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[Q8D3vil]

I can't climb because I consistently get destroyed by these Combo Priests. I don't know what beats it.

What kind of combo ?
Normal with or purify ?
Combo priest suck vs midrange palladin and shaman since there are so many cards that can debuff their minions and combo priest cant keep up cleaning a cheap board so dont commit and bait removals.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

Ok, I mean, let's be real here for a second. Equating Auctioneer and Frostbolt is a pretty big... well, not sure what to call it -- chasm, maybe? It's true hat both are staple cards; one in mage and one in rogue. One, however, enables an archetype single handedly. The other does 3 damage and freezes a target for 2 mana. If frostbolt suddenly disappeared the only thing that might happen is that mages might finally use flame surge for a bit. There's a reason why whenever Ben Brode gets talking about what kind of cards he might like to see removed from standard he talks about cards like Auctioneer, Ice Block and Alextrasa. We are talking about one of the most influential cards in the game here.

Regardless, I'm not actually arguing against the merits of Auctioneer and by extension Miracle Rogue here. I'm just pointing out that, GA has been on their radar for a while now and if I were a betting man I'd bet that it gets retired at the end this rotation. It has nothing to do with skill or if Miracle is a great deck with a high skill cap (for the record, I agree with both of those claims). It is my read that Blizzard just believes that it's time for a change.

One theory that I could see Blizzard buying that the relative ubiquitousness of Miracle Rogue stifles experimentation. For example, rogue still has a pretty decent jade package going on, but the deck never really caught on and was never really refined as a result. Was jade rogue a t1 deck? Probably not. But I could totally see Ben Brode and co reasoning that the deck never really had a chance.

Frostbolt is one of many examples. It was not given to equate them, but to show that common usage within a class is not enough. And furthermore, since only miracle rogue decks actually use auctioneer... comparing it to frostbolt's usage rate is a joke since every mage deck ever made uses frostbolt and only miracle rogue and some oddball hybrid decks use auctioneer.

Ubiquitous... I'm not seeing that. That is like saying all freeze mage is ubiquitous because they run frost nova + doomsayer + frost bolt + fireball + ice block + ice barrier etc.. Yes miracle rogue is somewhat "ubiquitous" among miracle rogue decks. And in competitive play right now, afaik few are playing QR but I could be wrong, miracle rogue is the only deck being played. But among all rogue decks being played right now, only 1 out of like 4 or 5 of them runs auctioneer. So no, it's not ubiquitous imo.

As far as miracle rogue stopping jade rogue from being played? Not tried enough? Or refined? Disagree on all accounts. Miracle rogue never stopped people from experimenting for a minute. People have experimented a ton with even c'thun rogue. Perhaps even more with n'zoth and jade rogue decks. Miracle rogue is not stopping them from being played and if miracle rogue were gone right now rogue would largely be gone right now. It wouldn't make some space for jade rogue to rise. If jade rogue is worth playing, it would be played regardless of miracle rogue.

If blizzard removes gadgetzan it'll likely be another mistake; perhaps bigger than nerfing blade flurry so hard. Lets assume they add cards to make a new competitive rogue deck. Whatever cool archetype blizzard introduces to replace miracle rogue will suffer the same issue. It'll be the only competitive deck rogue has, instead of now having 2 competitive decks, like many other classes have or have had.

We know the problem with auctioneer. People bitch about it enough and Blizzard might cave in. I won't predict what they do. They obviously talked about perhaps rotating auctioneer.

 

[Tacitus_]

Why are you so focused on usage rates? It's not that. Every class has staple cards that will fit in to almost every one of their decks.
Auctioneer is on the block because it allows you to draw stupid amounts of cards, while contributing to your decks gameplan and without the opponent being allowed to interact with it.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I don't get this fascination with interaction, hearthstone is designed to limit interaction. You're not gonna interact with sprint either.

 

[Tacitus_]

I don't get this fascination with interaction, hearthstone is designed to limit interaction. You're not gonna interact with sprint either.

Sprint doesn't put a minion on the board and contributes far less to the growth of Edwin and questing adventurers.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Sprint doesn't put a minion on the board and contributes far less to the growth of Edwin and questing adventurers.

different argument. Interaction is not a requirement or determinant of quality in hearthstone, yet it's used for arguments on a regular basis.

You can't interact with nourish, you can't interact with anything on your opponent's turn, by design.

The 4/4 body of auctioneer is a liability more than anything.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

Why are you so focused on usage rates? It's not that. Every class has staple cards that will fit in to almost every one of their decks.
Auctioneer is on the block because it allows you to draw stupid amounts of cards, while contributing to your decks gameplan and without the opponent being allowed to interact with it.

I focused on usage rates because it was brought up as an argument.

What wasn't brought up is this "draw stupid amounts of cards" and somehow being non-interactive.

Auctioneer is a minion. You can easily interact with it now that conceal is out of standard. "Sprint doesn't put a minion" - Exactly, there is zero interactive component to sprint because it doesn't produce a minion. If auctioneer didn't make a minion the card would cost far less than it currently does. Let's say 4/4 is worth 3 mana, then the text is worth 3 mana. Imagine a 3 mana auctioneer turn. Just lasts the single turn, but way stronger than auctioneer as it is.

 

[Tacitus_]

different argument. Interaction is not a requirement or determinant of quality in hearthstone, yet it's used for arguments on a regular basis.

You can't interact with nourish, you can't interact with anything on your opponent's turn, by design.

The 4/4 body of auctioneer is a liability more than anything.

And because you can't interact with your opponents turn, they have been culling those cards that produce solitaire gameplay. Brode has flat out stated that they don't want cards that enable strategies that aren't "fun and interactive".

The body is both a liability and a benefit. If it somehow sticks, you can easily draw the rest of your deck that turn.

 

[scarlet]

I got my hoej packs. I don't think I can wait that long, and I think I've got all un'goro legendaries I want.

Edit: 115 fust from 4 packs. Got 1 epic.

 

[Arjen]

Got my kolento packs and it had king mosh. Does it even see play or should i just dust it?

 

[Nopren]

I got rogue quest and paladin quest in my Høj packs. Dusted rogue quest, and now I'm thinking of what legendary to craft. I don't have any legendary, except for karazhan legs, and I love playing priest. I guess I should craft Lyra, right? I'm playing purify priest at the moment.

 

[rahji]

got 2 epics in my trunks pack, yeah.

edit: just saw, it is a golden epic! it is dinomancy. cannot wait for the sweet sweet dust!

 

[Tacitus_]

Packlento only gave me a golden common :|

Still paying for my godly luck with OG packs.

I got rogue quest and paladin quest in my Høj packs. Dusted rogue quest, and now I'm thinking of what legendary to craft. I don't have any legendary, except for karazhan legs, and I love playing priest. I guess I should craft Lyra, right? I'm playing purify priest at the moment.

Lyra is amazing in purify priest, but you might want to think twice about getting legendaries that can be used outside of a single class.

 

[scarlet]

I got rogue quest and paladin quest in my Høj packs. Dusted rogue quest, and now I'm thinking of what legendary to craft. I don't have any legendary, except for karazhan legs, and I love playing priest. I guess I should craft Lyra, right? I'm playing purify priest at the moment.

If you're playing priest exclusively, Lyra is a good choice.

 

[Sande]

Auctioneer was pretty cool when you were fatigued by turn 10. Then jade idol ruined everything.

I like facing miracle rogue. Those are always fun matches. So it'd be sad if they just nuke auctioneer but they've kinda forced themselves into the situation.

 

[Grief.exe]

Evolve Shaman is such a great deck to grind levels with.

Turn 6 you just win. I delayed it by one turn here because I was greedy.

 

[EmiPrime]

No Kolento packs yet (EU).

 

[Q8D3vil]

Evolve Shaman is such a great deck to grind levels with.

Turn 6 you just win. I delayed it by one turn in this game because I was greedy and wanted to produce another totem on 6 Mana to be able to get 2x Thing From Below on the board for my evolve.

Yeah totally not broken.

Spoiler

LOL

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

No Kolento packs yet (EU).

I got mine in EU.

 

[Tacitus_]

No Kolento packs yet (EU).

I got mine so they are probably just rolling them out slowly.

 

[Hycran]

Evolve Shaman is such a great deck to grind levels with.

Turn 6 you just win. I delayed it by one turn here because I was greedy.

I love saving counterspell, volcano, meteor, equality and any number of other spells for turn 6. So satisfying to feel the tilt.

Edit: NA got my kolento packs

 

[Karsticles]

What kind of combo ?
Normal with or purify ?
Combo priest suck vs midrange palladin and shaman since there are so many cards that can debuff their minions and combo priest cant keep up cleaning a cheap board so dont commit and bait removals.

Normal. I haven't had Midrange Paladin success, but Evolve Shaman might do the trick.

 

[Grief.exe]

I love saving counterspell, volcano, meteor, equality and any number of other spells for turn 6. So satisfying to feel the tilt.

Edit: NA got my kolento packs

Ya if you're playing against evolve Shaman, this is the advice to take. Don't burn your Dragonfire potion, Flamestrike, Equality/Consecration, etc before the evolve.

Don't freak out if they go wide early, just let them tickle you.

 

[inky]

4 Kolento packs. Neat.

 

[Blizzard]

I don't have my Kolento packs in the U.S. yet. Blizzard has abandoned me. ;(

 

[Keyser Soze]

Got my 4 packs, but not opening until new expansion goes live. The I will open all 80ish free/gold packs and need to lie down afterwards

 

[veryslowhand]

Better to open now, you can get a rogue quest.

 

[CelticKnight]

Just got my 40 dust from Blizzard.

Funny thing is out of the 4 times I've done this, 3 single player Championships (where I've "1 pack'd" every time) and the 1 College tournament (where I picked the winner) I actually think it's been 4 common's and a rare in every pack.

 

[Grief.exe]

Better to open now, you can get a rogue quest.

You probably have a greater chance of opening a duplicate legendary at this point 😵😵😵😵

Better not risk it.

 

[wiibomb]

Got my neirea packs and amazon has a 10% coin back today, so I jumped on the KFT preorder.

I have 115 packs waiting to be opened, but with my luck I cannot open them until the change, I'm sure I'll get duplicates out of those packs

 

[Blizzard]

Yay, the Kolentopacks just showed up!

All 4 were 4 common, 1 rare. The conspiracy is real. Basically 1.5 free rare cards of my choice.

 

[SodiumBenzoate]

Got a suggested deck list with mulligan guide? I'll try it.

This got me to rank 5 this month:

### token evolve
# Class: Shaman
# Format: Standard
# Year of the Mammoth
#
# 2x (1) Bloodsail Corsair
# 2x (1) Evolve
# 2x (1) Fire Fly
# 1x (1) Patches the Pirate
# 1x (2) Devolve
# 2x (2) Flametongue Totem
# 2x (2) Jade Claws
# 2x (2) Maelstrom Portal
# 2x (2) Primalfin Totem
# 1x (3) Hex
# 2x (3) Mana Tide Totem
# 2x (3) Stonehill Defender
# 2x (4) Jade Lightning
# 2x (5) Bloodlust
# 2x (5) Doppelgangster
# 1x (6) Aya Blackpaw
# 2x (6) Thing from Below
#
AAECAfe5AgT+BZG8ApS9Ava9Ag2BBOUH8AeTCfqqAvuqAqC2Aoe8AtG8Avm/ApHBApvCAuvCAgA=
#
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone

Mulligan for 1/2 mana cards, keep devolve/hex against priest/druid, keep Maelstrom portal vs warrior, rogue, druid, shaman.

Don't hesitate to play Corsair on turn 1 even against pirate warrior, the board presence is much more important than the weapon removal. Don't get too greedy with evolve, you can win without the Doppelgangster combo (except against control priest/mage, that's the worst matchup for the deck I think)

 

[Blizzard]

Don't hesitate to play Corsair on turn 1 even against pirate warrior, the board presence is much more important than the weapon removal. Don't get too greedy with evolve, you can win without the Doppelgangster combo (except against control priest/mage, that's the worst matchup for the deck I think)

Thanks...though by far the most common matchups (60% or more sometimes?) are Mage / Priest, so I guess I'll still have to keep looking for a deck that can hard counter them.

It's probably an even mix of control priest and combo priest and dragon priest, though perhaps most non-combo priests include the combo cards anyway in case you happen to leave a 3-5 HP minion alive.

 

[veryslowhand]

When does the double reward thing ends? Trying to maximize the possible gold

 

[Tacitus_]

When does the double reward thing ends? Trying to maximize the possible gold

From the horse's mouth

You know, I'm not sure. I kind of feel like Ragnaros has got a big head about the whole thing. Someone needs to take him down a peg. Like, c'mon, chill out, man.

So who knows. There were some guesses that it would be a two week event so you've got at least til next wednesday to get gold.

 

[Cockmagic]

3 packs from neirea? Pleasant surprise. Nothing in the packs, though. :/

 

[Keyser Soze]

I hope they keep it for longer than most expect, as quests finally seem worthwhile with the change.

Would love to see them permanently increase all quests 50% tbh. 60, 90, 150 world make me feel better about devoting times decks I dont normally play.

 

[Lone_Prodigy]

This got me to rank 5 this month:

Don't hesitate to play Corsair on turn 1 even against pirate warrior, the board presence is much more important than the weapon removal. Don't get too greedy with evolve, you can win without the Doppelgangster combo (except against control priest/mage, that's the worst matchup for the deck I think)

I run a similar list, but with a second Devolve instead of Hex.

 

[Karsticles]

From the horse's mouth



So who knows. There were some guesses that it would be a two week event so you've got at least til next wednesday to get gold.

"Chill out" sounds like it might last until the Northrend reveals.

 

[slightconfuse]

from Brode's AMA

Ice Block matches some red flags for cards that maybe shouldn't be in Standard forever.
No Legendary Totem card is an oversight. They'll see what they can do.
Stonetusk Boar is, in Ben's opinion, the most guilty card when it comes to limiting future card mechanics.
Mike Donais says that Preparation, Innervate, and Malygos are also mechanic limiters.

Charge is sometimes a great mechanic. The future could see more nerfs to Charge cards due to it being the "biggest balance challenge".

 

[wiibomb]

When does the double reward thing ends? Trying to maximize the possible gold

An user changed his pc clock date to next wednesday and he saw the gold icons revert to the normal 40-50-60 ones, so we kind of know now that this lasts until next wednesday, even if ben brode don't want to confirm.

He probably didn't want to confirm because the team is planning to follow up this event with the frost festival on wednesday, so they didn't want to tell people because the end was a surprise. (But datamine leaks ruin everything)

 

[DyslexicAlucard]

from Brode's AMA

I think It'd be hilarious to live in a world where Trump is president and Stonetusk Boar is a "Hall of Fame" card.

 

[Yaboosh]

Putting stonetusk boar in hall of fame is ludicrous. Fix charge if you think that is necessary.

 

[SonicXtreme]

Better to open now, you can get a rogue quest.

Yeah i have juuuust a tad under half of the legendaries from ungoro, obviously most of the good ones. i think i might as well open mine, since i still have a high chance of getting something new and more importantly a shot at the rogue (not like i'm going to get one anyway but that's my reasoning, if you have more than half of the legendaries and are missing some good ones def save, but most of my missing ones are pretty junk anyway). only bc the nerf is still live, def not opening classics or anything. also my pity timer is almost brand new which factored into my decision to just go with it.

 

[thepotatoman]

Putting stonetusk boar in hall of fame is ludicrous. Fix charge if you think that is necessary.

I guess at this point you probably should just say all Charge can't go face.

 

[SonicXtreme]

I guess at this point you probably should just say all Charge can't go face.

then face decks would just go weapon heavy and everyone would go on to the next whine quest of nerfing them. how tf can ppl even joke about moving boar into HOF now that quest rogue got nerfed lmao. at least with boar around the quest is semi playable in wild, i've seen it go pretty nuts since the nerf, still pretty off hinges and probably better than every other quest in wild sans maybe warrior. shaman quest is playable in wild too but its pretty damn gimmicky

 

[wiibomb]

then face decks would just go weapon heavy and everyone would go on to the next whine quest of nerfing them. how tf can ppl even joke about moving boar into HOF now that quest rogue got nerfed lmao. at least with boar around the quest is semi playable in wild, i've seen it go pretty nuts since the nerf, still pretty off hinges and probably better than every other quest in wild sans maybe warrior. shaman quest is playable in wild too but its pretty damn gimmicky

You can't be serious about comparing weapons to charge minions. There can only be 1 weapon on board at the time, pirate warrior would be nothing without its charge minions, weapons are only a part of it and sometimes having 3 weapons on hand just kills the PW because it starves (personal experience)

Also, weapons have already several hate cards to counter them, charge minions are not counterable since they enter the board and just hit face or whatever they want, their value is inmediate where weapons already wear the user.

Stonetusk boar is a problem for sure, and the devs have said so several times, I wouldn't be surprised if they moved it sometime, charge as a whole will move to be conditional or nonexistent, patches might be the last free charge minion released.

 

[SonicXtreme]

Also, weapons have already several hate cards to counter them, charge minions are not counterable since they enter the board and just hit face or whatever they want, their value is inmediate where weapons already wear the user.

taunt counters charge minions a hell of a lot better than it counters weapons. it's a very hard counter to charge that already exists. one spikeridged steed is basically game over for PW.

i'd much much much rather see better early game taunts to balance the game rather than to just blatantly get rid of charge and weak things like freaking boar. there's a reason deathlord and sludge are still so strong in wild, charge minions trade incredibly badly into even the lowest attack taunts

 

[Blizzard]

Stonetusk boar is a problem for sure, and the devs have said so several times, I wouldn't be surprised if they moved it sometime, charge as a whole will move to be conditional or nonexistent, patches might be the last free charge minion released.

What does the bolded mean? Neutral charge minion? They've already revealed a charge + lifesteal minion for paladin in the upcoming expansion.

 

[wiibomb]

What does the bolded mean? Neutral charge minion? They've already revealed a charge + lifesteal minion for paladin in the upcoming expansion.

Ah yeah, forgot that card... hmmm that card is expensive and not neutral, though. Doesn't work as well when you consider for the same cost you get on warrior a 4/3 with charge.

Kibler mentioned that card as a "defensive charger" and I kind of agree.