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Dragon Ball Super |OT5| Zenophobia

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S

Skii

Member
Just watched the episode. It was decent but a bit disappointing. Models were off a lot especially Beerus at the end. And I agree that Gohan's character is slowly going all over the place. This imo is how he should be but the way Super has built him up it's now a bit nonsensical that his "saiyan blood" is making him excited.

I think it's pretty much confirmed Goku has a new transformation he isn't telling anyone. Vegeta is going to have a stroke when he sees it I'm sure.

Lol @ Whis accelerating child birth.
 
K

Kagari

Crystal Bearer
Skii said:
Just watched the episode. It was decent but a bit disappointing. Models were off a lot especially Beerus at the end. And I agree that Gohan's character is slowly going all over the place. This imo is how he should be but the way Super has built him up it's now a bit nonsensical that his "saiyan blood" is making him excited. .
Click to expand...

They screwed up by making Gohan fairly one-note in Super early on. I guess I'm okay with what we're getting now so long as it continues past this arc? We'll see. Either way they seem to be really building him up a lot.
 
I

Icyflamez96

Member
Just read the manga chapter in English. Continues to be better. I don't like SSG much so I didn't like seeing it back initially, but the strat Vegeta figured out with it justifies it.

It'd be interesting to see how that'd look like in animation.
 
L

Linkstrikesback

Member
Icyflamez96 said:
Just read the manga chapter in English. Continues to be better. I don't like SSG much so I didn't like seeing it back initially, but the strat Vegeta figured out with it justifies it.

It'd be interesting to see how that'd look like in animation.
Click to expand...

I would have been more impressed if it wasn't basically the strategy future trunks used in DBmultiverse
 
S

Sec0nd

Member
GaimeGuy said:
I love the running gag of future zeno adjusting his pose to match present zeno.
Click to expand...

Watch it be the thing that'll save the destroying of universes. Zeno will do the 'I'm-erasing-you-all'-gesture and Future Zeno will do the opposite gesture, canceling each other out.
 
S

Slaythe

Member
I love Zeno so much tbh.

Beerus has also been a much MUCH better character this arc.

He is kinda the voice of reason now. Kaioshin is also hilarious and isn't afraid of Beerus anymore now that they know about the life link.

Whis has solidified his neutral position, which I appreciate.

Gohan was great until this episode but I'm gonna brush it off. They are really giving new life to all those characters.

And as for Goku, they didn't fix him but they made him come out with his selfishness, which I guess I can respect. I just despise his unjustified over confidence currently.

edit : and buu is the same but he was perfect so no need to change !
 
C

Chaotic-Strike

Banned
I like how Toyotarou traced Gohan punching Super Buu in the gut for the Zamasu and Goku fight. He even left the kanji exactly the same from that panel.

Old habits die hard I guess.
 
S

Skii

Member
Kagari said:
They screwed up by making Gohan fairly one-note in Super early on. I guess I'm okay with what we're getting now so long as it continues past this arc? We'll see. Either way they seem to be really building him up a lot.
Click to expand...

It would be absolutely terrible if he just reverts back to "I don't care what's happening even if it endangers everyone I love". Hopefully after this he'll play some sort of role as a fighter in future arcs because he's the most capable alongside Goku and Vegeta.

The current build up is a bit insane. I'm trying to keep my expectations in check but I really feel like he might do something special.
 
A

ArchedThunder

Banned
Skii said:
It would be absolutely terrible if he just reverts back to "I don't care what's happening even if it endangers everyone I love". Hopefully after this he'll play some sort of role as a fighter in future arcs because he's the most capable alongside Goku and Vegeta.

The current build up is a bit insane. I'm trying to keep my expectations in check but I really feel like he might do something special.
Click to expand...

Gohan is life, Gohan is love.
 
S

Skeeter49

Member
I don't think Gohan's too out of character, he was kind of the same in the Buu saga, not being much of a fighter in those years between Cell and Buu, but getting excited once he started fighting again, this is a little more extreme, but it seems to be similar to that, not missing fighting when he was trying to live a normal life, but once he gets exposed to stronger people, he's back into it easily.

Assuming the Krillin stuff is the ROSAT, Goku's imagination, or a Whis creation of something similar to the ROSAT.

I assume Vegeta's going to be mad about the Whis birth?
 
S

Slaythe

Member
Skeeter49 said:
I don't think Gohan's too out of character, he was kind of the same in the Buu saga, not being much of a fighter in those years between Cell and Buu, but getting excited once he started fighting again, this is a little more extreme, but it seems to be similar to that, not missing fighting when he was trying to live a normal life, but once he gets exposed to stronger people, he's back into it easily.

Assuming the Krillin stuff is the ROSAT, Goku's imagination, or a Whis creation of something similar to the ROSAT.
Click to expand...

Gohan back then wasn't far behind everybody else though.

Right now Gohan is a fly compared to the strongest.
 
S

Skeeter49

Member
Slaythe said:
Gohan back then wasn't far behind everybody else though.

Right now Gohan is a fly compared to the strongest.
Click to expand...

While he didn't know it until the Majin Vegeta stuff, he was weaker than Goku and Vegeta, but again that's suppose to be what's getting him excited, fighting people who are stronger than him and getting stronger from it. He'll still be stronger than most of the fighters on his team, since it's a safe assumption he'll at least be on par with how he was during his Super Buu fight, if not stronger, that's more relevant than everybody but Goku and Vegeta.

With the Future Trunks arc existing, power level scaling is a bit messed up right now anyway, all it takes is a rage boost and we have another Future Trunks situation where he goes from a fly to on par with Goku and Vegeta.
 
S

Slaythe

Member
Skeeter49 said:
While he didn't know it until the Majin Vegeta stuff, he was weaker than Goku and Vegeta, but again that's suppose to be what's getting him excited, fighting people who are stronger than him and getting stronger from it. He'll still be stronger than most of the fighters on his team, since it's a safe assumption he'll at least be on par with how he was during his Super Buu fight, if not stronger, that's more relevant than everybody but Goku and Vegeta.

With the Future Trunks arc existing, power level scaling is a bit messed up right now anyway, all it takes is a rage boost and we have another Future Trunks situation where he goes from a fly to on par with Goku and Vegeta.
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I'm not saying you're wrong. But you have to open your eyes and realize the big issues :

1) Gohan isn't just weaker than Goku and Vegeta. He is literally irrelevant and can't even damage anybody on their level. He's a fly. Remember how Beerus trashed him, how Frieza trashed him, etc...

2) Why is he getting excited ? "Woah they're stronger" so fucking what, he has been surrounded by people a billion times stronger than him for years now and that didn't bother him

3) Gohan doesn't know that a "rage boost" can instantly grant him god level so he has no reason to act that confident. "Woah awesome, fighters are stronger than my dad that's 4 billion times stronger than me, in the upcoming tournament that might eradicate my world and my family ! Woohoooo !" .

This is horrendous. I don't care at all if Gohan is indeed top 3 dog, or if he does good, I'm not saying he won't, or shouldn't, I'm saying, RIGHT NOW, he has no reason to act this way.
 
A

Ashodin

Member
Ash735 said:
Again, he was surprised at how much of an upgrade SSB was and didn't have time to prep, literally caught his breath after the quick assault and then taking that blast to the face. It came off more that way to me at least that he wasn't expecting THAT amount of increase from
Click to expand...
That eleven avatar doing work
 
B

Byakuya769

Member
Gohan's reaction to powerful foes with his universe facing eradication should have been "shit, I must get stronger, or I'll lose everything."

Him getting excited about fights seemed pretty out of character given the stakes.
 
M

Mory Dunz

Member
Why did goku's shoes change as a SSG....

goku_super_saiyan_god_2_by_bardocksonic-d9ac4zb.png


goku_super_saiyan_power_up__by_eymsmiley-d9370an.png
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I know this isn't official art, but they're on model.
His laces become fully red and you can see his white soles


fun fact: in old DBZ goku's vertical line used to yellow and his horiz laces red. Not sure when it switched (maybe around Frieza), but someone probably forgot

4689789-4840374150-mikot.png
Click to expand...
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

Member
Slaythe said:
This is horrendous. I don't care at all if Gohan is indeed top 3 dog, or if he does good, I'm not saying he won't, or shouldn't, I'm saying, RIGHT NOW, he has no reason to act this way.
Click to expand...

Well, last time we saw it in the anime Gohan was keeping up with a SSJ1 Goku who supposedly wasn't holding back. People assumed that he was holding back in spite of the dialogue, but maybe the writers aren't going with that. So, the gap might not be that big even if they're doing a very bad job in showing why it's smaller now.
 
S

Slaythe

Member
NeonZ said:
Well, last time we saw it in the anime Gohan was keeping up with a SSJ1 Goku who supposedly wasn't holding back. People assumed that he was holding back in spite of the dialogue, but maybe the writers aren't going with that. So, the gap might not be that big even if they're doing a very bad job in showing why it's smaller now.
Click to expand...

Once again, I'm really not against Gohan getting strong.

It's just.....

I'm getting tired of those fucking shitty ass undeserved power ups out of nowhere.

In FnF, we had to endure SSB Vegeta (SSB at all ?) and Golden Frieza. They tried to fix that a bit in Super.

Then Kaioken SSB out of nowhere. Ok why not. It's an old technique.

Then Trunks Black Vegeta and Goku broke their limits about 47 times in one arc.

And now Gohan is supposedly on god levels.

I can't handle this. I can't.

And while we're at it the Super Saiyan and base form depiction in terms of power is all over the place and I'm getting tired of that too.
 
V

Varjet

Member
Slaythe said:
And while we're at it the Super Saiyan and base form depiction in terms of power is all over the place and I'm getting tired of that too.
Click to expand...
Yeah, when fighting the wolf guys, Gohan and Goku going from base form to SSJ barely seemed to make any difference.
 
LordOfChaos

LordOfChaos

Member
"I already saw you go blue, just moments ago all the gods were commenting on the immense pressure of it, but I'm shocked, SHOCKED, that you were holding in more power than SS!"
-Toppo
 
T

The Silver

Member
I prefer the manga power scaling with the base and regular SSJ forms presumably still being "buu saga" level.(only way to make sense of SSG still existing) It makes things like Trunks vs Goku make a lot more sense. It also tones down the U6 characters like Frost and Cabba, now they aren't inexplicably god level, it makes more sense for Cabba to be equal to a SSJ Vegeta and for Piccolo to hang with Frost for a bit.
 
U

Unknown One

Member
In Super, base to SSJ1 is just a color change. In DBZ on the other hand it felt stronger. SSJ1 to SSJ2 felt really strong, same with SSJ2 to SSJ3.

Super in general seems a lot weaker for everything.
 
A

ArchedThunder

Banned
Hellwarden said:
Is Gohan gonna regain his power in 40 hours?

We could have really used said power when Freiza returned...
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It's not like they had any prep time for that, plus Gohan's already been training for over a year now. Depending on what they do if they say he lost his ultimate form, but has grown stronger than that because of training and then re-obtains his ultimate form on top of his current power through either Elder Kaioshin or meditation I can buy that.
 
A

ArchedThunder

Banned
Unknown One said:
In Super, base to SSJ1 is just a color change. In DBZ on the other hand it felt stronger. SSJ1 to SSJ2 felt really strong, same with SSJ2 to SSJ3.

Super in general seems a lot weaker for everything.
Click to expand...

Goku vs Frost - Super Saiyan turned it into a one sided battle
Vegeta vs Cabba - Super Saiyan turned it into a one sided battle
Gohan vs Watagash - Super Saiyan allowed Gohan to win with one blast
Gohan vs Lavender - Super Saiyan gave Gohan the edge until his body rotted too much
Goku vs Bergamo - Goku was giving Bergamo his power the whole fight

There's not many fights where they start in base and then transform into Super Saiyan, and the ones that do still show that Super Saiyan is a boost.
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
Gohan has been training with one of the best trainers in the universe. Piccolo made him strong again, believe in Piccolo. Believe in Gohan.
 
U

Unknown One

Member
Not talking about that, my bad.

Super's animation is straight up ass. There is hardly any visual differences for power ups. Hardly any visceral changes in a fight at all.

SSJ1 Goku vs Frieza had their punches's shockwave destroy the terrain.
SSJ1 Goku vs Perfect Cell was all out mayhem in terms of destruction and speed.
SSJ2 Kid Gohan is drastically faster than everybody else and his power was enough to 1 shot Cell Jrs to the point where Vegeta shit his pants.
SSJ3 Goku shook the planet while powering up.
SSJ Vegetto moved so fast against Super Buu that he looked like he barely moved at all.

Super fails in comparison.
 
B

brinstar

Member
Unknown One said:
In Super, base to SSJ1 is just a color change. In DBZ on the other hand it felt stronger. SSJ1 to SSJ2 felt really strong, same with SSJ2 to SSJ3.

Super in general seems a lot weaker for everything.
Click to expand...

I'm struggling to remember any time Goku even fights in base in DBZ after getting SS
 
D

dlauv

Member
Gohan's switch flipped when he figured out a strat to counter blindness, lol. It seemed pretty clear. He started smirking and really getting into it when his back was against the wall. But I'm a bit surprised he's not so concerned about the survival of the Universe. We might see a more concerned Gohan when he sees his family again.

I laughed when Goku got caught in an "rear naked choke." JJ shits on everything exciting about fighting in the UFC and I'm surprised the Z-warriors hadn't fought a counterpart sooner. And I liked the tornado attack Toppo opened with. It had Goku shook a bit.

I like that the fights are so inventive now. It's like the U6 tournament but with less bullshit. The final push with Blue and the Kamehameha was hype. Goku mentioned pushing beyond his limits, so I think we're going to see a new form.

Also, Goku's acted surprisingly aloof this entire episode. He hasn't responded directly to blunt criticism like he usually would have.
 
L

LogicStep

Member
No idea how they are going to win unless there is a big gap between the strongest and the not so strong in each of the teams so Goku and others can actually hold their own.
 
F

Fulminator

Member
I really want a concrete answer as to how strong Beerus (and the rest of the GoDs are for that matter)

Is there a requirement for the GoD to be the strongest being in their respective universe (aside from the angels)??

Part of me feels like Goku is being particularly resistant towards Beerus because he knows he'll be as strong or stronger than him soon, but this also seems ridiculous, and contradicts what toriyama said about Goku and Vegeta surpassing Beerus (we all know how Toriyama is with his claims/continuity though lol)

Even just saying yeah , they have to be the strongest would be fine. I'm particularly wondering this both because of the Goku comment, but also regarding Toppo. If Toppo was a GoD candidate, and did become the GoD, Jiren would be stronger than the u11 GoD. how would they deal with Jiren going rogue if that were the case?
 
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