimes's logic you believe that cows are holy.

OM. ॐ

 

[GTP_Daverytimes]

People are complaining about your grammar and punctuation because they actively interfere with our attempts to understand your arguments. Nothing personal.

Am sorry for that, am African and am not fully fluent with English (Although i have aced every English course i have ever taking. Yes am bragging lol). Typing fast is usually the cause.

 

[Qwomo]

Am a christian and i believe in God, do you see me saying "Thank Buddha?" the same can be said about you, you say you don't believe in anything but on more than one occasion am willing to bet that you have said "Thank God" and if you try to downplay it as a common thing to say then you will be playing back to the point i made earlier in the thread that "It's a built in tendency for us to believe in something, there is nothing like believing in nothing".

I laughed so hard my sides hurt.

 

[Subtervotion]

By GTP logic, if i say 'Thank Xenu' it means i believe in Xenu just because I said it.

Spoiler

Not because irony isn't lost on me.