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[Eurogamer\DF] Orbis Unmasked: what to expect from the next-gen PlayStation.

K

Krabardaf

Member
Seems very believable and in line with both previous rumors and what the industry is shaping into. Raw performance is no longer the one and only goal, that's for sure.

Durango and Orbis will certainly leave Nintendo behind once again. Even if a midrange PC will outperform the next gen at launch. Pc games will strongly benefit from next gen development anyway, so I think no one will loose in the end.

Satisfied with theses specs, hope they are true, but I have little doubt about it.
 
A

amstradcpc

Member
aegies said:
Take fixed tasks that are computationally expensive, particularly for more general purpose GPU hardware, and make hardware that is good at that kind of task specifically. The problem with GPUs is that they're doing a lot of things that they're decent at, rather than fewer things that they're really good at.
Click to expand...
Now we are talking.i smell the shaders in durango gpu are also custom,at least arranged in a more efficient way. Somewhere speculated that nowadays alus where not very good with vertex shaders.Maybe geometry management wil have its own block...
 
C

Chuck Norris

Banned
Can those in the know put a rough price estimate down on Orbis? I know that's a difficult question, but ballpark it? Are we looking at $300 console, $400 console... $599 console?

Or assuming $400-$500 does it seem like we are missing a piece of the puzzle? Like expensive controller of some sort
 
S

shinobi602

Member
Proelite said:
I think I prefer Durango's secret sauce, it has more tang and doesn't leave an aftertaste.
Click to expand...

0475_f5ovk.gif

Start talkin or we break your legs.
 
M

michaelius

Banned
aegies said:
Take fixed tasks that are computationally expensive, particularly for more general purpose GPU hardware, and make hardware that is good at that kind of task specifically. The problem with GPUs is that they're doing a lot of things that they're decent at, rather than fewer things that they're really good at.
Click to expand...

Isn't rellying on secret sauce a recipe for disaster ?

Cell in PS3 was such an idea with small cores supposed to aid weaker gpu - didn't exactly went as planned.
 
T

thuway

Member
Chuck Norris said:
Can those in the know put a rough price estimate down on Orbis? I know that's a difficult question, but ballpark it? Are we looking at $300 console, $400 console... $599 console?

Or assuming $400-$500 does it seem like we are missing a piece of the puzzle? Like expensive controller of some sort
Click to expand...

$399, and a very healthy profit margin within a year. I'm sure the Super Saiyan version will cost $50-$100 more (includes your favorite LCD controller!)
 
K

KareBear

Member
Im worried that these new consoles will devastate the industry with rising unsustainable dev costs.If that happens im gald im mainly a pc gamer now,thanks to steam and kickstarter etc indie games are increasing in scope and quality all the time.
 
P

Ponn

Banned
Chuck Norris said:
Can those in the know put a rough price estimate down on Orbis? I know that's a difficult question, but ballpark it? Are we looking at $300 console, $400 console... $599 console?

Or assuming $400-$500 does it seem like we are missing a piece of the puzzle? Like expensive controller of some sort
Click to expand...


Durango $599 BUT you can get it on a payment plan with 5 year Xbox Live Subscription at your local Walmart!!
 
A

aegies

Member
michaelius said:
Isn't rellying on secret sauce a recipe for disaster ?

Cell in PS3 was such an idea with small cores supposed to aid weaker gpu - didn't exactly went as planned.
Click to expand...

It can be? Cell is a bad example, because that was supposed to be a supercomputer-on-a-chip that was powerful enough for everything, but turned out not to be late in the game, which led to Sony contracting with Nvidia for the RSX, which was poorly matched. I *think* that what Microsoft is going for makes a lot of sense, assuming I have it right, but it could totally blow up in their face. It's a risk.
 
D

dynamitejim

Member
That sounds.......massively disappointing. The PS4 is going to have less power than a year old laptop when it comes out and the next Xbox is rumored to be even less powerful. We waited 7 years for this? Looks like I'll be sticking with PC gaming.
 
A

amstradcpc

Member
aegies said:
It can be? Cell is a bad example, because that was supposed to be a supercomputer-on-a-chip that was powerful enough for everything, but turned out not to be late in the game, which led to Sony contracting with Nvidia for the RSX, which was poorly matched. I *think* that what Microsoft is going for makes a lot of sense, assuming I have it right, but it could totally blow up in their face. It's a risk.
Click to expand...
Dont tell me its raycasting related!
 
K

Krabardaf

Member
Chuck Norris said:
Can those in the know put a rough price estimate down on Orbis? I know that's a difficult question, but ballpark it? Are we looking at $300 console, $400 console... $599 console?

Or assuming $400-$500 does it seem like we are missing a piece of the puzzle? Like expensive controller of some sort
Click to expand...

The hardware is an indication of the price, but what matters is the overall experience companies want to deliver, and most importantly, what price they can reasonably put on their system for them to reach the desired public.

I haven't seen the future, but i'd be highly surprised if any systems released over 500$.
But i also believe you can't reasonably hope for a first price below 350$. So yeah, 400$ seems like a nice pricetag to me.
 
C

Chuck Norris

Banned
thuway said:
$399, and a very healthy profit margin within a year. I'm sure the Super Saiyan version will cost $50-$100 more (includes your favorite LCD controller!)
Click to expand...
That's where I'd put it too, but those controller rumours got me thinking that there may be more to the system than we expect. Assuming these two systems are roughly the same level and MS are shipping standardised Kinect - then it would seem Sony could either aim to beat them on price or introduce something like a LCD controller
 
Saberus

Saberus

Member
dynamitejim said:
That sounds.......massively disappointing. The PS4 is going to have less power than a year old laptop when it comes out and the next Xbox is rumored to be even less powerful. We waited 7 years for this? Looks like I'll be sticking with PC gaming.
Click to expand...

Thank god you told us, now I won't worry about you.
 
S

shinobi602

Member
dynamitejim said:
That sounds.......massively disappointing. The PS4 is going to have less power than a year old laptop when it comes out and the next Xbox is rumored to be even less powerful. We waited 7 years for this? Looks like I'll be sticking with PC gaming.
Click to expand...

Please think before you speak next time.
 
S

sTeLioSco

Banned
dynamitejim said:
That sounds.......massively disappointing. The PS4 is going to have less power than a year old laptop when it comes out and the next Xbox is rumored to be even less powerful. We waited 7 years for this? Looks like I'll be sticking with PC gaming.
Click to expand...

you forgot: "weaker than the wiiu"
 
M

Mxrz

Member
Darn. Looks like the thread shifted to doom and gloom. But anyway.

Cannot believe the Orbis is going to have 4gb gddr5. Maybe I'm missing something but that seems a crazy advantage. Unless MS really has shifted its focus, not sure how or why they wouldn't have something in the Durango to make up for it.

$399 seems a good bet unless Sony or even MS get freaky with the controllers. All I really want its maybe a bigger dual shock, or have it split-able for us lazy bastards. Biometric sensors would be alright if developers are on board. But if its another sixthaxis thing, meh. Actually, maybe they'll just replace it. Let move/kinect do the motion stuff.
 
R

RamzaIsCool

The Amiga Brotherhood
So anybody have a clue what these secret sauces are? Could it be a second "weaker" GPU for the Orbis. There were rumors of a dual-GPU setup a while back, if I remember correctly.
 
K

Krabardaf

Member
DSN2K said:
PS4 sounds better platform overall...
Click to expand...

At this point it may or may not have a slight advantage in performances.

But what's for sure is that there won't be a huge difference. In other terms, third parties will once again looks globally the same on both platform, and first parties may push a little beyond the best ones.
 
P

Ponn

Banned
dynamitejim said:
That sounds.......massively disappointing. The PS4 is going to have less power than a year old laptop when it comes out and the next Xbox is rumored to be even less powerful. We waited 7 years for this? Looks like I'll be sticking with PC gaming.
Click to expand...

Right, because reaching those expectations while keeping the console price reasonable is totally doable.
 
G

Gemüsepizza

Member
THE:MILKMAN said:
Proelite, do you know what the secret sauce is in both systems?
Click to expand...

I doubt it.

dynamitejim said:
That sounds.......massively disappointing. The PS4 is going to have less power than a year old laptop when it comes out and the next Xbox is rumored to be even less powerful. We waited 7 years for this? Looks like I'll be sticking with PC gaming.
Click to expand...

Right. Does your "old laptop" have 3,5 GB GDDR5 RAM? A dedicated compute unit for physics and more? An 8 core CPU? HSA? A BDXL drive? HDMI 2.0 and playback for 4K media? The PS4 seems to be a pretty nice machine. You can't compare this to an old computer.
 
Proelite

Proelite

Member
dynamitejim said:
That sounds.......massively disappointing. The PS4 is going to have less power than a year old laptop when it comes out and the next Xbox is rumored to be even less powerful. We waited 7 years for this? Looks like I'll be sticking with PC gaming.
Click to expand...

Just wait until you get to E3, I heard both Sony and Microsoft are fully behind casual games, and would have no cores games at all except for ports with higher resolution assets since the systems are barely an upgrade over current gen.

They might even chase after Apple by having tablet on a controller.
 
M

Mario007

Member
Krabardaf said:
At this point it may or may not have a slight advantage in performances.

But what's for sure is that there won't be a huge difference. In other terms, third parties will once again looks globally the same on both platform, and first parties may push a little beyond the best ones.
Click to expand...
Honestly? No. Right now it seems like PS4 is leaps beyond the next Xbox.However, that is simply because we don't know what modification MS is doing to the GPU, so we'll have to wait and see.
 
O

onQ123

Member
aegies said:
Take fixed tasks that are computationally expensive, particularly for more general purpose GPU hardware, and make hardware that is good at that kind of task specifically. The problem with GPUs is that they're doing a lot of things that they're decent at, rather than fewer things that they're really good at.
Click to expand...

I talked about this months ago when I was talking about having a FPGA that could be used to run some codes better than what the CPU or GPU can do & take the load off of the GPU\CPU.


http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?p=1649853#post1649853


http://neogaf.net/forum/showpost.php?p=37464018&postcount=1389

http://neogaf.net/forum/showpost.php?p=37816442&postcount=1684


but I was talking about the PS4 but now it applies to the Xbox Next.
 
K

Krabardaf

Member
Mxrz said:
Cannot believe the Orbis is going to have 4gb gddr5. Maybe I'm missing something but that seems a crazy advantage. Unless MS really has shifted its focus, not sure how or why they wouldn't have something in the Durango to make up for it.
Click to expand...
Well, EDRam would certainly be a valid response to GDDR5. What truly matters after all, beyond the quantity, is the total bandwidth. This doesn't only depends on memory type, but also on buses used.
 
Insane Metal

Insane Metal

Member
Damn it's getting hard to keep up with the thread lol

And I'm really enjoying all this speculation with posts from karak, AndyH, Proelite, aegis, thuway, etc. I just wish I could know more :p

Also, people saying the consoles are weak will have their brains melted from the awesomeness these boxes will produce, I'm pretty sure of that.

Regarding games, this year both Sony and Microsoft will be ready to show REAL GAMES running on real hardware, imo. It's not gonna be like 2005 where Sony had to rush to have something (anything) to show, ending up with those infamous CGs and very very early game assets (I-8 at the time, which became Resistance, Warhaw, Genji, etc).
 
C

clutch.as.it.gets.

Member
dynamitejim said:
That sounds.......massively disappointing. The PS4 is going to have less power than a year old laptop when it comes out and the next Xbox is rumored to be even less powerful. We waited 7 years for this? Looks like I'll be sticking with PC gaming.
Click to expand...


Yeah, i`m thinking to switch back to PC gaming too. I´m expected more than middle class laptop tech in those machines.
 
A

Aguirre

Member
dynamitejim said:
That sounds.......massively disappointing. The PS4 is going to have less power than a year old laptop when it comes out and the next Xbox is rumored to be even less powerful. We waited 7 years for this? Looks like I'll be sticking with PC gaming.
Click to expand...
Wait so the day 360 came out you were waiting for its predecessor? okay then :p
 
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