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[Deleted member 752119]

I'm not sure I would gamble on a non-refundable, full-price console game. But then again I'm pretty risk averse. Steam games, sure.


I'm not saying that I haven't succumbed to pre-release hype and pre-ordered, but I like to think I learnt from that and I more often than not blamed myself if it turned out to be a total lemon. There are scenarios where developers have completely flipped a game on its head *post* release via updates, which is almost impossible to avoid and genuinely should incite rage. That's not cool.

Pretty much the same here. Plus I've been gaming and know my likes and dislikes very well so I'm pretty much never surprised by liking a game outside my preferred genres.

Actually, I usually regret spending precious gaming time on something I end up not enjoying as much as various various games in my favored genres that are sitting in my backlog and wish list. Being adventurous and trying lots of things is for gamers far more hardcore than I who are willing and able to spend far more time gaming than I am.

 

[oni-link]

Im toying with the idea of just playing GOTY versions of games - playing something day 1 (outside of competitive MP) just seems to end up being a worse experience...

ps3ud0 8)

I do this, play games 6-12 months later you get them cheaper and all patched up, often with DLC on the disc, day 1 is for MP focused games and suckers

Spoiler

oni-link 8)

 

[Sanctuary]

Best Dark Souls game. But Demon's is even better

I'm not sure, but I think they are talking about the major downgrade before release. Also, Dark Souls > Dark Souls 2 without all of the DLC.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOmWf4oSav8

 

[DonShula]

This is a great point actually - if you only ever play what the critical consensus has deemed acceptable then you're not really in charge of your own choices. You're essentially getting others to vet games for you. Which is odd - if you like the look of a game, give it a whirl. Sometimes you just have to take a leap of faith. There have been plenty of games that I've loved, that I would never have played if I'd paid any attention to the majority opinion. And conversely I've disliked enough critical darlings to know that the opinons of others hold very little stock in what I should play.

There's a difference between just looking at numbers to make your decision and actually reading about the game, though. You can read a review that slams a game and still come away thinking you may enjoy it. I had a friend who said "don't get NMS, it's all exploration and crafting and it's boring." And to me that sounded kind of great. The key is waiting until the finished product is in the wild and THEN reading up on it - this whole cycle of reading previews and preordering and finding a game isn't what was advertised is so avoidable.

 

[Kysen]

I think you're preaching to the choir here on GAF.

Is that why there are multiple angry threads on NMS? So many gaffers fell for the hype.

 

[oni-link]

There's a difference between just looking at numbers to make your decision and actually reading about the game, though. You can read a review that slams a game and still come away thinking you may enjoy it. I had a friend who said "don't get NMS, it's all exploration and crafting and it's boring." And to me that sounded kind of great. The key is waiting until the finished product is in the wild and THEN reading up on it - this whole cycle of reading previews and preordering and finding a game isn't what was advertised is so avoidable.

Bloody good post

It's always better to wait till the game is out, even if you only wait a week

Half the people burnt on Unity or NMS or Destiny wouldn't have bought the game if they waited even a week or two

But the damage was already done by then, they'd already voted with their wallets that they want more bullshit

Full disclosure edit: I bought Destiny day 1 and really liked the game

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

If you know what you like and do some research you'll hardly get burned.

 

[Simbabbad]

I think you're preaching to the choir here on GAF.

Not really, this forum seems forever outraged about stuff and not into the "tons of games to enjoy" mentality.

 

[cartographer]

It's fairly easy for me now but it wasn't always. I made a bad purchase on an overhyped game five or so years ago that I knew I likely wouldn't like and that ended up changing my purchasing habits. I spend a lot less time and money on games now and the time I do spend is more enjoyable.

But I also play primarily on PC and live in the US, so I know I'll always have a good price available to me. That's not the same for everybody, where location or platform price issues down the line can scare people into pre-ordering everything if it offers even modest savings.

I think you're preaching to the choir here on GAF.

I don't really think so. There is still a large focus on pre-release "hype hype hype" here and plenty of people disappointed every time whatever game of the month inevitably is bad or just mediocre.

 

[SmokedMeat]

I think you're preaching to the choir here on GAF.

GAF members are just as gullible as anyone else. They fall for the hype with their OTs and preview threads. No Man's Sky is a perfect example of a game that suckered a slew of gamers who should know better.

Since I've started gaming on PC, I've stopped paying attention to the big hyped releases. I don't scour through previews, I don't follow every pinch of news. I don't preorder them, nor do I buy them at release. I don't care enough to bother anymore. I notice they exist, I see the reactions, and I wait until the price is where I want it to be. I'm no longer getting burned by anything or anyone. The choir should try it.

 

[Admodieus]

Preach OP.

Another thing that I think most people don't do - find a reviewer or group of reviewers who share your taste in games. Their opinion/review on a new game should be much more important and relevant to you than a Metacritic score.

 

[gelf]

This is a great point actually - if you only ever play what the critical consensus has deemed acceptable then you're not really in charge of your own choices. You're essentially getting others to vet games for you. Which is odd - if you like the look of a game, give it a whirl. Sometimes you just have to take a leap of faith. There have been plenty of games that I've loved, that I would never have played if I'd paid any attention to the majority opinion. And conversely I've disliked enough critical darlings to know that the opinons of others hold very little stock in what I should play.
.

There's a difference between taking a chance on a game where your not sure if the concept is for you and just blindly rushing out and buying a game on day 1 before waiting for impressions and finding out its totally broken. I have ended up with games I don't like and thats fine but I've never felt like I've been conned into it.

 

[GOOCHY]

Just don't buy the hype, ever.

The writing was on the wall for the expectations being out of hand on NMS. We know who makes good software and who doesn't. If you're posting on GAF you know who is good and who isn't. Those guys were completely unproven and the way they held back information was, well, it's one way to market things.

 

[SliceSabre]

I get ya OP. It is extremely rare for me to ever play a game that I would say was complete trash.

While I do look at pro reviews, I take stock in what friends and people I'm following say about a game, various videos and let's plays and maybe I just have a very good eye for games that aren't terrible.

 

[GidbinN]

The earliest moment I'd purchase a game is 7 days after the release.

 

[ReadingRambo]

I think you're preaching to the choir here on GAF.

NMS is on OT2 here.

 

[Incendiary]

why would you ever preorder a game

I've got five games on pre-order right now - two are special editions that I wanted to make sure I got a copy of in case they ended up limited or unavailable closer to launch (Dishonored 2, Persona 5). One is a remaster collection of three games I already played and enjoyed and just want the remastered version to play on my PS4 (Bioshock Collection). One is a sequel to a game I put 80 hours into and from a company I trust to make good games (SMT IV:Apocalypse). And the last is a sequel to a game that was absolutely hilarious and also one of the more polished RPGs I've played in a long time (South Park: The Fractured But Whole). On top of this, I'm getting a discount on all five of these orders thanks to Amazon's preorder discount deal that comes with Prime.

I think all of those reasons are good enough to pre-order for, personally. I don't preorder everything, and I don't preorder just out of necessity to play it day one. If you have a game coming to your house every week from here to December thanks to pre-orders, you might have a problem, sure. But it's entirely possible to have good reasons to pre-order and still be picky enough to know which games you'll be satisfied with and which you won't be.

 

[Chinese Cartoons]

/thread

Just to clarify: pretty much everyone here at GAF is educated in gaming, meaning we don't get duped as easily as other people. If a game sucks, you'll be hard pressed to find a faster place than here or reddit that lets you know the game sucks or is filled with microtransactions or is bugged as hell.

This is sarcasm right? or is this a gaf gold subforum exclusive post?

Gaf drives the hype train.

 

[Auctopus]

Totally with you, OP.

It's hilarious because the people who feel the need to say "No, Ubi. I'm not going to fall for this shit again." out loud, are always the people who do.

Some people seem to find it hard to understand that it's possible to be excited by the premise of the game without the need to build your life around its upcoming release. Without building more and more hype around a product you know nothing about.

I think you're preaching to the choir here on GAF.

I really don't think he is.

 

[LTWheels]

Price of games fall quite quickly now days unless your Nintendo. So much comes and it's easy to wait a couple of months and almost get the game at half price.

 

[mnz]

It's simple for me.

Larian or CDPR? Day 1.

Any other developer? Wait for user reviews.

Exactly those two have done huge updates to their games that made them way better. They won't screw you over, but waiting might still be a good idea.

 

[Oersted]

You learned from Street Fighter V?

Congrats I guess

 

[NoblesseOblige]

I think you're preaching to the choir here on GAF.

I find a contingent of GAF to be one of the most susceptible to hype which typically turns into anger when they ultimately feel lied to and screwed over for falling for Day 1 purchases and unrealistic expectations.

 

[ArtHands]

Im toying with the idea of just playing GOTY versions of games - playing something day 1 (outside of competitive MP) just seems to end up being a worse experience...

ps3ud0 8)

Thats what I do.

I am not a day-one-purchase sucker, so it helps a lot. I'll tend to wait for Summer sales then purchase slightly old games that has good words of mouth or reviews. By then they are dirt cheap, latest patches which has fixed most of the bugs, game of the year with all DLC bundled etc. I have dodged many bullets with this practice, so I am happy.

 

[shotgunbob04]

I agree, OP. It's pretty simple. I do the same thing with movies at the cinema. I can wait several months for a much cheaper price (and a much-improved game nowadays).

Doom 2016 is the latest example of why waiting a few months is worth it. Probably going to wait until Black Friday for that one, actually. Just picked up Battlefield 4 on PSN for $4.49 and am enjoying it a lot. Should get me through the next month or two.

 

[Admodieus]

I've got five games on pre-order right now - two are special editions that I wanted to make sure I got a copy of in case they ended up limited or unavailable closer to launch (Dishonored 2, Persona 5). One is a remaster collection of three games I already played and enjoyed and just want the remastered version to play on my PS4 (Bioshock Collection). One is a sequel to a game I put 80 hours into and from a company I trust to make good games (SMT IV:Apocalypse). And the last is a sequel to a game that was absolutely hilarious and also one of the more polished RPGs I've played in a long time (South Park: The Fractured But Whole). On top of this, I'm getting a discount on all five of these orders thanks to Amazon's preorder discount deal that comes with Prime.

I think all of those reasons are good enough to pre-order for, personally. I don't preorder everything, and I don't preorder just out of necessity to play it day one. If you have a game coming to your house every week from here to December thanks to pre-orders, you might have a problem, sure. But it's entirely possible to have good reasons to pre-order and still be picky enough to know which games you'll be satisfied with and which you won't be.

Not coming at you specifically, but this is another thing that I think a lot of gamers need to get over - the whole special edition/limited edition nonsense. How many times do we see people upset over the quality of a statue or figurine or other knick knack that looked great in pre-order promo shots but is terrible in reality? How many of these items sit around and collect dust for years until you throw them out in an attempt to downsize while moving?

Collector's Editions, Limited Editions, etc. are just another tool to get you to pre-order games and another way for you to be disappointed in the end result.

 

[Bolivar687]

I think you're preaching to the choir here on GAF.

More like giving sound, reasoned advice to a distressed penitent during confession.

 

[OfTheOverflow]

I consider myself a pretty savvy consumer and like many of us on Gaf, equally cynical about preordering. So yeah OP, I don't think there's much excuse for the consumer to cry fowl when there's an enormous amount of reviews and impressions online prerelease. If you wait max, like, a day after release, there'll be considerable fan opinion.

 

[His Majesty]

Exactly those two have done huge updates to their games that made them way better. They won't screw you over, but waiting might still be a good idea.

Mostly because they actually listen to the feedback from their fans and improve upon it instead of calling it a job well done and moving on. Got two amazing playthroughs out of Original Sin and Witcher 3, vanilla and enhanced.

 

[karnage10]

This isn't about you. It isn't about the fact that yes, it's possible not to get screwed over. The problem is they try, and that the industry is building around the notion that you can oversell a feature (or make it up). Sure, the solution is always for consumers to smarten-up, but really the blame isn't on them in the first place. Nobody asked for publishers to sell what's not in their product.

It's like saying "I'm fine with them not making good things since I can wait for them to be available and find out at a later time if they are indeed good or bad" vs "don't make bad things". I think we're all just mostly trying to get the industry stick to the later sentiment.

This is a very good way to look at it. I highly agree with the bolded part: what turn me off about pre-ordering is the fact that it's impossible to know what we are receiving.

 

[StereoVsn]

The OP is short sighted. The problem is that the bad parts make good games a lot less attractive. Take MGSV and new Deus Ex. FOBs and microtransactions in first and microtransactions and consumable shit in the latter out me off these games.

I wanted to play both and wanted to support the games (well, not so much support with MGSV) but at the same time the BS caused me to wait for a major sale on MGSV and I am going to do same with Deus Ex.

So it's not that these are bad games but bad industry practices put people off from even relatively good games.

 

[Davey Cakes]

I've never truly been a victim of bad industry practices or any of the problems that folks on these boards seem to complain about. I'm a conscious consumer on a budget so I make my choices carefully. I guess I've impulse bought several Humble Indie Bundles but it's not like I've ever been screwed over by paying $10 for $100 worth of games.

Haven't pre-ordered a game in a while.

Haven't bought any major AAA games since, I don't know, RE6? And that wasn't even a hard choice when it was included in the heavily discounted RE Archives on Amazon and was more of a bonus on top of Code Veronica HD and RE4 HD.

Rarely buying at full price and mostly sticking to Nintendo and indies has helped. Lots of good value there, with not many opportunities to get screwed.

 

[bosseye]

There's a difference between just looking at numbers to make your decision and actually reading about the game, though. You can read a review that slams a game and still come away thinking you may enjoy it. I had a friend who said "don't get NMS, it's all exploration and crafting and it's boring." And to me that sounded kind of great. The key is waiting until the finished product is in the wild and THEN reading up on it - this whole cycle of reading previews and preordering and finding a game isn't what was advertised is so avoidable.

I would agree, although for me the problem is gamers reading previews, watching promotional stuff, digesting all the info out there; and then believing that is representative of the final product. Down that route lies disappointment and internet shrieking.

My comment was more aimed at people who say stuff like "I was really interested in NMS, but AngryJoe hated it so I guess I won't bother" or when the first reviews drop and its stuff like "5/10? Welp I'm out then" as if they need that validation from external sources to have a go at things they previously believed they will enjoy. It irritates me irrationally.

There's a difference between taking a chance on a game where your not sure if the concept is for you and just blindly rushing out and buying a game on day 1 before waiting for impressions and finding out its totally broken. I have ended up with games I don't like and thats fine but I've never felt like I've been conned into it.

I've never felt conned either. And I'm never disappointed because I don't believe E3 trailers, previews and the like. I didn't believe a jot of the NMS stuff - seeing all these video comparisons of the early videos vs what was released is laughable to me - same for Witcher 3 rage when that was release, or Watch_Dogs, who is watching these videos and thinking this is what I will be playing in a year. Idiots, thats who.

My original point was to do with those games where you're not 100% sure its for you, but there is a still something about it that interests you - in those situations I say go for it when time/money/backlog allows. There are a ton of reasons not to buy games of course, lots of them entirely personal to the individual. I just don't think the opinions of others or a metacritic number should hold that much worth if its something you feel could be for you.

 

[Oersted]

I find a contingent of GAF to be one of the most susceptible to hype which typically turns into anger when they ultimately feel lied to and screwed over for falling for Day 1 purchases and unrealistic expectations.

What is a unrealistic expectation?

That all parts of the game work?

 

[Mass_Pincup]

I'm with you OP, I very rarely buy Games at full price and the ones I do buy are things I'm fairly certain to enjoy (last exception was Zero Time Dilemma).

I don't pay for PS+ or Gold
I don't buy DLC (just expansion like for the Witcher)
I don't buy season passes
I don't preorder unless it's way cheaper then to buy at launch
I don't pay for early access games
I often wait before buying games
I know what I like
I don't fall for the hype

With all of that I rarely if ever get burned.

 

[cartographer]

I consider myself a pretty savvy consumer and like many of us on Gaf, equally cynical about preordering. So yeah OP, I don't think there's much excuse for the consumer to cry fowl when there's an enormous amount of reviews and impressions online prerelease. If you wait max, like, a day after release, there'll be considerable fan opinion.

I think there's plenty of practices for consumers to criticize even if they don't fall prey to it. Being personally disappointed or misled isn't the only reason to take the industry to task.

 

[Oersted]

I'm with you OP, I very rarely buy Games at full price and the ones I do buy are things I'm fairly certain to enjoy (last exception was Zero Time Dilemma).

I don't pay for PS+ or Gold
I don't buy DLC (just expansion like for the Witcher)
I don't buy season passes
I don't preorder unless it's way cheaper then to buy at launch
I don't pay for early access games
I often wait before buying games
I know what I like
I don't fall for the hype

With all of that I rarely if ever get burned.

OP does not appear to be one of those

 

[Rexatality]

why would you ever preorder a game

Maybe because there are games I wanna play day 1 and I'd like to pre-order them as soon the option is available

I pre-ordered Collector's Edition of Dishonored 2. I don't see anything wrong with that

 

[Greddleok]

why would you ever preorder a game

I have money now, and I don't know if I'll have money later.

 

[bosseye]

Just follow my checklist when watching E3 videos, gameplay snippets, promotional stuff on upcoming games:

• The game is running on a PC
• Ignore the console pad, its still running on a PC
• Its running on a very good PC
• Better than yours
• The video shows a carefully curated slice of the action
• It won't look like this on release. It may look similar, but it will likely be not as good looking/dense/physics enabled
• BRACE FOR PVP

Cynical? Nope. Sensible. Assume the worst, then you can only ever be pleasantly surprised.

 

[Skilletor]

Been playing games so long that it's really apparent what I'll like when I see a video. I haven't bought a game I'd consider bad in a very, very long time.

Don't care about reviews. Only listen to gaffers whose tastes align with mine.

Works pretty well.

 

[Shadybiz]

I have money now, and I don't know if I'll have money later.

Kinda off topic for the thread, and I know that preorders can always be cancelled, but, if your situation is that uncertain, should you be investing possibly non-disposable income into a game that won't be out for weeks or months, (edit) that might very well not live up to expectations, or even work for that matter, when it comes out?

 

[SeeNoWeevil]

the BS caused me to wait for a major sale on MGSV and I am going to do same with Deus Ex.

You voted with your wallet. They lost money.

 

[Incendiary]

Not coming at you specifically, but this is another thing that I think a lot of gamers need to get over - the whole special edition/limited edition nonsense. How many times do we see people upset over the quality of a statue or figurine or other knick knack that looked great in pre-order promo shots but is terrible in reality? How many of these items sit around and collect dust for years until you throw them out in an attempt to downsize while moving?

Collector's Editions, Limited Editions, etc. are just another tool to get you to pre-order games and another way for you to be disappointed in the end result.

No offense taken, in fact I actually agree with you on this one. I rarely get limited editions - I think the last one I got was the Dark Souls II figurine edition. I'm getting both of these because they both have something I want in them, but in general I try not to get suckered in by them.

It used to be that it was nearly impossible to get gaming related collectibles without buying a cool limited edition straight from the company. Now, though, go to any gaming convention and you can find all sorts of neat things as collectibles without having to pay extra money on a game.

 

[Ultimadrago]

going by some of the NMS forums, I don't think he is...

Yeaaah, many the defenders for No Man's Sky (and to further extent, Sean Murray's documented claims) really had me scratching my head.

 

[gelf]

I would agree, although for me the problem is gamers reading previews, watching promotional stuff, digesting all the info out there; and then believing that is representative of the final product. Down that route lies disappointment and internet shrieking.

My comment was more aimed at people who say stuff like "I was really interested in NMS, but AngryJoe hated it so I guess I won't bother" or when the first reviews drop and its stuff like "5/10? Welp I'm out then" as if they need that validation from external sources to have a go at things they previously believed they will enjoy. It irritates me irrationally.



I've never felt conned either. And I'm never disappointed because I don't believe E3 trailers, previews and the like. I didn't believe a jot of the NMS stuff - seeing all these video comparisons of the early videos vs what was released is laughable to me - same for Witcher 3 rage when that was release, or Watch_Dogs, who is watching these videos and thinking this is what I will be playing in a year. Idiots, thats who.

My original point was to do with those games where you're not 100% sure its for you, but there is a still something about it that interests you - in those situations I say go for it when time/money/backlog allows. There are a ton of reasons not to buy games of course, lots of them entirely personal to the individual. I just don't think the opinions of others or a metacritic number should hold that much worth if its something you feel could be for you.

Well that I can completely agree on. I wait to make sure something isn't obviously off at launch but I'd never take metacritic or the words of some youtuber as gospel not to buy a game. I'll make up my own mind from all available information. Proper information about the final game of course not info that was in an E3 trailer 2 years ago.

 

[Tain]

Yeah, hard to disagree with the OP.

It feels like in a lot of online gaming conversations the default, assumed state is that someone has purchased or will purchase a game. It's almost as though the option of not buying is ignored. It doesn't make sense to me.

Of course, criticism is a wonderful thing and those displeased with how a game is made should voice that (both purchasers and non-purchasers alike), but maybe don't try to frame your very specific criticisms into grand and supposedly-objective Consumer Rights Issues.

 

[Auctopus]

To say nothing of the usual hype game syndrome, especially for console exclusives. The Order and No Man's Sky were extremely obviously always what they ended up being on release, yet GAF was filled with shocked rage that they ended up as they did. After months of posters basically dogpiling anyone who dared mention the obvious warning signs pre-release.

This place has an increasingly nasty, delusional hype cycle going for a lot of AAA games.

Totally agree with this post. Especially the feeling that it's getting worse.

 

[Servbot24]

Agreed with OP. It's almost always obvious even from the marketing when a game is going to underwhelm. No Man's Sky, Destiny, The Order, Evolve, etc. It was clear from the beginning they would not be great, but fans have practically made it a sport to convince themselves that games will be better than they have any chance of being.

 

[SpiceMelange]

I would have said that too, if it wasn't for the Halo MCC collection. Who would let their poster child franchise get out of the door so unpolished? It was very uncharacteristic of them. It's like if Nintendo would suddenly release a buggy unresponsive sub 20fps Mario game. Don't tell me it was easy for you to dodge that bullet, assuming you were interested in the Halo franchise. I never pre-order or buy games day 1 except for games I know very well will be good (Nintendo games, but also long proven franchises) and I've never been burned except for Halo MCC.