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[big_z]

Man, size of an original 360? How is it so big if they're using relatively tame hardware? Either they got the size wrong or the specs are higher than we think because that just doesn't make sense.

Hard drive, disc drive, heat sink and fans take up a fair bit of space. It's very likely the chips will be 32nm at best as well and that means you need more cooling. It's quite possible that the psu will be internal as well.

IMO nintendo is screwed if they arent using future hardware. 22nm chips are going to be a huge jump and those are coming late this year or early next.

 

[_Alkaline_]

Why bother caring that Galaxy wasn't on better hardware?

It was amazing anyway and it looked amazing anyway. Hardware didn't hold it back in any real way.

That's like living in 1988 and wishing SMB3 was heading to the SNES instead. Did it stop SMB3 from being fuck-awesome? No.

 

[Cow Mengde]

The art was obscured by the Wii's hardware. What is so difficult to understand? With literally no changes but a higher resolution, you end up with an image that's enormously more attractive, because you can actually see the art. This is controversial among GAF's more unfortunate, it seems.

How is the art obscured by the hardware? Cause, last time I checked, the game blew my mind when I played it on the Wii. I was marveling at the imagination, art, and creativity of the world. My jaws were on the floor when I saw Mario fly above the sun while watching the lava swirl and erupt all around Mario.

 

[Zeliard]

How is the art obscured by the hardware? Cause, last time I checked, the game blew my mind when I played it on the Wii. I was marveling at the imagination, art, and creativity of the world. My jaws were on the floor when I saw Mario fly above the sun while watching the lava swirl and erupt all around Mario.

Yeah, and that was at 480p. Now imagine it at 1080p. It would light your ass on fire.

 

[DragonKnight]

Yeah, and that was at 480p. Now imagine it at 1080p. It would light your ass on fire.

I lol'ed. Not because your wrong but because I thought this was funny

 

[nincompoop]

As in "it's a shame the Wii was such garbage hardware."

You and Andrex should try to keep up.

The art was obscured by the Wii's hardware. What is so difficult to understand? With literally no changes but a higher resolution, you end up with an image that's enormously more attractive, because you can actually see the art. This is controversial among GAF's more unfortunate, it seems.

So why do you think the Wii hardware is garbage when at the same time you're admitting that it's capable of producing insanely impressive visuals? You realize that increasing the resolution doesn't add any detail, it only lets you see the detail that the hardware was already producing more clearly, right?

 

[WillyFive]

Agreed. N64 games on the other hand always looked bad to me, and aged even worse.

That sucks. I was constantly being impressed by the N64's graphical feats (at the time).

uuu no it wasn't, and no the water wasn't as mind boggling...

The best water that generation was the one in Wave Race BS (even if the game wasn't that good), and SMS wasn't a technical beast, it was criticized for it's graphics when it came out (was criticized when the first screenshot was leaked).

People also criticized Wind Waker's first footage. Also, the first footage of Sunshine didn't even show off the water, it just had flat texture. The Spaceworld footage had graphics nowhere near as good as the final game.

The game had a lot of faults, mainly, repetitive stages (repetitive in the sense that most of it was beach based) and unfair design (fucking blue coins).

Not graphics, and not graphics.

Even with that, it was probably the best 3D platformer of the generation, and I loved the game, but come on! it's like we live in an alternative reality here.

What happened to make it an alternative reality? Did someone say the game was bad?

The problem with Mario games is that they'll never be graphic beasts because of the art; the games are very clean looking, which means, they will never require a big hardware to run. And I think that's a good thing, simplicity is better than games filled with crap.

Pixar movies are graphical beasts, and their art styles are just as simple as Mario's.

I'm on the team that thinks the next Mario game will not look that much better than SMG, because of the art.

What if it has even better art?

Even if they make the game HD (SMG looks insanely awesome in emulators), the games will continue to be clean, so you won't see hundreds of elements that weren't there before.

What if there are hundreds of elements that weren't there before, like hundreds of enemies or hundreds of moving background objects like flowers?

The most I see Mario doing, is playing with light/shadow effects and stuff like that, but not looking much better than Galaxy.

This being said, no one can be so stupid to say that SMS looks on par with SM64; that's an idiotic comment and it's obviously trolling, it's like the people saying that the OOT 3D remake looks the same as the original OOT...

To be fair, the difference between OoT and OoT 3D is a lot smaller than Mario 64 and Mario Sunshine.

 

[Zeliard]

So why do you think the Wii hardware is garbage when at the same time you're admitting that it's capable of producing insanely impressive visuals? You realize that increasing the resolution doesn't add any detail, it only lets you see the detail that the hardware was already producing more clearly, right?

The art team is producing these insane visuals. The Wii hardware is doing its best to muddy them up. The fact that you can run Mario Galaxy 2 through an emulator keeping the same art assets and everything and have it look so majestic it almost looks like a different game should be telling. At a higher resolution everything comes through much more clearly in Nintendo's first-party games, art almost drawn as if that's how it was meant to be.

The Wii is just very old hardware and was very old off the bat. I've always been one of the people content with the Cafe not being much more powerful than current gen "HD" systems, specifically because the work Nintendo produces isn't performance-intensive. They could be giving us games that don't do significantly more than Galaxy 2 does from an overall tech standpoint but running at 1080p/60FPS. They don't necessarily need to do much more than that because that's already been proven to result in very high visual quality.

 

[GDGF]

I can see this controller being interesting but I can't see it being used to actually enhance gameplay. Beyond maps and inventories why would you ant to take your eyes or the main TV screen?

Selecting plays in sports games, card type games, strategy games, new gameplay styles where a player receives instructions the other players aren't supposed to know (like maybe a FPS game type where one player is secretly a spy) and instances where you want to continue playing but the TV is occupied with other family members for starters.

 

[beelzebozo]

 

[Emitan]

People also criticized Wind Waker's first footage.

That's because Wind Waker's first footage looked like ass. The game's final version is better looking by leaps and bounds.

 

[manueldelalas]

That sucks. I was constantly being impressed by the N64's graphical feats (at the time).

People also criticized Wind Waker's first footage. Also, the first footage of Sunshine didn't even show off the water, it just had flat texture. The Spaceworld footage had graphics nowhere near as good as the final game.

Not graphics, and not graphics.

What happened to make it an alternative reality? Did someone say the game was bad?

Pixar movies are graphical beasts, and their art styles are just as simple as Mario's.

What if it has even better art?

What if there are hundreds of elements that weren't there before, like hundreds of enemies or hundreds of moving background objects like flowers?

To be fair, the difference between OoT and OoT 3D is a lot smaller than Mario 64 and Mario Sunshine.

Whatever, but SMS was never a graphical beast (and never intended to be one); it looked far better than SM64, that's obvious, but there was nothing really outstanding about it's graphics, other than the water PHYSICS were good, and it had a clean look.

Nintendo is no Pixar (you can see that in the unnecessary SMS FMVs...), and their games have a MUCH smaller budget than the typical third party AAA (whatever that stands for) have, with the sole exception of Zelda. Nintendo teams are smaller, and that's a good thing; but they'll never push for high end graphics. Nintendo will never make Halo-Killer, nor GT5 killer, and probably will continue to stay away from "realistic" (i.e. graphically much more demanding) games.

I'm happy that their games have the clean look, I love their style, but one has to recognize that they are not in the business of hardware demanding graphics; they consider other stuff much more important (loading times, gameplay, fun, etc).

Even OOT, one of the most impressive for it's time game Nintendo has ever released, was outshined by the contemporary Turok 2 in the graphics department.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

That's because Wind Waker's first footage looked like ass. The game's final version is better looking by leaps and bounds.

I disagree that it looked significantly different. But the things like Link winking and moblins suffering from Wile E. Coyote gravity turned a lot of people off.

 

[Cromat]

Why not make a regular controller with pointer functionality? That way you can have a controller that can play games normally as well as retain the one good thing the Wii controller brought to the table (because the motion controls are broken and never improve anything). I mean it can also have motion controls for steering and so on, like Six Axis (but accurate).

The screen thing seems like a weird way of trying to innovate just to innovate.
It would also mean that getting another controller would cost more than $80... I don't see the point in taking the player's eyes of the screen. At least the VMU was portable on its own. And Nintendo won't make the controller into a handheld because that would compete with 3DS.

Also Ive been thinking that Sony should just call NGP the Playstation 4, ship it with a dock that connects it to an HDTV and allow it to use extra controllers. That way it could be a sort of console-portable hybrid and would certainly justify the +$300 price tag it's going to have, which will be hard to sell in the iPad-age. It would differentiate Sony from the rest, since it would be the only company allowing you to play the same exact games on a portable and on a big screen, and make them look and play great either way,

 

[Teknoman]

I disagree that it looked significantly different. But the things like Link winking and moblins suffering from Wile E. Coyote gravity turned a lot of people off.

Looked fine to me...but then again I really like anything wind waker style.

Why not make a regular controller with pointer functionality? That way you can have a controller that can play games normally as well as retain the one good thing the Wii controller brought to the table (because the motion controls are broken and never improve anything). I mean it can also have motion controls for steering and so on, like Six Axis (but accurate).

Whatever was implemented with the motion plus addition fixed all that.

Just wait until Skyward Sword hits. As far as normal functionality, I dont think you can really make a normal looking controller with pointer functions as it would just be unwieldy for aiming.

 

[BlueTsunami]

Yeah, and that was at 480p. Now imagine it at 1080p. It would light your ass on fire.

I have to agree with this. I definitely agree that SMG was beautiful looking but being one who games on a 65" HDTV, resolution matters.

 

[Krev]

Why not make a regular controller with pointer functionality? That way you can have a controller that can play games normally as well as retain the one good thing the Wii controller brought to the table (because the motion controls are broken and never improve anything). I mean it can also have motion controls for steering and so on, like Six Axis (but accurate).

The usefulness of the Wiimote's pointer is entirely contingent on the two handed set-up. Waving around a standard gamepad like this to aim would not be fun.

 

[rosjos44]

Software matters more than the hardware people. As long as the hardware can match next generation systems from Sony / Microsoft so that we can have games across all three platforms from 3rd parties then we are fine.

 

[From The Dust]

Yeah, and that was at 480p. Now imagine it at 1080p. It would light your ass on fire.

we can already do that

but fur grass would be cool. granted they prolly removed it as it didn't mesh well with the asthetic. I actually like the poly grass bunches better anyway

 

[Fantastical]

Twilight Princess was ugly as sin. Super Mario Sunshine looked barely better than late gen N64 games and the only outstanding graphical achievement is the water.

You are crazy. Play some N64 games and see how wrong you are.

 

[Emitan]

Software matters more than the hardware people. As long as the hardware can match next generation systems from Sony / Microsoft so that we can have games across all three platforms from 3rd parties then we are fine.

CODE RED! CODE RED!
Who let this one escape?

 

[Outtrigger888]

What if each controller could play a differnt game, not full retail games but downloadable classics. Imagine being in your room and wanting to play a little super mario world before bed you grab your cafe controller it connects to the console and you can choose from your library of classic nintendo games. And others could play differnt games at the same time. The tv your console is hooked up to isnt always available so this would be awesome.

 

[Imperial Hot]

It can't cost more than the Wii cost at launch.

 

[AceBandage]

It can't cost more than the Wii cost at launch.

How so?
We have no idea what's inside this thing. For all we know, it could cost $800 for the parts in a single system.

 

[Emitan]

It can't cost more than the Wii cost at launch.

It will and I will not be happy. I'm never going to pay more than $299 for a console so I hope it doesn't take too long for a price drop.

 

[From The Dust]

It can't cost more than the Wii cost at launch.

I bet it will

 

[Zeliard]

we can already do that

I know, I have been. The reason I've been pissing on the Wii hardware is I lament the fact that the vast majority of people will never experience these games at high resolutions without playing them through a Nintendo system, so hopefully this next one will allow for that sort of emulation (as well as those sorts of capabilities in general for new games).

Jumping around planetoids in Galaxy 2 at 1080p/60FPS feels like Christmas as a kid. It's so joyous, especially because you so uncommonly see games with the art styles of Nintendo's first-party at such crisp resolutions, and with such overall image quality. They look really great.

 

[BrokenEchelon]

It can't cost more than the Wii cost at launch.

I'm pretty sure the era of sub-$300 consoles ended with the Wii.

 

[Instro]

Id say $300-$350 is the range, depending on what they put in it. $300 might even be to low considering the 3DS is currently at $250.

 

[From The Dust]

I know, I have been. The reason I've been pissing on the Wii hardware is I lament the fact that the vast majority of people will never experience these games at high resolutions without playing them through a Nintendo system, so hopefully this next one will allow for that sort of emulation (as well as those sorts of capabilities in general for new games).

Jumping around planetoids in Galaxy 2 at 1080p/60FPS feels like Christmas as a kid. It's so joyous, especially because you so uncommonly see games with the art styles of Nintendo's first-party at such crisp resolutions, and with such overall image quality. They look really great.

aye, I know what you mean. Galaxy/2 looks fantastic on my 720p tv. just needs some anti aliasing and proper resolution bump. I hope they do include upscaling. but if they don't, we are garunteed to get Mario and Zelda in HD and goddamn it it will be beautiful

 

[CrunchyFrog]

Agreed! Should have been on 360/PS3. I still pray for Mario Galaxy to be ported onto them.

On what planet do you live that would make this thought even remotely reasonable?

Unless of course this is a joke post. In which case, bravo, hook line and sinker.

 

[_Alkaline_]

CODE RED! CODE RED!
Who let this one escape?

What are you saying?

 

[Emitan]

What are you saying?

Everyone seems to care more about hardware than software, which is crazy.

 

[AzureNightmare]

Exactly. Next gen consoles at most will aim for 6850-6870-6950 like power at 28nm or even 20nm(which will be available in 2013).

I see 85-100w HD6950 @20nm.

We are talking about a <200/150w total power consumption for the machines.

Obvious pro-Nvidia troll is obvious

 

[Gilby]

I think I just realized what the vitality sensor was all about...

Power Glove 2

Think about it.

(Individual finger movement?)

edit: The more I think about this, the more it makes a weird sort of sense. If you can sense which fingers have more pressure...(I love hypothetical tech)

 

[Dreams-Visions]

imagine if the new console UNSCALED all the old games like the Dolphin Emulator?

hnngggggggggggggggg

 

[_Alkaline_]

Everyone seems to care more about hardware than software, which is crazy.

Agreed, but his post supported that notion.

Maybe I'm just confused about the joke.

 

[From The Dust]

this on the pad would be pretty damn cool

lack of pointer on the other hand... ;_;

 

[See You Next Wednesday]

Mario Sunshine was a graphical beast when it came out. Especially that water, which at the time was mind-boggling.

What game was everyone playing? Sunshine looked borderline ugly.
Compared to Jak & Dexter and Ratchet & Clank, it almost did look like a N64 game.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

imagine if the new console UNSCALED all the old games like the Dolphin Emulator?

hnngggggggggggggggg

I don't think going lower than 480p is really a smart move.

 

[watershed]

What game was everyone playing? Sunshine looked borderline ugly.
Compared to Jak & Dexter and Ratchet & Clank, it almost did look like a N64 game.

right......

 

[From The Dust]

What game was everyone playing? Sunshine looked borderline ugly.
Compared to Jak & Dexter and Ratchet & Clank, it almost did look like a N64 game.

I had to look up some screens to make sure you weren't kidding. you are.

 

[ThanksVision]

I just can't see Nintendo releasing a console that's over $300. It doesn't sound like them.

 

[CurseoftheGods]

I was a hardcore Nintendo fan back in the day, and even then I admitted that SMS looked like garbage compared to J&D/R&C.

Played a lot better than them, though.

 

[nincompoop]

How does something look like an N64 game compared to one game but not another? Either it looks like an N64 game or it doesn't.

Did Mario 64 look like a SuperFX game compared to Crash and Spyro?

 

[I NEED SCISSORS]

imagine if the new console UNSCALED all the old games like the Dolphin Emulator?

hnngggggggggggggggg

Imagine if Nintendo also released this CASSEROLE this year

uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu



(* I believe the term you are looking for is 'upscaled')

 

[crazy monkey]

why do we have two threads? It is hard to caught up.

 

[carlo6529]

I just can't see Nintendo releasing a console that's over $300. It doesn't sound like them.

Were you able to see Nintendo launching a handheld at 250 bucks?

 

[donny2112]

why do we have two threads?

First thread was for the initial information. Lots of vagueness in the details. "Better than PS3." "Notch above 360."

This thread was put out when IGN had some real specific information to go on, and it was deemed worthy of a new thread. It's worked out pretty well, in my opinion, too, as this thread seems to be much more technical oriented than the other one due to being founded on more technical information.

 

[From The Dust]

I just can't see Nintendo releasing a console that's over $300. It doesn't sound like them.

With the tech floor being raised higher and higher every gen, it was only inevidable