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[Rootbeer]

I feel dumb but is this sarcasm?

Yes. That processor is a six-core and only recently came out. It is very capable. People think it was trolling so they are giving sarcastic answers.

 

[sirap]

I feel dumb but is this sarcasm?

Of course it is. An overclocked 5820k is a beast for gaming.

 

[Coolbgdog12]

As long as you overclock that shitty CPU to 5ghz+ and overclock the core of the 970 to 1600mhz then you should be good for 1080p/30fps at Ultra Low settings.

Pfft ultra low? He's lucky if he can even do that at 1080p. 900p ftw

 

[InfYn]

I feel dumb but is this sarcasm?

5820K is an x99 six-core chip, extremely capable

 

[SliChillax]

Yes. That processor is a six-core and only recently came out. It is very capable. People think it was trolling so they are giving sarcastic answers.

Of course it is. An overclocked 5820k is a beast for gaming.

5820K is an x99 six-core chip, extremely capable

I know because I have it, that's why I got worried for a second lol

 

[hamster3 3]

Any benchmarks yet?

 

[aravuus]

I know because I have it, that's why I got worried for a second lol

Haha, sorry about that!

 

[Raven77]

I would say at this point it's a given that the next Elder Scrolls game will not have a new engine. Considering how much they have supposedly upgraded this old janky ass engine I doubt they would bother if they had a new one coming out in the next year or two.

Unless they just added some stuff to make it passable while they work on their new engine. But would working on a new engine really be a secret? Would it have leaked out by now that they are? I guess if they MUST release a game in a certain time frame (this is a business after all) then maybe they had no choice.

I hope to God I am wrong.

 

[tuxfool]

I would say at this point it's a given that the next Elder Scrolls game will not have a new engine. Considering how much they have supposedly upgraded this old janky ass engine I doubt they would bother if they had a new one coming out in the next year or two.

Unless they just added some stuff to make it passable while they work on their new engine. But would working on a new engine really be a secret? Would it have leaked out by now that they are? I guess if they MUST release a game in a certain time frame (this is a business after all) then maybe they had no choice.

I hope to God I am wrong.

Heh. Somebody made a joke about grandchildren and Creation engine earlier.

 

[The Lamonster]

My PC has an i7 5820k and a 970, so I should be able to match this come release date.

How is the game running though with that hardware?

that sucks dude, glad I went Skylake

 

[UnrealEck]

Never pre-order.

Advice I know I should take, but sometimes don't.

 

[koryuken]

Advice I know I should take, but sometimes don't.

This and also never buy "season pass" are words to live by. Either it ends up being not a true season pass where "new" DLC falls outside of it (a la Destiny) or you get bored of the game before you end up playing all of the DLC (BF4 for me).

 

[10k]

I get a little tired about this 'it's a game with a massive scale so it can't be compared to any other game' nonsense. It's as if loading a page from Wikipedia is allowed to take a lot of time because the archive is massive. The scale of the game is massive, but that has nothing to do with whether a texture on a wall is looking like wallpaper or that there are no shadows where there should be etc. If you think they have every little object the player can interact with in memory at any given time, you're mistaken. The player is at a given point in the world space and the elements in that close area are loaded, like in any other open world game. The player points the cursor on an element in world space, the engine detects an interactable container and looks up what it is in its in-memory 'database' (not really a database, but you get the idea). if there are 1000 or 1million, that's not important. If that slows down your game engine that much that there's no frame budget anymore to use a couple more shaders or push a bit more polygons, you have bigger problems.

Avalanche created a massive open world with Just Cause 2 that felt alive and you could go anywhere and not only using 2D plane movement like in Bethesda's games but also through the air. It ran flawlessly on a PS3 with 512MB ram, the same amount of ram as the iPad 2.

Please accept that the Bethesda teams are great in designing a game that allows you to make your own story, and that they are good at giving you a sandbox in which you can play that story in any order you wish using whatever moronic outfit and hairstyle you can think of, and at the same time they ship that in a vehicle made by programmers who e.g. can't figure out how to write a proper state machine so quests bug all over the place.

That the games are vast has nothing to do with the shoddyness of their programming.


I don't think people base their judgment solely on a couple of screenshots, they also take into account Bethesda's trackrecord from previous games, especially their last ones. FO4 costs 59.95 EURO here on Steam. I could perhaps get a cheaper key through a shady key seller, but do the devs get any money from that route? Doubtful. So if I want to legitimately want to buy the game using the official channels I'm paying a premium price. That's OK, it's just that I then compare it with the games that also demand that premium price. If I go to the store and pick up a PS4 copy, it's cheaper. That's with the console tax included.

My point with that is that if you ask the highest price for your wares, the quality of the product must therefore be stellar. I don't have to remind you about Bethesda's latest game's quality at launch? Looking at these screenshots I have my doubts their quality bar is extremely higher this time around. Skyrim shipped on PC with the 360 assets.

THAT's the point here. Stop making excuses, they're a business that tries to milk as much money from their customers as they possibly can (remember their paid mod plan?). Nothing wrong with that, we all have bills to pay, but as a customer on my part I want to get as much as possible for my money. With Bethesda's stuff that's always a mixed bag and this time it won't be different. It will be highly enjoyable for sure, but not without the help of countless volunteers (modders) who make the game look and feel the way we all expect it to be.

Terrific post.

 

[Raven77]

Terrific post.

I disagree. It makes an assumption that every team making games has 500+ people who can create, texture, animate, etc. as many objects as the designer wants to throw in the game. An open world game can require many more objects, more textures, more sound effects, more animations, etc. than a much more limited linear game.

Maybe they don't have the time or money or work force working on the game to ensure every aspect of every object is amazing looking.

For sure, it can be done, look at Witcher 3. But it is not a cop-out excuse, it has some validity to it.

 

[DrROBschiz]

I disagree. It makes an assumption that every team making games has 500+ people who can create, texture, animate, etc. as many objects as the designer wants to throw in the game. An open world game can require many more objects, more textures, more sound effects, more animations, etc. than a much more limited linear game.

Maybe they don't have the time or money or work force working on the game to ensure every aspect of every object is amazing looking.

For sure, it can be done, look at Witcher 3. But it is not a cop-out excuse, it has some validity to it.

To be fair Witcher 3 isnt a perfect darling either

There have ben plenty of screebshots in this thread showing where CDPR compromised on quality in one way or another

Gotta pay that open world tax somewhere

 

[koryuken]

I disagree. It makes an assumption that every team making games has 500+ people who can create, texture, animate, etc. as many objects as the designer wants to throw in the game. An open world game can require many more objects, more textures, more sound effects, more animations, etc. than a much more limited linear game.

Maybe they don't have the time or money or work force working on the game to ensure every aspect of every object is amazing looking.

For sure, it can be done, look at Witcher 3. But it is not a cop-out excuse, it has some validity to it.

I could be mistaken, but isn't Project Red a smaller studio as compared to Bethesda? Especially their funding stream?

 

[Denton]

Oh nothing major. They just forgot to compile the game with SSE instruction support. When it was finally patched a few months later, my framerate went from 35 to 60fps in some locations.

IIRC someone modded this in pretty quickly. I remember using some mod that almost doubled my framerate back then. Still hilarious though, Bethesda is pretty uniquely incompetent.

I could be mistaken, but isn't Project Red a smaller studio as compared to Bethesda? Especially their funding stream?

CDP had 230 people on TW3 in height of its development, Bethesda has around 110-120. That said, Bethesda sold 30 million copies of Skyrim so this is not really an excuse. They could hire many extremely talented people if they wanted. For some reason, they don't want.

 

[SpacePirate Ridley]

I could be mistaken, but isn't Project Red a smaller studio as compared to Bethesda? Especially their funding stream?

Yes, and have much less money, and their games sell much less sadly (the numbers of workers in the studio seems to be somewhat higher). But I already read in this forum some posters saying the contrary (using the number of people as excuse), and I dont even know why they are using as they sell MUCH more to hire more capable people.
The only thing that CDPR has easier is that their workers wages are lower for being in Poland.

Its not even about numbers for me, you dont need 50 writters to make good stories, and 30 scenario directors to make interesting quests and charaters.
You need a small number, even 1 in some cases, that knows what he or her is doing, that knows how to write, to create good characters, etc...

CDPR, Obsidian, Larian... Smaller studios that have more talented people than Bethesda. Thats the key difference in all this. And I wouldnt have a problem if Bethesda was as small as Larian, for example, but they are not, and much less they have any money problems, they could hire better people. Im sure they know their writting is mediocre at best, they just dont give a fuck (because I really hope they dont think high of them in that department).

 

[Hellshingu]

I could be mistaken, but isn't Project Red a smaller studio as compared to Bethesda? Especially their funding stream?

Being based in Poland their overall costs are going to be lower compared to it being made in the States. I would assume that if the Witcher 3 was made in the States that the cost of the game would have been much, much more expensive.

 

[koryuken]

Yes, and have much less money, and their games sell much less sadly (the numbers of workers in the studio seems to be somewhat higher). But I already read in this forum some posters saying the contrary (using the number of people as excuse), and I dont even know why they are using as they sell MUCH more to hire more capable people.
The only thing that CDPR has easier is that their workers wages are lower for being in Poland.

If that's the case, then fans should absolutely hammer Bethesda to innovate more (esp in technology/engine/graphics IMO). There is no excuse for smaller studios with smaller budgets pushing the boundaries of tech, while Bethesda is raking in the cash and is completely comfortable with incremental upgrades to their series. Hopefully, I won't be alone in voting with my wallet.

Sheet, they are still using "an updated" version of the Oblivion engine from 2006 -- which was a time when the world was in transition from XP to Vista lol. Come now.

 

[Hellshingu]

If that's the case, then fans should hammer Bethesda to innovate more (esp in technology/engine/graphics IMO). There is no excuse for smaller studios with smaller budgets pushing the boundaries of tech, while Bethesda is raking in the cash and is completely comfortable with incremental upgrades to their series.

I'll have to find the article from a few years back but they compared the average costs of living in Poland and where some studios are based in the US and the average costs were almost 3 times as much. I don't disagree with you overall but it seems like they are playing it too safe at times.

 

[Raven77]

Yes, and have much less money, and their games sell much less sadly (the numbers of workers in the studio seems to be somewhat higher). But I already read in this forum some posters saying the contrary (using the number of people as excuse), and I dont even know why they are using as they sell MUCH more to hire more capable people.
The only thing that CDPR has easier is that their workers wages are lower for being in Poland.

Its not even about numbers for me, you dont need 50 writters to make good stories, and 30 scenario directors to make interesting quests and charaters.
You need a small number, even 1 in some cases, that knows what he or her is doing, that knows how to write, to create good characters, etc...

CDPR, Obsidian, Larian... Smaller studios that have more talented people than Bethesda. Thats the key difference in all this. And I wouldnt have a problem if Bethesda was as small as Larian, for example, but they are not, and much less they have any money problems, they could hire better people. Im sure they know their writting is mediocre at best, they just dont give a fuck (because I really hope they dont think high of them in that department).

But smaller studios also, possibly, deal with less corporate red tape and general bull shit. It's pretty likely that the development process is much more controlled, monitored for how long things are taken, and deadlines held over their heads at bigger studios like Bethesda with corporate backing than smaller private developers like CDPR.

Bethesda's developers may WANT to texture everything perfectly and make it look incredible but they wouldn't be given the time to do so.

Bethesda may also REALLY want a new engine but if the corporate budget (both time and money) doesn't allow for it then they can't do anything about it.

I'm not trying to go out of my way to make excuses for any developer, just to point out that developing a game for a major corporation like EA, etc. is likely very different than developing a similarly sized title for a privately owned developer like CDPR.

 

[koryuken]

Bethesda may also REALLY want a new engine but if the corporate budget (both time and money) doesn't allow for it then they can't do anything about it.

I'm not trying to go out of my way to make excuses for any developer, just to point out that developing a game for a major corporation like EA, etc. is likely very different than developing a similarly sized title for a privately owned developer like CDPR.

I don't disagree with you at all. However, I am hoping that fans vote with their wallet and demand a better product for their 60 dollars. As consumers, we shouldn't have to care about the corporate red tape -- we should about the finished product in front of us. Maybe this will send a stronger message if they see their sales are down from Fallout 3 to Fallout 4. Perhaps I am naive, but perhaps not.

 

[Raven77]

I don't disagree with you at all. However, I am hoping that fans vote with their wallet and demand a better product for their 60 dollars. As consumers, we shouldn't have to care about the corporate red tape -- we should about the finished product in front of us. Maybe this will send a stronger message if they see their sales are down from Fallout 3 to Fallout 4. Perhaps I am naive, perhaps not.

I 110% agree with you, please note, thats even more than 100%...

People should vote with their wallets as you said. Honestly, the game should be better looking. My personal theory is that they are developing a new engine for the next Elder Scrolls (it may even be mostly complete, the engine) but Fallout 4 was started before the engine was finished and they can't spend the time to port it over.

 

[CarbonFire]

I don't disagree with you at all. However, I am hoping that fans vote with their wallet and demand a better product for their 60 dollars. As consumers, we shouldn't have to care about the corporate red tape -- we should about the finished product in front of us. Maybe this will send a stronger message if they see their sales are down from Fallout 3 to Fallout 4. Perhaps I am naive, but perhaps not.

But that's the problem, sales likely won't suffer unless the game is a total buggy mess and gets tremendously bad word of mouth.

Because when it comes to open world, sandbox RPG games in the AAA space, Bethesda is pretty much the only game in town. And they know it.

 

[OnionPowder]

Haha, sorry about that!

Got me second guessing my PC build.

 

[koryuken]

But that's the problem, sales likely won't suffer unless the game is a total buggy mess and gets tremendously bad word of mouth.

Because when it comes to open world, sandbox RPG games in the AAA space, Bethesda is pretty much the only game in town. And they know it.

Hopefully more people follow my lead and don't pay $60 at launch. I will buy it when it hits $30.

 

[Crossing Eden]

But that's the problem, sales likely won't suffer unless the game is a total buggy mess and gets tremendously bad word of mouth.

Because when it comes to open world, sandbox RPG games in the AAA space, Bethesda is pretty much the only game in town. And they know it.

If the game is extremely good then I see no incentive to wait before purchasing. I don't even have it pre-ordered. "I don't feel that they worked hard enough on pretty graphics" isn't incentive for me.

Yes, and have much less money, and their games sell much less sadly (the numbers of workers in the studio seems to be somewhat higher). But I already read in this forum some posters saying the contrary (using the number of people as excuse), and I dont even know why they are using as they sell MUCH more to hire more capable people.
The only thing that CDPR has easier is that their workers wages are lower for being in Poland.

Its not even about numbers for me, you dont need 50 writters to make good stories, and 30 scenario directors to make interesting quests and charaters.
You need a small number, even 1 in some cases, that knows what he or her is doing, that knows how to write, to create good characters, etc...

CDPR, Obsidian, Larian... Smaller studios that have more talented people than Bethesda. Thats the key difference in all this. And I wouldnt have a problem if Bethesda was as small as Larian, for example, but they are not, and much less they have any money problems, they could hire better people. Im sure they know their writting is mediocre at best, they just dont give a fuck (because I really hope they dont think high of them in that department).

Just because a company is successful does not mean that they get unlimited time, money, and manpower to create a game. That's not how those things work, like it has been pointed out, Bethesda's team is smaller than CDPR's, Rockstar or Ubisoft, more manpower does not automatically mean better product in the end.

 

[Hellshingu]

Hopefully more people follow my lead and don't pay $60 at launch. I will buy it when it hits $30.

Because the game doesn't have rig-melting unobtainable system requirement graphics people shouldn't buy this game and wait until it is 50% off?

If the game is extremely good then I see no incentive to wait before purchasing. I don't even have it pre-ordered. "I don't feel that they worked hard enough on pretty graphics" isn't incentive for me.


Just because a company is successful does not mean that they get unlimited time, money, and manpower to create a game. That's not how those things work, like it has been pointed out, Bethesda's team is smaller than CDPR's, Rockstar or Ubisoft, more manpower does not automatically mean better product in the end.

I agree with this I wish more people would understand this. These are businesses not charity. Ubisoft's solution of throwing 500 people at a game has not worked out for them on multiple titles. Most people don't understand how businesses work and expect every game to have mind blowing new tech.

 

[aravuus]

Hopefully more people follow my lead and don't pay $60 at launch. I will buy it when it hits $30.

A world where nobody pre-ordered games would be a beautiful one indeed, but it's never happening

 

[koryuken]

Because the game doesn't have rig-melting unobtainable system requirement graphics people shouldn't buy this game and wait until it is 50% off?

Re-read our conversation again.

Waiting until its 50% off is a personal decision for me. Not buying it at launch is what I am advocating.

 

[Houndi101]

I hope there was a $30 Nvidia code for this but

Spoiler

the game isn't good looking enough

 

[DrROBschiz]

Because the game doesn't have rig-melting unobtainable system requirement graphics people shouldn't buy this game and wait until it is 50% off?

People are still in the denial stage. That said games get discounted so damn fast nowadays

 

[Mihos]

Hopefully more people follow my lead and don't pay $60 at launch. I will buy it when it hits $30.

I have pretty much the whole month of December off. I know I am going to buy it, Bethesda knows I am going to buy it, GAF knows... fricken Amazon just went on ahead and put it in my cart and texted me the buy it now button...

I am not fooling anyone.

 

[koryuken]

I have pretty much the whole month of December off. I know I am going to buy it, Bethesda knows I am going to buy it, GAF knows... fricken Amazon just went on ahead and put it in my cart and texted me the buy it now button...

I am not fooling anyone.

This made me lol.

 

[Hero Prinny]

Hopefully more people follow my lead and don't pay $60 at launch. I will buy it when it hits $30.

Well if gmg honors their mistake ill be getting it for $30 )

 

[Pseudo_Sam]

Hopefully more people follow my lead and don't pay $60 at launch. I will buy it when it hits $30.

Of course, a lot of people may prioritize Bethesda freedom over graphics. Like me. It looks how it looks, all I really care is that it's as fun to play as every other Bethesda release. And I also don't think it looks bad. In fact I have never been more hyped for a game, idk how it happened but I am frothing at the mouth right now.

 

[GavinUK86]

Hopefully more people follow my lead and don't pay $60 at launch. I will buy it when it hits $30.

Fuck that, Pip-Boy edition is on it's way!

 

[Breads]

CDP had 230 people on TW3 in height of its development, Bethesda has around 110-120. That said, Bethesda sold 30 million copies of Skyrim so this is not really an excuse. They could hire many extremely talented people if they wanted. For some reason, they don't want.

Hell they could have hired Obsidian to make more games for them in any version of their engine but still didn't. Obsidian basically asked them to hire them in several open letters to the public for years too.

 

[jim2point0]

Even just an ENB preset would help this so much. I wouldn't be surprised if a Fallout 3/NV preset would work straight-up.

You clearly have no idea how ENB works

Just to set you straight, no, it won't. FO3 ENB is DX9. FO4 is DX11. These are not cross compatible.

ENB has to be hand-crafted on a per-game basis, and the only DX11 game Borris has ever done is GTA5. He gave up after putting in anti-aliasing. I suspect DX11 is a lot more complicated for him to code for. If he didn't want to do it for a game as huge as GTA5... I have to wonder how much incentive he'll have for Fallout 4. I'm just hoping a lot since it's a Bethesda title which are notorious for being mod-magnets.

 

[aravuus]

Hell they could have hired Obsidian to make more games for them in any version of their engine but still didn't. Obsidian basically asked them to hire them in several open letters to the public for years too.

Man, if they had only hired Obsidian to just write everything for Fallout 4

It would be fucking magnificent

 

[CarbonFire]

You clearly have no idea how ENB works

Just to set you straight, no, it won't. FO3 ENB is DX9. FO4 is DX11. These are not cross compatible.

ENB has to be hand-crafted on a per-game basis, and the only DX11 game Borris has ever done is GTA5. He gave up after putting in anti-aliasing. I suspect DX11 is a lot more complicated for him to code for. If he didn't want to do it for a game as huge as GTA5... I have to wonder how much incentive he'll have for Fallout 4. I'm just hoping a lot since it's a Bethesda title which are notorious for being mod-magnets..

That's going to be a huge shock for a lot of people who are steeped in Fallout/Skyrim modding and not much else. There will still be things that can be changed/improved in the graphics department, but nothing to the degree that ENB changes DX9 Gamebryo.

 

[Auctopus]

Oh nothing major. They just forgot to compile the game with SSE instruction support. When it was finally patched a few months later, my framerate went from 35 to 60fps in some locations.

Is this sarcasm? Other games are roasted on an open fire for months because of framerate issues way smaller than this.

 

[K.Jack]

I really do wonder at these kind of posts.

Makes you wonder how people spend so much on a PC, yet have no concept of its capabilities?

Yeah, me too.

 

[Hellshingu]

Man, if they had only hired Obsidian to just write everything for Fallout 4

It would be fucking magnificent

It would have been nice if they would have brought back the New Vegas writing staff to help them with this game. Not sure how Chris would feel about working under Bethesda again though. Was really hoping that Chris had gone to help them with FO4 when he announced he left Obsidian... John Gonzalez is already at Guerrilla so that would be a pipe dream.

 

[k4n3]

dated graphics cringe worthy dialog reduced dialog tree and bethesdas amazing track record of releasing broken and buggy games .... yep GOTY for sure

its amazing what happens to people when you want something bad enough

 

[Breads]

Man, if they had only hired Obsidian to just write everything for Fallout 4

It would be fucking magnificent

Aren't most of their writers freelancers too? It still bugs me that they never hired any of them.

 

[PMS341]

Why would Obsidian work with Bethesda again, especially after the New Vegas Metacritic fiasco?

 

[koryuken]

dated graphics cringe worthy dialog reduced dialog tree and bethesdas amazing track record of releasing broken and buggy games .... yep GOTY for sure

its amazing what happens to people when you want something bad enough

This is how I'm feeling also at the moment... maybe I'm just being cynical.

 

[CarbonFire]

Why would Obsidian work with Bethesda again, especially after the New Vegas Metacritic fiasco?

The answer is they wouldn't, unless they got better terms from Bethesda (which, again, wouldn't happen). But it doesn't stop people from dreaming about that remote possibility.