Crossing Eden
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Charles Randall on why game developers aren't more candid with public
- Thread starter Messofanego
- Start date
Whenever toxicity comes up about "gamers" I wonder how much fault lies with the publishers of this industries. Did any publisher condemn the actions of Gamergate? How long did Nintendo think about firing that woman that was bullied by Gamergaters because she was responsible for the missing boob slider in XCX according to them? To me it always feels like these people feel enabled by the lack of response from bigger publishers. I might be totally wrong though.
On the other hand there can be no culture of sharing production developed if no one is starting it. I know it must be hard to do this if there are a fair bunch of shitheads online harassing, insulting and knowing it better. Maybe this could be changed but there will always be idiots.
It's a shame that we rarely get insights because some assholes ruin the fun for everyone.
On the other hand there can be no culture of sharing production developed if no one is starting it. I know it must be hard to do this if there are a fair bunch of shitheads online harassing, insulting and knowing it better. Maybe this could be changed but there will always be idiots.
It's a shame that we rarely get insights because some assholes ruin the fun for everyone.
That's a big loss for everybody. I love to hear devs talk about their development experiences and adventures.
Jesus, that's messed up. How is that even a thing?
I kind of understand what he means.
Like children who have limited funds and have to stick to one console. At some point they try to to convince themselves, that what they don't have is pure garbage, just to make them feel they did the right decision when choosing the platform.
I also see that mentality when it comes to fighting games. It's not enough for their own game to be successful, others need to fail. Especially the top dog hogging the spotlight.
With Capcoms failing on SFV it has become even more apparent than ever before.
Not even mentioning other franchises, it even happens within the franchise itself. The latter happens probably, because of the big changes between new iterations. This might also fit other franchises like Final Fantasy.
In terms of movies. It's a difficult comparison, because a) they are less expensive and b) you spend less time on them.
Games, especially multiplayer games, are more like playgrounds.
Jesus, that's messed up. How is that even a thing?
I kind of understand what he means.
Like children who have limited funds and have to stick to one console. At some point they try to to convince themselves, that what they don't have is pure garbage, just to make them feel they did the right decision when choosing the platform.
I also see that mentality when it comes to fighting games. It's not enough for their own game to be successful, others need to fail. Especially the top dog hogging the spotlight.
With Capcoms failing on SFV it has become even more apparent than ever before.
Not even mentioning other franchises, it even happens within the franchise itself. The latter happens probably, because of the big changes between new iterations. This might also fit other franchises like Final Fantasy.
In terms of movies. It's a difficult comparison, because a) they are less expensive and b) you spend less time on them.
Games, especially multiplayer games, are more like playgrounds.
Of you want to understand how little onli e communities know about an industry they arent directly involved with, look up any comment section or thread on an article about an industry you are apart of. Seriously people dont known shit and arent willing to put in the effort to actually learn about an industry via industry talks/seminars. Easiest example os gaf doesnt talk at all about gamasutra or GDC talks, only whatever dumb little new blurbs that a developers spends 3 seconds to mention in a 1 hour talk.
While pretty much every medium can be toxic - from literature to music to film and art - I do find the gaming medium to be particularly virulent, or at least to utilize internet and social channels far more readily and far more aggresively that with most other mediums.
Not sure why but there does seem to be less interest in the "why" behind games creation. For all the toxic reactions other mediums can generate there's a decent interest in music production, film production, artistic technique, etc. that seems to balance it out better.
While there's clearly a similar demographic in gaming it feels - may just be perception vs reality of course - that it's smaller in ratio and often gets drowned out by hyperbolic overreaction and ranting.
While say with films "piling on" to a creative team feels fairly rare - BvS feels like a recent (and even arguably somewhat warranted) example - in gaming it feels like it happens much more regularly.
Shame as I love the production process for games as I do with film and while - thankfully - there is a fair amount of info available if you go looking it does feel it's a little more curated in terms of how its released and through what channels. GAF thankfully often points the way to good presentations and intel releases from developers at least IMO anyway.
Not sure why but there does seem to be less interest in the "why" behind games creation. For all the toxic reactions other mediums can generate there's a decent interest in music production, film production, artistic technique, etc. that seems to balance it out better.
While there's clearly a similar demographic in gaming it feels - may just be perception vs reality of course - that it's smaller in ratio and often gets drowned out by hyperbolic overreaction and ranting.
While say with films "piling on" to a creative team feels fairly rare - BvS feels like a recent (and even arguably somewhat warranted) example - in gaming it feels like it happens much more regularly.
Shame as I love the production process for games as I do with film and while - thankfully - there is a fair amount of info available if you go looking it does feel it's a little more curated in terms of how its released and through what channels. GAF thankfully often points the way to good presentations and intel releases from developers at least IMO anyway.
I'm absolutely not denying that there's plenty of elitism around the games you mentioned. But I've also seen people taking offense when someone describes games like Hots and Overwatch "casual". Being more casual game or even let's say "noob friendly" isn't inherently a bad thing. Hots is definitely deliberately designed to be less complex, more forgiving, less about invidual skill than Dota 2. And these are all valid reasons to prefer Hots over Dota 2. It's not always someone trying to disparage you, unless it's done in a way you phrased ofc. There should be no stigma in preferring the more relaxed variation of the game over the "hardcore" one. This is one aspect where gaming community needs to grow up. Just like people here were arguing against easier difficulty setting to the next Ori game, luckily the devs were already working on it.
Edit: I think this thread is related to the discussion too, Rime Creative Director: "Reading Neogaf made me cry for two days".
I was looking around to see if I can find a more newbie-friendly thing but it's hard to find stuff that avoids jargon.
This was an article I found interesting: https://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/Mar...th_Unity_in_creating_an_arcade_style_game.php
It's true that the guy had a lot of complaints about Unity, and to be honest despite not being very experienced with game dev I can sympathize with his complaints about the inability to customize things in Unity (a friend of mine was complaining about Unity shaders at some point). That said, he said he would still use Unity because the time it takes to get something out to production was really important to him. He would be willing to tradeoff these pains or quirks later in the process for ease of development earlier. Thinking about the tradeoffs people are making helps me try to understand why people make decisions, even if it's just something like familiarity.
In the end, to me it's about finding articles like this and learning about people's friction points with engines versus what they like. I've seen a lot of articles of indie devs talk about unity's simplicity and how the asset store is better.
I wonder how much of gaming's toxicity owes itself to "games journalism", which got it start in corporate propaganda (Nintendo Power), before evolving into fanboy-reporters sucking the corporate teat for their daily livelihood, while hoping for an all-too-frequent promotion into becoming an employee for the people they just flatteringly reported on. With reporters who step out of line, like Jim Sterling, being blacklisted by companies like Konami or sued by Digital Homicide, or Jeff Gerstmann being fired from a major games journalism site because his literal bought-by-the-publisher positive review didn't sound positive enough coming out of Gerstmann's lips.
Which isn't to say that constant negativity is right, but the relationship between developers and fans has never been normal.
RoninChaos
Member
Deeke[VRZ];249949779 said:
There's a difference between talking about why design decisions are made and inserting a pretty universally hated "hook" designed to milk the consumer. Especially when you have companies who have changed gameplay loops to incentivize paying money to get the game to actually function properly, such as candy crush, where you can't even finish some levels until you pay money. If WB removed loot boxes then people would actually talk about the gameplay and gameplay systems rather than what gameplay and gameplay systems the loot boxes are effecting.
You need to calm the fuck down and seek help
fabricated backlash
Member
The ghosts I called, I can't get rid of now.
The AAA industry has for over a decade cultivated a fanatical and one track minded fanbase, pampered them and fired them up constantly... Putting fans on pedestals, delineating fandoms and creating the hardcore gamer lifestyle as opposed to the filthy casuals...
Forgive me if I won't shed a tear now that they reap the fruits of all that labour.
They poisoned the well themselves and now complain about toxic responses... go figure.
The AAA industry has for over a decade cultivated a fanatical and one track minded fanbase, pampered them and fired them up constantly... Putting fans on pedestals, delineating fandoms and creating the hardcore gamer lifestyle as opposed to the filthy casuals...
Forgive me if I won't shed a tear now that they reap the fruits of all that labour.
They poisoned the well themselves and now complain about toxic responses... go figure.
Shifty1897
Member
I mean, he's not wrong. I wish I had more to say about the topic but... he's totally right.
Hrm.
Hrm.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
There was an article about this a few years ago actually (Eurogamer?). Dumbing down technical jargon makes the audience think that implementing new features is a minor thing. Explaining why your new lighting system, AI routines, or multiplayer modes run the way they do goes a long way to dispelling the "lazy dev" shitpost.
Yeah. I step into the GAF threads on this stuff, but don't tend to be in the places it happens.
The worst I tend to see is console wars, mostly pro- and anti-Nintendo stuff because of where I haunt. And that's incredibly tame and localized compared to what you describe. It also has a non-human target.
It makes me glad that I never got sucked into the internet growing up and even still have no social media. It also disturbs me.
It also ruffles my feathers because it brings, without necessarily meaning to, support to "sit down, shut up, and consume mindlessly," which is a strain of thought here as well as hyperbolic, toxic negativity, by problematizing negative critique. It makes me want to point out that consumers should be thinking about what they consume.
'Critique is fine' as in it is permissible is not how I'd put it. I think critique, as in full on critique, not necessarily just a list of complaints, should be encouraged. I think it is a good thing. I think effort should be expended towards it.
I also think enlightened discourse is the best way to make gaming "grow up."
I get that I'm focused on hoping for better discourse from a safe place where I don't experience how bad it is let alone be a victim myself. But I still think that's where our end-game should be--good discussion.
Remember the shit show when the Skullgirls dev talked about how much it costs to make a character?
It started off REALLY bad. Just assumptions and declarations of fact with no basis out the wazoo. However... it eventually turned into something really good and educational by the end. Thanks in no small part to one of the devs themselves going everywhere to challenge people on what they were saying and dropping firsthand knowledge of how things are like. One of the most informative and eye opening things I've seen on here actually.
That said, that's a pretty unreasonable thing to ask of most people especially after an initial reaction like the one the Skullgirls character info ignited.
Until something changes about the culture and norms that engender that sort of reaction, I can't see why most devs would look at the above situation and go, "that seems like a fun thing, let's give it a whirl."
It started off REALLY bad. Just assumptions and declarations of fact with no basis out the wazoo. However... it eventually turned into something really good and educational by the end. Thanks in no small part to one of the devs themselves going everywhere to challenge people on what they were saying and dropping firsthand knowledge of how things are like. One of the most informative and eye opening things I've seen on here actually.
That said, that's a pretty unreasonable thing to ask of most people especially after an initial reaction like the one the Skullgirls character info ignited.
Until something changes about the culture and norms that engender that sort of reaction, I can't see why most devs would look at the above situation and go, "that seems like a fun thing, let's give it a whirl."
More_Badass
Member
Game developers are more than the AAA industry or publishers
rackham
Banned
Gamers piss me off. I hate that term. I refuse to be apart of it and it's my biggest hobby. Overwatch community is an example of a shitty community.
And honestly BLIZZARD is partly to blame. There was a post from Jeff Kaplan about how some guy had over 2000 reports (when Jeff tried shitting on the guy about something related) that only ended up showing that you could be reported over 2000 times with no real ramifications (perma ban). Like, why? Is it because of money?
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20758687468?page=4#post-72
yeah real funny Jeff. Not all gamers. Not all devs. etc. etc.
And honestly BLIZZARD is partly to blame. There was a post from Jeff Kaplan about how some guy had over 2000 reports (when Jeff tried shitting on the guy about something related) that only ended up showing that you could be reported over 2000 times with no real ramifications (perma ban). Like, why? Is it because of money?
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20758687468?page=4#post-72
yeah real funny Jeff. Not all gamers. Not all devs. etc. etc.
I remember that thread as well. I think that one piece of the puzzle does involve educating the fan base, and I think the people on the front lines should be delivering that education: the community managers. They should be empowered by devs to go into their respective communities and lay down some hard science about how things are actually made. Even if they have to interview devs to deliver it. Basically, getting your community to understand what goes into making a game is part of managing expectations.
so thats a no then
Not sure that I follow, for a long time I've heard complaints of AAA games being "dumbed down" and "pandering to the casuals". And this really contradicts what you are saying. Also look at the reactions from "core gamers" during E3 when pubs dedicate time to sports and party/casual games.
I'm totally with you. It's definitely not going to be easy as that though. I feel the past year and a half should be proof enough that occasionally even hard facts aren't enough for some folks. What's more, this might be especially tough for any company that's seemingly tied up with old school Japanese cultural business norms, like Capcom USA + Capcom Japan.
Then you have to consider that something like that would only add on to the total development cost and some companies might not see quick enough return to justify this extra openness (not including potential harassment of employees because of the new policy).
30yearsofhurt
Member
Randall is right. We are a part of the problem.
fabricated backlash
Member
I realize that, and I wanted to add to my statement and clarify:
Even if my observation is true, and without any extensive data it remains that, an observation; even if true, it wasn't intended to excuse the toxicity that permeates gaming fandoms. It's absolutely despiccable how some deranged morons act like petulant entitled little shits.
I also don't fault any developer for not wanting to interact with these fanatics, and don't get me started on GG and the rest of that filth. It royally sucks that devs have to deal with this behaviour, but it doesn't come from nowhere and just pointing at fans while washing their hands in innocence is hypocritical at best. Because again it's only hurting those most vulnerable in the first place.
Look at how gaming was marketed: Hardcore vs casuals. If you own a Wii, you're a filthy casual, real gamers get that Dorito flavoured Xbox 360, and for the players... now that's the true gamers.
It's marketing talk, calculated and insidious. While targeting mass market appeal, they tell their audience that they are special snowflakes with superior taste.
Just look at all the Sony shills coming to defend poor Sony for not being part of the Minecraft cross play update. That's what you get. People actively working against their interest to cheerlead for a fucking company that fed them some condescending bullshit about protecting their playerbase.
Walled gardens are what got us into this mess. Susceptible fans starting to believe the constant Mt Dew drip feed of being better because they like a product or line of products.
Human Trashcan
Banned
speaking of toxic behavior, telling people to "seek help" has to be one of the shittiest things to just throw around.
rackham
Banned
Honestly the response that luulubuu replied to wasn't even bad..wtf? talk about toxicity.
I really haven't seen this from the pubs and devs. Can you give me concrete examples? I've seen this from the consumers for sure, not denying that. I actually adressed this in my earlier post where I said that this is one aspect where gamers need to grow up.
Eh, I love CDPR too but this "Only decent people seem to be CD Projekt with Witcher 3." is awful and hyperbolic thing to say. And exactly something we shouldn't be saying.
Alexander DeLarge
Member
Deeke[VRZ];249949779 said:
It sucks that he can't get the feedback he needs because of the publisher's bullshit but should anyone really be able to expect it to not dominate the conversation when we're talking about the biggest push for microtransactions in a full priced single player game ever?
This thread is amazing, right down to the posts saying it can be done in a week, or in mugen for free. Wow.
rackham
Banned
CDPR is a great company and that's Daffy's opinion. It's hyperbolic but being told to "calm the fuck down and seek help" is just as disingenuous.
Jacksinthe
Banned
You're right. It doesn't come from nowhere.
It comes from whiny cunts on message boards who, instead of just letting a game, developer or publisher die by making sure they are associated with dirty deeds and thus lose money, they attack individuals, females, track down addresses, etc of developers busting their ass to put food on the table for families they barely see because the AAA industry sucks.
Instead of making sure that the face of the problem is the company pulling the strings, the cogs in that wheel who often are just following their workload for a paycheck are attacked, not the company. They find individuals who have literally had nothing to do with what their grievance might be - just to attack something because that's groupthink, that usually will trigger a reaction they can pile on. Attack a the symbol of a company? You're met with dead air or shitty PR. Attack an individual and now you're drawing blood. That sweet, red, thick velvet fluid shitbags can't seem to get enough of. NOW you're fucking up someone's life, forcing them into hiding, forcing them to quit, because goddammit - SOMEONE has to pay and you can't make the company bleed as easily as you can one person caught by circumstance.
So, yeah. It starts somewhere alright. Theres a way to deal with shitty companies. Finding and attacking individuals who may or may not play any part in your grievance isn't one of them.
I'm happy Charles said something as the problem exists just about everywhere. I wouldn't say GAF is toxic, but there have been threads or conversations where people show a willful ignorance towards game development. Sometimes it seems like people only want to know what can be used for ammunition to support or bash something. I know some publisher practices and higher cost of some games don't help, but the gaming community as a whole needs to learn that developers are not the enemy.
Hopefully this opens some eyes to what developers sometimes have to deal with.
Hopefully this opens some eyes to what developers sometimes have to deal with.
"next time you don't like a game, maybe consider just... moving on?"
"dwelling on something you don't like isn't healthy. spend your time on what matters instead"
Are you saying that I shouldn't bother with video games then, isn't that equivalent to giving up? You criticise a person you love because you know they can be a better person than they are. The moment you stop doing that is when you don't care about them anymore, and that's a much worse state, no?
I don't know what exactly he's refering to with toxicity but blizzard and the like deserve to be called out for how shit their games have turned out lately. Who in their right mind thinks the legendary drop system in Legion is acceptable? How on earth can you even begin to defend the amount of time and/or money you need to spend on Hearthstone before you can get a competitive deck? Sorry but this is horseshit. Move on.. to what? I love those games, all they need is a tiny tweak that's extremely easy to implement. It's a matter of adjusting parameters such that they reduce profit and increase enjoyment. That's it.
"dwelling on something you don't like isn't healthy. spend your time on what matters instead"
Are you saying that I shouldn't bother with video games then, isn't that equivalent to giving up? You criticise a person you love because you know they can be a better person than they are. The moment you stop doing that is when you don't care about them anymore, and that's a much worse state, no?
I don't know what exactly he's refering to with toxicity but blizzard and the like deserve to be called out for how shit their games have turned out lately. Who in their right mind thinks the legendary drop system in Legion is acceptable? How on earth can you even begin to defend the amount of time and/or money you need to spend on Hearthstone before you can get a competitive deck? Sorry but this is horseshit. Move on.. to what? I love those games, all they need is a tiny tweak that's extremely easy to implement. It's a matter of adjusting parameters such that they reduce profit and increase enjoyment. That's it.
The classic. I don't think I'll ever understand what motivates people to be so shitty to someone else they've never met.
Sure, the bad thing wasn't praising CDPR. The bad thing was bringing everyone else down on the expense. "Only CDPR are decent people" isn't just talking about CDPR, but condemning everyone else to be something less than decent people.
And CDPR had their own "downgrade" debacle too, that seemed to be one of the things making devs/pubs less than decent to Daffy.
This right here.
I'm not sure it really is that easy. Not that I'm advocating anti-consumer practices but in the end we do have to keep in mind these are businesses. I would hope that any changes that negatively effect profits wouldn't lead to layoffs.
The point is more about how vicious gamers can be to individuals who open up about their careers or place of employment. Raising concerns about nickel and diming is one thing, several ding death threats over a delayed game is an entirely different matter.
I'm no doubt guilty of this as well, but most of my criticism is taken out on the publishers because of terrible business practices more so than the developers.
In the end, most of us are just arm chair game designers who like to think we know the ends and outs of designing a good game and what should be the exact solutions to the problems for which developers face just because we play them when it reality we know fuck all.
Nevertheless, there are games out there that are bad. So poorly developed that you don't need to be a developer to know it. You just play it and know it's just not fun or clearly poorly made. Those are the times for which I see hard criticism is necessary, as it can be rather insulting to waste money on such a bad product.
There is also, as I mentioned earlier, the terrible business practices of this industry that do put people in a nasty attitude when they have to deal with them, and as a result they have less respect for those behind the games. Which should be the publishers, but a lot of the time people can't differentiate publisher from developer.
Overall, I think Randall is right to a degree, but the conniptions consumers can have are not entirely unjustified, and it has only evolved into the toxic behavior that is so prevalent among consumers, as unfortunate as that is.
In the end, most of us are just arm chair game designers who like to think we know the ends and outs of designing a good game and what should be the exact solutions to the problems for which developers face just because we play them when it reality we know fuck all.
Nevertheless, there are games out there that are bad. So poorly developed that you don't need to be a developer to know it. You just play it and know it's just not fun or clearly poorly made. Those are the times for which I see hard criticism is necessary, as it can be rather insulting to waste money on such a bad product.
There is also, as I mentioned earlier, the terrible business practices of this industry that do put people in a nasty attitude when they have to deal with them, and as a result they have less respect for those behind the games. Which should be the publishers, but a lot of the time people can't differentiate publisher from developer.
Overall, I think Randall is right to a degree, but the conniptions consumers can have are not entirely unjustified, and it has only evolved into the toxic behavior that is so prevalent among consumers, as unfortunate as that is.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Do you need me to link them to you? :|
Isn't Legion really well received by the fans and they are having their highest player numbers in a long time? I haven't bought Legion, so what is wrong with the legendary drops? You don't like how common those have become? Not really a fan of that change myself either tbh. But I don't see how that negates everything else the game does well, making it "shit". And aren't people in HS constantly playing to Legend rank in few days on f2p decks?
Uno Venova
Banned
Great insight and I never realized that more than reading the thread about vitriol from GAF making a developer cry, and an actual common response was 'deal with it'.
Yeah, we have all this material from Gamasutra, Siggraph, GDC, etc., and yet the discussion threads for those never go on for very long purely because the majority of consumers actually don't give enough shits to educate themselves.
We have the means for people to educate themselves on how modern game dev works, but people would rather lazily and blindly spew hate rather than put in the work to actually have anything resembling a strong foundation for productive discussion. Dunning-Kruger effect in full swing here. Ultimately, I feel like a significant part of this is just runoff from an overall toxic culture that rewards anti-intellectual laziness as opposed to solid effort. Too many people actually outright revel in their ignorance to a degree that is stultifying.
I don't know how to fix this, but it needs fixing. If only publishers would push back more against this kind of bullshit somehow...
The legendary drops are completely random and have a huge impact on your performance level. The droprate is low, but that's offset by the "luck protection" system which means the chance of getting a drop from increases every time you don't receive one.
If you exhaust the game's content every weekly reset you get about 1 legendary drop per two weeks in my experience, which only applies to 1 spec on 1 class. So if you want to maximize just 1 spec on your main you need essentially all of them because many of them are useful depending on the circumstances. They also want you to go back to previous raids and spend hours clearing them on each difficulty every single week to get legendaries, which is boring and a huge waste of time as you can imagine.
Then there's the titanforge system on regular gear. Any gear you get in Legion has a chance to proc higher item level, so the way competitive PvE works nowadays is that besides maximizing your main you need to have multiple alts for so called split runs in order to farm titanforges for your guild's mains. I wouldn't call this an ejoybable experience, although granted most people play the game casually as a kind of glorified chat program so they aren't really affected by these things. The game is extremely time consuming and players in top guilds say they have to literally grind 24/7 as to not fall behind.
Regarding Hearthstone, idk I just remember coasting to rank 20 and having a blast until I hit a roadblock (some guy used legendary card after legendary card even though I had control all game, and I eventually lost). It's supposedly a bottleneck because everybody deranks to 20 at the end of the month or something like that. Yeah you can win games but that's mostly because of the RNG factors and the asymmetric daily quest system, the latter meaning that to get your daily coins you need to say "play 30 warrior class cards" while you get "win 3 games as a paladin" and if you main paladin then you're gonna have an easier time against people who're playing a class they're less familiar with in that day aka higher chance of winning. It's stuff like that which bothers me.
SatelliteOfLove
Member
One of the things that hasn't been brought up enough is, to borrow Jim Sterling's pronunciation, con-TROV-ersy.
Side A has within its ranks people who would have no qualms about setting off on an internet vendetta against ANYTHING Ninja Theory or Capcpom for the BETRAYALTON that was DmC. None.
Side B has within its ranks people who would have no qualms about setting off on an internet Helm's Deep to defend Ninja Theory or Capcpom against ANYTHING for the ONSLAUGHT against their fair Devil may Cry reboot.
Here's the thing: how did this go from a very shaky business move hooking NT up with Character Action darling DMC that had some success but a host of problems to "MY ONE LIFE I GIVE FOR THEE, DmC!!!" or "FROM HELL'S HEART, I STAB AT THEE, CAPCPOM!!!", and how are we still hashing on this five years later?
Con-TROV-ersy. That din from those two crowds constantly sneak attacking and launching diatribes against each others' extreme faction led to a warped understanding of what happened, how did it happen, what would come of it, the development, actual strengths and weaknesses, what happens when a base isn't tendered to, what didn't attract enough of a new base, etc.
We need less NERDRAGE and more tasteful, understated nerdrage to control the remembered narrative.
Poking my head into that thread probably gave me the deepest douche-chills of that year. Oy vey.
It doesn't contradict it, it's another facet of fallow markets of Gen 7. Now, how long did it take to satisfy them? How many were shit-flinging nerdragers, and how many were just quietly bitter after saying their peace? How many were cocky Haves flinging shit back at those nerdragers, from the safety of numbers and attention from industry trends? Just who are these factions? How many? How numerous?
There is a ton of nuance here that Us vs Them cannot encapsulate, and like KS reinvigorating Grognard-Ass Grognard Games, the solutions seem oddly obvious in retrospect even though the problem remains shrouded by itself.
RichiRamjag
Member
Ah, I kind of thought you were, but couldnt be sure. Apologies.
Yeah I definitely can, which is why I don't play anymore =P The game has always been about grind in my eyes, I just realized it very late after spending hundreds of days in-game time. But I do feel that they have been doing better to accomodate those who aren't there for the grind and top end-game challenge. But they haven't forgotten those either who want to put in the effort and want to be challenged, there's more difficulty options for different kind of players than ever before. Thanks for the great explanation btw, it was interesting to read.
But to HS, legendaries aren't really a requirement for climbing the ranks. https://i.imgur.com/uAOw6eK.png this deck reached Legend rank just a month ago. It's mostly common cards, only 2 epics and 3 rares even.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
I mean, i wasent referring to the price, tho im sure it added to it, Sony was front and center in putting "gameplay videos" of games where the graphics clearly wasent representative of the final product, in some cases using full on CGI movies and calling it gameplay that the PS3 could do, I wouldnt say I'd hate sony for this, but im pretty sure a ton of people sued sony for misrepresenting a product.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
This is a prime example of what he mean.