Support NeoGAF

[liquidspeed]

I like Thom Hartman but keep in mind that he has an anti-nuclear power viewpoint.

The situation at Fukushima is a mess . . . but calling it 'TOTALLY OUT OF CONTROL' is overly negative. The area around the plant is toast and will need to be abandoned like the area around Chernobyl.

Of course when viewing a news story one should be aware of the presenter's bias's. I would say that if in fact the report( that the fuel rods are melting into the Earth with cracks spewing radioactive steam) is true, then "Out of control" would not be an improper characterization. However, "OUT OF CONTROL" does not necessarily mean mass public danger or death in areas away from the plant, and a distinction should be made between the two.

 

[Upsidedown Fuji]

I just saw a short news clip on TV about Minamisoma in the 30km voluntary evacuation zone near the Fukushima powerplant. The clip mentioned that the city is having some kind of campaign this month to clean up the radiation on roofs and soil as best it can to entice residents to return. Apparently of 70,000 residents there, 30,000 or so have left.

So I figured I'd look for more videos about Minamisoma and I found a short documentary in English made by a guy who drove in and did some interviews there. The footage is from late spring so its a few months old but not much has changed there from what I've seen on TV and read on news sites. It's worth a watch if you're curious what life is like there and how uncertain things are concerning levels of radiation are really "healthy" to live in. http://www.youtube.com/user/DocumentingIan#p/u/8/iGXy0XiFKw0

So sad.

 

[Shouta]

If they can get a lot of it cleaned up, it might be ok around Minamisoma but the government, local municipalities, and even the people in the local areas themselves are really slowing things down. Some of that has been leaking into the news recently too.

 

[Steelrain]

The yen really is a damn nightmare right now :O I get paid in U.S dollars mainly so its been painful lol. Im headed to Miyagi next month with my school to assist cleanup. Ill try to post pics when I get back.

 

[Upsidedown Fuji]

If they can get a lot of it cleaned up, it might be ok around Minamisoma but the government, local municipalities, and even the people in the local areas themselves are really slowing things down. Some of that has been leaking into the news recently too.

I agree it doesn't hurt to try but I think this may be somewhat of a futile effort at this moment. The problem is that there are lots of trees and open stretches of land around. Even with cleaning up topsoil and rinsing down buildings in heavy traffic areas you're still left with the stuff that is in areas you didn't reach. Fukushima is known for its harsh winds during the winter. A lot of it may just blow back in from the uninhabitable zones. I think its a bit early to just say hey it's cool, we're cleaning stuff up come back home. I guess time will tell.

I am glad things are starting to leak back into the news again. It's really frustrating how easily forgotten this all is. It feels like a lot of it has been deliberately swept under the rug. Humans have gold fish like brains when it comes to news. They forget quickly if not reminded often. :/

 

[Upsidedown Fuji]

The yen really is a damn nightmare right now :O I get paid in U.S dollars mainly so its been painful lol. Im headed to Miyagi next month with my school to assist cleanup. Ill try to post pics when I get back.

Bummer man. I couldn't imagine getting paid in dollars while living here right now. I doubt your employer is willing to adjust pay for current exchange rates.

I look forward to seeing some of your pictures from the cleanup work. Good luck and stay safe.

 

[Zoc]

One of my students today is a professor at Tohoku University, in charge of testing samples sent in for radiation, specifically cesium. She says that every sample she's tested had more cesium than is usual, but none of it has been above the government-set limits. She didn't give me any numbers. Still, she was nervous about it, and she said I should send in samples from my family's rice fields (in Iwate) when the harvest comes in.

 

[Upsidedown Fuji]

One of my students today is a professor at Tohoku University, in charge of testing samples sent in for radiation, specifically cesium. She says that every sample she's tested had more cesium than is usual, but none of it has been above the government-set limits. She didn't give me any numbers. Still, she was nervous about it, and she said I should send in samples from my family's rice fields (in Iwate) when the harvest comes in.

Wow so you have a family in Japan with a rice farm. That's cool. I'm so sorry about all this mess. It must be really screwing things up for your family if they are large scale harvesters.

It's good to hear the tested samples from the professor you know aren't over the government set limit but I think the problem lies in the government set number and standards of distributing important information in an orderly and efficient manner. The public is loosing their blind confidence in them and for good reason. After the beef screw up it really gave fuel to the fire that things up north are all bad even if they may not be. Hopefully the government standards actually mean something besides just being placed to give a false sense of security. It would be really sad 10 or so years down the road to find out a large group of children who grew up in the affected regions develop symptoms related to their long exposures to once contaminated environments.

I am really curious how the fall rice harvest will go. Hopefully the worries have been hyped up for nothing but it doesn't hurt to be skeptical and ask for forgiveness later. The farmers are screwed this season good news or not. There's just too much going on for everybody to go back to normal grocery shopping habits. Grown in Japan doesn't have the same meaning it used to just a few months ago before 3/11.

 

[Zoc]

Wow so you have a family in Japan with a rice farm. That's cool. I'm so sorry about all this mess. It must be really screwing things up for your family if they are large scale harvesters.

Ha, no, they're as small-scale as it gets. My wife's aunt and uncle (both in their eighties) run the place, and make enough rice to feed about twenty people a year. Most of it goes to family members. It's a very common in Tohoku, where almost everyone seems to get their rice from family fields. That's why people are so worried. If they bought rice from a supermarket, they'd expect it to have been tested, but they have no idea how to go about testing the home-grown stuff themselves.

But as you say, it's not like the government standards themselves are based on any solid research or anything, so we're damned either way. At this point, if the radiation in food and water is high enough to cause health problems, there's nothing much we can do about it, besides banning the stuff that's obviously too radioactive. We just have to hope that most levels turn out to be harmless.

 

[Upsidedown Fuji]

Ha, no, they're as small-scale as it gets. My wife's aunt and uncle (both in their eighties) run the place, and make enough rice to feed about twenty people a year. Most of it goes to family members. It's a very common in Tohoku, where almost everyone seems to get their rice from family fields. That's why people are so worried. If they bought rice from a supermarket, they'd expect it to have been tested, but they have no idea how to go about testing the home-grown stuff themselves.

But as you say, it's not like the government standards themselves are based on any solid research or anything, so we're damned either way. At this point, if the radiation in food and water is high enough to cause health problems, there's nothing much we can do about it, besides banning the stuff that's obviously too radioactive. We just have to hope that most levels turn out to be harmless.

Ah yeah small family farms. Those are just as wide spread as large co-ops. It will be a shame if the stuff they spent growing this year is inedible. It's not their fault.

My family here in Japan only grows smaller vegetables like cucumbers, tomatoes, eggplants, potatoes, and onions. Its just a small plot of land behind the house but we do get free rice from neighborhood family friends. So I know how that testing worry feels like. Although I doubt its as big as a problem where I live compared to you.

Good luck with the volunteer work.

 

[sfedai0]

I just read an article where the area around the nuclear plant will be unlivable for many years. As tragic as it is displacing the thousands, it will be fascinating to observe nature doing its work and overtaking the area. Like a enclosed bio dome..

 

[luoapp]

Ha, no, they're as small-scale as it gets. My wife's aunt and uncle (both in their eighties) run the place, and make enough rice to feed about twenty people a year. Most of it goes to family members. It's a very common in Tohoku, where almost everyone seems to get their rice from family fields. That's why people are so worried. If they bought rice from a supermarket, they'd expect it to have been tested, but they have no idea how to go about testing the home-grown stuff themselves.

But as you say, it's not like the government standards themselves are based on any solid research or anything, so we're damned either way. At this point, if the radiation in food and water is high enough to cause health problems, there's nothing much we can do about it, besides banning the stuff that's obviously too radioactive. We just have to hope that most levels turn out to be harmless.

From what I've read, the way radioactive contamination gets into people's digest system is from the deposition on leafy vegetables ( like spinach ), and grass eaten by cows, consequently transfered into milk. Rice should be much safer than leafy veges: people don't eat rice leaves, and the out shell (chaff) needs to be removed during the process.
( I am not an expert by any means, just provide the information I know. Then again, if you can find some people to test the rice, that's much better.)

 

[Upsidedown Fuji]

Here's an interesting read about what things are like in the abandoned no entry zone around the Fukushima nuclear plant. I wish pictures were provided. I can't even begin to imagine all the dead livestock and broken into buildings in the evacuation zone.
http://japanfocus.org/events/view/109

 

[Ether_Snake]

They don't break into houses over there.

 

[bbsting120]

They don't break into houses over there.

Not true. There's been widespread looting in the evac zones. Many of the people who have gone back in on the buses to collect a few of their belongings have reported things stolen.

Though I'm sure it's still much better than if the same thing happened in other parts of the world.

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

Wouldn't the things they are looting from the evac zones have high levels of radiation? Joke's on them?

 

[Upsidedown Fuji]

They don't break into houses over there.

Obviously you have a very rosey image of Japan. There are plenty of nails that stick up in Japan.

The buildings and other places vandalized were most likely done by street thugs/punks refered to as chimpira which are very common to that area and most of Japan for that matter. I doubt it is anything as bad as what would come of riots in other parts of the world, but the fact that it happens show that humans are opportunists anywhere in the world.

What is very Japanese about the whole ordeal is how civilized the majority is about the evacuations and generally staying out of the restricted zones.

Anyhow the article wasn't about the vandalism. It focused more on the dead livestock and ghost towns that remain while comparing it to what happened in Chernobyl. I still think its worth a read.

 

[Trokil]

6 Months later

I am impressed, they really work hard in Japan.

 

[kingocfs]

Amazing.

 

[Riposte]

Having a big ass boat in the middle of a residential area would have made my RPG-fueled kid imagination run wild. Too bad they'll get rid of it before the area is livable.

 

[Angelus Errare]

Damn impressive.

 

[Shalashaska161]

That's an amazing cleanup effort. Props to the people of Japan.

 

[LQX]

I wonder where they're putting all those debris. Grass is growing back pretty fast which is good sign there was not much damage from the ocean water.

 

[Mik2121]

Having a big ass boat in the middle of a residential area would have made my RPG-fueled kid imagination run wild. Too bad they'll get rid of it before the area is livable.

I heard in the news that they would keep a boat in the middle of the town (don't remember which town though, so it might not be the one in the pic), fix it so it doesn't move nor anything, and use it as a museum for the whole thing.

That's what I heard anyway, dunno if it will happen or not, or when will it be ready.

 

[Rur0ni]

Nice to see the reconstruction efforts. Strong society.

 

[crazy monkey]

I heard in the news that they would keep a boat in the middle of the town (don't remember which town though, so it might not be the one in the pic), fix it so it doesn't move nor anything, and use it as a museum for the whole thing.

That's what I heard anyway, dunno if it will happen or not, or when will it be ready.

That would be good idea.

 

[Trokil]

I wonder where they're putting all those debris. Grass is growing back pretty fast which is good sign there was not much damage from the ocean water.

According to some reports they are recycling up to 50% of it.

 

[SMT]

Update on the nuclear crisis from RT Today: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sET4fqowKIg&feature=channel_video_title

Thank you for sharing the truth liquidspeed, I think we are about to see waves of knowledgeable adoptive citizens of Japanese descent in the coming years.

 

[wenis]

That's just in 6 months? Goddamn, that's just amazing.

 

[Ether_Snake]

The water must have become heavily polluted from all the debris:|

 

[speculawyer]

I've been tempted to create a Fukushima nuclear thread. That story is ongoing and fascinating. The great 'show curtain' they are building now is funny. Cool that they have innovative ideas . . . but the fact that they are building a massive shower curtain shows how desperate we are in dealing with these types of problems. Like Chernobyl, the slag of melted fuel will probably just remain as is for the next 10 to 100 years since there is no technology for dealing with it.

 

[The Elite]

I've been tempted to create a Fukushima nuclear thread. That story is ongoing and fascinating. The great 'show curtain' they are building now is funny. Cool that they have innovative ideas . . . but the fact that they are building a massive shower curtain shows how desperate we are in dealing with these types of problems. Like Chernobyl, the slag of melted fuel will probably just remain as is for the next 10 to 100 years since there is no technology for dealing with it.

I really think you should. I haven't been following the story myself and would love to hear more details. I'm still interested in the story despite the fact it has disappeared from the media.

 

[Jarmel]

That's the Japanese for you.

 

[Jme]

Whats the timeline on the 2nd pic? Then...?...6 Months Later

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

Thank you for sharing the truth liquidspeed, I think we are about to see waves of knowledgeable adoptive citizens of Japanese descent in the coming years.

You do know Russia Today is a garbage source, right?

 

[Stet]

Dat white van.

 

[The Main Event]

Daaaaaamn.

 

[speculawyer]

Dat white van.

It makes you wonder if they are leaving it for the owner to recover but the owner is probably dead. :-(

 

[SouthernDragon]

Impressive, Japan.

 

[Guardian Bob]

Man, cleanup Katrina vs Japan. No contest.

 

[Biscuits]

Holy shit. That is impressive.

 

[SMT]

You do know Russia Today is a garbage source, right?

No I did not Manos, but they had a university professor presenting a testimonial that back them up, so that has to count for something, right?

 

[Upsidedown Fuji]

I've been tempted to create a Fukushima nuclear thread. That story is ongoing and fascinating. The great 'show curtain' they are building now is funny. Cool that they have innovative ideas . . . but the fact that they are building a massive shower curtain shows how desperate we are in dealing with these types of problems. Like Chernobyl, the slag of melted fuel will probably just remain as is for the next 10 to 100 years since there is no technology for dealing with it.

I would gladly participate in a Fukushima nuclear thread. I think there's plenty to talk about there.

The curtain that Tepco is building around the #1 reactor isn't a solution although they are pushing it as one. That is also the reactor that has been leaking into the ocean. While it may help to reduce background radiation for the relief workers at the plant, it won't do much for the water problem.

You can't instantly clean up a contamination leak as big as Fukushima's with just elbow grease and a building. But they're kind of damned if they do or don't now. They have to show they're doing something that people can recognize as real work. I'm really curious how Tepco will clean surrounding areas. Many are planning on removing topsoil and rinsing down buildings as best they can. They may be successful in cleaning small patches of cities, but it's quite a huge task to completely wipe out what has changed that area forever.

 

[Darklord]

Damn, that's some serious clean up. Well done.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

No I did not Manos, but they had a university professor presenting a testimonial that back them up, so that has to count for something, right?

Except he's extremely anti-nuclear and as spec pointed out he's a alarmist report. More importantly Russia Today's is the Kremlins mouthpiece and likes to put on people who criticize the West. I'm not saying he's garbage, but I have to question anything coming from something on Russia Today.

 

[SMT]

Except he's extremely anti-nuclear and as spec pointed out he's a alarmist report. More importantly Russia Today's is the Kremlins mouthpiece and likes to put on people who criticize the West. I'm not saying he's garbage, but I have to question anything coming from something on Russia Today.

I see he is a fear-mongerer, I am against nuclear power as well, but I don't harm people with my words. As for RT being Kremlin's mouthpiece, it makes all the more sense. Manos, thank you for clearing this up for me, I will now be more cautious with similar news, doubt it, and verify this thread to see if it has any basis.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

I see he is a fear-mongerer, I am against nuclear power as well, but I don't harm people with my words. As for RT being Kremlin's mouthpiece, it makes all the more sense. Manos, thank you for clearing this up for me, I will now be more cautious with similar news, doubt it, and verify this thread to see if it has any basis.

I'm happy I could be of help, good sourcing is always important and I think it's always easy to make a mistake, so no worry. Russia Todays hook is how it seems at first glance and looks like a regular news channel, just from Russia (due to heavy YouTube advertising and other such things).

Here is a little background on them from the Columbia Journalism Review.
http://www.cjr.org/feature/what_is_russia_today.php

 

[AbsoluteZero]

Man, cleanup Katrina vs Japan. No contest.

While cleanup is evident, there's areas of New Orleans that have never recovered, 6+ years later.

It's like some sort of time machine. Crazy.

 

[Wellington]

Some of those look shopped.

 

[SMT]

I'm happy I could be of help, good sourcing is always important and I think it's always easy to make a mistake, so no worry. Russia Todays hook is how it seems at first glance and looks like a regular news channel, just from Russia (due to heavy YouTube advertising and other such things).

Here is a little background on them from the Columbia Journalism Review.
http://www.cjr.org/feature/what_is_russia_today.php

Haha, wow Manos, Russia Today lost credibility as soon as I saw the little segmented part about Obama being in-league with Amnedinjehad. Hilarious!! xD

a fairly new and still mostly obscure English-language cable news channel funded by the Russian government.

Kremlin, indeed.