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[Liquidsnake]

LOL That's the dude from Head of the Class.

Is it really? Because its been bothering me for 10 min.

 

[Zane]

As long as it isn´t child porn? Of course. Fantasizing is a-ok. Fantasies are allowed to be sick. That´s why we keep them that: Fantasies. Never fantasized about beating some asshole, or even killing someone? Of course, you did. Yet, nobody proposed that you should turn yourself in.



They can *gasp* masturbate to satisfy their urges. You know, masturbation is fun, too. It´s what I do instead of raping women, as member of virgin-gaf.

Hey! Masturbating to a minor isn't OK! Even if it's "just" a fantasy.

please stop defending people who jack off to underage children, thanks.

And no, I've never fantasized about killing someone. I think you should stop projecting and get some professional help, yo.

 

[freenudemacusers]

Rape fantasies are quite common from what I hear.

There is a substantial difference between 'rape fantasy' and 'fantasizing about raping someone'.

wat?! No, I´m saying that just because I haven´t had sex yet, I´m not committing crimes because of that. Just like a pedophile doesn´t fuck children, only because of his attraction.

Well, when I was a member of the virgin club 10 years ago, I didn't think to myself, "Well macuser, since you aren't getting anywhere with the ladies, why not just jack it and pretend you're raping them."... I guess I don't get where you were going with that.

 

[okdakor]

I wouldn't just scoff at that and go "cool beans as long as you know not to act on it." I would be a little alarmed.

Exactly.

 

[Harry Dresden]

You can't condemn people for just their thoughts. This isn't 1984.

 

[tiff]

So, what were you alluding to then when you threw out how it's more common than one might think for people to have rape fantasies? You admit that you weren't referring specifically to something like my role-playing example, my "I fantasized about raping that person" apparently weirded you out like it would have me. So, what food for thought was supposed to be gleamed from that. What were you talking about?

Fantasy about rape that doesn't go quite as far as looking at someone and having a strong desire to rape them?

 

[Orayn]

You can't condemn people for just their thoughts. This isn't 1984.

You're right, it's got elements of Brave New World mixed in there too.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

You can't condemn people for just their thoughts. This isn't 1984.

Well, no. But again, what can we take from this? Do you really think it's in the best-interest of anyone to encourage non-aggressive pedophiles to be open about their predilections? Should we encourage that it's okay to have those kinds of thoughts and fantasies because it's not their fault as long as they don't act on it? I promise you that I'm not being obtuse. I'm not arguing that we violate civil liberties and engage in a pedophile witch hunt where the mere suggestion that someone might have impure thoughts about children will have them ostracized from society, but at the same time, I don't really find fantasizing about child molestation to be a defensible act.

Fantasy about rape that doesn't go quite as far as looking at someone and having a strong desire to rape them?

So, I shouldn't be weirded out if the participant in my previous fake conversation had just said "I'd really like to have my way with a random girl against her will" instead of having a specific target in mind? If so, I'd still be pretty alarmed. That really doesn't seem healthy to me.

 

[bengraven]

ITT I learned that the fat guy from Better Off Dead and Head of the Class is the driving force behind every single live action TV show on Nick that my 12 year old niece watches just to annoy me. Fuck that guy.

wat?! No, I´m saying that just because I haven´t had sex yet, I´m not committing crimes because of that. Just like a pedophile doesn´t fuck children, only because of his attraction.

Bro, you nearly, nearly finally came out.

I come into these threads knowing Sennorin is here and waiting for the epic end that's on the horizon.

 

[Dabanton]

I doubt it. Gretchen Mol could not get huge roles because of Weinstein. A young actor turning down someone with power could have a really hard time breaking out if that person decides to blacklist them.

I remember the gossip about that. There are loads of stories about her fucking for both roles and directing jobs for her husband..

It was mystifying several years ago why she was hyped the way she was hyped. Just another starlet with no real significant starring vehicles somehow ending up with a prestigious magazine cover proclaiming her as the next It. Well It never happened. And after all this time and a string of failures, she’s been trying to change the course. So she’s gone back to the major player who tried to make it happen for her the first time. There was an arrangement back then – her sexual services for his professional services – and apparently the same arrangement was resurrected recently in the hopes that she’ll finally confirm a juicy role to kickstart a stagnant career.

Never mind that he’s married. His wife benefits handsomely from his generosity and while he may not fulfill her with fidelity, he certainly makes up for it through client exchange. Probably better that way. And given what he looks like, it totally makes sense. But he is a legend in the business both for his accomplishments and for the way he leads these ladies to their accomplishments, counting a couple of award winners and a few box office heavyweights on his resumé…which is why he quickly tired of our poor girl and discarded her.

But not before drying her out. One day late summer, they were joined in a hotel suite by a third gentleman (identity insignificant), both of them enjoying her as she allowed herself to be taken, and, um, decorated appropriately, all for a reward at the end of the session – the privilege of simply looking at a script, no promise, no confirmation…just an advance read. And a suggestion to show up at a premiere for a few introductions. She is so desperate, it’s been so meagre, she submitted to the humiliation although gamely seems to have enjoyed it. An actor after all, obviously able to shut out her husband and child waiting for her back at home.

And then he just cut it off. Told her he could no longer help her. That her body in his bed was no longer required. Which of course only added to her degradation. She tried and tried to offer up more, willing to engage in further depravity, but was only met with rejection. Because he’s moved on. He’s hunting his next target. A young, nubile, blonde babe with a large profile and a perky rack who so far has been able to resist his advances but is trying to graduate from supporting roles in film, as the fact that she’s a headliner on the small screen has not helped with the quality of scripts she’s being offered, or with many of her auditions so far. She’s currently waiting on a big break and he’s trying to make sure it doesn’t happen, so that in her disappointment, she’ll come running to him, ready to wheel and deal.

http://rumorsontheinternets.org/2010/05/13/is-gretchen-mol-a-hollywood-hoe/

 

[J-Rod]

The only way this rape fantasy analogy can work is if the hypothetical person is only interested in rape and would otherwise be uninterested in intercourse with the same person if they consented or was willing. If they could only get off by harming the other person or by forcing themselves on them against their will while being completely unattracted to them if it was consensual, then it comes closer to fitting pedophilia.

And that is what pedophilia really is, anyway. They want to have sex with people unable to consent and unequipped to even participate (without pain, at least). Take the same individual and let them reach a level of maturity where it is no longer abuse, and the pedophile is not interested.

It's not that it is just "socially unnaccepted" like interacial relationships and homosexual relationships are/were. There are no victims and mutual love in those relationships. With pedophilia, it's that it is evil at its core.

 

[Acerac]

I don't say it's valid or anything, I'm saying it's funny that people made crazy predictions that actually do happen for all the wrong reasons.
They said, after you've accepted gays and others you'll have to accept child molesters and the likes (sometimes making an equivalence).
Well some people are actually trying to do that (as evidenced by the whole NAMBLA movement for example) but totally not inline with what was said would happen.

Who in this thread is championing people who molest children?

You're one of those people I mentioned earlier who can't separate pedophiles who don't act on their urges and those who do.

I just can't see myself hating somebody because of the way they are, especially if they have no choice in the matter. Even if they are fucked up in the head, I can't imagine why people would prefer to not try to help these people, instead torturing them for the amusement of crowds, as was suggested earlier.

Well, I suppose I can, but it is a fairly fucked up mindset in my eyes.

Well, no. But again, what can we take from this? Do you really think it's in the best-interest of anyone to encourage non-aggressive pedophiles to be open about their predilections? Should we encourage that it's okay to have those kinds of thoughts and fantasies because it's not their fault as long as they don't act on it? I promise you that I'm not being obtuse. I'm not arguing that we violate civil liberties and engage in a pedophile witch hunt where the mere suggestion that someone might have impure thoughts about children will have them ostracized from society, but at the same time, I don't really find fantasizing about child molestation to be a defensible act.

So, I shouldn't be weirded out if the participant in my previous fake conversation had just said "I'd really like to have my way with a random girl against her will" instead of having a specific target in mind? If so, I'd still be pretty alarmed. That really doesn't seem healthy to me.

We should set up ways for the people burdened with this unhealthy sexual appetite to get help. Simple as that.

Currently there are no channels for these people to seek help. Sick people should be able to get help, not receive our scorn. This is better for society as a whole, these people find a way to deal with their unhealthy attractions and we don't have to worry about sickos jacking off behind bushes in a playground.

 

[Orayn]

Well, I suppose I can, but it is a fairly fucked up mindset in my eyes.
We should set up ways for the people burdened with this unhealthy sexual appetite to get help. Simple as that.

Currently there are no channels for these people to seek help. Sick people should be able to get help, not receive our scorn. This is better for society as a whole, these people find a way to deal with their unhealthy attractions and we don't have to worry about sickos jacking off behind bushes in a playground.

The problem is that a lot of people, especially on the socially conservative side, don't want to view the issue in those terms. Everything gets thrown under the general heading of "evil," and nobody wants to discuss how to actually address the underlying issues, but want the individuals in question to be killed, ostracized, or jailed.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

We should set up ways for the people burdened with this unhealthy sexual appetite to get help. Simple as that.

Currently there are no channels for these people to seek help.

Do therapists currently refuse to work with them while outing them to law enforcement if they seek help? Honestly, I'm just not sure of the specifics of what you're proposing. My assumption right now is that help is available, but people are afraid to out themselves even if they were to do so discretely.

And again, I don't know how you fix that. I understand that it can be argued that they were born like that. However, this is not in any way, shape, or form similar to the campaign to convince middle America that homosexuality is okay, for instance. You're talking about individuals who want to molest children. Even if they hate themselves for it and don't act on it, advocating tolerance is a near impossible sell.

Though, that's not to say that therapists shouldn't try to help them. I'm just saying that any campaign for society to embrace and want to help so-called harmless pedophiles is a complete non-starter.

 

[tiff]

So, I shouldn't be weirded out if the participant in my previous fake conversation had just said "I'd really like to have my way with a random girl against her will" instead of having a specific target in mind? If so, I'd still be pretty alarmed. That really doesn't seem healthy to me.

I couldn't tell you what you should or shouldn't be weirded out by, but so long as I didn't fear that your previous fake acquaintance actually planned to make good on his statement then that's about what I'm talking about, I guess.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

I couldn't tell you what you should or shouldn't be weirded out by, but so long as I didn't fear that your previous fake acquaintance actually planned to make good on his statement then that's about what I'm talking about, I guess.

Again, my point is this: your comparison to adults engaging in rape fantasy was a bad one. You yourself clearly do not understand what that term even means.

 

[plagiarize]

Well, no. But again, what can we take from this? Do you really think it's in the best-interest of anyone to encourage non-aggressive pedophiles to be open about their predilections? Should we encourage that it's okay to have those kinds of thoughts and fantasies because it's not their fault as long as they don't act on it? I promise you that I'm not being obtuse. I'm not arguing that we violate civil liberties and engage in a pedophile witch hunt where the mere suggestion that someone might have impure thoughts about children will have them ostracized from society, but at the same time, I don't really find fantasizing about child molestation to be a defensible act.

So, I shouldn't be weirded out if the participant in my previous fake conversation had just said "I'd really like to have my way with a random girl against her will" instead of having a specific target in mind? If so, I'd still be pretty alarmed. That really doesn't seem healthy to me.

i'm not going to touch the analogy because analogies drive me batty.

do you not see the good in rewarding pedophiles that don't rape children though? if we treat them all the same, that gives them little encouragement. if you treat them like child rapists, even if they haven't raped a child, given that we know they want to rape children (because legally all sex with children is rape) that's going to make it more likely that they will start raping children.

if they're equally persecuted without the 'reward' they are looking for, they'll reward themselves.

i know you're not saying 'equal' persecution, but the smaller the gap between the persecution received by fantasy only pedophiles, and raping children pedophiles, then the greater temptation for the first group to join the second, from my perspective at least.

i can absolutely seperate fantasy from reality. i write. my stories contain sick twisted things that i would never do under any circumstance. i have imagined the horrors of pedophilia and explored it through fiction.

i didn't fantasize about child molestation, but i did imagine it. does that make me sick too?

i'll take you at face value and presume that you have never fantasized about doing something illegal or immoral. that makes you a very rare person, and it makes it understandable that you'd struggle to understand the huge seperation between what some of us imagine and what some of us would actually contemplate doing in reality... but that doesn't make it wrong.

if someone truly can't stop fantasizing about children, then they need societies HELP not hatrid. if they truly don't want to hurt children, i'm sure that they don't want to fantasize about it. we should absolutely punish anyone that acts out that fantasy, and we should be kind to the ones that don't...

because whatever our feelings on morality, it will likely lead to the least number of children getting raped, and that's the only thing that should matter.

 

[Jonm1010]

Rich Cronin's stories about him on the Stern show were so fucking funny, very creepy but the part where he tells the group "You guys gotta do me a big favor...." killed me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cahs0_CthVI

I listened to that whole thing. I couldn't turn it off.

Well today I learned the Jennifer Love Hewitt is a dishonest nympho boy-band slut and that somebody in the backstreet boys and Nsync used to let Lou Perlman touch their dick.

 

[Acerac]

The problem is that a lot of people, especially on the socially conservative side, don't want to view the issue in those terms. Everything gets thrown under the general heading of "evil," and nobody wants to discuss how to actually address the underlying issues, but want the individuals in question to be killed, ostracized, or jailed.

Jail for pedophiles who act on their desires I can understand, and agree with completely. As to those who think pedophiles who don't act on their desires should be tortured for the amusement of others? That just seems like a rancid opinion to have.

Do therapists currently refuse to work with them while outing them to law enforcement if they seek help? Honestly, I'm just not sure of the specifics of what you're proposing. My assumption right now is that help is available, but people are afraid to out themselves even if they were to do so discretely.

And again, I don't know how you fix that. I understand that it can be argued that they were born like that. However, this is not in any way, shape, or form similar to the campaign to convince middle America that homosexuality is okay, for instance. You're talking about individuals who want to molest children. Even if they hate themselves for it and don't act on it, advocating tolerance is a near impossible sell.

Though, that's not to say that therapists shouldn't try to help them. I'm just saying that any campaign for society to embrace and want to help so-called harmless pedophiles is a complete non-starter.

I am saying we should have special programs for these people. Completely anonymous and doesn't land the person on any life ending government list. This kind of help would go quite a long way, I'd imagine.

I sincerely doubt the average therapist is trained to deal in such matters, though I could be underestimating the average therapist. They may be able to help somewhat, but I think a specialist would be best for somebody with the sizable issues we are discussing. As to your comment about therapists outing these people to the law, I'd assume the vast majority wouldn't. A small portion however would likely have the mindset of many posters in this thread, and certainly would. Would you disclose this info if you were a pedophile? I wouldn't take the risk if I were.

I agree with you that society as a whole will likely never give pity to these people. That's society for you, and one of the major reasons why they get so much sympathy from me. I just hate people getting spit on for stuff they have no power over. =/

 

[Steve Youngblood]

if they're equally persecuted without the 'reward' they are looking for, they'll reward themselves.

...

if someone truly can't stop fantasizing about children, then they need societies HELP not hatrid. if they truly don't want to hurt children, i'm sure that they don't want to fantasize about it. we should absolutely punish anyone that acts out that fantasy, and we should be kind to the ones that don't...

How do we reward them? How do we be kind to them?

Again, I'm going back to my earlier point. Intellectually, I understand perfectly where you're coming from. On paper, it's all very sound. I get that. However, let's move away from theory into the real world. And by "real world," I'm not even talking about those susceptible to knee-jerk hyperbole that propose any pedophile -- guilty of any real crime or not -- should be hanged for our amusement. I'm talking about real people who aim to do well in life, and probably have families.

Like, myself. I'm about a month away (assuming everything continues to go well) from the birth of my first son. Now, like most other fathers, I assume that I will very much not want to see him sexually violated. Now, again, I'm not in that position just yet, but I assume that ensuring that will take priority over my compassion for my fellow human who wants to do the right thing but was unfortunately cursed with impure thoughts he can't control. That's not to say that I'd be leading the posse and grabbing pitchforks to dispense mob justice, but I'm pretty sure that I would want nothing to do with this individual, and certainly wouldn't want him anywhere near my son.

I think others would share that sentiment. Is that unfair? Perhaps. However, though there are certain things worth dreaming about when we envision our ideal world, sympathy for pedophiles isn't very high on my list. My apologies if that seems cruel, as I realize that it might be perceived as insensitive.

 

[Acerac]

Not everyone wants to be sympathetic to the sick. Many people aren't, especially if those who are sick have a chance of hurting their loved ones because of their sickness.

I just can't share your opinion is all. I think those with mental afflictions are very worthy of my pity, especially if the world as a whole wants to see these people dead. I think this would be a good time for us to agree to disagree.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

I just can't share your opinion is all. I think this would be a good time to agree to disagree.

I'm not necessarily trying to convince you of anything. I'm just offering a counterpoint. I'm not calling you a misguided crackpot. However, though I consider myself very socially liberal, this is one progressive idea that I have trouble getting behind. I'm not saying that they're beyond being helped, or that they shouldn't seek it. However, I firmly believe that it's kind of silly to expect tolerance from society in regards to pedophiles, whether they act on their desires or not.

 

[dudeworld]

Sennorin is a defense force troll. He'll defend hitler if there was a thread about him

 

[PairOfFilthySocks]

Public indecency?

So would the fact that he did it next to a playground play into what he should be charged with?

 

[devenger]

I like to murder. Don't worry! I try very hard not to act on these impulses. You can call me a hero, if you like, but that's not the term I use. I'm just a good person ignoring the voices in their head. What's that? Just kidding.

By the way, I do offer baby sitting services.

 

[plagiarize]

How do we reward them? How do we be kind to them?

Again, I'm going back to my earlier point. Intellectually, I understand perfectly where you're coming from. On paper, it's all very sound. I get that. However, let's move away from theory into the real world. And by "real world," I'm not even talking about those susceptible to knee-jerk hyperbole that propose any pedophile -- guilty of any real crime or not -- should be hanged for our amusement. I'm talking about real people who aim to do well in life, and probably have families.

Like, myself. I'm about a month away (assuming everything continues to go well) from the birth of my first son. Now, like most other fathers, I assume that I will very much not want to see him sexually violated. Now, again, I'm not in that position just yet, but I assume that ensuring that will take priority over my compassion for my fellow human who wants to do the right thing but was unfortunately cursed with impure thoughts he can't control. That's not to say that I'd be leading the posse and grabbing pitchforks to dispense mob justice, but I'm pretty sure that I would want nothing to do with this individual, and certainly wouldn't want him anywhere near my son.

I think others would share that sentiment. Is that unfair? Perhaps. However, though there are certain things worth dreaming about when we envision our ideal world, sympathy for pedophiles isn't very high on my list. My apologies if that seems cruel, as I realize that it might be perceived as insensitive.

it's difficult obviously and i don't have all the answers. we used to treat people who were homosexual much in the same way, and we were able to get where we are today (which isn't where we need to be, but is much closer), but the thing there was that you could go to the 'they aren't hurting anyone else' argument. even if you thought what they were doing was immoral. even if you thought it'd leave them spending eternity in the lake of fire, it was easier to rationalise it as 'okay i suppose'.

a lot of people grit their teeth over homosexuals, and over racial minorities, and i think that's a good thing. just as i think not acting on pedophilic desires is 'good enough' i think not acting on bigotted desires is good enough too.

i guess what you'd need to do is to look at the pedophile who is obeying the law and be thankful that he's setting a good example. look at him as someone with a harmful addiction who is fighting it. be encouraging. help him avoid temptation. keeping him away from your kid is good for him too, so i don't think that urge is necessarily harmful. it wouldn't be helpful to ask a recovering alcoholic to go to the liquor store to buy you a bunch of beers.

i don't know if it can happen, but we seperate desires from actions in lots of other ways, and we treat the recovering addicts, or the people with anger issues who don't act on them, well.

it's very difficult, i appreciate that. not everyone can take the higher view, and i absolutely understand why an expecting parent would find it very difficult to step back. but i think we can do it.

obviously pedophiles will never reach the levels of acceptance that homosexuals have... but we can be a lot nicer to the ones that rise above their desires, and i think society wins if it can pull that one off.

one way of being 'nicer' is to not go the route of australia. in australia if you have drawings of underage children in sexual situations that can put you in prison. that's making the desire illegal even when no child is being hurt. australia isn't helping anyone with that i don't believe.

again, if the fake stuff is punished the same as the real stuff, why bother with the substitute?

these are just my beliefs, and as ever i'm a slave to facts... if a study proves otherwise, and that the best thing for our children is to lock them up and throw away the key i'll support it, but i don't think any study does.

 

[Sennorin]

Well, when I was a member of the virgin club 10 years ago, I didn't think to myself, "Well macuser, since you aren't getting anywhere with the ladies, why not just jack it and pretend you're raping them."... I guess I don't get where you were going with that.

What, no, you read that wrong. The comparison was that when people accuse *every* pedophile of wanting to rape children, because they cannot control their urges, then someone like me who doesn´t get the heterosexual sex he´d desire, apparently has to want to rape girls. Because seemingly sex is such an uncontrollable force that it doesn´t matter how peaceful a person is. And that is bullshit. Imo, at least.

On another note, I am *shocked* how many people in here attack the freedom of thoughts. Is this for real?! On one side we have phonies who claim they never thought about killing someone, on the other side we have people that want to control other people´s fantasy. wtf?! Your fantasy is your very private realm of whatever you desire. ANYTHING is legal within your fantasy. Why? Because thoughts aren´t hurting anyone.
You guys that acted outraged towards me defending some pedophile´s fantasies are the true danger to society, no, to humanity. My imagination is my most precious treasure, and I assume the same for everyone. And you want to take that away, because of your stuck up, conservative attitudes? Yeah, you´re not the "good guys" in this debate.

Also, great postings, plagiarize.

 

[plagiarize]

What, no, you read that wrong. The comparison was that when people accuse *every* pedophile of wanting to rape children, because they cannot control their urges, then someone like me who doesn´t get the heterosexual sex he´d desire, apparently has to want to rape girls. Because seemingly sex is such an uncontrollable force that it doesn´t matter how peaceful a person is. And that is bullshit. Imo, at least.

On another note, I am *shocked* how many people in here attack the freedom of thoughts. Is this for real?! On one side we have phonies who claim they never thought about killing some, one the other side we have people that want to control other people´s fantasy. wtf?! Your fantasy is your very private realm of whatever you desire. ANYTHING is legal within your fantasy. Why? Because thoughts aren´t hurting anyone.
You guys that acted outraged towards me defending some pedophile´s fantasies are the true danger to society, no, to humanity. My imagination is my most precious treasure, and I assume the same for everyone. And you want to take that away, because of your stuck up, conservative attitudes? Yeah, you´re not the "good guys" in this debate.

Also, great postings, plagiarize.

thanks, but i have to disagree with some of your post here. all pedophiles do want to rape children. by definition.

you want to have consenting sex with ladies. fortunately for you, that's a legal thing. pedophiles want to have sex with children, which is by definition statutory rape at the absolute best. there is no sex with a minor that isn't rape, so yes, all pedophiles want to rape kid, even though not all pedophiles would.

but we should help them overcome those urges, and i wouldn't be comfortable removing simulated kiddie porn from the equation (apart from where it's indistuinguishable from the real thing, obviously).

 

[LakeEarth]

Rich Cronin's stories about him on the Stern show were so fucking funny, very creepy but the part where he tells the group "You guys gotta do me a big favor...." killed me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cahs0_CthVI

Wow @ that guy.

 

[Foxy Fox 39]

As long as it isn´t child porn? Of course. Fantasizing is a-ok. Fantasies are allowed to be sick. That´s why we keep them that: Fantasies. Never fantasized about beating some asshole, or even killing someone? Of course, you did. Yet, nobody proposed that you should turn yourself in.



They can *gasp* masturbate to satisfy their urges. You know, masturbation is fun, too. It´s what I do instead of raping women, as member of virgin-gaf.

I think Sennorins problem is he doesn't realize how humans work and how things escalate.

Everyone knows that if you continually use drugs your tolerance goes down. Therefor you need to use more to get the same high. You watch porn and soon regular porn isn't going to cut it. You look for crazier "hotter" "sexier" and more risque things.

We adjust to stimulus so that more and more is needed. In EVERYTHING!

So masturbating to some 8 year old and having a fantasy is completely stupid and idiotic to claim as something that's fine. Its not fine, its incredibly creepy and wrong, and it WILL escalate to masturbating to child pron, and eventually (if help is not sought) pedophilia. Some guy thinking about little kids isn't going to cut it. With ALL pedophiles that's generally how it begins. A simple fantasy which soon became a reality.

Secondly why would you say raping women instead of simply having consensual sex? If what you said about kids isn't an alarm (which it is) then that bolded sentence is. That right there is a definite red light in terms of your thought process. "I'm a virgin, therefor I masturbate since I don't rape women."

maybe I misunderstood but wth man?!?!

 

[freenudemacusers]

What, no, you read that wrong. The comparison was that when people accuse *every* pedophile of wanting to rape children, because they cannot control their urges, then someone like me who doesn´t get the heterosexual sex he´d desire, apparently has to want to rape girls. Because seemingly sex is such an uncontrollable force that it doesn´t matter how peaceful a person is. And that is bullshit. Imo, at least.

On another note, I am *shocked* how many people in here attack the freedom of thoughts. Is this for real?! On one side we have phonies who claim they never thought about killing someone, on the other side we have people that want to control other people´s fantasy. wtf?! Your fantasy is your very private realm of whatever you desire. ANYTHING is legal within your fantasy. Why? Because thoughts aren´t hurting anyone.
You guys that acted outraged towards me defending some pedophile´s fantasies are the true danger to society, no, to humanity. My imagination is my most precious treasure, and I assume the same for everyone. And you want to take that away, because of your stuck up, conservative attitudes? Yeah, you´re not the "good guys" in this debate.

Also, great postings, plagiarize.

What do pedophiles want to do if not have sex with kids? I don't get your point here at all. If your point is the assumed 'forcefulness' of pedophile sex with your weird analogy to rape, well, I don't even know how to address this.

 

[tiff]

Again, my point is this: your comparison to adults engaging in rape fantasy was a bad one. You yourself clearly do not understand what that term even means.

The idea that my comparison was only concerning adults playing out rape fantasies is purely your own, as is your implication that the term only applies to sexual roleplaying. Not only is your assertion rude and dismissive, it is also blatantly false. I think we're just about done here.

Everyone knows that if you continually use drugs your tolerance goes down. Therefor you need to use more to get the same high. You watch porn and soon regular porn isn't going to cut it. You look for crazier "hotter" "sexier" and more risque things.

We adjust to stimulus so that more and more is needed. In EVERYTHING!

So masturbating to some 8 year old and having a fantasy is completely stupid and idiotic to claim as something that's fine. Its not fine, its incredibly creepy and wrong, and it WILL escalate to masturbating to child pron, and eventually (if help is not sought) pedophilia. Some guy thinking about little kids isn't going to cut it. With ALL pedophiles that's generally how it begins. A simple fantasy which soon became a reality.

I've never seen anything to support this assertion.

 

[Sennorin]

you want to have consenting sex with ladies. fortunately for you, that's a legal thing. pedophiles want to have sex with children, which is by definition statutory rape at the absolute best. there is no sex with a minor that isn't rape, so yes, all pedophiles want to rape kid, even though not all pedophiles would.

That is within the context of fantasies, yes. But I was talking about reality. The reality in which I´m a loser who doesn´t get sex, but still doesn´t start raping girls. It is this same reality in which pedophiles don´t rape children, even if they desire it. That was my point.

 

[charsace]

I remember the gossip about that. There are loads of stories about her fucking for both roles and directing jobs for her husband..




http://rumorsontheinternets.org/2010/05/13/is-gretchen-mol-a-hollywood-hoe/

I heard he tried and failed to add gwyneth paltrow to his collection in the 90s.

I'm not surprised that hollywood has molesters as sexual coercion seems to be the norm.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

The idea that my comparison was only concerning adults playing out rape fantasies is purely your own, as is your implication that the term only applies to sexual roleplaying. Not only is your assertion rude and dismissive, it is also blatantly false. I think we're just about done here.

In this post, you asked me a question:

For curiosity's sake, though, what do you think about men and women who have rape fantasies?

My genuine, sincerest apologies if I'm misunderstanding your aim, here, but as far as I can tell you have been unable to elucidate why this question was relevant. Later on, you again referenced that having rape fantasies is common among adults. When challenged, you have been unable to clarify what you specifically mean by engaging in rape fantasy other that you are uncomfortable with someone fantasizing about raping a specific victim, but anything short of that is fair game since it's just fantasy. I contend that it doesn't seem relevant to the discussion at all because, by and large, what is meant by this term is not actually a desire to carry out a brutal crime on a victim incapable of defending themselves.

Why did you bring up rape fantasy in this discussion? My belief is that you think it refers to something that it really doesn't, and thus constitutes a valid comparison to pedophiles who fantasize about molesting children but don't act on it. If I'm misrepresenting your position, then I apologize and seek enlightenment as to why you brought it up. Even though I might appear to be a confrontational jerk, here, that's not really my aim. I just want to understand why you interjected the example into the conversation.

 

[solid102]

Why is it everytime we have a thread about pedos, child molestation, older guy boning an underage chick, female teacher boning under age boy or anything related to pedophilia, ephebophilia or any other age related social no-nos we end up talking about the same points over and over again in each thread.

Does GAF have a major hard on for this kind of topics? Do some people in here secretly have such desires in themselves so bad that in order to not admit it to themselves they come in here saying how fucked up the related news is?

Because I am sure I could post news about a serial necrophile who violated hundreds of dead women and I wouldn't get more than 4 pages of responses at best.

 

[Seraphinianus]

My dad is 9 years older than my mom.

What say you, NeoGAF?

my gf is 9 years older than me! best relationship ever, so far.

what can i say, if you're looking for a serious relationship (heavy emphasis on this qualifier) you eventually grow to hate 20-something females that live in major metropolitan areas. they all got serious attitude problems or much worse.

 

[devenger]

Does GAF have a major hard on for this kind of topics?

Thats exactly what they have. Again, first post won.

 

[Stealth Editor]

So masturbating to some 8 year old and having a fantasy is completely stupid and idiotic to claim as something that's fine. Its not fine, its incredibly creepy and wrong, and it WILL escalate to masturbating to child pron, and eventually (if help is not sought) pedophilia. Some guy thinking about little kids isn't going to cut it. With ALL pedophiles that's generally how it begins. A simple fantasy which soon became a reality.

You seem to really know what you are talking about.

 

[bengraven]

That is within the context of fantasies, yes. But I was talking about reality. The reality in which I´m a loser who doesn´t get sex, but still doesn´t start raping girls. It is this same reality in which pedophiles don´t rape children, even if they desire it. That was my point.

If someone is lusting after a child, but refusing to act on it, they should still be getting mental help for the issue. I don't know how old you are, but you can't hold onto urges for long without damaging your own life or personality. Eventually there comes a time when either you can't take it and you act or you can't take it and you harm yourself.

Or maybe the pedophile doesn't want to act on it, but simply strike up a platonic relationship with the underaged person in question. Maybe they feel that their own perspective on relationships and sex is just as immature and confused as the child and that way they can connect: I still feel they are using that relationship in a destructive, manipulative, and predatory way.

If someone has sexual urges toward a young person, even without acting on them, you should talk to a non-biased source before you either hurt yourself or someone else.

 

[plagiarize]

I think Sennorins problem is he doesn't realize how humans work and how things escalate.

Everyone knows that if you continually use drugs your tolerance goes down. Therefor you need to use more to get the same high. You watch porn and soon regular porn isn't going to cut it. You look for crazier "hotter" "sexier" and more risque things.

i think you're suggesting here that everyone who watches porn will end up raping someone. i really hope that i'm misreading it though.

the key word you used was 'continually'. most people don't continually do any of these things, because most people can control themselves to some degree.

We adjust to stimulus so that more and more is needed. In EVERYTHING!

So masturbating to some 8 year old and having a fantasy is completely stupid and idiotic to claim as something that's fine. Its not fine, its incredibly creepy and wrong, and it WILL escalate to masturbating to child pron, and eventually (if help is not sought) pedophilia. Some guy thinking about little kids isn't going to cut it. With ALL pedophiles that's generally how it begins. A simple fantasy which soon became a reality.

you are using the term 'pedophile' to mean 'person who rapes a child' yes? making pedophile synonymous with sex offender is part of the problem i think.

pedophiles already want to have sex with a child. if they don't 'let off steam' one way or another that urge is going to increase. there is no evidence at all that a pedophile who watches child porn will always end up raping a child.

though naturally anyone who watches ACTUAL child porn is creating a demand for material which necessitates the rape of children in its creation, and is and should be completely illegal.

if you're using pedophile to mean 'someone who wants to have sex with children' then, no. someone who isn't a pedophile isn't going to magically turn into one because they watched some underage girl get raped.

Secondly why would you say raping women instead of simply having consensual sex? If what you said about kids isn't an alarm (which it is) then that bolded sentence is. That right there is a definite red light in terms of your thought process. "I'm a virgin, therefor I masturbate since I don't rape women."

maybe I misunderstood but wth man?!?!

don't forget that in the mind of the pedophile there is a difference between wanting sex with a child, and wanting to rape a child. legally, the difference isn't there. a pedophile who doesn't want to 'rape' children may pressure and mislead a child into sleeping with them, raping them in the process, but a pedophile who doesn't want to forcefully rape a child isn't going to.

that's sort of the distinction i think Sennorin was trying to make, but i think we should protect the word 'rape' and continue its use in application to statutory cases, espescially when we're talking about prepubescents.

If someone is lusting after a child, but refusing to act on it, they should still be getting mental help for the issue. I don't know how old you are, but you can't hold onto urges for long without damaging your own life or personality. Eventually there comes a time when either you can't take it and you act or you can't take it and you harm yourself.

Or maybe the pedophile doesn't want to act on it, but simply strike up a platonic relationship with the underaged person in question. Maybe they feel that their own perspective on relationships and sex is just as immature and confused as the child and that way they can connect: I still feel they are using that relationship in a destructive, manipulative, and predatory way.

If someone has sexual urges toward a young person, even without acting on them, you should talk to a non-biased source before you either hurt yourself or someone else.

yes, i agree... but that's also why i think we need to be more tolerant to people that don't act on these urges. the greater fear someone has in stating those urges, the less likely they are to admit them and get help.

 

[Foxy Fox 39]

i think you're suggesting here that everyone who watches porn will end up raping someone. i really hope that i'm misreading it though.

the key word you used was 'continually'. most people don't continually do any of these things, because most people can control themselves to some degree.


you are using the term 'pedophile' to mean 'person who rapes a child' yes? making pedophile synonymous with sex offender is part of the problem i think.

pedophiles already want to have sex with a child. if they don't 'let off steam' one way or another that urge is going to increase. there is no evidence at all that a pedophile who watches child porn will always end up raping a child.

though naturally anyone who watches ACTUAL child porn is creating a demand for material which necessitates the rape of children in its creation, and is and should be completely illegal.

if you're using pedophile to mean 'someone who wants to have sex with children' then, no. someone who isn't a pedophile isn't going to magically turn into one because they watched some underage girl get raped.


don't forget that in the mind of the pedophile there is a difference between wanting sex with a child, and wanting to rape a child. legally, the difference isn't there. a pedophile who doesn't want to 'rape' children may pressure and mislead a child into sleeping with them, raping them in the process, but a pedophile who doesn't want to forcefully rape a child isn't going to.

that's sort of the distinction i think Sennorin was trying to make, but i think we should protect the word 'rape' and continue its use in application to statutory cases, espescially when we're talking about prepubescents.


yes, i agree... but that's also why i think we need to be more tolerant to people that don't act on these urges. the greater fear someone has in stating those urges, the less likely they are to admit them and get help.

You are.

 

[jaxword]

my gf is 9 years older than me! best relationship ever, so far.

what can i say, if you're looking for a serious relationship (heavy emphasis on this qualifier) you eventually grow to hate 20-something females that live in major metropolitan areas. they all got serious attitude problems or much worse.

How did you manage to meet someone like that?

 

[Seraphinianus]

How did you manage to meet someone like that?

same way you meet anyone- branching out of your social circle and talking to strangers.

 

[tiff]

In this post, you asked me a question:

My genuine, sincerest apologies if I'm misunderstanding your aim, here, but as far as I can tell you have been unable to elucidate why this question was relevant. Later on, you again referenced that having rape fantasies is common among adults. When challenged, you have been unable to clarify what you specifically mean by engaging in rape fantasy other that you are uncomfortable with someone fantasizing about raping a specific victim, but anything short of that is fair game since it's just fantasy. I contend that it doesn't seem relevant to the discussion at all because, by and large, what is meant by this term is not actually a desire to carry out a brutal crime on a victim incapable of defending themselves.

Why did you bring up rape fantasy in this discussion? My belief is that you think it refers to something that it really doesn't, and thus constitutes a valid comparison to pedophiles who fantasize about molesting children but don't act on it. If I'm misrepresenting your position, then I apologize and seek enlightenment as to why you brought it up. Even though I might appear to be a confrontational jerk, here, that's not really my aim. I just want to understand why you interjected the example into the conversation.

I think it's impossible to elucidate when we seem to be working off of different definition of the word rape fantasy. If you maintain that my view of the word is incorrect it'd be a great help if you would explain why. I looked it up in case I really was wrong, but from a cursory search much of the results seem to be using it in the same capacity as I have, using it to refer to the fantasies themselves, and not just the act of sexual roleplay. If I'm misunderstanding something here then by all means let me know.

 

[plagiarize]

You are.

so to be clear, you were saying that a normal person thinking about having sex with children, would go to masturbating while thinking about it, would go to watching child porn, would go to an actual pedophile?

i'm just trying to understand what you laid out. i don't agree with that either, but i'm not sure that's what you were getting at either.

i don't think this escalation thing is universal. pictures of attractive people in swimwear don't stop arousing most people once they start looking at other things. if someone needs to continually escalate, they probably have a problem.

 

[devenger]

if they don't 'let off steam' one way or another that urge is going to increase.

I think chemical casteration emits some steam.

Seriously, if these poeple are sick, remove the desire.

edit:

if someone needs to continually escalate, they probably have a problem.

Continually escalate, without release. Virgins may eventually have consensual sex, these people never will.

 

[jaxword]

same way you meet anyone- branching out of your social circle and talking to strangers.

I think you misunderstood; I was asking for more details, really. I meet people all the time, but I've honestly never dated a woman in her 30s, nor would I have any venues to meet such a person. All my classmates are in their early 20s and my coworkers are the same. So...what's your venue? The bar? Yoga class? Random bus stop?

 

[bengraven]

yes, i agree... but that's also why i think we need to be more tolerant to people that don't act on these urges. the greater fear someone has in stating those urges, the less likely they are to admit them and get help.

Well people are obviously very protective of their children, which is why there's a low tolerance in the first place. Yes, people are very harsh about this and parents are usually the first to go on about "gelding" or "chemical castration" - going back to my first sentence.

That said, no one is preventing these people from thinking it, just don't express to, say, the parents of the child they're lusting after that they have these feelings. Come out to your immediate family or better yet, a professional to find the proper treatment of this.

Because it's not going to change any day soon, because we're talking about the victimization of innocents that will affect those people's lives and the lives of their families forever all because a lonely person wants 5 minutes or more of sex with an underaged child.

If someone is lusting or has lusted after my son, for example, I want to know about it. I'm not going to castrate him or even call the police, but I'm going to insist that he get psychological help, especially if this is someone who wants to have a close relationship with my family.

And if he won't get help, yes, I won't let him be around my child. I'm not persecuting him for that...I'm protecting my child the same as I would in regards to a bully.

 

[Sennorin]

If someone is lusting after a child, but refusing to act on it, they should still be getting mental help for the issue.

And I don´t think so. But that is because I believe that sex isn´t some mythical power that blinds you from reality and takes away control over yourself.

I don't know how old you are, but you can't hold onto urges for long without damaging your own life or personality. Eventually there comes a time when either you can't take it and you act or you can't take it and you harm yourself.

Well, I´m a fucked up person, but I´d say that my lack of sex definitely isn´t at fault for that. And I really don´t like the continued "if you don´t have sex, you *will* become a rapist some day". Isn´t necessary, is it.