Support NeoGAF

[Cheddahz]

Watch it be a iOS game

 

[Chemo]

This rumor reads like a fucking fanfic. Do not believe.

 

[Raptor]

NGB > W101

Ahahha out of nowhere!!! poor W101.

NGB is Action Game Perfection.

That is a fact baby!!

 

[Kajiba]

This rumor reads like a fucking fanfic. Do not believe.

It really does in some parts.

I get the feeling I'm only going to play this game in my dreams. It would be nice if Itagaki pops up at TGS or something. Guy just disappeared off the earth on the gaming side of things.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Every other game in the genre I guess

I love what Itagaki did with the Hurricane Packs and the Master Ninja tournaments and how all of that was incorporated into the development of Black. That kind of post release support for a single player action game was tremendous, and will probably never be seen again.

but in no way is the game perfect.(Karma and combo systems are complete trash) Especially when you consider all the above mentioned factors that played out in its development. NGB was the product of testing the game in a highly competitive setting among live players, a luxury most action games never have. and it still had problems.

Game is fun no doubt, but goddamn the way people talk about this particular version of it(to the point of shitting on other versions of THE SAME DAMN GAME) you'd think it was their religion.

just the way you phrased this suggests you didnt understand the way these worked. They are opposing gameplay systems.

The karma system rewarded speedy kills and use of ET and UT's.

The combo system, like all combo systems was about flash.

With NGB being a game that any enemy is supposed to be a threat. It makes sense to kill quickly and dececively rather than style like in DMC games.


Likewise, while DMC rewards high combos with increased health/orbs, NG actively discourages it. You are supposed to use On-landings and UT's.


Im sorry Retro, but to call the karma system trash suggests you simply didnt invest enough time in it. There is a huge amount of planning and depth required to achieve a high score, arguably on par if not better than any Bloody palace run.

 

[Retro_]

The Karma system was great; you are never going to please everyone, but it was implemented very well for those that wanted to focus on that system from a competitive angle.

I know that Karma runs are more than just spamming UT's.

but I still don't like the system. It doesn't reward creativity at all or play to the game's strengths. (Doesn't reward what most players of the game would define as "skill") Purely rewards game knowledge(in the most literal sense. Knowledge of wave composition and geography and time limits of each encounter) and memorizing numbers.

Also, NG was never about combos like say DMC was, so I'm curious to know what your criticism of that was.

There's alot of filler in the moveset and combo theory is extremely linear and limited. and I can't tell if that was intentional or not.

It works fine in how the enemies and encounters are designed but I don't see how people could praise the combat mechanics of NG set apart from all that.

I don't think any action game is "about combos" to begin with. DMC was just about giving you interesting tools and options to play with. Combo videos were a result of its design, not a cause.

Likewise, while DMC rewards high combos with increased health/orbs, NG actively discourages it. You are supposed to use On-landings and UT's.

Black rewards high combos with Karma

That's why it's so confusing to me. Game has a combo counter and gives you points based on number of hits, but it has all these limits on what you can do to keep combos going. (Game never embraced Real Time Weapon switching and your only real canceling options are Shuriken and Jump cancels) and at times seems balanced around these limits with how its encounter design works.

Black to me just seems to have all these conflicting design decisions. Is it a fun game if you ignore all that? Yes. But I don't understand on what planet in which these systems are perfect or masterfully crafted as a whole.

 

[DC R1D3R]

I know that Karma runs are more than just spamming UT's.

but I still don't like the system. It doesn't reward creativity at all or play to the game's strengths. (Doesn't reward what most players of the game would define as "skill") Purely rewards game knowledge(in the most literal sense. Knowledge of wave composition and geography and time limits of each encounter) and memorizing numbers.



There's alot of filler in the moveset and combo theory is extremely linear and limited. and I can't tell if that was intentional or not.

It works fine in how the enemies and encounters are designed but I don't see how people could praise the combat mechanics of NG set apart from all that.

I don't think any action game is "about combos" to begin with. DMC was just about giving you interesting tools and options to play with. Combo videos were a result of its design, not a cause.



Black rewards high combos with Karma

That's why it's so confusing to me. Game has a combo counter and gives you points based on number of hits, but it has all these limits on what you can do to keep combos going. (Game never embraced Real Time Weapon switching and your only real canceling options are Shuriken and Jump cancels) and at times seems balanced around these limits with how its encounter design works.

Black to me just seems to have all these conflicting design decisions. Is it a fun game if you ignore all that? Yes. But I don't understand on what planet in which these systems are masterfully crafted as a whole.

Tell me Retro, you aren't by any chance a Jimmy Wang Yu fan are ya pal?

 

[Riposte]

Man, I really want to believe this is true. I feel Itagaki is one of the greats, but has hardly had the chance to prove that in the last few years. Devil's Third looked like it had a lot of potential. I'm extremely excited for this game. I don't care what it is an exclusive for.

 

[Zezboob]

Good news.

I was sad to hear nothing about it during the TGS.

 

[bidguy]

After what he did with DOA4 and NG2 I dont know why so much people hold him on a pedestal still. Sure he made some great games but not everything he did was golden.

ugh
ng2 was rushed but not because of itagaki
he actually wanted more time. tecmo pushed for an early release.

 

[Discotheque]

god damnit toku i swear to god i just copied that image link from google to post in this thread.

 

[border]

I believe the game is still getting made but I have a hard time believing the story in the OP. It all sounds a little fantastic, the bit about them selling everything they have to purchase back their IP. Especially when you consider that whoever publishes the game is probably going to claim their right to the IP anyway.

 

[VibratingDonkey]

If I where you, I'd change that.

But I actually mean that it's a cool story. Don't really have anything else to add, just wanted to express that I appreciate him sharing it.

 

[kick51]

Regarding the game, one thing that really struck me was something he said about the art direction of Devil's Third: that's among the aspects i care the most in a videogame, and he said that when he entered the room the first time, the team had this huge wall full of concept arts, sketches, pics and whatever... but they were so random they made no sense.
He said there were crazy manga-style drawings, paintings similar to those you can find on ancient Greek pottery, the portrait of a dark cyber-old man, over the top characters taken from comics, reinassance paintings... Very diffente styles, that apparently had no coherence whatsoever as an ensemble.

So he asked what was the point of all that, why inspirations and concepts were so distant from one another (to his eyes there was no clear direction in what the team had come up with), and Itagaki basically answered "To us, it just makes sense. That's what matters, it's gonna be cool", and left him like that, without even adding a single word on that topic.

I just thought of this while playing Devil May Cry 1. It makes no sense. I was always puzzled by Dante as a kid...most heroes have some context or reference. He's just a guy in red with bad ass moves. And he has white hair, despite being young. and him and his brother are directly named after Inferno characters. And he's invading a random haunted gothic castle. And electric guitars. and pizza.

but i wouldn't change a thing!

I know that Karma runs are more than just spamming UT's.

but I still don't like the system. It doesn't reward creativity at all or play to the game's strengths. (Doesn't reward what most players of the game would define as "skill") Purely rewards game knowledge(in the most literal sense. Knowledge of wave composition and geography and time limits of each encounter) and memorizing numbers.



There's alot of filler in the moveset and combo theory is extremely linear and limited. and I can't tell if that was intentional or not.

It works fine in how the enemies and encounters are designed but I don't see how people could praise the combat mechanics of NG set apart from all that.

I don't think any action game is "about combos" to begin with. DMC was just about giving you interesting tools and options to play with. Combo videos were a result of its design, not a cause.



Black rewards high combos with Karma

That's why it's so confusing to me. Game has a combo counter and gives you points based on number of hits, but it has all these limits on what you can do to keep combos going. (Game never embraced Real Time Weapon switching and your only real canceling options are Shuriken and Jump cancels) and at times seems balanced around these limits with how its encounter design works.

Black to me just seems to have all these conflicting design decisions. Is it a fun game if you ignore all that? Yes. But I don't understand on what planet in which these systems are perfect or masterfully crafted as a whole.

Black was about speed. Beating encounters for the time bonus. Finesse. That's it! You find the moves and weapons that fit the encounter, for every encounter. So, getting most of the fights under time was essential to competing with the big boys. After that, UTs, combos, all other categories--those are the tie breakers. The fun in the game came from score attacking it.

Sounds like you pretty much totally missed the point of the game, but now that means you can go back to it with a new perspective.

 

[R3TRODYCE]

I was wondering about this.

 

[a.wd]

NG2 is an unpolished gem. It's clearly rushed, but still better than 90% of the games in the genre.

Ninja Gaiden 2 would probably be the best action game of all time, if Itagaki and his team had 6 months and no fucking interruptions to fix it.

That makes me sad, like knowing that in a parallel Universe Biggie and Jay z could have made their watch the throne album, but it will never happen...

 

[lumzi23]

Strangely, I expected more mockery of Itagaki in this thread.

The little I played of NG2 was disappointing. I don't really know how I feel about this game so we'll see.

 

[BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO]

Could end up being one of those rumored Japanese XBO exclusives.

Yup, Itagaki and Microsoft have a lot of history.

 

[JoeFenix]

I'm just commenting on that I've just never seen such fanaticism for the game anywhere else. To the point where people feel the need to shout from the mountain tops every thread about how much better it is than every other game and why people should play it over the "garbage" ports.

Never seen any other game put up on this pedestal as being perfect and flawless.(especially in the face of glaring flaws) Never seen that mentality so commonly exhibited by fans of similar games. and for this game I've never seen it anyplace other than gaf.

Not implying that such an opinion is invalid so much as I'm implying that it's weird as fuck to me and I don't get it.

The ports ARE shit though, Sigma introduced alot of issues and didn't really improve on anything other than introducing the twin katana weapon.

NG:B is an amazing achievement and is rightfully considered a masterpiece. No game is absolutely flawless but NG:B is an incredibly well rounded, innovative action/adventure game that deserves all the praise it gets.

 

[TheSeks]

The ports ARE shit though, Sigma introduced alot of issues and didn't really improve on anything other than introducing the twin katana weapon.

NG:B is an amazing achievement and is rightfully considered a masterpiece. No game is absolutely flawless but NG:B is an incredibly well rounded, innovative action/adventure game that deserves all the praise it gets.

Eh... Sigma 1 is fine mostly. Yes, it has a few issues but it isn't as terrible as people make it out to be.

Now... Sigma 1+... yeah that's a terrible port and deserves all the hate it gets. Double so for Sigma 2+, which is the same story: Sigma 2 fixed some issues that 2 had (namely rushed so balance on higher difficulties was kinda fixed with less enemies. Screw the haters of this change), but then was ported really badly to where it can't even be played.

 

[Totobeni]

Eh... Sigma 1 is fine mostly. Yes, it has a few issues but it isn't as terrible as people make it out to be.

Now... Sigma 1+... yeah that's a terrible port and deserves all the hate it gets. Double so for Sigma 2+, which is the same story: Sigma 2 fixed some issues that 2 had (namely rushed so balance on higher difficulties was kinda fixed with less enemies. Screw the haters of this change), but then was ported really badly to where it can't even be played.

Sigma 2 (PS3) was the best thing Hayashi ever did thanks to all the tweaks and rebalanced Hayabusa (and Ayane) and I prefer it over NG2, he even gave me hope about the team ninja but sadly then he screwed everything again with NG3 and NGS2+ now I think Hayashi dude need to give NG to another director.

 

[rockman zx]

Thanks for the info, I'm a big fan of Itagaki and this bring tears to my eyes. I hope they re-announce the game soon.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Ninja Gaiden 2 would probably be the best action game of all time, if Itagaki and his team had 6 months and no fucking interruptions to fix it.

That makes me sad, like knowing that in a parallel Universe Biggie and Big L could have made their watch the throne album, but it will never happen...

ftfy

Sigma 2 (PS3) was the best thing Hayashi ever did thanks to all the tweaks and rebalanced Hayabusa (and Ayane) and I prefer it over NG2, he even gave me hope about the team ninja but sadly then he screwed everything again with NG3 and NGS2+ now I think Hayashi dude need to give NG to another director.

Sigma 2 proved Hayashit was a hack. There was plenty ways to balance NG2 without neutering the game (no im not talking about blood) Simply removing the IS entirely being one of the simplest.

Though people still fail to realise that many of hayashits changes were due to platform limitations (enemy count, purple mist) than any directorial vision. Sigma 2+ should of proved that by now. NG2 was built for the Xbox 360. It simply cannot run well without major concessions, Much like Bayonetta.

 

[Spring-Loaded]

Game will be wack as hell anyway. Itagaki is so overrated. Dude is like the Baja Men of game designers.

Woah, woah, hold the fuck up, woah.

have you listened to Junkanoo?? Tell me that album is wack.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

Good news, if factual. Hopefully, this game comes out before we are well into next generation though. How long has it been since it has been announced?

 

[rockman zx]

Good news, if factual. Hopefully, this game comes out before we are well into next generation though. How long has it been since it has been announced?

Announced on June 2010.

 

[TheSpoiler]

"My dad works at Nintendo" but with a smaller lie.

 

[Retro_]

"My dad works at Nintendo" but with a smaller lie.

damn

 

[JoeFenix]

Eh... Sigma 1 is fine mostly. Yes, it has a few issues but it isn't as terrible as people make it out to be.

Now... Sigma 1+... yeah that's a terrible port and deserves all the hate it gets. Double so for Sigma 2+, which is the same story: Sigma 2 fixed some issues that 2 had (namely rushed so balance on higher difficulties was kinda fixed with less enemies. Screw the haters of this change), but then was ported really badly to where it can't even be played.

I was only talking about the ports of NG1, not gonna go into NG2 right now.

It's a weird game for me, I can't tell how I feel about it...

 

[Muchi Muchi Pink]

Sigma 2 was so bad. Lots of empty areas without any enemy approaching you while in NG2 you got stressed every 10 meters. Also to counter this they pushed the HP on enemies. It did fix some issues, just to introduce way bigger ones.

 

[rvy]

AHMGSADS

AHAMGAAAAAAD

Please be true.

Please. Please. Please. Please. Please. Please.

BE STILL MY HEART!

op, I will murder you in your sleep if this is bullshit. Take heed, motherfucker! TAKE HEED!

 

[wiggleb0t]

If things weren't as they are with the current leader steering the ship Ninja Gaiden titanic. 1080p NG2 heavy AA & AF at 60fps with a few minor corrections re-released on XboxOne would make me purchase the XboxOne despite it conflicting with my morals of supporting being fucked over. Purchased once <$200. Post or pre-180 they still fucked up n I'm all about the games but that was on another level of 'take it, take it! you not want? fuck you, take it!'

That aside can you please change the thread title. I mean seriously, rumor at least or 'from little I've supposedly heard Devils 3rd may exist'...

 

[UrbanRats]

Crossing my fingers for this.
And hopefully it's also a good action.

 

[Salvor.Hardin]

Reading the OP as if it's an HP Lovecraft story really adds to the narrative.

 

[Mouth For Games]

I have been looking forward to this since Itagaki left Tecmo and announced his own studio. I'm curious as to when they decided to make the jump to next-gen if the rumor is true, which I'm guessing it is, and how much the game has changed since it's reveal.

The game-play seemed to be a mix of Vanquish and Ninja Gaiden when they first showed it off, so hopefully it did not change much. I'm basically saying this has the potential to be the greatest third-person action game ever created.

As long as there is no multiplayer...

Spoiler

who am I kidding.

 

[Retro_]

I think they said multiplayer was a focus from very early on.

as well as 30 FPS

but the latter might have changed if it's really next gen now

 

[rvy]

I'm basically saying this has the potential to be the greatest third-person action game ever created.

Itagaki in charge of a game with swords, guns and fighting? I mean, holy shit. How can anyone not be excited at the prospect after NG and NG 2's combat system.

 

[Hellraider]

As long as there is no multiplayer...

Spoiler

who am I kidding.

If I remember correct the game was multiplayer heavy and that's why they were (at the time) targetting 30fps for the game.

It has been a couple of years since then and we have no idea what they are doing at this moment.

 

[Yurt]

I believe you Mdk7

I BELIEVE YOU BABY

They should've bought the NG IP too.