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[Jack The Nipper]

They may make ground next year with scorpio. That's a really tough call on power/pricing and what sony does.

I think Switch is another major factor for the short term in Sony losing market share so for now I don't see MS hitting that point and as far as ever, I would have no idea. I see them possibly wanting the Steam pie as of right now.

 

[Movalpolos]

It's already won in MAUs. Sony and Nintendo don't post MAUs as far as I know. They must be scared that people will find out the dirty truth.

 

[aggienader]

I'm not really understanding why this question really matters. Yes being the "worldwide" leader in sales is great and all, but why is it so important from the ground level? They help drive competition. That's all that matters.

It's really sort of an irrelevant question. The more important question is will they help drive competition throughout various regions and continue to do so through the console generation? And you could ask that for Sony and Nintendo as well.

I mean seriously. Why do we act like we're asking for an answer to a deep and well thought out conundrum like this without looking at the answer when it's right in front of us?

 

[wapplew]

MS already won next gen.
When Sony start a new gen from scratch, MS will have 40m+ install base because they don't start over.

 

[Anth0ny]

It would have to get way stronger in Europe.

Luckily Japan is now irrelevant for them.

 

[novabolt]

They must be scared that people will find out the dirty truth.

All three companies are going to be this 8th gen. We currently have no numbers on XB1, WII U, PS now, Vita and PSVR.

 

[daTRUballin]

I'm pretty sure Nintendo made more money considering they sold over 250 million units of hardware and made a profit on all of them.

Umm, 250 million? You might want to check your numbers again. Unless maybe if you're combining Wii and DS sales?

 

[ps3ud0]

I suspect if it ever happens it will be more to do with the failings of Sony or Nintendo rather than MS knocking it out of the park.

I amazed how insular the brand is beyond the US and the seemingly lack of movement within Xbox to really affect real change in that. It seems they are happy with that current perception - was hoping the change in leadership might have been the end to that...

ps3ud0 8)

 

[Bgamer90]

As the lines become blurred from a generational standpoint it becomes increasingly important, especially as more and more users are shifting towards digital.

Imagine if everytime there was an iPhone/iPad refresh everyone had to start from scratch from a software perspective. Do you think that Apple would still maintain the ability to retain over 80% of their userbase if they did this?

This is the direction we are heading in in the console space and if the manufacturers want to "lock in" large proportions of their current active userbases then that's the best way to go about it.

Completely agree. I don't think it's make or break at all but it's definitely becoming increasingly important. PS4 has more overall users but BC is helping Xbox One owners that had an Xbox 360 to stay with the Xbox for their next console(s).

 

[Movalpolos]

I suspect if it ever happens it will be more to do with the failings of Sony or Nintendo rather than MS knocking it out of the park.

I amazed how insular the brand is beyond the US and the seemingly lack of movement within Xbox to really affect real change in that. It seems they are happy with that current perception - was hoping the change in leadership might have been the end to that...

ps3ud0 8)

It's almost ironic. These (thought to be) insular Japanese companies are more forward-thinking and actual World players, whereas MS has carved out an American niche. Sony and Nintendo are closer to Apple in their approaches and appeal to the world.

 

[goldenpp72]

No, they had all the momentum they were ever gonna get on the 360 and shat the bed before the Xbox One released, only to further purge their resources further since. The Xbox brand in my mind will die well before it ever sees huge success again, which is a shame. MS just doesn't seem interested in funding content for it anymore.

 

[WadeitOut]

I care about international sales outside the US about as much as I care about international box office sales outside of the US.

Not even a little.

TFA IS GOD!


But seriously, the company in the lead always ends up doing a bunch of stuff I hate. Like Sony with VR. Nintendo is shovelware.

 

[tareqsalah1]

I'd argue the original Xbox and maybe even the early years of the Xbox 360 have nostalgia going for them at this point......

I respectfully disagree. What games can have nostalgia from these 2 consoles? Halo does but thats kinda it. Maybe gears.

When it comes to sony, even third party games are viewed as sony games and their nostalgia is tied to sony:
-final fantasy
-metal gear
-tomb raider
-resident evil
-kingdom hearts

Every time a new game comes out of these serieses i remember the first time i played them on playstation, there is a connection between me and playstation and nintendo that cant be broken no matter how many times these companies mess up.

 

[DocSeuss]

If I'm not mistaken, the PS3 and X360 were either tied for second place or the 360 was slightly behind the PS3 in third place. I don't think the 360 was higher than the PS3 in the end.

You're mistaken. The 360 outsold the PS3.

It was erroneously reported near the end of the generation that the PS3 had outsold the 360, but this was not correct.

I suspect if it ever happens it will be more to do with the failings of Sony or Nintendo rather than MS knocking it out of the park.

I amazed how insular the brand is beyond the US and the seemingly lack of movement within Xbox to really affect real change in that. It seems they are happy with that current perception - was hoping the change in leadership might have been the end to that...

ps3ud0 8)

It's always funny to me when people go "ah but the Xbox only sells the best in America," as if that matters.

America is a bigger market than the rest of the world combined. The 360 selling better in the US and UK alone is why it outsold the PS3.

 

[FIREKNIGHT2029]

Nope.

Not as long as Sony and mainland Europe & Asia exist. MS worldwide brand just isn't strong enough to compete with Sony in Europe and Asia.

 

[Iced Arcade]

I don't think a #1 banner is part of the company's goal. I think profits are more of a key. You don't have to be #1 to be the most profitable.

 

[MikeE21286]

I agree that many don't care but this is a bad example in my opinion. Those systems came out at a different time.

I personally feel that BC is far more expected now thanks to iterative consoles and companies pushing digital compatibility and purchase access. Many would view the PS5 not having BC whenever it releases as far more disappointing than the PS4 not having it back in 2013/2014.

I agree with this 100%

I don't think a #1 banner is part of the company's goal. I think profits are more of a key. You don't have to be #1 to be the most profitable.

This is not entirely true. Profits are largely relative to the external industry environment. Market-standing is many times a key performance indicator.

 

[Samanosuke Akechi]

Not likely. They only really cater to a certain type of demographic. Plus they don't have nearly the number of memorable ips that Sony and Nintendo have produced over the decades.

 

[OldMan]

M$ should drop a handheld.

 

[Inuhanyou]

MS already won next gen.
When Sony start a new gen from scratch, MS will have 40m+ install base because they don't start over.

That's a weird kind of logic, i don't see the sense in it. Every time hardware changes, the clock resets by default, losing that 40 million customerbase. The previous hardware has to be left behind at some point, and at that point, they start over.

If we're talking about bringing over the software libraries on the other hand, there is nothing stopping Sony from emulating the same situation with a focus on traditional BC for PS5 and an extended cross generational period with PS4/Pro.

Essentially your saying that MS 'don't start over' because they prioritize forwards compatibility with XB1, but that is not the same as not starting over, that is simply extending the support of the previous hardware.

 

[Imperfected]

America is a bigger market than the rest of the world combined.

...?

 

[N.Domixis]

You're mistaken. The 360 outsold the PS3.

It was erroneously reported near the end of the generation that the PS3 had outsold the 360, but this was not correct.



It's always funny to me when people go "ah but the Xbox only sells the best in America," as if that matters.

America is a bigger market than the rest of the world combined. The 360 selling better in the US and UK alone is why it outsold the PS3.

Fortunately, the reason for such a massive gap was the kinect. That's gone forever.

 

[goldenpp72]

You're mistaken. The 360 outsold the PS3.

It was erroneously reported near the end of the generation that the PS3 had outsold the 360, but this was not correct.



It's always funny to me when people go "ah but the Xbox only sells the best in America," as if that matters.

America is a bigger market than the rest of the world combined. The 360 selling better in the US and UK alone is why it outsold the PS3.

Well first off, this is false, second off, it ultimately did not outsell the PS3, pretty sure 360 ended up in last place.

 

[Luminaire]

MS already won next gen.
When Sony start a new gen from scratch, MS will have 40m+ install base because they don't start over.

Why would you assume PS5 won't have BC?

 

[FIREKNIGHT2029]

Nope

While japan is not strong hardware wise you cant over look this numbers on a weekly basis

System | This Week | Last Week | Last Year | YTD | Last YTD | LTD |
+-------+------------+------------+------------+------------+------------+-------------+
| PS4 # | 98.684 | 116.593 | 40.289 | 1.608.553 | 1.095.199 | 3.739.286 |
| XB1 # | 363 | 315 | 234 | 7.861 | 17.168 | 71.912 |

This is just mind boggling. People still believe that MS can ever win worldwide with numbers like that?

 

[Slangblade]

I think it might be possible if PS5 is not BC. I don't think the consumers will let Sony get away with it again.

Is this a joke post?

 

[novabolt]

Well first off, this is false, second off, it ultimately did not outsell the PS3, pretty sure 360 ended up in last place.

Numbers? From a valid source as well.

 

[Iced Arcade]

I agree with this 100%



This is not entirely true. Profits are largely relative to the external industry environment. Market-standing is many times a key performance indicator.

ex:
MS most likely made more money last gen from xbox live subscriptions than any 3 companies made from hardware.

Things like deals with AMD play a factor and software attach rate makes a huge difference as well.

Not saying hardware sales are not important... just saying business is more than a "I'm #1"

 

[Zen_Arcade]

I agree that many don't care but this is a bad example in my opinion. Those systems came out at a different time.

I personally feel that BC is far more expected now thanks to iterative consoles and companies pushing digital compatibility and purchase access. Many would view the PS5 not having BC whenever it releases as far more disappointing than the PS4 not having it back in 2013/2014.

This is the truth. Imagine someone going all digital this gen and finding out that none of their games will transfer over to that company's new console.

That's just a big middle finger.

 

[xxracerxx]

Numbers? From a valid source as well.

Doc should also be asked for numbers.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I don't think people should go in expecting PS5 to not have BC. Sony was in a unique situation with the PS3's architecture, that won't be repeated with whatever x86 based configuration they use next. They won't have an excuse.

Again, even without the iterative push of Pro and Scorpio, i think people would have expected it anyway considering the importance of these companies holding onto their marketshare and ecosystems.

 

[daTRUballin]

I respectfully disagree. What games can have nostalgia from these 2 consoles? Halo does but thats kinda it. Maybe gears.

When it comes to sony, even third party games are viewed as sony games and their nostalgia is tied to sony:
-final fantasy
-metal gear
-tomb raider
-resident evil
-kingdom hearts

Every time a new game comes out of these serieses i remember the first time i played them on playstation, there is a connection between me and playstation and nintendo that cant be broken no matter how many times these companies mess up.

Well, I guess you have a point about Sony's third party offerings being nostalgic for many people. I would argue that people have nostalgia for the Xbox brand when it comes to first party stuff. Whereas for Sony it may be the other way around, although I'm sure some of Sony's first party stuff is nostalgic for people as well.

I can definitely see franchises like Halo, Gears, Fable, and Forza being nostalgic for gamers. And if there's not much nostalgia for them now, I'm sure there will be in the near future. Microsoft is currently on their third console and it's been 15 years since the release of their first console. There's bound to be nostalgia coming from somewhere at this point.

Also, we can't forget that they own Minecraft. That's a huge deal. Sure, Minecraft may be relatively new at the moment, so there's no way nostalgia can be attached to it, but I'm 99% sure kids who grew up with this game will miss the "good old days of playing Minecraft." Although I guess Minecraft isn't really a good example since it's not just on Xbox platforms, but it's technically an MS franchise. It's a weird one.

 

[Jacksinthe]

Truthfully within the next 10 years no. It's possible in the future but right now it's not probable. I feel they really need a brand and messaging refresh, tbh. Sony went bonkers with the PS3 in terms of messaging in a literal 180 to win the 7th gen and while this gen MS is turning things around, I feel they are focusing on all the wrong reasons how a gaming console needs to stand out. Their approach seems more tit for tat and reactionary, not progressive and visionary (in the right direction, mind you).

 

[novabolt]

Doc should also be asked for numbers.

I didn't see his post. Now that I have, I'm just laughing at both posts.

People can't face fact that XB as a console alone won't win.

 

[Luminaire]

Truthfully within the next 10 years no. It's possible in the future but right now it's not probable. I feel they really need a brand and messaging refresh, tbh. Sony went bonkers with the PS3 in terms of messaging in a literal 180 to win the 7th gen and while this gen MS is turning things around, I feel they are focusing on all the wrong reasons how a gaming console needs to stand out. Their approach seems more tit for tat and reactionary, not progressive and visionary (in the right direction, mind you).

While Sony did fix their issues for the most part, they did not win the 7th Gen. Nintendo did. By a huge gulf.

 

[Blobbers]

They'll easily do it next gen when they partner up with Sega and create the Dreambox.

 

[DSix]

They have a good shot in North America only.

Worldwide they are done.

 

[Inuhanyou]

While Sony did fix their issues for the most part, they did not win the 7th Gen. Nintendo did. By a huge gulf.

About 15 million or so...15% isnt THAT huge a gulf.

I think people's views of Wii are so out of whack because it was a weird cycle. It burned really hot but went out way quicker than the other consoles, so it has a huge number of hardware sold, but it became obsolete fairly quickly as phones and other devices became the next time waster, and the core gaming market was still focused on the HD twins.

When did Wii start to decline, like 2009 or so?

 

[Celcius]

No chance without more japanese games

 

[Luminaire]

About 15 million or so...15% isnt THAT huge a gulf.

I think people's views of Wii are so out of whack because it was a weird cycle. It burned really hot but went out way quicker than the other consoles, so it has a huge number of hardware sold, but it became obsolete fairly quickly as phones and other devices became the next time waster, and the core gaming market was still focused on the HD twins.

When did Wii start to decline, like 2009 or so?

15m seems pretty big to me, but they did kinda faceplant after a while. I'm sure the chart has a steep dive around 2010.

 

[Samanosuke Akechi]

While Sony did fix their issues for the most part, they did not win the 7th Gen. Nintendo did. By a huge gulf.

I don't know if I'd call it a huge gulf. Didn't they just barely cross 100 million mark where Sony was approximately 84-85 ish million?

Again, a 14-15 million or so gap isn't what I'd call huge. Sizable but nothing close to what Sony usually wins by.

 

[Zedox]

Generations no longer exist. It's about platform. They lost the war in the battle of the last gen. The platform war is just beginning.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Generations no longer exist. It's about platform. They lost the war in the battle of the last gen. The platform war is just beginning.

As long as Sony and Nintendo still see console generations as a thing, MS doesn't decide the war platform.

They are the only ones who have dismissed generations so far, and they are playing their own game to win or lose.

 

[Luminaire]

I don't know if I'd call it a huge gulf. Didn't they just barely cross 100 million mark where Sony was approximately 84-85 ish million?

Again, a 14-15 million or so gap isn't what I'd call huge. Sizable but nothing close to what Sony usually wins by.

For some reason I was thinking Sony and MS were still around 70m when I posted, hence why I said huge. 30m would be massive but it's only 15, which I still consider pretty large.

There's a bigger gap between PS4 and XB1 than there were XB360/PS3 and Wii it seems.

 

[Fdkn]

America is a bigger market than the rest of the world combined.

You wish

 

[Shock32]

Its hard for xbox to win because the Playstation brand is so deep. Seriously comparing the stables of each company I jst dont think its possible. If Microsoft released the greatest lineup of games, the most powerful hardware. All Sony has to do is release the next masterpiece fron naughty dog, or something like spiderman, days gone, death Stranding. Something from their worldwide studios just puts them on the map with gamers.

Ms has a chance in NA. No doubt, but it just takes one game to even the odds. I still think the last of us was the biggest momentum shift ever. Not just from last gen but it carried over to this Gen in a big way. Everybody was talking about it in a time when the 360 was just cruising on 3Rd party games. Why wouldnt somebody buy a playstation system for Atleast one of those games. Example right now is death Stranding, I walked in to my work and people were talking about it. Its not just nostalgia (crash bandicoot) but something out of the norm is what PS is about. It will never go away,ever.

 

[pixelation]

Sure they will. It's Sony. People worship them as if the company can see them as anything other than just a number. "Uncharted 5 guys? TLoU 3? Look at these graphics guys. It's the Naughty Gods! AMIRIGHT AMIRIGHT?!?!? I mean no BC, no folders again, and we're not going to allow you to stream video files anymore either, but PS5. Greatness is still waiting!"

I hope this is a joke post!!!

Anyways... i don't see MS ever being in the pole position world wide speaking, much less with the recent decision to practically leave the XB with close to zero exclusive games. What is the purpose of owning an XB again?, i really don't see the appeal. It has close to zero exclusive games on it... i think that the Scorpio will be the last dedicated box we get from MS.

 

[Bear Force One]

I feel like 9th gen will upset a lot of people.

With clear thought out plans, I could see the XB brand (as a whole) dominating. XB console stands no chance on its own at the minute.

Zero chance.

 

[Samanosuke Akechi]

For some reason I was thinking Sony and MS were still around 70m when I posted, hence why I said huge. 30m would be massive but it's only 15, which I still consider pretty large.

There's a bigger gap between PS4 and XB1 than there were XB360/PS3 and Wii it seems.

Correct. PS4 is currently over 50 million WW where Xbox one is rumored to be around 24-25 million or so.

 

[bitbydeath]

MS already won next gen.
When Sony start a new gen from scratch, MS will have 40m+ install base because they don't start over.

How's that work?
Launch PS3s had both PS1 and PS2 BC, does that mean you combine all those sales to get the final PS3 numbers?

Or are you saying that MS won't launch a new console post Scorpio and it will just be manually upgraded parts from then on?