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[Gravy Boat]

Yeah guys let’s all relax and just pay sony for their notoriously shitty internet service so we can get access to basic console features. It’s not a big deal we’ve all got tons of money to throw around

If you're throwing up over a less than £4 a month fee then you really do need to relax. Or just stop paying it. And if you're already not paying it, then you really need to relax.

 

[Mupod]

It's why I didn't get Destiny 2 on PS4. I would've definitely caved in for double-dipping otherwise.

I'll grudgingly get PS+ for a few months for Monster Hunter World but other than that I'm done. And I have been done since they massively jacked up the price in Canada last year.

 

[watdaeff4]

Weird? How do you save if you don't pay?

Just local HD.

 

[jett]

They won't, it's not 90s anymore. And IRC by default is afwul.


so you suggest that they're "greedy" to their employees instead? Services like that is not cheap. If it's "free" that means someone is paying for you.

I prefer the simplicity of IRC multiple times over discord. That thing's interface is trash.

 

[gamz]

Just local HD.

Was it like that last generation? I don't remember on my PS3?

So you have to move your saves over with your games if you buy a new system or what not? What if your hard drive takes a crap you lose them?

 

[test_account]

I'm still waiting for when Nintendo drops the fee on us for what they want their online services.

There are so many games of theirs that I do enjoy playing online - Mario Kart, Splatoon - that i see myself doing it, if not for myself, then for other people in my family that enjoy playing Nintendo games online, as well.

They would at least be the first company to finally fleece men or an online fee, where Microsoft and Sony have failed thus far.

Its confirmed to be $19.99 a year in the US at least:

https://www.nintendo.com/switch/online-service

Or $3.99 for one month, and $7.99 for three months.

 

[WillyFive]

Yeah, its a big reason why I have a hard time justifying buying a PS4 or an Xbox One.

But it's also weird how so many here are justifying the expense due to "free games". They are not free if you are paying money for them.

 

[DigSCCP]

I've been a PS+ user since the PS3 so I never had this feeling of "paying to play online".
But I can understand the OP, it must be frustrating to come back to a plataform after a while and not being able to play online because of a paywall.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

SO how much for that initial build and how long is "a few years?"

Not trolling, genuinely curious as you seem someone who is willing to give a straight answer and not downplay it because it is your perferred method of gaming.

I’m not the person you replied to, but as with everything on PC, it depends. You get to decide when your hardware is too old.

I made a PC for about $650. I estimate it’ll last me the rest of this console generation and into a little bit of the next. I’ll have to slowly turn the quality settings down on games to achieve that (but I get to choose what settings I reduce to get there). I am not an Ultra settings gamer, nor do I care about getting higher than 1080/60fps. Once it gets to an equilibrium of performance and quality that I don’t like, I’ll probably go buy another $200 graphics card and start the whole thing over.

But it’s possible I’ll just be happy with the deluge of indie games pouring into Steam every day and I won’t feel the need to get a new PC based on the new releases. Or I’ll be ok with 1080/30 for a while. Who knows.

Its confirmed to be $19.99 a year in the US at least:

https://www.nintendo.com/switch/online-service

Or $3.99 for one month, and $7.99 for three months.

That’s less than I thought. I probably would not sub the multiple years, but I could see myself getting one year of the online, just for that sweet Nintendo action.

 

[watdaeff4]

Was it like that last generation? I don't remember on my PS3?

So you have to move your saves over with your games if you buy a new system or what not? What if your hard drive takes a crap you lose them?

I have PS+ so don't know for sure, but I assume the answer to all your questions is "Yes"

It's a complete rip off.

It's always sad and annoying when I see people defending this shit.

I'm not "defending" it, but am a lemming and have accepted it as at this point in my life, I don't want to be bothered with PC builds and gaming. I like the simplicity and "comfy couch" aspect of console gaming (and don't want a PC rig hooked up to my TV).

As far as the "complete rip-off" quote - when MS did it initially with the 360, that was the complete rip-off. There are some arguable other side-effect "perks" now with both Gold and PS+. (Definitive other perks thrown in, the arguable part is how "valuable" they are)

I'm not the person you replied to, but as with everything on PC, it depends. You get to decide when your hardware is too old.

I made a PC for about $650. I estimate it'll last me the rest of this console generation and into a little bit of the next. I'll have to slowly turn the quality settings down on games to achieve that (but I get to choose what settings I reduce to get there). I am not an Ultra settings gamer, nor do I care about getting higher than 1080/60fps. Once it gets to an equilibrium of performance and quality that I don't like, I'll probably go buy another $200 graphics card and start the whole thing over.

But it's possible I'll just be happy with the deluge of indie games pouring into Steam every day and I won't feel the need to get a new PC based on the new releases. Or I'll be ok with 1080/30 for a while. Who knows.


That's less than I thought. I probably would not sub the multiple years, but I could see myself getting one year of the online, just for that sweet Nintendo action.

Thanks for the reply - how old is your PC? I appreciate you giving up the $$ amount, but the "few years part" still seems to be a bit fuzzy. (no offense intended)

I"m a 99.9999% console gamer now, but am interested in having options even though I"m a tad set in my ways and don't really want to mess around with the tech that much tbh. But could still change my mind.

 

[Baraka Obama]

Nintendo has been charging for trading for ages.

 

[ArtHands]

Yeah, its a big reason why I have a hard time justifying buying a PS4 or an Xbox One.

But it's also weird how so many here are justifying the expense due to "free games". They are not free if you are paying money for them.

But calling them 'free' makes them feel better with their justification.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Because no other gaming service charges for cloud saves.

What other game service has cloud saves?

 

[Raw64life]

I bought 5 years of PS+ a few years ago when they went on sale for $30. In my defense, they were giving you at least one free game that I actually wanted to play almost every month back then. I think I'm good until 2020 now but I'm definitely not just going to auto-renew when that shit expires. Dragon Quest Heroes II is the only game I even used to play online on my PS4 in the last year.

 

[The ๖ۜBronx]

But calling them 'free' makes them feel better with their justification.

No, it's just most are adults that understand what's meant. Not pedants that feel a need to nitpick a point that's irrelevant to the discussion. People seem to think they're casting some illuminating light when they say "but it isn't free" – they aren't. No one has to "feel better" about their justification. Stop acting like yours is the only valid position and that everyone else has to trick themselves into being alright with what they've got. Such a juvenile and absurd response – if you don't see the value in it don't buy it. Not a hard concept to understand.

 

[Quonny]

There are some arguable other side-effect "perks" now with both Gold and PS+. (Definitive other perks thrown in, the arguable part is how "valuable" they are)

I buy PS+ for those perks. Online play is just a bonus to me.

 

[paperspace]

⁣

 

[Nev]

What other game service has cloud saves?

Steam and Live?

 

[Finky Spunky]

Best things in life are free.

That's why PSN on PS3 was so intriguing.

 

[test_account]

Yeah, its a big reason why I have a hard time justifying buying a PS4 or an Xbox One.

But it's also weird how so many here are justifying the expense due to "free games". They are not free if you are paying money for them.

I think that is people just saying they think the value is good due to the games being offered. Personally, i got PS+ because of the "free" games. I dont remember when i got PS+, but it was in late 2010 or in 2011 i think. For me, it had nothing to do with playing online. I'd probably still have a subcription to this day even if PS4 online was free.

But calling them 'free' makes them feel better with their justification.

I dont think anyone arent aware that they pay for them.

That's less than I thought. I probably would not sub the multiple years, but I could see myself getting one year of the online, just for that sweet Nintendo action.

Nintendo is smart to not charge more than that to begin with. It makes it easier for people to pay, $20 a year is almost nothing after all. They also dont include as many "free" games as well. I'm curious to see how the developement of their service will be in the upcoming years.

 

[watdaeff4]

I buy PS+ for those perks. Online play is just a bonus to me.

tbh I do to. I play a couple games online here and there on the PS4, but most of my online gaming is on Xbox. PS+ games (have a Vita also) and the discounts aren't nothing to sneeze at IMO. But the "other side" will just say we are corporate apologists.

What other game service has cloud saves?

You just being obtuse here?

 

[Cpt Lmao]

If Nintendo were smart, they'd try and get some big online games like Overwatch and then be like "lol free online, and portability"

 

[FRS1987]

I tend to forget too since I don't play online on consoles. Any multiplayer game I usually play on Steam/PC. I tend to play single player games on console so when my PlayStation plus subscription expired, I wondered why would I want to renew it if I don't even play multiplayer games on my PS4. I guess it depends on the person but I don't like the model since you never really feel like you get your money's worth by paying to play online imo.

 

[sixteen-bit]

Wild to think netplay is an added cost of like $250+ over the lifetime of the system. That's a whole console.

 

[hydruxo]

I mean, it sucks, but it is what it is. If I don't pay it, I can't play on PSN with my friends so it's the price I have to pay. Plus the "free" games are nice as well.

 

[The ๖ۜBronx]

But even disregarding that, I don't see your point here. It's not free to operate, nothing really is, but that doesn't mean it will become a paid service in the future. Even if it comes to that there are a lot of free services that people will just use instead.

I think the point was that if someone wishes to charge a fee for the use of a product they've created and support it shouldn't be taken as greed. People are not entitled to use the work of others for free, but thankfully many companies and people are willing to provide the service for no cost (or alternative costs).

 

[EricTheRed]

Mumble is free, open source, slightly better voice quality than discord, and you can run your own mumble server very easily.

I did not know this level of ignorance still existed in this day and age, where pretty much any information is literally a web search away...
If you're not just trolling, it's basically like this; once you build your pc, you're set for a few years (if you chose your parts wisely). When it is time to upgrade, you only need a new graphics card most of the time. Get a mid ranger for $300-$400 (same cost as a new console really) and you're good for another few years. PC gaming is certainly not as simple as some will have you believe, but it's also not as complicated as a lot of console diehards will have you believing either.

Listen to the voices of experience, not the fanboys.

OK maybe I was over exaggerating but I wasn't trolling. My point was that people tend to moan about paying a small amount a month then will quite happily spend hundreds/ thousands on a PC. My job doesn't pay a massive amount but £5.99 a month to me is still less than nothing. In the grand scheme of life, who cares?

 

[Dragon1893]

Moving from PS3 to PS4 was the end of MP on consoles for me.

 

[MoogleMan]

SO how much for that initial build and how long is "a few years?"

Not trolling, genuinely curious as you seem someone who is willing to give a straight answer and not downplay it because it is your perferred method of gaming.

Ok, so $400 will get you an entry level system, good for 1080p. About $600 for a decent system. Probably much above $800 would be hitting the point of diminishing return, but other factors have to be taken into account, like monitor resolution. There's a lot of great builds on the build a pc thread, logical increments, and r/buildapc.

Comparing apples to apples, the $600 system would last for probably the entirety of a console generation. You'll easily be hitting 1080p 60fps for that amount of time. Then, when it is time to upgrade, the only thing that would really need an upgrade would be the graphics card. Maybe the generation after (~10 years maybe) you'd want to build a new pc. Most build a new one sooner because it's addicting. ;-)

When I built my system, I went all in, so I spent quite a bit more, but it has a lot of features I wanted in a system (32gb ram, 512gb ssd boot drive, x2 4tb hdd for media/games, etc.). My graphics card is a 980 ti; at 1080p ultrawide (2560x1080), I likely won't need to upgrade my card for a good 3-4 years. Maybe even longer if I stay gaming at 1080p.

Long story short though, locking online play and cloud saves (for ps4 anyway) was one of the main reason I built my gaming pc. The other was Ori and the Blind Forest. ;-)

OK maybe I was over exaggerating but I wasn't trolling. My point was that people tend to moan about paying a small amount a month then will quite happily spend hundreds/ thousands on a PC. My job doesn't pay a massive amount but £5.99 a month to me is still less than nothing. In the grand scheme of life, who cares?

Console gaming = spend less upfront, more over time.
PC gaming = spend a bit more upfront, way less over time.

So, yeah, that 5.99 may not be that much per month, but it does add up over multiple months.
Most of the guys spending thousands on PCs do so out of hobby and not necessity.
Steam's hardware survey usually indicates very modest hardware as being the most popular/used.

 

[jdmonmou]

Microsoft and Sony said they wanted to offer an alternative to PC which is why we have the Xbox One X and PS4 Pro. Why not be like PC and remove the online play paywall?

 

[Horns]

All the free games makes it worth it to me. I have no issues with it. If steam offered a similar deal with free monthly games for $60 annually i would likely take it.

 

[Windu]

You do get 3 or 4 games a month, so I think the value is ok. Still sucks though.

I myself don't pay for it. I get Xbox live free through Microsoft Rewards.

 

[WillyFive]

What other game service has cloud saves?

I've been using cloud saves for years on two+ different services (Steam, Origin, random iOS/Android games) and never had to pay for it.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

Thanks for the reply - how old is your PC? I appreciate you giving up the $$ amount, but the "few years part" still seems to be a bit fuzzy. (no offense intended)

I"m a 99.9999% console gamer now, but am interested in having options even though I"m a tad set in my ways and don't really want to mess around with the tech that much tbh. But could still change my mind.

I built my $650 PC in 2016. I’ve been very happy with it. I once felt the same as you, but I quickly realized that many of the pains and aches of a bad PC experience are self inflicted by getting poor parts and cheapening out. (I was limping along with a bad PC before that) Now I plop down in front of my projector, fire up the Steam Link, and press play on anything with a controller icon. Bam, playing a game in 1080/60 at high or ultra. It’s quite nice.

The thing is, I can’t know for certain how long this PC will last me. It really is up to me and some unknowns in the gaming industry. Will there be a big push to a DirectX 13? Will there be a big push to six or eight core systems? I don’t know. I know that I’ll be able to play a crap load of games on my PC still in 2023 but the question of whether those games will be what I want to play (or at the settings I want) is another matter. I’m guessing it will do me for at least 6 years for the big AAA titles, but we will see.

If you wanted to see something in this vein play out in real time, check out JermGaming’s Potato Masher videos or Oafah’s Shitbox videos on YouTube. They’re both small experiments in long term budget PC gaming. The Potato Masher series is what sold me on building a PC in the first place.

 

[B_Signal]

If it wasn't for the PS+ games, which I rarely touch because I buy too much (more my fault than Sony's), I wouldn't bother. Online gaming really should just be part of the deal when you buy a console

If Nintendo's offering is a good deal then I might get it, paying for 2 services when I rarely play online is just stupid, even if if is only a few quid a month (not that most of us pay it monthly)

 

[dragonyeuw]

Thanks for the reply - how old is your PC? I appreciate you giving up the $$ amount, but the "few years part" still seems to be a bit fuzzy. (no offense intended)

I"m a 99.9999% console gamer now, but am interested in having options even though I"m a tad set in my ways and don't really want to mess around with the tech that much tbh. But could still change my mind.

I'll give you my scenario- I got a 750ti/I5-4690k build back in early 2015 that serves me well. Now, I don't know what a 750ti was considered back then( maybe entry-mid level?) but it's firmly in the 'entry-level' class at this point and most high fidelity games nowadays I'm having to reduce to mid settings to get good framerates at 900/1080p( of course, optimization comes into it as well). Most of last gen's AAA stuff I can more or less max out. Stuff like Doom 2016 or Rise of Tomb Raider? Mid settings at 900p to get 50-60 frames. But, the option is there to upgrade at my pace. I can stretch it out another year and enjoy Ps4 level settings for a while....or I can plunk down $300 on a 1060 and I'm good for a few more years....or maybe I can eventually find a decent priced 1070/1080 that hasn't been price-spiked due to mining. I also feel like the 'tweaking' thing is a bit overblown. Yeah, sometimes I may have to update my drivers, or google a fix for something. I suppose to some degree I actually find tinkering fun, but that's a personal thing. But is console gaming strictly plug and play nowadays? Shit, you have games coming out nowadays that have 20-30GB day one patches FFS, OS updates, and the like. Whether it's PC or console, we're well past the days of plugging in a controller, turning on your console, put in your game, and off and running in under a minute.

Either way, PC gaming is very much a matter of getting into it at whatever level you want( entry, mid, mid high, high end) and upgrade according to your budget and what you want to do. PC gaming for me is as much about options( tweaking settings, free online, multiple storefronts, various controllers,etc) as it is being more powerful that whatever console is on the market. In a nutshell, PC gaming's biggest strength( in my eyes) is choice.

 

[Pantz]

I only work like 6 months out of the year and I can afford 4K gaming, VR gaming, online gaming and much much more. No need to get in to the details but paying for a nice online service is not a big deal and these companies that give me endless hours of entertainment deserve my money.

 

[Sgt.Pepper]

Paid online for Pokemon/Mario Kart sounds horrifying.

 

[Blam]

Tbh it's only happening because we allow it.

 

[ch4fx_]

This thread reminded me that I have to renew my PSN subscription soon, kudos for that.

 

[shotgunbob04]

Looking back, I'm ashamed I ever paid for PSN multiplayer on PS4.

PSN is absolute trash. It goes down unexpectedly multiple times per month, and each time lasts anywhere from 30 minutes to several hours. And there's no "sorry" or extension of the subscription when that happens.

Now with playing online exclusively on PC, I pay nothing and all the different services never go down. Honestly, I've been playing on PC for a year and not once has Steam or Origin or Battle.net just decided to go offline unexpectedly. And with Steam—where I play most of my online games—I have achievements, I can change my username for free, I can set my profile picture to whatever I want without paying for new pictures, and all my saves get synced automatically to the cloud. Oh and downloading a game on Steam takes me 1/3 the time that PSN does.

 

[Mr-Joker]

How the fuck do you all do it? And how the fuck do they get away with charging for one of the most basic features of the internet?

Because Microsoft started this trend back in the 360 days and Sony follow suit with the PS4 but because gamers were in the "fuck you Microsoft" they just ate it up, and now Nintendo is following suit because "Hey easy free money"

I haven't paid for on-line and I still won't.

Worried fake edit: Can Nintendo actually charge money to trade/battle pokemon in their new upcoming Switch game? Because that idea is truly horrifying

Probably not as the Pokémon company probably won't let them as they don't want to drive away their younger fanbase and for the most part the Pokémon Company is pretty consumer friendly towards their fan base.

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

I only work like 6 months out of the year and I can afford 4K gaming, VR gaming, online gaming and much much more. No need to get in to the details but paying for a nice online service is not a big deal and these companies that give me endless hours of entertainment deserve my money.

And not everyone is lucky like you.

 

[jdmonmou]

I only work like 6 months out of the year and I can afford 4K gaming, VR gaming, online gaming and much much more. No need to get in to the details but paying for a nice online service is not a big deal and these companies that give me endless hours of entertainment deserve my money.

I wouldn't have as much of a problem with it if Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo explained how the subscription money was being used. We haven't gotten that from someone like Phil Spencer, Shuhei Yoshida, or Reggie so it feels like a blatant money grab. And there are still ads on the dashboard.

And I feel like MS and Sony especially are missing the big picture on how to keep their consoles relevant as PC gaming gets more popular. The answer is not mid-gen upgrades, but improving the services and policies of their console ecosystems. Keeping an online play paywall is just another reason for consumers choose a PC over a console. I don't know how MS can reconcile the fact that they charge an Xbox Live subscription on their consoles while offering their games on PC where you can play them online for free.

 

[RichiRamjag]

I pay it for XBL or PSN (never doing both again), but I’ll normally buy two years for around $60 during a sale and just forget about it. Not sure if I’m keen on even bothering with Nintendo’s online service though.

 

[Fantasy Final]

A big reason I went PC + Switch. I wanted to play some Halo 5 online the other day for fun and I actually forgot you have to pay to play online. I didn't pay of course, so I turned it off.

 

[Clarkus Darkus]

Just account share with your friend and then use his sub, Still free to you then. Simple.

 

[WillyFive]

I only work like 6 months out of the year and I can afford 4K gaming, VR gaming, online gaming and much much more. No need to get in to the details but paying for a nice online service is not a big deal and these companies that give me endless hours of entertainment deserve my money.

Rich people can also afford to give hundred dollar tips to people in restaurants. No need to minimize the fact that it's an extra expense just because you get to have enough money to not worry about the nickle and diming.

 

[Lyon N. Laap]

A big reason I went PC + Switch. I wanted to play some Halo 5 online the other day for fun and I actually forgot you have to pay to play online. I didn't pay of course, so I turned it off.

But you'll have to pay for Switch online eventually. Cheaper, but still paid. Though if you don't care about most online Nintendo games (Splatoon, Mario Kart, etc.), then I guess it doesn't really matter.

 

[Feel the Swift]

You can find XBL codes so cheap if you time it right that I don't lose sleep over the little extra money. Not worth it because it will never change