-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Call Of Duty: Black Ops |Sep 1st Reveal|
- Thread starter sweetvar26
- Start date
Net_Wrecker
Member
Blutonium said:
Seriously. The more kills you need for the killstreak reward, the more the campers camp. Lower killstreak rewards are way better, especially since killstreaks don't build up more killstreaks. Getting 11 kills by your actual work isn't as easy as getting 14 kills with the Chopper Gunner/AC-130 for a Nuke.
Stoney Mason
Banned
lame. no one answered my question about the ammo types 
Otherwise though I'm pretty happy. Devoured most of the info yesterday and liked what I saw. I like MW 2 a lot but I like changes between the versions of COD and there seems to be a good number of changes here.
Most of the core changes to the game seem to be conservative. Like none of the new perks are essentially "new" which is slightly disappointing but the new game types seem pretty dope. I've always hated free for all matches in the COD series but now suddenly I want to play all those wager match types.
The theater mode thing I've always wanted. I think I'm more excited for that than anything. I like some of the minor balance change things I've seen so far.
I didn't care much for WaW mp but I like how the complete dedication towards black ops for them as a studio has translated into a lot of good stuff.
Otherwise though I'm pretty happy. Devoured most of the info yesterday and liked what I saw. I like MW 2 a lot but I like changes between the versions of COD and there seems to be a good number of changes here.
Most of the core changes to the game seem to be conservative. Like none of the new perks are essentially "new" which is slightly disappointing but the new game types seem pretty dope. I've always hated free for all matches in the COD series but now suddenly I want to play all those wager match types.
The theater mode thing I've always wanted. I think I'm more excited for that than anything. I like some of the minor balance change things I've seen so far.
I didn't care much for WaW mp but I like how the complete dedication towards black ops for them as a studio has translated into a lot of good stuff.
You know, I used to really agree with you, then I bought Bad Company 2. It doesn't even have any killstreak rewards whatsoever, but people camp harder in it than they do in any CoD!Net_Wrecker said:
I think zam's right; a camper is a camper in any game or situation. They don't know how to get kills any other way, and kills are the only thing that counts for the kids nowadays. If you win the match by capping everything by yourself but with a 8-15 KD, you're a terrible player according to popular opinion, so they do what they have to do to and they don't do it for the killstreaks per se. That's just the bonus.
Net_Wrecker
Member
aku:jiki said:
But I don't care about a camper in Bad Company 2 because he will always lose without a good team around him. Camping, in MW2 especially, seems to be rewarded with how you can just hide in a corner after a Harrier and potentially end the game if you rack up enough kills without ever having to fire your gun again. Having the Killstreaks max out at 11, removing the Nuke, and having them not build other streaks means that EVENTUALLY, that camper is going to run out of options and be forced to move.
Yeah the RC looks like an awesome anti-camper weaponBlutonium said:Luckily we've got RC cars to drive up their asses
Maybe you should start playing with a better crew?ZZMitch said:
I would love it if that were the case, but I fear that realistically the campers will keep camping once they max out their streak (or just end the streak by suicide or running out and then camp for a new streak), the kids don't care about winning, just about getting lots of kills/high kdr. As aku:jiki said, in objective games barely anyone cares about winning, just getting tons of wins. If we win a game of demolition but have lower kdr than people on the team that lost, the losers on the other team yell out how we suck and that we are losers, they just play objective games cause they can potentially rack up more kills than in TDM cause the time-limit is longer and there is no kill-limit..Net_Wrecker said:
Net_Wrecker
Member
zam said:
Well yeah, a camper is a camper is a camper. People camped in CoD4 long after their Chopper was gone, and that was only a 7 Killstreak. At least Black Ops looks to be going away from REWARDING these people because MW2 was at an all time high with the amount of ridiculous things people were doing to stay alive for the Chopper Gunner/AC130 -> Nuke combo.
And again, the RC Car and Dogs will be getting up in people's asses come November. That should help matters.
divisionbyzorro
Member
zam said:
My crew does the same, but the community in general sure doesn't! I don't think aku needs to worry about the community abusing anti-air killstreaks. :lol
MarkMclovin
Member
aku:jiki said:
When you play with a shogun, you don't run around as you would with a M16. You put yourself in a position where you won't be firing across a length that reduces the impact of the 1 kill shot. i.e indoors/defending flags etc.
The shotgun doesn't suck at all, as long as you're using it in the environment it fits in.
MarkMclovin
Member
aku:jiki said:
You'll find that they are the lowest scoring players too.
Campers in BC2 are so easy get back at due to the reveal of the players after the kill. Is he still there? Great, I'll sneak up and knife him. Or maybe I'll just find a spot and snipe him as well. It always works, unless the player moves after each kill - playing the sniper role as it should, meaning less camping.
Playing on Hardcore is another story, but still.....
Mr. B Natural
Member
Net_Wrecker said:
Exactly.
What most people call camping in COD is sometimes just protecting key spots in the map. It's strategic especially when you actually have a team that you play with all the time that knows their "role" in the team-strategy. It, by itself, is a reward. I don't really need to go 21 and 2 for "camping" the 3rd floor in Crash. I can got 8 and 2. I'm ok with that.
And as much as I like having an amazing KDR and tons of kills, getting a free kill or two with the RC car is plenty incentive enough to try to get 3 kills in a row. I don't need to hide and chain to get an air strike, then a harrier along with it for incentive to kill and not be killed.
iNvid02
Member
Tomcat said:
no, i think that is the only problem with the killstreaks, 3 is too low for an almost
guaranteed kill, you get unlimited time so its basically guaranteed like a predator
missile i guess. should be 5, i think 5 would be perfect for it.
as for everything else, i think its great. no more camping for massive streaks.
there will of course always be camping, but this should reduce it.
THEN again, the RC should be brilliant against boosters who will just cheat anyway
to improve their stats, and the dogs should fuck them over too.
TheApatheticOne
Member
Camping - an issue as old as time. I agree that there's a difference with holding down an area and keeping a two ft. by two ft. area warm. I understand camping, but dont understand the popularity. Its SOOOO boring. Even if I get PISSED and go "fine, ILL CAMP!", I dont even get to 5 seconds before I get so bored im on the move again.
Reading more once I got home from work yesterday and watching more videos, I absolutely cant wait for this. Love the changes so far.
Reading more once I got home from work yesterday and watching more videos, I absolutely cant wait for this. Love the changes so far.
Stoney Mason
Banned
Mr. B Natural said:
This.
My role play style in any COD no matter what the game is pretty much the same. The longer distance the weapon I'm using. The less I move. I generally try to hold down areas. When I die and respawn I go around to the next area nearest to where I respawn. If I get too many kills in any area I generally try to move to the next area simply because its obvious that people will be flooding that area soon due to the killcam. Often people will accuse you of camping if you don't run around like a madman just like they are. Holding down a good area of the map is smart play whether somebody wants to call that camping or not. This will always be the case no matter what the game.
Not to say that there isn't true camping but I do tire a bit of everybody talking about campers. Especially in a Team Deathmatch context.
For what its worth I "camped" even more in COD 4 simply because you got two claymores default without having to use OMA so you could seal off more entrances.
Oh, I'm sure you're totally right about them being at the bottom of the scoreboard, but that wasn't really my point... I was just saying that people will camp for the sake of camping, not specifically for killstreaks.MarkMclovin said:
Sorry man, but if you spend your matches on Crash on top of the three-story, you're a camper, not a "strategical defender." I mean, what do you think camping is, if not "protecting key spots (or high traffic areas)"? That's exactly what it is!Mr. B Natural said:
It's another thing to do it next to an objective, but no game mode has an objective on top of the three-story on Crash so...
divisionbyzorro
Member
aku:jiki said:It's another thing to do it next to an objective, but no game mode has an objective on top of the three-story on Crash so...
No, but there is a bomb site on the second story. Keeping people out of the building is generally a good idea.
aku:jiki said:Sorry man, but if you spend your matches on Crash on top of the three-story, you're a camper, not a "strategical defender." I mean, what do you think camping is, if not "protecting key spots (or high traffic areas)"? That's exactly what it is!
It's another thing to do it next to an objective, but no game mode has an objective on top of the three-story on Crash so...
I respectfully disagree.
Camping in my book is sitting in a dark corner, where it doesn't make sense and taking guys off when they pass by...
Sitting on top of the 3 story building is getting a tactical advantage... no camping.
Lionheart1827
Member
Stoney Mason said:lame. no one answered my question about the ammo types
What was your question?(Can't find the question)
On the subject of camping, no sympathy for the true campers that crouch in a single corner with an HBS, but I do make it my mission to humiliate them for being a pussy. I once had a C4 class and this one guy on skidrow kept going back to the same spot, and it was a TERRIBLE spot right next to an open window. I swear, everytime I tossed a C4 in, I'd kill him. Must have gotten at least 10 C4 kills alone on this wiener. He just had no clue.. He raged after that match and called me a modder. Good job loser, stop camping the same spot. :lol
Btw, did they confirm tac insertion?
divisionbyzorro
Member
Lionheart1827 said:
Yep.
Here's hoping there's some sort of anti-cheat mechanic to go along with it.
buy teh haloz
Banned
Lionheart1827 said:
Yeah, it's still in.
Stoney Mason
Banned
aku:jiki said:Sorry man, but if you spend your matches on Crash on top of the three-story, you're a camper, not a "strategical defender." I mean, what do you think camping is, if not "protecting key spots (or high traffic areas)"? That's exactly what it is!
It's another thing to do it next to an objective, but no game mode has an objective on top of the three-story on Crash so...
In a team death match context where killing is the objective then a three story building that gives overview of both sides of the map, then the person or team who hold thats building is the smart team.
You make not like the particular design of that map in that you think there should be more ways to attack that building. Which is a reasonable complaint. But holding that building is smart in nearly every playlist on that map. If that's camping then camp me up.
The argument should be more about level design or weapons to attack an area in that case if there is an argument to be had.
Stoney Mason
Banned
Lionheart1827 said:
Earlier they mentioned different ammo type and gave an example of Dragon's Breath ammo. Are there other ammo types and which weapons can use them and what is there effect is essentially what I've been trying to find out.
It may be a campaign only thing but it sounded earlier like something that was in the MP so I'm not sure.
Lionheart1827
Member
divisionbyzorro said:
Fuck.
Well I guess in worst case scenario, at least well have some more booster justice videos from sandy ravage.
Lionheart1827
Member
Stoney Mason said:
Ohh. I have no idea, that's actually the first time I heard about it-shows how much I've been paying attention.:lol
Outdoor Miner
Member
Another area where I hope Black Ops improves tenfold over MW2 is in its spawns. I haven't played too many FPS, but from what I have I gather MW2 has the most fucked up spawns in the genre. You can be running along and the game will literally spawn an enemy behind you essentially handing them a free kill. That and some maps weren't even properly utilized like in Sub-Base where past the initial spawns half the map goes unused.
Camping used to refer to guarding power weapons in games, or waiting outside spawn points and slaughtering people with power weapons as they come out. Now people just use it to complain whenever they lose.
If you're dumb enough to get killed by someone who doesn't change locations in COD it's your own fault.
If you're dumb enough to get killed by someone who doesn't change locations in COD it's your own fault.
electroshockwave
Member
So is there any info on the theatre mode on PS3? Does it have video editing capabilities, can you upload directly to youtube or at least save it to the XMB so you can upload it from there?
And are tactical respawns actually back? Because they never seemed to get much use outside of boosters. Even with lower killstreak rewards I think people will still use them to boost, I once saw a pair of boosters in Demolition on Scrapyard FFS.
Should have F5'd before I posted.
And are tactical respawns actually back? Because they never seemed to get much use outside of boosters. Even with lower killstreak rewards I think people will still use them to boost, I once saw a pair of boosters in Demolition on Scrapyard FFS.
divisionbyzorro said:
Should have F5'd before I posted.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Zabka said:
Spawn camping happens all the time in MW2 (specifically in Demolition and Domination), and is recognized as a legitimate tactic. I really hope BO does something about it.
MarkMclovin
Member
So is Gaf's hate for Treyarch diminishing now or have they just left the thread?
Never understood the hate either, if I'm honest.
Never understood the hate either, if I'm honest.
Zabka said:
Very often it's not just one person camping. I can't count the times I've watched a killcam, and the player not even moves, and just pull the trigger whenever he sees somebody run up a flight of stairs he's looking down on. Then when you respawn (usually 3 feet away because the respawning f***ing sucks) and you want to flank the bastard, another akimbo shotgun camper in the corner, completely oblivious to you, kills you.
I'm not a sore loser, and I know the difference between defending a strategic point and flat out camping. The latter being done very often, just for the killstreaks.
MrCompletely
Member
MarkMclovin said:
I never understood the hate for Treyarch either. World at War is awesome, and better than MW2 in many ways.
Brian Fellows
Pete Carroll Owns Me
Blutonium said:
I've got about 4000 matches in now and I have to say shit like this is extremely rare in my experience.
MW2's spawn system is pretty terrible, but your example just sounds like you need to be more careful about blindly running up staircases. People covering each other is just good teamwork.Blutonium said:
Yeah the spawn camping in those games can be rough, but most complaints about camping are just impotent whining due to losing. I generally stuck to TDM in MW2 so it wasn't a huge issue to me.
Stoney Mason
Banned
MarkMclovin said:
GAF is GAF which means they can safely be ignored as a mass collective on just about everything. I've never been much of a fan of Treyarch. I've never especially liked their prior output outside of COD. I hated COD 3. I thought WaW was an improvement in most respects but I also didn't especially care for it or find it very fun. Someone else is free to have a different opinion on those subjects of course.
I'm very much into Black Ops. I like a lot of what they have shown. It seems like they have taken a big step. And if the game turns out to be fun to play and I put a lot of time into it, then I will look forward to their next product. But that doesn't mean the prior reasons I didn't like their output suddenly disappear and history gets rewritten because I may like their current output. That's the way it works for any dev. "Gaf hate" or "Gaf love" is generally irrelevant to whether I end up liking or not liking a game. If anything having the entire company focused on one product seems to have done good things for them. If that's what it took for them to put out something I'm excited about then good for them.
Brian Fellows
Pete Carroll Owns Me
itsgreen said:
Activision will probably sue you for that.
Play objective games like Domination or Demolition, no more enemies spawning 5 ft away ever again (unless you are in their spawn, or if your team was stupid and capped all 3 flags on domination for no good reason).Outdoor Miner said:
I haven't touched TDM or FFA in months cause the spawns are way better in most objective games.
Lagspike_exe
Member
MarkMclovin said:
It's not really a hate, it's just pointing out that they're a team devoted to fixing IW's games, not making new ones.
Yeah, that's not really how it works. Considering the perspective issue in CoD (he can see all of you but you can only see a few pixels of his forehead), the available kits (noobtubes say hello) and so on, it's not as easy as that.Zabka said:
Can we skip arguments from people who played MW2 for like 3 weeks back in november yet still think they're absolute experts on the subject? Oh wait, no we can't, this is GAF...
Bumblebeetuna
Member
Zabka said:
Agreed for the most part, especially in MW2. It's a lot harder to kill a good camper in MW and WaW, but there's really not much of an excuse in MW2. There are so many ways to get into virtually every area that people love to camp. A far cry from the corridor choke point flow of maps in the other two games.
Tomcat said:
From what I've seen, it appears to have the same explosive power/radius as C4. I wouldn't compare it to the Pred Missile as others have, chiefly because with the RC Car you have quite a few disadvantages:
~ You can control it forever sure, but the chances that someone won't find you eventually are pretty far fetched, considering how much ground on the maps is covered by both teams over a short period of time. So, if you choose to wait for a rainy day to actually blow the thing up, it's likely someone will have already knifed you or simply seen the car and blown it up themselves.
~ It can only move across flat terrain. What I mean by that is it can't jump or climb walls. It can't fly through holes in the ceiling or windows. It can go up stairs, but oh well.
~ Yet to be proven, but I'm more than willing to bet it can set of off Claymores.
~ I've also yet to see this, but I wouldn't be surprised if the thing only took one or two shots from any weapon to be destroyed.
I guess at the end of the day, the Pred Missile is invincible, whereas the RC car looks like it has at least a couple weaknesses. It certainly doesn't do as much damage or have as large of a radius as the Pred Missile.
Of course we all know there will be a million of those things driving around on day 1. Which I can definitely see as getting annoying, I actually think if they nudged it up to a four Kill-Streak I'd be a lot more comfortable with it.