I'm sorry what. The Xbox has been tanking since its release three years ago when the PC strategy wasn't even in the cards yet. This has nothing to do with PC. This is just Xbox One selling terribly since forever.
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Germany sales update: PS4 3.25 million; Wii U 750K; XBO 710K
- Thread starter Ryng_tolu
- Start date
I'm sorry what. The Xbox has been tanking since its release three years ago when the PC strategy wasn't even in the cards yet. This has nothing to do with PC. This is just Xbox One selling terribly since forever.
Welfare
Member
For some perspective for how these consoles are doing:
Xbox 360 November 2008 [36 months]: 664k
PS3 November 2008 [21 months]: 696k
Wii November 2008 [24 months]: 1.388m
Xbox One July 2016 [33 months]: 706k
PS4 July 2016 [33 months]: 3.26m
Wii U July 2016 [44 months]: 750k
LTD for 7th gen in Germany wasn't updated much past 2008 so there isn't a more accurate comparison for PS and Nintendo, but it is clear that both the XB1 and PS4 are doing better than their predecessors and Wii U is lagging behind significantly.
Xbox 360 November 2008 [36 months]: 664k
PS3 November 2008 [21 months]: 696k
Wii November 2008 [24 months]: 1.388m
Xbox One July 2016 [33 months]: 706k
PS4 July 2016 [33 months]: 3.26m
Wii U July 2016 [44 months]: 750k
LTD for 7th gen in Germany wasn't updated much past 2008 so there isn't a more accurate comparison for PS and Nintendo, but it is clear that both the XB1 and PS4 are doing better than their predecessors and Wii U is lagging behind significantly.
ethomaz
Banned
I did not expect to PS4 be so ahead Wii... even counting the add months for Wii it will be close to 2:1.
Yep; Not surpirsing.
Countries in which the PS3 did better were going to heavily be PS4 this gen after MS' mistakes.
Welfare
Member
That 360 number is inaccurate. It was at 2.4m at the end of September 2013.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
That's my point. It's a lazy attempt to gain sales.
Poimandres
Member
"We understand Homer. After all, we are from the land of Sony"
Xbox Master The
Banned
Is the Xbox One still ahead of the 3560 in Germany.
Soo, the Xbox One ain't doing actually bad in comparison with the 360. It's just that the PS4 is doing stupidly good
Welfare
Member
PS4 is doing insanely good. Xbox One is doing bad in the sense that it is so far behind the PS4 when the 360 was artificially doing good in Germany compared to the PS3 because the 360 had a 16 month head start.
At the end of their respective second year, the Xbox One was 56% ahead of the 360.
Xbox 360 December 2007 [25 Months]: 384k
Xbox One December 2015 [26 Months]: 601k
And at month 16/17
Xbox 360 March 2007 [16 Months]: 252.5k
Xbox One March 2007 [17 Months]: 378k [+50%]
So the Xbox One is actually increasing the gap between it and the 360.
Do you have any PS2 numbers in comparison with the PS4? It would be interesting to see if the PS4 is doing as close as good as the PS2
Welfare
Member
I don't have any PS2 numbers, I think. I'd have to check.
DriftingSpirit
Member
I think MS' mistakes just intensified it. I think this sort of situation was going to occur whether MS was on top of their game or not.
I never understood this line of thinking. NPD is a separate thing. Just USA... just like this is just about Germany. Bringing up the World in an NPD thread would be like bringing up NPD sales numbers in a Germany sales thread, or Japan sales thread.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
All this talk of NPD when Xbox won by last month by only 10k is suspect.
Yes, we know NPD is not the world, but why are people in here feeling the need to downplay it's significance all of a sudden.
It's awfully transparent what people are getting at and it's just as embarrassing as the people who were high giving each other over the first Xbox win of the year.
Yes, we know NPD is not the world, but why are people in here feeling the need to downplay it's significance all of a sudden.
It's awfully transparent what people are getting at and it's just as embarrassing as the people who were high giving each other over the first Xbox win of the year.
The US is the largest market for consumer spending, so..... yes it is quite important.
KillerMan91
Member
X360 was successor to console that sold like dog shit in Germany. Xbox One is successor to console that sold actually pretty well in Germany (around 2.5 million). Even while MS was trying their best to sabotage Xbox One launch it was pretty much impossible for Xbox One sell less than X360 during first few years. This reminds me how people showed that 3DS is doing amazingly because it was ahead of DS launch aligned for year or two. Give it year or two and Xbox One will fall behind X360 launch aligned in germany and will not sell anywhere near the X360 LTD.
Xbox One launched exactly during the highpoint of the NSA scandal with the always on Kinect.
Noone minded buying a Wii U. People warned about Xbox One.
Xbone release was toxic and it had to go up against a far more popular brand with weaker offerings. Wii U had its niche.
This is why I find all that talk about scorpio closing gaps fruitless. Europe and Asia are not going to start buying xboxes because 6 teraflops and some more US-centric marketing.
Lion Heart
Banned
I said dayum
malboroking
Banned
I believe the EU is technically the biggest market for consumer spending. Yes they are separate countries, but it is a single market. 19.205 trillion gdp for EU, 16.77 trillion for US.
They almost did it with the 360, with a year head start mind you.
I said overstate the importance not that it has no importance.
Rellik
Member
It was one and half years in Europe. And the PS3 still managed to catch up with the 360 thanks to places like Germany not caring about the Xbox and all buying PS3s.
wapplew
Member
Thanks to piracy.
Good call.
Haunted
Member
Yup.
Where the Wii was able to transcend the usual gaming bubble and reach into the mainstream in a positive way last generation, the XB1 managed the same this generation - but negatively.
I've had people who usually have little to no idea about console hardware suddenly speak up to me and mention Microsoft's "new surveillance box".
Couple that extremely negative first impression with the off-putting US-centric marketing before and during launch and it's easy to see why it didn't manage to reach the larger market (remember "40% marketshare"?) and basically bombed just as hard as the WiiU did.
I agree with you, but I think the deeper issue is that a global context is often unwelcomed by the loudest responders in a sales discussion.
Without context then numbers are just numbers. For example, the reason why it's easy to criticize and or make fun of PR fluff pieces such as BC hours/bullets fired/sniffs of a finger/etc. is because the numbers are almost never contextualized -- they are literally meaningless. With that in mind, it makes sense to try to figure out what a sales victory -- whether it be weekly or monthly -- actually means for a product or a piece of software.
It's fine that the PS4 is leading the pack in Germany, but what do the numbers actually tell us? Do the numbers indicate a wider trend in Europe i.e. Europeans aren't that interested in supporting two consoles (concurrently)? If yes, then what can that tell us about the PS4 elsewhere -- can the numbers in Germany and EU be indicative of a global shift towards the PlayStation ecosystem? If yes, then how should Sony position Neo: should it be a higher-spec PS4 that lives alongside the current PS4 OR should it be the one and only PS4 going forward? Etc etc etc. This stuff might be boring to people because it requires spending more time thinking about countries that you only read about, but to a good number of us, it's really really interesting to know and discuss how this videogame 'thing' is actually doing in different parts of the world.
Wonder if the WiiU or the XB1 will have made more money by the time NX/Scorpio come around. XB1 started more expensive and pretty quickly fell off a cliff while WiiU got one drop for the Premium console and largely stayed the same ever since. Actually is more expensive than the XB1 right now. Quick search on amazon tells me I can get XB1 + 2 games for 250, whereas WiiU + 1 game is 280.
Lister
Banned
This is untrue. While PC gaming is more popular in Germany than in other western European nations console gaming still takes the biggest amount of revenue at least when it comes to traditional software
This graph is from 2014:
It also includes Steam. Doesn't include F2P or MMOs (that is why mobile revenue is so low). Considering the utter dominance of PS4 in console space It's the biggest platform in Germany at least for traditional games.
There is no way that chart is accurate. Source?
Lister
Banned
There is no correlation between people buying games and people playing games, as I already stated. You don't need to buy anything to play games on the PC which is why the PC market has far more players than the console market (saw a graphic last year and PC dominated).
Nah, that chart is just messed up. They probably had no idea what they were doing and named it wrong.
Not sure what exactly goes in there (and VR is debatable) but this seems to be a decent one.
This chart is weirdly structured. With consoels being lumped in with VR and smart Tv gaming,which apparently is not miniscule in Germany.
Some percentages: https://www.bitkom.org/Presse/Press...-Praesentation-PK-Gaming-11-08-2016-final.pdf
(Warnign PDF). Out of people who consider themselves gamers in Germany 78% play games on laptops and 67% on PC vs 59% on consoles.
Here's another info graphic from Newzoo: https://newzoo.com/insights/infographics/infographic-german-games-market/
The PC screen dominates. And I'm not sure if TV screen is just consoles or also incorporates things like PC gaming on the big screen.
<- German
There is no need for a xbox one, PS4 + WiiU has the best Value.
Xbox one exclusive = 99% Shooters and nobody cares about shooters on a consoles.
I think it is known that in germany PC is relative strong - compared to other markets, where consoles clearly dominate.
You can see it from the size of the PC section in stores, Sim segment and a lot of smaller Steam titles do get a disc release here. Iphs
The initial question was: Why are there so few gamers? The answer is: Germany is probably not as hardcore as UK but people play a lot on PC and also on Handhelds.
It still might be true to some extent (never had an arcade culture here) - but you'd have to take a look on the whole picture and also include the "old" consoles.
NDS for instance was the most succesfull gaming hardware ever with 7,5 mio sold - easily beating the PS2 (5,9).
However the exact numbers are - there are not so many stationary console gamers because people play on other devices - probably more than in other countries where consoles dominate.
Yep, it's as I mentioned which is the reason why I disliked that part. Handheld/tablet one was interesting though, same with casual browser/mobile.
Thanks for the second link, that one includes the chart I mentioned (with PC dominating). Funny thing regarding the first link, they group the laptop as mobile...which isn't really the case. I'm always surprised (and taken aback) at how many people play MMOs on their laptops.
PS4 owners have the occasional reason to purchase a Wii U.
I wonder how much the marketing costs are. The launch advertisement campaign for Xbox One was extremely agressive. Deaf, but extremely aggressive. You couldn't go anywhere without seeing Xbox ads. And they got the Bundesliga tie in. Can't be cheap.
Omnistalgic
Member
So if Germany likes PC, will the market there gravitate towards more powerful PS consoles more frequently?
No, they will gravitate towards PC more frequently.
Xbox Master The
Banned
The XBO has been outselling the WIi U constantly according the the above posters.
Welfare
Member
Yes, it's just not outselling it by much to have already surpassed it. It'll do it before the end of the year.
Look at the size f the European market as a whole to get a better view of a population comparable to the US and the difference isn't that big.
Because npd is not the world and the bigger picture is winning one month by 10k while it's getting smashed 100 times that or more worldwide shows how little it means in the big picture.
Beating your opponent by devaluing your product, making less money and then only getting ~7% better sales is certainly significant for a lot of bad reasons.
<- Also German
While I agree that PS4 + Wii U offers a very, very broad library of games and seems like the way-to-go I don't agree with the second statement. Yes, Xbox One has more shooters, but that's not the reason we don't buy the XBONE. We have a huge console shooter market, it just sits where most people play: On PS4. We do care about console shooters, but why bother getting both consoles when one of them is just fine?
Xbox Master The
Banned
I don't think clearing stock and creating momentum into the S launch is devaluing the console.
100 times?
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