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[op_ivy]

I didn't want to buy "that guy" that does the comparison shots, because I think the new stuff looks good, just not as good, but here goes:

http://www.larabie.net/gaf/comparison.html

the lighting is different, the dust is different, but it looks like simple tweaks to me, not a downgrade. in fact, like others, i think it looks better. you can see the details better and the lighting isnt as over the top.

 

[Falagard]

As I said on the last page, Bungie posted what was different about the reveal trailer than what would be in the final game. And that was the lighting and possibly the aliasing. Bungie, the developers of this particular videogame we are discussing, stated this. When they revealed it.

I'm about to head to work and I'm done with this graphical discussion. I cannot wait for this game.

I don't remember them saying anything about the lighting (link if anyone has one, but I pretty much read/watch/consume everything I can about Halo), but they mentioned that the aliasing had been cranked up, that the game was a work in progress, and that with exception of the aliasing it was the target they hoped to hit.

Everything looks great - the new motion capture stuff they've integrated into their workflow is awesome. Very cinematic, almost documentary style feel. Definitely a step up from everything they've done in the past, and even what they've done in the past was awesome-riffic.

 

[ToyMachine228]

Is Reach going to be any less cartoonish than its predecessors?

Bungie has redesigned all the species of the Covenant to make them "scary" again. As they were in Halo: CE. Alien creatures. Even the Grunts look more menacing in Reach. They also no longer speak English, they speak their native languages again to reinforce their alien origin.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

Is Reach going to be any less cartoonish than its predecessors? Are the Grunts still in it? Do they waddle around and make jawa noises?

I hope not. The biggest disconnect for me regarding Halo games has been how well made and cinematic the trailers are compared to how cartoonish the actual game is.

What toy machine said.

 

[Shake Appeal]

As I said on the last page, Bungie posted what was different about the reveal trailer than what would be in the final game. And that was the lighting and possibly the aliasing. Bungie, the developers of this particular videogame we are discussing, stated this. When they revealed it.

After they revealed it and a bunch of people immediately said, nope, not happening, not in realtime, not on a 360 (and took shit in similar threads to this one for saying that).

 

[Louis Wu]

I didn't want to buy "that guy" that does the comparison shots, because I think the new stuff looks good, just not as good, but here goes:

http://www.larabie.net/gaf/comparison.html

Okay, now I see the differences you're talking about.

And I can understand that the first one is more complicated, from a rendering standpoint.

But I like the new one better.

::shrug:: maybe I'm just a white-bread-and Bud Light kinda guy when it comes to this stuff; you've shown me the improvements that were lost, and I'm just not caring.

(In real life, I dislike white bread and Bud Light. Before today, I'd have thought I disliked them in my videogames, too - but I guess you learn something new every day.)

 

[Sill4]

You really know you don't belong on Gaf when your in a thread gushing about a game's lore and gameplay when everybody else is babbling over graphics :lol

I don't really care if it's a "downgrade" to all you experts out there, the new version is brighter and much more distinctive than the old. Funny how long time Halo Gaf members can easily forget that Bungie has a unique style that seperates it from any other shooter on the market.

-edit- Wu nailed it

 

[Stinkles]

More like it's all cut-scenes.

There is also gameplay in the trailer.

 

[Len Dontree]

Motion Capture. Finally.

Indeed, I think it was a really good choice. They've got their own mocap facility now, correct?

I've always thought their in-game animation was fine, the aliens have good personality and the human movement gets the job done, but their cutscenes have always been too stiff. This looks like an across-the-board improvement.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

You really know you don't belong on Gaf when your in a thread gushing about a game's lore and gameplay when everybody else is babbling over graphics :lol

I don't really care if it's a "downgrade" to all you experts out there, the new version is brighter and much more distinctive than the old. Funny how long time Halo Gaf members can easily forget that Bungie has a unique style that seperates it from any other shooter on the market.

Agree 100%. Engage FTL drives!

 

[ToyMachine228]

I don't remember them saying anything about the lighting (link if anyone has one, but I pretty much read/watch/consume everything I can about Halo), but they mentioned that the aliasing had been cranked up, that the game was a work in progress, and that with exception of the aliasing it was the target they hoped to hit.

It's in an interview if I recall. I don't know where. I'm off to work now so I don't have time to search for it for you. Sorry.

 

[The Librarian]

The graphics need to be darker and grittier, and more mature.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

The graphics need to be needler and needler, and more needler.

Fixed!

 

[Spasm]

Cynar, check PM plz kthx (I screwed up).

 

[Lakitu]

Wow. People are actually comparing the jump from Halo: Reach's teaser to final gameplay to Halo 2/3's jump. Crazy. Don't care how much of an 'expert' you are.

 

[Wiggum2007]

Can't we all just be excited about the fact that we're getting a Halo game with human faces that don't look like burn victims?

 

[Shake Appeal]

Wow. People are actually comparing the jump from Halo: Reach's teaser to final gameplay to Halo 2/3's jump. Crazy. Don't care how much of an 'expert' you are.

Dunno about you, but I haven't seen any final Reach gameplay yet.

 

[ToyMachine228]

Anyone else notice the blinking red light in the final frame of the trailer on the ground behind the Spartan? Before Remember Reach 09.14.2010. Just noticed it.

 

[Chinner]

Bungie needs to incorporate more sock puppets into their trailers.

 

[Lakitu]

Dunno about you, but I haven't seen any final Reach gameplay yet.

Clever. You seem like a lovely person.

 

[ShinAmano]

In the epic words of some guy from high school whose name I forget: 'Hut Hoy O God Dagit!'

 

[Gui_PT]

There is also gameplay in the trailer.

Is it the part with the Elite? In 1st person?

 

[op_ivy]

Is it the part with the Elite? In 1st person?

i think hes referring to the space battle

 

[Lakitu]

Is it the part with the Elite? In 1st person?

The Falcon flying through the city is gameplay.

 

[Cynar]

Cynar, check PM plz kthx (I screwed up).

np, thanks.

 

[Stinkles]

Not sure I really understand where Falagard is going - he's posting pics of an art direction change, not a tech change - it's a cut-scene, albeit in-engine, and there's no particular perf issue with rendering whatever in a controlled cut-scene, so any changes made to it would be aesthetic, not technical.

So I can't pretend to know what specific changes were made, other than what's visible in the shot, but the idea that that comparison has anything to do with a technical downgrade seems silly to me, even on its face.

It frankly looks to me like they made everything look sharper in the cut-scnes and more focused to match the way some of the stuff is now rendering in the game - the crisper, more visible vehicles with rim lighting being a good example of recent changes.

 

[Sill4]

Anyone else notice the blinking red light in the final frame of the trailer on the ground behind the Spartan? Before Remember Reach 09.14.2010. Just noticed it.

When I saw that, it reminded me of a moon landing. Just the barren look of it and that slow flashing light.

Of all the environments, that was actually my favorite. So simple, yet so good.

 

[Captain Blood]

I was able to check it out during my break, thanks for the mobile link Wu. Damn that was awesome, I can't wait to check it out on my TV with the audio blaring

 

[∀ Narayan]

Noble 6 has his/her own voice depending on what gender you pick.

Whoa. He's/she's going to speak? Awesome!

 

[Doodis]

Has this ever been brought up before? Because it's all I think of when I see Jorge.

=

 

[Chinner]

Not sure I really understand where Falagard is going - he's posting pics of an art direction change, not a tech change - it's a cut-scene, albeit in-engine, and there's no particular perf issue with rendering whatever in a controlled cut-scene, so any changes made to it would be aesthetic, not technical.

So I can't pretend to know what specific changes were made, other than what's visible in the shot, but the idea that that comparison has anything to do with a technical downgrade seems silly to me, even on its face.

It frankly looks to me like they made everything look sharper in the cut-scnes and more focused to match the way some of the stuff is now rendering in the game - the crisper, more visible vehicles with rim lighting being a good example of recent changes.

i've been looking at his posts, and i'm pretty sure hes complaining about the lack of sock puppets.

 

[Mr_Brit]

Whoa. He's/she's going to speak? Awesome!

Yes but are they a character or just an avatar with no emotions or opinions.

 

[Falagard]

Okay, now I see the differences you're talking about.

And I can understand that the first one is more complicated, from a rendering standpoint.

But I like the new one better.

::shrug:: maybe I'm just a white-bread-and Bud Light kinda guy when it comes to this stuff; you've shown me the improvements that were lost, and I'm just not caring.

(In real life, I dislike white bread and Bud Light. Before today, I'd have thought I disliked them in my videogames, too - but I guess you learn something new every day.)

Absolutely - most people probably wouldn't notice these things unless pointed out to them directly, so if the framerate drops too low during cut-scenes with the added effects then Bungie decides to remove some of the effects in order to keep things running smoothly. It's simply part of the development process, and I understand that.

I think it's hard to say that the general consensus is that people would like the cut-scenes better without the extra lighting, shadows and particle effects because those subtle effects usually make things look more realistic, and therefore "better", but my guess is that the vast majority of people will still think the cut-scenes look incredible without them (as is evidenced on GAF) and hardly notice the difference.

Okay, comparisons out of the way - speculation time!

Someone mentioned earlier it looks like Noble 6 is jumping from the Spire multiplayer map, which looks like a convenant structure. Would the covenant have time to build structures on Reach during the battle, or maybe they can just drop them from a cruiser or something?

 

[Shake Appeal]

he's posting pics of an art direction change, not a tech change

Oh come now, we can argue about the merits of bloom and dust effects, but removing the shadow the Warthog throws on the ground is an aesthetic change? Et tu, Frankie?

Sure the thread is getting sidetracked, and overall the game looks great (and the faces and animation are highlights), but I just can't fathom how people convince themselves that the flat removal of shadowing and lighting is in fact some sort of subtle tonal adjustment to shadowing and lighting.

 

[squidhands]

Has this ever been brought up before? Because it's all I think of when I see Jorge.

=

Noble 6 is motherfucking Higgins!!!!!

 

[Stormtrooper30]

I noticed the difference when I watched the trailer for the second time. It's just less hazy and so more sharp, definately prefer the newer version better than the older.

Also, I hope the spoiler tags see generous use here. I don't wanna have to leave HaloGAF for a month+.

 

[Gareth Bale]

Not sure I really understand where Falagard is going - he's posting pics of an art direction change, not a tech change - it's a cut-scene, albeit in-engine, and there's no particular perf issue with rendering whatever in a controlled cut-scene, so any changes made to it would be aesthetic, not technical.

So I can't pretend to know what specific changes were made, other than what's visible in the shot, but the idea that that comparison has anything to do with a technical downgrade seems silly to me, even on its face.

It frankly looks to me like they made everything look sharper in the cut-scnes and more focused to match the way some of the stuff is now rendering in the game - the crisper, more visible vehicles with rim lighting being a good example of recent changes.

I understand what you are saying and I certainly agree to an extent (it does look a lot crisper) but we can't pretend that the removal of shadowing from the warthog is an art direction change, or an aesthetic change rather than technical one.

Edit: and beaten by a mile

 

[Flipyap]

Is Reach going to be any less cartoonish than its predecessors? Are the Grunts still in it? Do they waddle around and make jawa noises?

I hope not. The biggest disconnect for me regarding Halo games has been how well made and cinematic the trailers are compared to how cartoonish the actual game is.

This is the worst post I have ever read. You make me sad, thread.

 

[Instigator]

Update your avatar. You have no more excuses.

 

[Stinkles]

Oh come now, we can argue about the merits of bloom and dust effects, but removing the shadow the Warthog throws on the ground is an aesthetic change? Et tu, Frankie?

Sure the thread is getting sidetracked, and overall the game looks great (and the faces and animation are highlights), but I just can't fathom how people convince themselves that the flat removal of shadowing and lighting is in fact some sort of subtle tonal adjustment to shadowing and lighting.

Just telling you what I saw for myself, I literally have no extra insight.

 

[JaggedSac]

Perhaps they made the changes to match the in-game graphics. That way there is not so much of a jolt when jumping from cut scene to gameplay. I think that is a very valid path to take.

 

[Major Williams]

summary: Engine in trailer is worse

The more I see Halo off screen and in-screen, and these wonderfully shaded low-res pics, it makes me hesitant to give it such praise simply because Halo 3 looked that way with the low-res screens and trailers before it came out and I almost died of too much awesomeness that really didn't pan out when I played the game itself.

For me it feels like Halo 3 largely but with particle effects and improved faces - nothing really revolutionary here graphics-wise. There's no antialiasing, and the lack of shadowing really hurts the perception of certain things that I was once excited about in the world premiere trailer. Perhaps this is what bungie was going for though - an improved and refined engine that delivers the same core experience, but with subtle improvements throughout time. Just kind of sucks that we once saw something in a previous trailer that was then removed from the final product.

One thing I am always excited about, however, is the new environments and vistas to look at. The environmental artists have gone all out for this one, and created some VERY epic-looking shots.

 

[.la1n]

art direction is really impressive, Iv'e enjoyed all the Halo games but like a weirdo I actually thought ODST was the best (single play campaign.) I really like what i'm seeing and I hope that they are able to implement some AA this time in game. since it was such a vocal complaint on 3 and ODST I think they will probably attempt to remedy the issue.

 

[Mr_Brit]

Update your avatar. You have no more excuses.

B&W looks better.

 

[witness]

Hooooly shit that trailer is amazing. Some of those big sweeping shots of them flying around the planet reminded me of Avatar. I'm ready to be taken away by the hype machine.

 

[Red]

art direction is really impressive, Iv'e enjoyed all the Halo games but like a weirdo I actually thought ODST was the best (single play campaign.) I really like what i'm seeing and I hope that they are able to implement some AA this time in game. since it was such a vocal complaint on 3 and ODST I think they will probably attempt to remedy the issue.

You're no weirdo; ODST's campaign was great. It's not my favorite, but it's a very unique experience and is a joy to play.

 

[AwesomeSyrup]

I think the graphics look quite a bit better than Halo 3, but all I really care about is the gameplay. Bungie has perfected FPS gameplay with Halo and I just want more of it. Sexy graphics are just an added bonus.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I like the new shots better as the imagery is just more clear; the original is really quite dark. I like a bit of color in mah Halos.

I am not an expert, though. I just looked at the picutres and thought it looked gud. Impressive, even.

Opened up the thread expecting to see speculation and gifs, got arguments about the shadow under the Warthog compared to the early announcement trailer. :\

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Consider this fan disappointed.

This was their fucking CAMPAIGN trailer.

Think back to the HALO 2 Announce trailer. Then to HALO 3's Chief/ARK reveal trailer. Immensely more epic and hype-inducing.

This is fucking REACH - when the humans are supposed to lose a huge fucking battle - the low point of their struggle and that is the best they could come up with? Disappointment total.

 

[Kibbles]

what spoiler?

everyone already knows the ending

Ugh, this is something that will happen before the ending and it reveals a specific character dying during a specific scene, so when I get to that scene now I'll be like

Spoiler

Oh look, this is where Kat dies!

Doesn't bother me too much, but for some people I know it's going to be a big spoiler so when people say it's not, I just :lol.