reggieandTFE
Member
What the fuck is this? How are we a page later and you're still not banned?
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Family of Florida boy killed by Neighborhood Watch seeks arrest
- Thread starter Dram
- Start date
- Status
What the fuck is this? How are we a page later and you're still not banned?
There is no master list of things which are legally threatening or non-threatening. What matters is how a court of law interprets information. Being followed by a stranger in a car, is potentially threatening. Getting out of said car and confronting a person is very threatening. Even if the boy initiated fisticuffs, he could have felt threatened and justified in his acts.
Dude, but the stranger wasn't black *rolls eyes*
Dude, but the stranger wasn't black *rolls eyes*
So no.
Also no.
And another no!
Uh...we're dealing with the law right now. Exclusively.
And would you consider a physical response legally justifiable?
KHarvey16 said:
The thread is moving fast but stalking goes against Florida law:
FLORIDA
Section 784.048. STALKING; DEFINITIONS; PENALTIES. 1997.
(1) As used in this section, the term:
(a) "Harass" means to engage in a course of conduct directed at a specific person that causes substantial emotional distress in such person and serves no legitimate purpose.
(b) "Course of conduct" means a pattern a conduct composed of series of acts over a period of time, however short, evidencing a continuity of purpose. Constitutionally protected activity is not included within the meaning of "course of conduct." Such constitutionally protected activity includes picketing or other organized protests.
(c) "Credible threat" means a threat made with the intent to cause the person who is the target of the threat to reasonably fear for his or her safety. The threat must be against the life of, or a threat to cause bodily injury to, a person.
(2) Any person who willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly follows or harasses another person commits the offense of stalking, a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.
(3) Any person who willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly follows or harasses another person, and makes a credible threat with the intent to place that person in reasonable fear of death or bodily injury, commits the offense of aggravated stalking, a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.
(4) Any person who, after an injunction for protection against repeat violence pursuant to s. 784.046, or an injunction for protection against domestic violence pursuant to s. 741.30, or after any other court-imposed prohibition of conduct toward the subject person that person's property, knowingly, willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly follows or harasses another person commits the offense of aggravated stalking, a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.
(5) Any person who willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly follows or harasses a minor under 16 years of age commits the offense of aggravated stalking, a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, so. 775.083, or s. 775.084.
(6) Any law enforcement officer may arrest, without a warrant, any person he or she has probable cause to believe has violated the provisions of this section.
So what the neighborhood watch guy did was technically an offense. There isn't any way around that.
^Thanks.
what you feel is threatening. Please stop being obtuse for the sake of being obtuse. Would you find that threatening?
I'm asking you
what you feel is threatening. Please stop being obtuse for the sake of being obtuse. Would you find that threatening?
It depends how it happened. Which we don't know. Considering this guy decided to play rogue cop, we have no idea what he actually said to the kid.
I would ask him what he was doing. If I initiated a physical altercation, I would expect to be arrested.
Precisely.
Devolution
Member
So we've reached the point where Harvey is so out of touch with reality being followed by a car isn't threatening. Don't even post in his direction anymore fellas. Seriously. Don't give him any more attention.
LaserBuddha
Member
I've said multiple times that he should bear responsibility for refusing to stand down and contributing to the situation, that's true regardless of what happened next.
I'm only saying "what if he's innocent?" because there are a ton of people concluding he's a murderer based on what little we know. If anyone was concluding he was innocent I'd be saying "what if he's guilty?" too. This is the position that you and everyone else refuse to acknowledge in both KHarvey16's and my posts, and just argue against the idea of him being innocent.
When you were 17? Charges would not stick. You could explain the circumstances in court and any case would be thrown out. The kid was a fucking minor for Christ's sake.
No, he's just a shooter and he only did it in self defense because he wanted to have a chat with his gun!
CrazyDogg77
Member
Why would he be banned?
Big Baybee
Member
You are just being willfully ignorant then.
slidewinder
Banned
The 'little we know' is that he's already in the wrong and should be locked up for that much if nothing else.
Murder, manslaughter, selolfdefense can be decided after the whole rogue neighborhood watch thing gets decided... and you and harvey aren't arguing the same thing either.
He is. At least it's clear now.
Car rolls up on you in the middle of the night - "Want some of my skittles!
"The case for him being innocent is weak at best. We have someone stalking a minor, leaving a vehicle against police advice to confront said minor because he was "suspicious". Why would he be so bold to leave his car? Because he was armed and wasn't afraid to start shit.
Foxy Fox 39
Banned
lol. hey devo I know you weren't calling me out. Man this thread is all kinds of fun though.
No, I can read. It says "Any person who willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly follows or harasses another person." They'd need to prove malice and they'd also need to prove this happened before. Do you see evidence for this?
Devolution
Member
Oh sup. You know just calling the cops on these black kids that keep walking up my street.
Likely not.
We're talking about what you would find threatening since you've been all over the place with this DA stuff.
We'd like to ask the kid, but he's dead. So what's your opinion on being rolled up on by a car in the middle of the night after leaving a convenience store?
It was in regards to you saying that driving behind somebody and questioning them isn't a threat. It is a very real threat. Again, I don't know how you would feel if some stranger drove up to you and started questioning you. The kid had every right to feel (assumingly) threatened. I know I would have, and again, the scenario is similar to if a woman was walking around late at night and some stranger drove up to them asking them questions.
*rolls eyes* A minor is followed in an automobile by an adult, who gets out AGAINST POLICE ADVICE to confront them. If you started the fight and claimed you felt threatened, charges would be dropped. If you feel there is any chance that in reality you would face any kind of penalty then you are living in fantasy land.
Maybe it would help us understand each other better if we wrote out the possible scenario's we are envisioning here - here's a possible scenario where the 17 year old started the physical confrontation:
26 year old man gets out of the car, and approaches the 17 year old
26: "Hey, let me talk to you"
17: "Uh, yeah?"
26: "What are you doing right now?"
17: "What am I doing right now? What the fuck is it your business what I am doing right now?"
26: "Well where are you going then?"
17: "None of your business man"
*starts to walk away, 26 year old tells him to stop, maybe moves in front of him*
17: "Get the fuck out of my way"
*pushes/shoves 26 year old, or in some way, gets physical - fight breaks out, 17 year old gets shot*
Does that sound plausible?
26 year old man gets out of the car, and approaches the 17 year old
26: "Hey, let me talk to you"
17: "Uh, yeah?"
26: "What are you doing right now?"
17: "What am I doing right now? What the fuck is it your business what I am doing right now?"
26: "Well where are you going then?"
17: "None of your business man"
*starts to walk away, 26 year old tells him to stop, maybe moves in front of him*
17: "Get the fuck out of my way"
*pushes/shoves 26 year old, or in some way, gets physical - fight breaks out, 17 year old gets shot*
Does that sound plausible?
How was it done? Also I'll point out that legally how I perceive these actions is not what is most relevant. Unless the man's actions legally justified a physical response from the teen the self defense scenario is still in play according to the law.
I'm responding to your speculative about the shooter & justifying altercations. After hes instructed by the police, he shoots the kid. And I didn't say anything about the legality of an order. The law is on the shooters side in this matter.
Harvey would ask if the person needed directions. If they got out of the car, he would draw a map for them, because there would be no reason to feel threatened. I bet this happens all the time.
Going against Police orders to follow - repeated following willfully.
Tailing teen in the middle of the night and then confronting while carrying loaded gun into gated community - harassment and malice
Most likely the guy panicked and shot the kid. I seriously doubt the guy was thinking HOO WEEE IMMA SHOOT ME A BLACK KID!!! Either way, have fun in prison, bitch.
Do you really need an armed neighborhood watch in a gated upscale community? Sounds like someone's got a cop fantasy.
Do you really need an armed neighborhood watch in a gated upscale community? Sounds like someone's got a cop fantasy.
Why not? Its the same situation here, no?
Except some people caught wind of the teen fighting for his life.
Middle of the night, a car pulls up beside you and a guy with a bulky object around his waist/in his jacket gets out of his car and walks up to you.
Not threatened?
reggieandTFE
Member
That's not how racism works. The point is that he would not have been following to kid and calling 911 if he was white.
Roger Danish
Member
Like... a gated community?
That article says his back was wet and he had grass clippings on him... That's enough to straight up shoot someone in the chest?
Foxy Fox 39
Banned
Good. But, just to be safe approach them and ask them if they're up to no good. If they tell you to F off that means they're probably about to burglarize something.
Does this describe the incident here? According to who? Where was the gun? Can I see it? How is the man behaving?
No? I don't understand your question.
And since we can't do that, assume guilt. Right?
Devolution
Member
I got a deer rifle and a car. I can handle dis.
CrazyDogg77
Member
So if some random guy pulled up to you in the middle of the night you wouldn't feel threatened?
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked