ShadowFox08
Member
Its more like x bone vs x bone x
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How much more powerful is the Switch vs Wii U?
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Rushersauce
Banned
Wii-u Is imperial system
Switch is metric system. Superior in every way.
Switch is metric system. Superior in every way.
thelastikilla
Neo Member
Around 3x when docked and +50% undocked I think.
Splatoon 2 evidence that the console can run the game at 2x resolution docked and same resolution undocked at the same time that improve graphics significantly (Modeling, lighting, shadows, reflections...) and maintaining the rock-solid 60fps.
In terms of GFLOPS is around 2x docked and similar undocked in regard to Wii U, but the leap in terms of architecture (Old AMD DX10 and pre-GCN to actual nVidia Maxwell with DX11/12 feature level) is tremendous. Also, 3x RAM usable for games and a relatively modern ARM CPU compared to the obsolote Wii U CPU derived from GameCube.
In terms of GPU it can be around 1/3 of PS4 docked and 1/6 undocked but the more complex games may be even more limited by amount of RAM, bandwitch, CPU power... Especially the engines with high use of deferred rendering like Frostbite may be unportables by the very poor bandwith.
Splatoon 2 evidence that the console can run the game at 2x resolution docked and same resolution undocked at the same time that improve graphics significantly (Modeling, lighting, shadows, reflections...) and maintaining the rock-solid 60fps.
In terms of GFLOPS is around 2x docked and similar undocked in regard to Wii U, but the leap in terms of architecture (Old AMD DX10 and pre-GCN to actual nVidia Maxwell with DX11/12 feature level) is tremendous. Also, 3x RAM usable for games and a relatively modern ARM CPU compared to the obsolote Wii U CPU derived from GameCube.
In terms of GPU it can be around 1/3 of PS4 docked and 1/6 undocked but the more complex games may be even more limited by amount of RAM, bandwitch, CPU power... Especially the engines with high use of deferred rendering like Frostbite may be unportables by the very poor bandwith.
ShadowFox08
Member
Which could explain why botw on switch handheld runs as good as it does, and docked isn't doubling the resolution because you need 2.25x gpu power to go from 720p to 1080p. Not to mention, Switch only gets 25% more RAM usage in docked over handheld mode which isn't proportional to the gpu gains in docked mode.
Velocity:Design:Comfort
Banned
Worst post in the thread? Worst Switch post on GAF?
The tile based rendering certainly helps but it doesn't compare to the 50 to 100gbs boost with in the edram.
frankie_baby
Member
RAM? Thats exactly the same in both modes, its gpu that is relevant and that is exact 2x in docked compared to handheld
GabeTheGrouch76
Member
I myself think the honor system would be a more noble comparison unit.
Consoles are measured in the honor system by the amount of "unprecedented" third-party partnerships they have.
ShadowFox08
Member
The speed is different. 25% faster in docked mode.
frankie_baby
Member
Again not true, its only slower in the lower power 157gflops mode not the 196 gflops mode
ShadowFox08
Member
That's what I was comparing from, not boost mode.
frankie_baby
Member
You were talking about breath of the wild, that game gets no increase in ram speed going fron handheld to docked
I cant imagine anything much apart from simple games being made in the low power mode
Skittzo0413
Member
I don't know if we have solid proof of this but I very much doubt anyone will be using the low power mode for a game that would struggle with docked mode RAM.
I figured the > equals x times 2 squared was a dead giveaway, of how dumb this shit is. Lol
Sure, but then again, the rest of your comparison is rather accurate... just the Switch and WiiU were complete BS. And in a way that someone who is not well informed, might actually believe what you wrote. In a thread about this very topic, no less. It would have been different had you snuk in the 3DS somewhere between the Switch and XboxOne for instance. So surely, you can understand people responding to your "dumb shit".
They opened up RAM for undocked to allow 1600 MHz as well according to DF.
GameAddict411
Member
I think the biggest issue with the switch is memory bandwidth. Everything else is considerably better than the Wii u, and it shows in some of the ports we have seen.
The Switch seems to have new chips with better architecture and way more RAM, which would make it a much, much bigger jump from Wii-U than the Wii was from GC, but no matter how powerful the system may be capable of in docked mode, won't it always be limited to what can be accomplished in undocked mode?
Skittzo0413
Member
Sure, but since modern games and engines are made to be easily scalable that isn't really a big issue.
ambar_hitman
Member
Will U is Vegeta.
Switch is Super Saiyan Vegeta when undocked.
When docked, Switch becomes Ultra Super Saiyan Vegeta. It gains power but looses mobility.
Switch is Super Saiyan Vegeta when undocked.
When docked, Switch becomes Ultra Super Saiyan Vegeta. It gains power but looses mobility.
UltimaKilo
Gold Member
They would have been significantly closer had they waited for the Tegra X2 and die shrink, but the consoles price may have been significantly higher and they would have been stuck with the Wii U for longer than they should.
Still hoping to get a die shrink Switch in the future with a higher clock speed, improved kickstand and a few ounces shaved off the device, but we're not getting that any times soon.
Target for docked is 1080p (full output resolution). Target for handheld is 720p (full output resolution). That's already half the performance needed just by going handheld (for graphics). For instance, Breath of the Wild performs better in handheld mode (downclocked but at a lower resolution) than docked at full speed and a higher resolution.
Zombegoast
Member
More than enough to make people mad and say the PS4 version is a terrible port.
Oh the early years of 7th gen.
Oh the early years of 7th gen.
It's like Gamecube -> Wii jump.
I saw zero Switch games those potentially can't run on Wii U.
This is not exactly true. The Wii was basically a beefed up Gamecube. Higher clock speed and more RAM. But with the same CPU and GPU architecture. Not only does the Switch have 3x more useable RAM compared to WiiU and more than double the raw GPU power, it is also a far far more modern architecture with added features. This was not the case from GCN > Wii.
Skittzo0413
Member
A Tegra X2 revision would not really improve performance all that much. If they were to release such a revision I'm pretty sure it would be purely for the increased battery life, as well as the reduced amount of space the chip will use. Which could even let them use a bigger battery if they wanted.
So basically it would be purely for battery life I think.
What does this mean exactly?
Gotdatmoney
Member
The Tegra X2 is not going to be feasible in a system for another 2-3 years. The board just came out commercially. If Nintendo wanted more power the best they could do is add another shader core and die shrink the current chip. That's about it. You're not getting much better than that for a long time.
A die shrunk Maxwell (X1) is basically Pascal (X2) anyway. Other process improvements in X2 (128bit bus, 8GB RAM) are things Nintendo would probably want anyway. The only sticking point might be using Denver CPUs rather than going for A72/73 or something but since Switch has proven such a big success perhaps Nvidia would be amenable to doing something more customized for Nintendo's needs.
Gotdatmoney
Member
The new board also allows big little core access at the same time which means they could use the A53s for games. But as I said, the board just came out and it's expensive as fuck. It's not feasible currently. And the only way to really boost the graphics is more shader cores which adds size.
CPU stays the same docked or undocked.
FunkyDealer
Banned
Same console, greater leap.
Yoshi's Island offloads much processing to a powerful chip in the cartridge.
killatopak
Member
You said "no matter how powerful the system may be capable of in docked mode, won't it always be limited to what can be accomplished in undocked mode?". But even though the system doesn't run as fast in handheld mode as in docked mode, it also has to output the graphics at 720p max (because the screen is only 720p). Whereas docked, most games try to output at a higher resolution (up to 1080p). Well, because the screen is only 720p, that means the fact that the performance in handheld mode is lower, is not much of an issue since the output resolution is less taxing on the hardware to begin with. Switch can only use half of its resources in handheld mode, but it also has to do only half of the work. Ofcourse, this is only true for the graphics (GPU etc) and not for AI or game code, which doesn't change from handheld to docked.
In Zelda, you should try to run around where you
meet the Deku Tree and find the Master Sword
Only effects like boss or stage scaling, rotation and warping. That Yoshi sprite is 100% vanilla SNES.
lwilliams3
Member
Not necessarily. It depends on the developers.
At best, the GPU would have been something like 50% of the Xbox One in raw power. X2/Parker wouldn't dramatically make a difference, and it would make the price and shipment issues of the Switch even worse.
There is no universal "target". Devs are free to use the extra power as they wish. A game may use the power to push more geometry or AA instead of resolution changes. It would be interesting to see what a port to SSBU will do, for example, since it was already 1080p/60fps on the Wii U.
Ozfunghi is correct. For the same reasons, it's not really comparable to the mid-gen refreshes like the PS4Pro and even the XB1X to a lesser extent.
Any UE4 game, for example, would be difficult to port on the Wii U due to the lack of supporting tools for its architecture.
I think Nintendo may move to use some of the X2 technology at some point, not so much for the power jump but to increase battery life and smooth out performance issues. So they may keep the clock speeds the same and the shader cores the same but keep the extra bandwidth and allow the CPUs higher efficiency to give a jump without messing with game logic.
Council Pop
Member
I don't think this is true at all. PS4 struggled with that game at times.
Would love them to release it though, just so we could refer to it as The Switcher 3.
Skittzo0413
Member
It runs fairly well on low end PCs weaker than the Switch. Lonely1 just posted a video of it running pretty badly, but still running, on the GPD Win. And the Switch is a great deal more powerful than that.
Rushersauce
Banned
It's like you don't even know what you talking about!
It's a notable jump, not only to RAM increase but just the general technology being used can do things more quickly than 360/U/PS3 era tech can.
Lack of UE4 on Wii U was more office politics than actual hardware capability, considering UE4 runs on budget Android phones.
Lack of UE4 on Wii U was more office politics than actual hardware capability, considering UE4 runs on budget Android phones.
Skittzo0413
Member
I'd actually say it was more a combination of hardware and interest/politics. The Wii U likely didn't have all of the features necessary for Epic to easily tweak UE4 for it, so it would've taken a good deal more work and time for them to do it, and very little incentive to do so.
killatopak
Member
sure.
800x540 res on sub 15fps plus all graphic quality turned low with dithering and shitty pop-in is proof that it could work on switch.
Best of all is that Geralt is just walking on the initial part of the story. It's not even while fighting or on a vast open field and the frame rate is already chugging. While fighting, it turns into 10 fps.
Switch GPU could handle it but I doubt the CPU could. Unless Switch CPU is significantly stronger than the GPD's it's just not possible.
Dice already admitted the switch can run frostbite unlike WiiU.
pretty done
Member
Not buying 4x when docked at all. Zelda would've been 1080p if that were true.
Shit everything would be 1080p if that were true.
Shit everything would be 1080p if that were true.