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F'DUPTON 3: Back in the Tub with 5.0/5.5/6/7/several Inches of RAM-Flavoured Water

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O

omonimo

Banned
MichaelMikado said:
The bandwidth usage of eSRAM would not be affected by system operations. The 90% of the DDR3 bandwidth and it would have no barring on the eSRAM as they are separate memory pools with independent bandwidth. Basically one is taking available bandwidth from the other to perform operations.
Click to expand...
You trying to say gddr5 on ps4 has those limits? wat
 
A

Aquamarine

Member
thuway said:
Thank you Kagari. :eek:

I hope this puts an end to the GAF hive mind. Stop trying to compose a narrative where the RAM available on PS4 is somehow compromising vision for next generation titles. Famousmortimer, Bruce, Verendus, and I have all heard:



This cannot be repeated enough. No matter how many times this was said, there is "disappointment" and an insistence that Sony is crafting a machine that isn't focused on gaming. Stop it GAF.


WITH THIS SAID: There are games in development that are using 6 GB of RAM. I will not say any more about this.

I will say: the RAM situation on launch, will not reflect the RAM situation in two years, and not reflect the RAM situation at the end of the console's life cycle.

Another hint I've been trying to drop is that there is potential for an upclock a few years into the console life cycle for both Xbox One and PS4. This can give a late generation graphics boost similar to the one on PSP. (Optimistic parrot hopes for a 2.4 TF 1 GHZ GPU)

Finally,
GAF, I love you, but sometimes you have to understand people can be wrong. I've been wrong, yes, I'm sorry, but I have never personally tried to mislead anyone. Leadbetter has done incredible work on reporting the ins and outs of these machines, and is an amazing source of knowledge. I've chatted with him personally about 4k gaming and where we see the future of graphics. Do not make Leadbetter out to be some console fanboy that is getting paid in Kinnects.
Click to expand...

You are an awesome parrot. Don't let ANYONE tell you otherwise, okay!?
 
B

Bunta

Fujiwara Tofu Shop
thuway said:
WITH THIS SAID: There are games in development that are using 6 GB of RAM. I will not say any more about this.
Click to expand...
iNtBXN6IHDyE7.gif
 
cyberheater

cyberheater

PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
MichaelMikado said:
I am agreeing I am simply posing the question that we do NOT KNOW how much or what their cap/reserved is. That is all. It could be .01% and it could be 30%. No one speaking knows for sure but SONY would have likely give a cap which explains why devs may be "aiming for 60 fps or 1080P" when they technical have the system bandwidth to do it fairly easily.
Click to expand...

Yes but this is also true of the Microsoft system.
 
D

Dennis

Banned
With 6 GB GDDR5 there is basically no real restriction to MASSIVE levels/huge explorable open-world.

Developers who can't deliver that are not getting the full potential out of the new hardware and will struggle.

I think I am going to start up a Chinese asset-creation company.....
 
G

Goldenhen

Member
Honestly I'm very happy if the OS memory is 2GB because that give Sony room to improve their OS over the next 5 years. Meaning they can change their UI overhaul like Microsoft did with their Xbox 360.

Giving the developer 6GB is pretty good considering the next gen console suppose to last 5 years?
 
M

MichaelMikado

Banned
i-Lo said:
Is this a serious post? Cross game chat, custom soundtrack will take up a few hundred kilobytes to a few megabytes at the worst. Also, background download (iirc) goes directly to HDD.
Click to expand...

I assume your source on this is the same one who said the PS4 OS wouldn't be more than 1GB..... please cite source. I explicitly said its UNKNOWN and used the word IF not IT IS......
 
G

GodofWine

Member
I'm glad I'm joined this thread right after thuway posted above and I didn't have to go through it all to go from 4.5-5-5.5-6.

So we have enough ram...cool.
 
O

omonimo

Banned
Thunder Monkey said:
I haven't kept up with One since the DRM ordeal.

I just always took it as the norm for the eSram solution to be faster than Sony's main mem.

If it isn't then I can safely say I don't know what I'm talking about in this case either. :)
Click to expand...
esram on xbone is faster of gddr 5 on ps4 ? It's a news to me. Isn't it a bit slower even at the maximun speed?
 
B

BleachAndPepsi

Banned
thuway said:
Thank you Kagari. :eek:

I hope this puts an end to the GAF hive mind. Stop trying to compose a narrative where the RAM available on PS4 is somehow compromising next generation titles. Famousmortimer, Bruce, Verendus, and I have all heard:



This cannot be repeated enough. No matter how many times this was said, there is "disappointment" and an insistence that Sony is crafting a machine that isn't focused on gaming. Stop it GAF.


WITH THIS SAID: There are games in development that are using 6 GB of RAM. I will not say any more about this.

I will say: the RAM situation on launch, will not reflect the RAM situation in two years, and not reflect the RAM situation at the end of the console's life cycle.

Another hint I've been trying to drop is that there is potential for an upclock a few years into the console life cycle for both Xbox One and PS4. This can give a late generation graphics boost similar to the one on PSP. (Optimistic parrot hopes for a 2.4 TF 1 GHZ GPU)

Finally,
GAF, I love you, but sometimes you have to understand people can be wrong. I've been wrong, yes, I'm sorry, but I have never personally tried to mislead anyone. Leadbetter has done incredible work on reporting the ins and outs of these machines, and is an amazing source of knowledge. I've chatted with him personally about 4k gaming and where we see the future of graphics. Do not make Leadbetter out to be some console fanboy that is getting paid in Kinnects.
Click to expand...

image_4.gif
 
W

Whiteshirt

Member
MikeDown said:
and people though vista was a bloated OS...
Click to expand...

When people rail against Vista, they don't understand why. Vista was awful because:

- at the time most computers had like half a gb of RAM.
- Vista had huge driver issues so shit didn't work

It was bloated because there wasn't enough RAM in most systems so performance was shit. But if you use Vista in a modern computer with 4gb of RAM, it runs fine.
 
M

MichaelMikado

Banned
cyberheater said:
Yes but this is also true of the Microsoft system.
Click to expand...

Agreed but less likely as the eSRAM is too small to act as anything but a framebuffer. I would certainly assume they placed restrictions but the reality is the depending on the restriction we could have a situation where the xBONE has more theoretically bandwidth available to developers for graphics rendering. It is NOT likely but POSSIBLE.
 
B

BlazingDarkness

Member
Team Vernia said:
RAM situation at launch? Does that mean DF is correct at least for the launch titles?
Click to expand...

Probably, but that's not really surprising, when are launch titles on any platform ever pushing the hardware? If there are 6GB games in development already we can probably assume we'll be seeing the results of that in a year or two. Meanwhile, Sony have some breathing room to establish a competitive OS with the remaining RAM and whatnot.

Launch RAM usage: OS RAM <---------> GAME RAM <------------------>
In a few years (RAM reserved for OS is now unlocked and OS footprint is shrunk) OS RAM <-----> GAME RAM <-------------------------->

FYI: I have no technical knowledge whatsoever, lol.
 
S

SuperSonic1305

Member
I find it funny that the narrative for the first half of the year was "wait for confirmation" "wait for them to announce the console", etc. when we were dealing with rumoured specs and drm but now people are so desperate to cling to anything because "sources" and act like it's all but confirmed..
 
cyberheater

cyberheater

PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
MichaelMikado said:
Agreed but less likely as the eSRAM is too small to act as anything but a framebuffer. I would certainly assume they placed restrictions but the reality is the depending on the restriction we could have a situation where the xBONE has more theoretically bandwidth available to developers for graphics rendering. It is NOT likely but POSSIBLE.
Click to expand...

In truth. I'm pretty much a Xbox fanboy and I can see that there are corner cases where theoretically as part of a rendering pipeline you could have a case that the utilisation of the memory bus is more effectively used on Xbox One then PS4 but in reality. I really don't see it happening.

That is not to say that Xbox One won't produce some amazing games. It's not just about memory bandwidth and GPU power. The talent and vision of the developers are more important.
 
F

FinalStageBoss

Banned
thuway said:
Thank you Kagari. :eek:

I hope this puts an end to the GAF hive mind. Stop trying to compose a narrative where the RAM available on PS4 is somehow compromising next generation titles. Famousmortimer, Bruce, Verendus, and I have all heard:



This cannot be repeated enough. No matter how many times this was said, there is "disappointment" and an insistence that Sony is crafting a machine that isn't focused on gaming. Stop it GAF.


WITH THIS SAID: There are games in development that are using 6 GB of RAM. I will not say any more about this.

I will say: the RAM situation on launch, will not reflect the RAM situation in two years, and not reflect the RAM situation at the end of the console's life cycle.

Another hint I've been trying to drop is that there is potential for an upclock a few years into the console life cycle for both Xbox One and PS4. This can give a late generation graphics boost similar to the one on PSP. (Optimistic parrot hopes for a 2.4 TF 1 GHZ GPU)

Finally,
GAF, I love you, but sometimes you have to understand people can be wrong. I've been wrong, yes, I'm sorry, but I have never personally tried to mislead anyone. Leadbetter has done incredible work on reporting the ins and outs of these machines, and is an amazing source of knowledge. I've chatted with him personally about 4k gaming and where we see the future of graphics. Do not make Leadbetter out to be some console fanboy that is getting paid in Kinnects.

scarlet-macaw-725784-725843.jpg
Click to expand...

/end thread. it was fun while it lasted.
 
R

Respawn

Banned
thuway said:
Thank you Kagari. :eek:

I hope this puts an end to the GAF hive mind. Stop trying to compose a narrative where the RAM available on PS4 is somehow compromising next generation titles. Famousmortimer, Bruce, Verendus, and I have all heard:



This cannot be repeated enough. No matter how many times this was said, there is "disappointment" and an insistence that Sony is crafting a machine that isn't focused on gaming. Stop it GAF.


WITH THIS SAID: There are games in development that are using 6 GB of RAM. I will not say any more about this.

I will say: the RAM situation on launch, will not reflect the RAM situation in two years, and not reflect the RAM situation at the end of the console's life cycle.

Another hint I've been trying to drop is that there is potential for an upclock a few years into the console life cycle for both Xbox One and PS4. This can give a late generation graphics boost similar to the one on PSP. (Optimistic parrot hopes for a 2.4 TF 1 GHZ GPU)

Finally,
GAF, I love you, but sometimes you have to understand people can be wrong. I've been wrong, yes, I'm sorry, but I have never personally tried to mislead anyone. Leadbetter has done incredible work on reporting the ins and outs of these machines, and is an amazing source of knowledge. I've chatted with him personally about 4k gaming and where we see the future of graphics. Do not make Leadbetter out to be some console fanboy that is getting paid in Kinnects.
Click to expand...
2enpmv.gif
 
Shin

Shin

Banned
thuway said:
Another hint I've been trying to drop is that there is potential for an upclock a few years into the console life cycle for both Xbox One and PS4. This can give a late generation graphics boost similar to the one on PSP. (Optimistic parrot hopes for a 2.4 TF 1 GHZ GPU)
Click to expand...

I'm optimistic as well (2.0GHz CPU and maybe 50-100MHz increase on the GPU), but 100-150MHz increase might fry the GPU or at least drive it close to 80C+.
Also I had a bird just like that picture, we named it was called Mike :p

Thank you for your input, despite all the up/downs in this thread it remains fascinating stuff.
 
B

Bam Bam Baklava

Member
Arai said:
I'm optimistic as well (2.0GHz CPU and maybe 50-100MHz increase on the GPU), but 100-150MHz increase might fry the GPU or at least drive it close to 80C+.
Also I had a bird just like that picture, we named it was called Mike :p

Thank you for your input, despite all the up/downs in this thread it remains fascinating stuff.
Click to expand...

How is that possible though and why not do it from the start?
 
SEGAvangelist

SEGAvangelist

Member
Style Fox said:
How is that possible though and why not do it from the start?
Click to expand...

Why fry your console at the start? May as well play it safe and see how the launch units hold up. Also, could be stability issues that could be ironed out with firmware upgrades too.

Takuya said:
Shitty Digital Floundry journalism?
Click to expand...

My question was pretty clear and makes a whole lot of sense based on the way thuway worded things. Making jokes about DF doesn't change the fact that you're laughing at me for a dumb reason. He even said himself that he respected Leadbetter.
 
M

MichaelMikado

Banned
cyberheater said:
In truth. I'm pretty much a Xbox fanboy and I can see that there are corner cases where theoretically as part of a rendering pipeline you could have a case that the utilisation of the memory bus is more effectively used on Xbox One then PS4 but in reality. I really don't see it happening.

That is not to say that Xbox One won't produce some amazing games. It's not just about memory bandwidth and GPU power. The talent and vision of the developers are more important.
Click to expand...

Agreed, I fully support PS4 this generation but I can acknowledge when a competitor may have an advantage. The reason I am pointing out the bandwidth is that Sony stated Remote Play is on by default for EVERY title. Which means the rendering would have to take place on PS4 no matter what. The reason I am suspicious is that unlike the current PS3 remote play sony implied the system could still be usable with the Vita acting as a second screen for some games.

This leads me to believe a section of the bandwidth is carved off solely for PS Vita second screen/remote play rendering.
 
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