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Err ... Nintendo and MONOLITH?
- Thread starter soundwave05
- Start date
Tachikoma said:
I own both. What's your point? The games bombed spectacularly in Japan. Oh and do you really want to imply that Namco x Capcom is a great game by any means? I enjoyed the 48 hours I put into HALF of the game, but between the braindead difficulty, the one to two hour missions and the unskippable battle animations, seriously.
Dragona Akehi
Retired
duckroll said:I own both. What's your point? The games bombed spectacularly in Japan. Oh and do you really want to imply that Namco x Capcom is a great game by any means? I enjoyed the 48 hours I put into HALF of the game, but between the braindead difficulty, the one to two hour missions and the unskippable battle animations, seriously.
Baten Kaitos still stands, though johntv has a point: most of the design work is from tri-crescendo, while it seems like Monolithsoft did most of the grunt work...
Still tri-cresendo... THOSE DUDES ROCK. ANNOUNCE NEW GAME STAT.
Dragona Akehi said:
I'd really like them to get Baten Kaitos 3 (Wii) and Baten Kaitos DS out.
A new RPG IP wouldn't go amiss, either, but I definitely want to see the BK series continue.
I'm staying firmly away from the "Disaster will suck MonolithSoft OMG!" doomtrain, personally. The game's concept seems solid and fun, the art/CGI is wonderful, and I think they've definitely done some very good, if flawed, work. Supervision from Nintendo for Disaster certainly can't hurt.
Dragona Akehi
Retired
All I can say is the pure awesomeness of the BK series gives me enough pause to "wait and see" on this title. But only just.
This is quite a bit, considering how much I hate Xenocrap. It's existence on the same planet as my existence is a staggering insult. Or something.
This is quite a bit, considering how much I hate Xenocrap. It's existence on the same planet as my existence is a staggering insult. Or something.
pitt_norton
Member
I've got a strange hunch that this will play in the GTA mold...
pitt_norton
Member
duckroll said:
...I've still have a GTA hunch... with a disaster twist
I'm very excited for this title no matter what the outcome. Then it will just need to be reviewed.
duckroll said:
It sounds nothing like that at all.
Dragona Akehi said:
Yeah. Well, whether one likes or dislikes the Xeno games, I'd say the responsibility for how they turned out lies more with Tetsuya Takahashi than with Monolith in general. Even in the games made since Takahashi's demotion, they're still largely working from his blueprints and from the constraints that the earlier games in the series, made under his supervision, presented.
So whether one loves Xeno or hates it, credit/blame goes elsewhere than Monolith, I think. I don't view it as a black mark against them for future games.
ethelred said:
- Players race a car down a mountain to escape a roaring pyroclastic flow
- dodge toppling buildings during a devastating earthquake
- swim for their lives in a raging flood
Wrong. Monolithsoft have proven again and again that they are a TECHNICALLY incompetent studio not worthy of work in the industry.
Here are some fine points of utter incompetence:
Xenosaga Episode 1
- They couldn't get realtime cutscenes to load well, so instead they decide to fill a DVD9 with several gigs of recorded realtime cutscenes in MPEG2 with noticable artifacts
- Because of the storage issue in that stupid decision, the overall sound quality of the entire game suffered as the audio was compressed even further
- Loading times sucked ass
Xenosaga Episode 2
- Loading times got even worse
- Some moron decided that having really really ugly realistic character designs would somehow appeal to a larger audience, lol dumbasses
- Instead of using a battle system that was totally competent from Ep1, they ditched it and went for a completely boring, MORE time consuming and broken one instead
Baten Kaitos
- Really crappy audio quality once again, no idea why this time since the game is on 2 discs and it doesn't even have movies!
Namco x Capcom
- Really long battle animations in a strategy game which are totally unskippable
- Huge maps with no challenge at all, instead simply being time consuming and repetive
Xenosaga I+II
- People that make DS games which look like GBA games deserve to be shot, twice
- What an awesome idea, putting menus on the touch screen, but you can't touch them!
Xenosaga Ep3 DEMO
- Let's release a public demo of a story driven game and leave all the story contents in text AND image form on the disc anyway! We'll just rip the engine out of the full game, just because other studios bother to properly strip demos for release doesn't mean we have to!
So yeah, are you going to blame ALL that on Takahashi? Clearly Monolithsoft is BEST when doing merely grunt work (see: Baten Kaitos) but even then, their grunt work is C-grade at best. There are more than two dozen studios in Japan far superior in technical competence AND in design work, Monolithsoft has no place in the industry and offers nothing special or unique. Just a bunch of ripoffs of better concepts done in a sloppy manner.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
I'm curious as to how you mean. You need to get away from lava immediately, so steal that old woman's SUV and put the pedal to the metal?pitt_norton said:...I've still have a GTA hunch... with a disaster twist
duckroll said:- Players race a car down a mountain to escape a roaring pyroclastic flow
- dodge toppling buildings during a devastating earthquake
- swim for their lives in a raging flood
ormat: Wii
Launch Date: TBA
ESRB: RP (Rating Pending)
Game Type: Action
So it's an action game with some disaster sequences in it. Doesn't sound like WarioWare to me.
duckroll said:Wrong. Monolithsoft have proven again and again that they are a TECHNICALLY incompetent studio not worthy of work in the industry.
Here are some fine points of utter incompetence:
Xenosaga Episode 1
Xenosaga Episode 2
Baten Kaitos
Namco x Capcom
Xenosaga I+II
Xenosaga Ep3 DEMO
So yeah, are you going to blame ALL that on Takahashi? Clearly Monolithsoft is BEST when doing merely grunt work (see: Baten Kaitos) but even then, their grunt work is C-grade at best. There are more than two dozen studios in Japan far superior in technical competence AND in design work, Monolithsoft has no place in the industry and offers nothing special or unique. Just a bunch of ripoffs of better concepts done in a sloppy manner.
In most of the things you listed, the technical flaws were not the reasons why the games are generally criticized -- certainly the major complaints about Xenosaga Episodes I and II are not their loading or their audio effects; the criticisms are the story, pacing, characterization, emphasis on cinematics, battle system, and skill system. And most of that stuff DID come from Takahashi.
The technical glitches are bad, but they're hardly issues which are isolated to MonolithSoft. Plenty of other development studios have problems with ensuring the high production values of Square Enix titles, and the end result is quality games with technical -- rather than design -- flaws. If a game's game and story design are high quality enough, I can usually overlook minor technical issues. See, for instance, a lot of TOSE's work (VP: Lenneth comes to mind).
Further, you say that MonolithSoft is at their best when they're doing grunt work. Well, then, the good news is that they seem to just be doing grunt work for Nintendo on Disaster: Day of Crisis, so we may have the next Baten Kaitos (only in the action genre rather than RPG) in the making.
ethelred said:
So that solidifies my point that Monolithsoft has no purpose in the industry. When everything they have offered in design has failed, and their technical competence is in question, why then do they deserve a job?
No, Nintendo is publishing it, but the developer is listed clearly as Monolithsoft. Nintendo published Baten Kaitos 2 too, they didn't have anything to do with development. It's more likely we have the next Geist in the making.
Scalemail Ted
Member
duckroll said:So that solidifies my point that Monolithsoft has no purpose in the industry. When everything they have offered in design has failed, and their technical competence is in question, why then do they deserve a job?
No, Nintendo is publishing it, but the developer is listed clearly as Monolithsoft. Nintendo published Baten Kaitos 2 too, they didn't have anything to do with development. It's more likely we have the next Geist in the making.
So youre saying this is like 2nd hand Namco sabotage?
Scalemail Ted
Member
duckroll said:
Only this time its Nintendo approved. They have to publish their own sabotage. Calling it 'Disaster' is part of their inside joke.
duckroll said:No, Nintendo is publishing it, but the developer is listed clearly as Monolithsoft. Nintendo published Baten Kaitos 2 too, they didn't have anything to do with development. It's more likely we have the next Geist in the making.
Perhaps. The way Nintendo presented it at their media briefing certainly gave me the impression that this wasn't just some random game they were publishing for an outside development studio -- they labeled it as a new Nintendo IP. I certainly came away with the impression that Nintendo was supervising the development of the game, or was at the least heavily involved with the title beyond merely publishing.
If you have actual information to the contrary, then feel free to present, but the media briefing and the fact that Nintendo listed the IP as theirs and the game as one that they were responsible for (with Monolith Soft developing) hints otherwise.
Sho Nuff said:
I'm truly sorry if my words hurt your faith. I didn't mean to be insensitive. Won't happen again.
ethelred said:
Well as I said, Geist is a Nintendo IP too. Nintendo's work with Retro Studios might have resulted in good stuff, but I'm just pointing out, if the studio really really sucks (like N-Space did) there's still only so much the Nintendo power can do. I'll certainly agree that with Nintendo's name attached this game has a good chance to be the BEST Monolithsoft game ever produced, but that's really not saying much.
The Abominable Snowman
Member
Awesome! I love FEAR.
I've told all my Monolith-loving friends, and we're all scraping together money for a couple Wii's now! Fucking awesome news, guys! We're all definitely hyped! We're Monolith fanatics.
I've told all my Monolith-loving friends, and we're all scraping together money for a couple Wii's now! Fucking awesome news, guys! We're all definitely hyped! We're Monolith fanatics.
Scalemail Ted
Member
The Abominable Snowman said:
:lol
duckroll said:Well as I said, Geist is a Nintendo IP too. Nintendo's work with Retro Studios might have resulted in good stuff, but I'm just pointing out, if the studio really really sucks (like N-Space did) there's still only so much the Nintendo power can do. I'll certainly agree that with Nintendo's name attached this game has a good chance to be the BEST Monolithsoft game ever produced, but that's really not saying much.
Sure, but Monolith Soft is no n-Space.
Even at their worst, their work on Xenosaga is better than what n-Space did for Geist. And the Baten Kaitos series shows they're capable of quality with the right supervision.
The Abominable Snowman said:
WRONG MONOLITH! >_<
ethelred said:Sure, but Monolith Soft is no n-Space.
Even at their worst, their work on Xenosaga is better than what n-Space did for Geist. And the Baten Kaitos series shows they're capable of quality with the right supervision.
That's true, which is why I'm so annoyed! I'll actually have to BUY this like all the other Monolithsoft games just to see if they actually managed a good game! I wasn't worried about Geist, it was 100% suckage! :lol
IAmtheFMan
Member
I do have faith in Monolith Soft, but man, BK was one of the most bipolar experiences I've ever played in my life. There were times that I couldn't stop playing, and other times when I was ready to throw the damn game in my trash.
If anything, it was a game that showed me that they're a developer that has the potential to make a truly kick-ass amazing game... but that game IMO wasn't BK.
And at least judging from Xenosaga and BK, the presentation of the game will be very good.
If anything, it was a game that showed me that they're a developer that has the potential to make a truly kick-ass amazing game... but that game IMO wasn't BK.
And at least judging from Xenosaga and BK, the presentation of the game will be very good.
duckroll said:I'll certainly agree that with Nintendo's name attached this game has a good chance to be the BEST Monolithsoft game ever produced, but that's really not saying much.
The best MonolithSoft has produced is Baten Kaitos II/Origins, and it's fucking brilliant. I know some of it is from tri-Crescendo, but Baten Kaitos II is seriously an amazing game. Don't even try to compare it to Geist. Ever.
Chris Remo
Member
And if somebody comes over and tries to take the controller to try it out, you can just tell them "Can't touch this."
Icanplaythat
Member
From Wikipedia:
Monolith Soft or MLSI is an entertainment company (not to be confused with Monolith Productions) in Japan, specializing in creating video games for various consoles like the PlayStation 2 and Nintendo GameCube, and very recently cellphones. Monolith Soft is usually associated with the Xenosaga series, a series of role-playing games on the PS2 console. A portion of MLSI's staff are former employees of Square, who resigned after the creation of Chrono Cross. They were involved initially with the game Chrono Trigger, then in the game Xenogears, which the Xenosaga series is derived from.
Games developed by Monolith Soft
* Xenosaga Episode I: Der Wille zur Macht (2002, PlayStation 2)
* Baten Kaitos: Eternal Wings and the Lost Ocean (2003, GameCube)
* Xenosaga: Episode I: Reloaded (2003, PlayStation 2)
* Xenosaga Freaks (2004, PlayStation 2)
* Xenosaga Episode II: Jenseits von Gut und Böse (2004, PlayStation 2)
* Xenosaga: Pied Piper (2004, Mobile)
* Namco x Capcom (2005, PlayStation 2)
* Baten Kaitos II: Wings of the Beginning and the Heir to the Gods (2006, GameCube)
* Xenosaga: Episode I&II (March, 2006) Nintendo DS)
* Xenosaga Episode III: Also sprach Zarathustra (In development) (2006, PlayStation 2)
* Disaster: Day of Crisis (In Development) (TBA, Wii)
If some of their staff were involved in Chrono Trigger and Xenogears, how can they create such crap?
Monolith Soft or MLSI is an entertainment company (not to be confused with Monolith Productions) in Japan, specializing in creating video games for various consoles like the PlayStation 2 and Nintendo GameCube, and very recently cellphones. Monolith Soft is usually associated with the Xenosaga series, a series of role-playing games on the PS2 console. A portion of MLSI's staff are former employees of Square, who resigned after the creation of Chrono Cross. They were involved initially with the game Chrono Trigger, then in the game Xenogears, which the Xenosaga series is derived from.
Games developed by Monolith Soft
* Xenosaga Episode I: Der Wille zur Macht (2002, PlayStation 2)
* Baten Kaitos: Eternal Wings and the Lost Ocean (2003, GameCube)
* Xenosaga: Episode I: Reloaded (2003, PlayStation 2)
* Xenosaga Freaks (2004, PlayStation 2)
* Xenosaga Episode II: Jenseits von Gut und Böse (2004, PlayStation 2)
* Xenosaga: Pied Piper (2004, Mobile)
* Namco x Capcom (2005, PlayStation 2)
* Baten Kaitos II: Wings of the Beginning and the Heir to the Gods (2006, GameCube)
* Xenosaga: Episode I&II (March, 2006) Nintendo DS)
* Xenosaga Episode III: Also sprach Zarathustra (In development) (2006, PlayStation 2)
* Disaster: Day of Crisis (In Development) (TBA, Wii)
If some of their staff were involved in Chrono Trigger and Xenogears, how can they create such crap?
SolidSnakex
Member
Icanplaythat said:
Just because you take some members from a talented team doesn't mean that they'll put together a good product when they make another company. But if anything Monolith has been one of the better recent offshoot companies. Some others are Artoon (for Sonic Team who helped make NiGHTS) and Game Republic (Capcom). GR recently got embarrased at E3 for showing Genji 2 next to Heavenly Sword.
Icanplaythat
Member
SolidSnakex said:
You're right, an offshoot of a successful dev team doesn't guarantee anything. But sweet lord not one of those games is good, and they've ruined the good name of Xenogears through association.
ivysaur12 said:
But they made about SEVEN games so far, and the only TWO which are good happen to be collaborations with Tri-Crescendo. That means Monolithsoft SUCKS SHIT AND DESERVES NO SYMPATHY. Get it through your thick skull, they deserve to GO OUT OF BUSINESS and I'm glad all their games bombed! :lol
Mockingbird
Member
I've only played Baten Kaitos I and but I'm really looking foward to Origins. Also Episode III looks to be great so I'm glad to know they're on board for revolution development. The character animation in BKII, from the vid, looks so fluid which makes the game looks fanfreakingtastic.
Since BKII got a 35/40 from Famitsu, I have higher expectations from that game. With Nintendo publishing disaster, I think we can expect most of the quality to be maintained whether Tri-Crescendo is on it or not. Also doesn't Tri-Crescendo just do music? I hope Baten Kaitos III and DS make it! (Damn Japan for not buying BK II!!!!!!)
Since BKII got a 35/40 from Famitsu, I have higher expectations from that game. With Nintendo publishing disaster, I think we can expect most of the quality to be maintained whether Tri-Crescendo is on it or not. Also doesn't Tri-Crescendo just do music? I hope Baten Kaitos III and DS make it! (Damn Japan for not buying BK II!!!!!!)
duckroll said:
But Xenosaga I was good. Even if the story was a little whacky and over the top, the battle system was still fun. It wasn't until X2 that it got ruined. Pied Piper wasn't bad, and neither was Xenosaga I&II. It was actually a lot of fun to play X2 with a good battle system.
Hey, let them get out of the Xenosaga universe and see how they'll do. They obviously have talent from Baten Kaitos I and II, you can't deny it. Let's see how they do on Disaster.
duckroll said:
Most of their games haven't bombed. Xenosaga I & II did, the others sure haven't. Both Baten Kaitos games did poorly in Japan, but BK1 made up for it in the US, and BK Origins might, too.
Have you played Xenosaga III yet? Most of the impressions I've heard of its gameplay have so far been pretty positive.
And despite the technical flaws you highlighted, most reviewers praised Namco X Capcom.
Poor, poor, ducky -- the world just keeps not going your way.
I hear MonolithSoft was hired to work on Chrono DS.
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