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[Sianos]

This is where we get "but acting on homosexual urges is a choice." Indeed it is. But so is choosing to not bleach your skin and get facial surgery to pass as Caucasian in a racist society. Oh? It is ridiculous and abhorrent to expect people to surgically alter their racial appearance to appease racists????!!! Golly gee that's almost as that's my point.

People are confused because there is no concrete, observable action that must be undertaken for a homosexual person to appear to be straight - homosexual and heterosexual people are not visually distinguishable. In both cases, a person is being pressured into hiding a core part of who they are to appease people who apparently love all of them except for their skin color/sexuality.

 

[Tesseract]

if homosexuality is a sin, like any other, and one you don't care about, what the hell are you even saying

 

[CornBurrito]

People are confused because there is no concrete, observable action that must be undertaken for a homosexual person to appear to be straight - homosexual and heterosexual people are not visually distinguishable. In both cases, a person is being pressured into hiding a core part of who they are to appease people who apparently love all of them except for their skin color/sexuality.

Honestly it would be a lot easier to bleach my skin for a couple years to pass as white than it would be to police my mind 24/7 in order to avoid homosexual thought (lust is a sin after all).

 

[Shining Sunshine]

The issue is that statements do not exist in a vacuum. You can't say that you disapprove of homosexuality yet are also not judging homosexuals. Logically, if one disapproves homosexuality they must hold some sort of a negative belief of it to justify the disapproval. Whatever judgment has been levied against homosexuality as a concept is also levied against homosexuals as people, since the one quality to be placed in the subgroup of "homosexual" is being homosexual.

I personally think that most people against homosexuality cannot even articulate why they are beyond the fact that they are told to. They cannot reconcile the fact that they are supposed to be against homosexuality yet know plenty of nice homosexual people. Hence, the paradoxical rhetoric of trying to both simultaneous be tolerant of a group of people yet still following the twisted letter of misappropriated, antiquated scripture.

I don't see the connection between being judgemental and being hateful.

And I can tell you why Catholics are against homosexuality. It's actually not just homosexuality, it's any form of sex that isn't procreating life. That's why Catholics are against condoms, abortion, masturbation, any form of sexual activity that doesn't lead to having babies.

 

[DontBeThatGuy]

Why do you think I disagreed?

Generally, they didn't think that you get married to make yourself happy.

I'm pretty much of the opinion that they're so deep that nothing I can do will convince them. My best bet is to hope it changes with their kids.

How do they feel about same-sex couple's adopting? I bet they lose their shit.

 

[Siegcram]

I wonder how many homosexual couples who fully agree with the image in the OP will be too afraid to speak up and stand firm with that belief due to all the hatred and backlash they'll receive from former supporters?

Yes, what IS the number of homosexual couples that "don't support homosexuality".

 

[Sianos]

I wonder how many homosexual couples who fully agree with the image in the OP will be too afraid to speak up and stand firm with that belief due to all the hatred and backlash they'll receive from former supporters?

For a couple to be actively engaged in homosexual relations yet not support homosexuality strikes me as entirely paradoxical.

Honestly it would be a lot easier to bleach my skin for a couple years to pass as white than it would be to police my mind 24/7 in order to avoid homosexual thought (lust is a sin after all).

That is very true, but thinking is an abstract concept that is not directly observable and plenty of people are stuck in stages of concrete reasoning. In reality it is more difficult for one to pretend to be a different sexuality and repress their own sexuality, but it does not outwardly appear that way to observers - there is no physical change or process for them to notice.

 

[DoktorEvil]

How so? Neither race nor sexuality are controllable. But acting on sexuality is supposedly a choice, and expecting celibacy out of gays so that they can avoid sin is fine apparently. Not changing your physical appearance is a choice. Expecting people to change their physical appearance to avoid discrimination isn't fine? What's the difference?

Sexuality isn't hard coded into people. It isn't defined by DNA, gender is.

What you elicit eroticism from isn't the same as what somebody is born with in their nether regions.

 

[HiredN00bs]

That statement is about as unjudgmental as one can possibly be if you espouse the beliefs that person holds.

One might make the argument that it is not possible to be unjudgmental when you are against something like homosexuality.

Maybe that's true, but I'm not sure, so let's talk about it. As another example, many/most Christians also believe that not accepting Jesus Christ as your personal savior is a mortal sin. Do you feel this is arrogant and judgmental as well?

Yes.

 

[Soph]

If you believe in homosexuality, you're not a Catholic. You can't have a Catholic wedding without being a Catholic.

This line of reasoning is why a friend committed suicide, thanks. He was a catholic boy and a homosexual. Disgusting.

 

[Opiate]

if homosexuality is a sin, like any other, and one you don't care about, what the hell are you even saying

This is another good point, although I don't think we should apply it to anyone here specifically.

As a broad stroke: if homosexuality is a sin just like any other, then one has to ask why we spend so much more time talking about homosexuality in religious contexts than we do overeating or spending too much time playing video games or telling someone they look ugly; all of those are presumably sins, but I have never seen a collective, forceful movement to discuss those issues. Not in a religious context, at least. Why don't we see public campaigns by Christian institutions warning of the sins of gluttony? Surely it has significance in the modern American landscape.

 

[HiredN00bs]

The Bible commands that homosexuals are to be executed. That's enough for me to eliminate it as an ultimate authority on anything.

 

[CornBurrito]

Sexuality isn't hard coded into people. It isn't defined by DNA, gender is.

I disagree, and I don't think the science is with you on that. The current evidence suggests that sexuality is determined by prenatal hormonal environment and genetic factors. Even if it isn't hard coded by DNA, that is a far cry from it being under conscious control.

 

[Arkeband]

I thought that was pretty clear in my second post on this - that I think homosexuality is a sin, but it's like any other garden variety sin and I really don't care about it beyond "yes, i belive it is immoral" along with a bunch of other shit that I really don't care about and don't hold against anyone else. So here it is again for the second or third time in this thread for all of you that keep wanting to play this stupid semantics game.

1. Do I think homosexuality is a sin? Yes.
2. Do I care? No.
3. Should two men or two women be able to marry each other? Yes.
4. Are homosexuals horrible people because they live in sin? No. We all sin, and we all are not horrible people.

This is the same thing I've said in other posts here. I don't know what the confusion is about. I'm sure cornburrito or someone else will find some other grammar loophole in this and ask me to repeat this a 4th or 5th time though.

On second thought, I should probably just leave it at this. Have fun with this thread.

Every response you've had has used your disfigured, warped version of Christianity where you call the way someone was born a sin, and then excuse yourself of any wrongdoing because that's, like, how you interpret the bible, man.

And then you say something to the effect of "I'm leaving now" or "Goodbye", as a reminder to the rest of us that you can't debate with someone who's already made up their mind.

Your whole "So what if you're gay, we're all sinners lol" excuse is cowardly, it's the same as saying "Well your skin is black and I've been taught that's bad, but I do bad things sometimes too, so we're even." They're born gay. They don't choose to be gay. They have no control over it, and quite frankly nothing is wrong with it to begin with. It's a raw deal when you declare someone a sinner by default but you can go say some hail Mary's and you're now okay until you go home and jerk off.

 

[Sai-kun]

I don't see the connection between being judgemental and being hateful.

And I can tell you why Catholics are against homosexuality. It's actually not just homosexuality, it's any form of sex that isn't procreating life. That's why Catholics are against condoms, abortion, masturbation, any form of sexual activity that doesn't lead to having babies.

being judgmental leads to people taking their own lives so

there's that i guess

 

[Raistlin]

This is another good point, although I don't think we should apply it to anyone here specifically.

As a broad stroke: if homosexuality is a sin just like any other, then one has to ask why we spend so much more time talking about homosexuality in religious contexts than we do overeating or spending too much time playing video games or telling someone they look ugly; all of those are presumably sins, but I have never seen a collective, forceful movement to discuss those issues. Not in a religious context, at least. Why don't we see public campaigns by Christian institutions warning of the sins of gluttony? Surely it has significance in the modern American landscape.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortal_sin#Mortal_sins

Though your general point still stands - it certainly garners far more discussion and outcry than most others.




Side note: Contraception is a mortal sin. Chew on that for a minute.

>_<

 

[Fenderputty]

This is another good point, although I don't think we should apply it to anyone here specifically.

But as a broad stroke: if homosexuality is a sin just like any other, then one has to ask why we spend so much more time talking about homosexuality in religious contexts than we do overeating or spending too much time playing video games or telling someone they look ugly; all of those are presumably sins, but I have never seen a collective, forceful movement to discuss those issues. Not in a religious context, at least. Why don't we see public campaigns by Christian institutions warning of the sins of gluttony? Surely it has significance in the modern American landscape.

IMO it's because the sin isn't something the religious person can relate too. They understand the draw of premarital sex or lust or greed etc etc. So it's easier for them to rationalize. They even further try and distance themselves from understanding homosexuality (actual empathy) by claiming choice.

 

[Opiate]

I disagree, and I don't think the science is with you on that. The current evidence suggests that sexuality is determined by prenatal hormonal environment and genetic factors. Even if it isn't hard coded by DNA, that is a far cry from it being under conscious control.

What you are describing is typically referred to as epigenetics, and homosexual (and heterosexual and so forth) tendencies are a fairly clear case of epigenetic influence.

 

[-Minsc-]

I wonder how many homosexual couples who fully agree with the image in the OP will be too afraid to speak up and stand firm with that belief due to all the hatred and backlash they'll receive from former supporters?

Yes, what IS the number of homosexual couples that "don't support homosexuality".

Reading my post I realize I wasn't clear with the message I attempted to share and easily could have been interpreted as "homosexuals who don't support homosexuality".

I'm referring to the final paragraph.

"But realize that name-calling and stereotyping those of us who stand for what we believe is exactly what you don't want done to you. We have a right to speak what we believe, same as you have a right to speak what you believe."

 

[soul creator]

all I know regardless, is that you just gotta respect their beliefs. I mean, who cares about the actual content of the belief, and whether there's any actual rationale behind them (beyond "that's just how I was raised"), you just gotta respect it (which secretly means accepting it as totally awesome and wonderful). Because they're sincerely held beliefs, and criticizing them would be pretty damn mean. In fact, criticizing beliefs is pretty much the equivalent of oppressing them, and we don't want that.

And it's a belief based on faith too? Damn, you have to extra respect that kind of belief, because religion is so serious and beautiful and meaningful and spiritual and uplifting. I'm shedding a tear right now typing this post while thinking about the beauty of faith and God. And it's not like you can prove their belief wrong, because again, we're talking about faith and personal experience. So you trying to tell them they're wrong is just being arrogant. Who are you to act as if you know what god truly thinks about homosexuality? Or whether that God even exists? God speaks to us personally, so we must take everyone at their word when they say "God thinks gay marriage is totally sinful", regardless of the inherently contradictory answers you will get from everyone concerning this topic. I mean, it's exactly a 50/50 chance when it comes to deciding the correctness of a position, so I don't even know why we're debating this in the first place. Every single person everywhere is equally correct, especially when religion is involved!

 

[boiled goose]

Sexuality isn't hard coded into people. It isn't defined by DNA, gender is.

What you elicit eroticism from isn't the same as what somebody is born with in their nether regions.

Sexuality does have a biological basis.
It runs in families.
It is affected by birth order.
It is affected by hormones in development.

We don't understand completely how it arises, but it does seem like people are born either gay straight or anywhere in between. Your brain is physical. Your sexual preferences have a physical basis. Most major brain development happens before birth.

again, we dont understand it fully, but it does seem to be 'hardwired' (in the physical structure of the brain.

Ive known i was straight since I was 4.

What you are describing is typically referred to as epigenetics, and homosexual (and heterosexual and so forth) tendencies are a fairly clear case of epigenetic influence.

I'm not up to date on the research on epigenetics in sexual preference, but it is essentially the same as "being on your DNA". Epigenetics is basically how the DNA is modified, wrapped, etc. at the molecular level. Not AGCT but still a molecular basis.
Also, from my understanding, there is definitely at least partially an actual genetic (AGCT sequence) contribution to homosexuality. Complex behavior and gene expression is not gonna be explained by a single gene. But genes have definitely shown to affect sexuality (it runs in families)

 

[Mumei]

Great post, Mumei, and I would add something else; not only has this not historically been the response, but one could make a fairly reasonable assumption that the only reason that anti-gay rhetoric has become increasingly softened is that it is no longer socially acceptable to be so condemnatory. It's a bit like a jerk who starts acting nicer once the boss shows up; it's hard to have faith that their suddenly agreeable nature is sincere. Maybe it is -- that's possible -- but it's easy to understand why some would be skeptical.

Well, I've always thought that it was a fig leaf that didn't actually accurately describe Christian beliefs on homosexuality. So, yes, I view the other polite constructions with all the credence that the history of past polite constructions affords them, especially when these polite constructions are a fig leaf for opposition to equal rights. And I suspect - having done so many times - that if you engaged a person expressing those views, after getting past scripture and getting past, "Well, I just disagree," you'd reach the "It's gross" and "But the children!" arguments.

If they were opposed to it in principle, but still supported my rights to it and didn't use homophobic lies to justify their opposition but just stuck to the "Well, these are my religious beliefs and while I can't justify them, it isn't up to me to question what God says about this," line of defense, well then I'd think they were sincere in their protestations that their views weren't based in personal animus. But I can't say that I've seen this before.

Edit: Wait, I think Enron just did. Well, first time for everything.

 

[digita1alchemy]

Edit: wrong thread.

 

[Gradon]

I don't think I could ever be friends with someone who told me they don't like who I am or want me to have the same rights as them. Seriously. It's really obnoxious to say you still love someone but believe them to be inferior to you.

 

[Ryouji Gunblade]

"Stop challenging my ancient, oppressive belief system."

 

[Anoregon]

Why don't we see public campaigns by Christian institutions warning of the sins of gluttony? Surely it has significance in the modern American landscape.

I am now picturing the Westboro Baptist church holding up signs that say "GOD HATES FATS"

 

[Sianos]

I don't see the connection between being judgemental and being hateful.

And I can tell you why Catholics are against homosexuality. It's actually not just homosexuality, it's any form of sex that isn't procreating life. That's why Catholics are against condoms, abortion, masturbation, any form of sexual activity that doesn't lead to having babies.

I was moving on to a general point in the third "paragraph", but can see how that would be confusing. That said, being hateful is worse than being judgmental, but both are against the core tenants of the religion and unacceptable.

Then at least Catholics have a consistent rhetoric. That sort of reasoning is at least functional enough to be debated and not immediately contradictory. Disapproving of, for instance, all anal and oral sex regardless of participants is at least consistent - although there is still the issue that what is being disapproved of is still a core defining facet of a group of people, but at least it is more like their lifestyles are being included in the sin pile by extrapolation as opposed to a direct objection.

 

[Siegcram]

Reading my post I realize I wasn't clear with the message I attempted to share and easily could have been interpreted as "homosexuals who don't support homosexuality".

I'm referring to the final paragraph.

"But realize that name-calling and stereotyping those of us who stand for what we believe is exactly what you don't want done to you. We have a right to speak what we believe, same as you have a right to speak what you believe."

That paragraph suffers somewhat when they're proudly proclaiming denial and ignorance towards the people they so desperately want to stay friends with on the same picture.

Don't want to be called a bigot? Then don't impose your beliefs on others that don't share them.

 

[Triggafinga]

I have not read the thread but I am a christian who does support same sex marriage . I also believe in enforcing gender roles in my family and believe in the power (spirit power) of conception through hetero - sexual intercourse.

Wish more Christians were more detailed in where they stand. Instead of being " pro straight marriage" but also trying to act like their position is not a deal-breaker to their gay friends.

Sounds like people who wants segregation to re-commence, but want me as a black man to feel comfortable....

 

[Opiate]

I am now picturing the Westboro Baptist church holding up signs that say "GOD HATES FATS"

You're joking, of course, but it's actually a great example. There is no Westboro Baptist Church equivalent that protests obesity. There is no WBP equivalent with signs reading "God hates divorcees." There is particular and special attention paid to homosexuality which suggests it's more than just another sin for many Christians.

It's important to point out that this isn't true of all Christians, just to be clear. Saying that some Christians are suspiciously concerned with homosexuality is not the same as saying all of them are. I'm sure there are plenty of genuine Christians who think of homosexuality no differently than they think of masturbation (i.e. both are bad but we all sin), and some may be in this thread.

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

I have not read the thread but I am a christian who does support same sex marriage . I also believe in enforcing gender roles in my family and believe in the power (spirit power) of conception through hetero - sexual intercourse.

Wish more Christians were more detailed in where they stand. Instead of being " pro straight marriage" but also trying to act like their position is not a deal-breaker to their gay friends.

Sounds like people who wants segregation to re-commence, but want me as a black man to feel comfortable....

Enforcing gender roles? what does that mean? what if someone in your family is transexual?

 

[DoktorEvil]

I disagree, and I don't think the science is with you on that. The current evidence suggests that sexuality is determined by prenatal hormonal environment and genetic factors. Even if it isn't hard coded by DNA, that is a far cry from it being under conscious control.

Sexuality does have a biological basis.
It runs in families.
It is affected by birth order.
It is affected by hormones in development.

We don't understand completely how it arises, but it does seem like people are born either gay straight or anywhere in between. Your brain is physical. Your sexual preferences have a physical basis. Most major brain development happens before birth.

again, we dont understand it fully, but it does seem to be 'hardwired' (in the physical structure of the brain.

Ive known i was straight since I was 4.

I will admit ignorance on the current science of genetics, but as I can recall from human sexuality courses in HS and College, there are multiple factors that can shape human sexuality, both hard and soft sciences:

Biological, Physical, Emotional, Social, or Spiritual factors.

It is not one specific factor at play, it is many.

 

[Shining Sunshine]

This line of reasoning is why a friend committed suicide, thanks. He was a catholic boy and a homosexual. Disgusting.

I'm sorry about your friend, but I'm going to be objective about this. Your friend took the easy way out instead of moving away from his life he was born into to start a new one. It's going to be difficult to move out, make money, make new friends, but that's better than just committing suicide.

I'm also going to say that people aren't perfect, and that includes Catholics. His family was probably very angry and hateful towards him that forced him to do what he did. That is different from the OP image where that Christian isn't going to act on his judgement, and if he hated his friend, then they wouldn't be friends.

Hate and Judgement are very different things.

being judgmental leads to people taking their own lives so

there's that i guess

People take their own lives for a lot more reasons than that.

 

[Sai-kun]

uhhhhh

well then

edit: what the fuck is wrong with you man

 

[Arkeband]

I have not read the thread but I am a christian who does support same sex marriage . I also believe in enforcing gender roles in my family and believe in the power (spirit power) of conception through hetero - sexual intercourse.

Wish more Christians were more detailed in where they stand. Instead of being " pro straight marriage" but also trying to act like their position is not a deal-breaker to their gay friends.

Sounds like people who wants segregation to re-commence, but want me as a black man to feel comfortable....

I'm sorry about your friend, but I'm going to be objective about this. Your friend took the easy way out instead of moving away from his life he was born into to start a new one. It's going to be difficult to move out, make money, make new friends, but that's better than just committing suicide.

He should have prayed the gay away, right?

 

[CornBurrito]

I will admit ignorance on the current science of genetics, but as I can recall from human sexuality courses in HS and College, there are multiple factors that can shape human sexuality, both hard and soft sciences:

Biological, Physical, Emotional, Social, or Spiritual factors.

It is not one specific factor at play, it is many.

Science changes and moves on. There's really nothing supporting the idea that homosexuality is consciously controlled. I have as much control over my sexuality as I do my race, given current evidence.

 

[Sheroking]

I'm sorry about your friend, but I'm going to be objective about this. Your friend took the easy way out instead of moving away from his life he was born into to start a new one. It's going to be difficult to move out, make money, make new friends, but that's better than just committing suicide.

I'm also going to say that people aren't perfect, and that includes Catholics. His family was probably very angry and hateful towards him that forced him to do what he did. That is different from the OP image where that Christian isn't going to act on his judgement, and if he hated his friend, then they wouldn't be friends.

Hate and Judgement are very different things.

Well, except for the part where the bible says Christian's shouldn't be doing either.

 

[Kater]

I'm sorry about your friend, but I'm going to be objective about this. Your friend took the easy way out instead of moving away from his life he was born into to start a new one. It's going to be difficult to move out, make money, make new friends, but that's better than just committing suicide.

I'm also going to say that people aren't perfect, and that includes Catholics. His family was probably very angry and hateful towards him that forced him to do what he did. That is different from the OP image where that Christian isn't going to act on his judgement, and if he hated his friend, then they wouldn't be friends.

Hate and Judgement are very different things.

People take their own lives for a lot more reasons than that.

 

[Triggafinga]

Enforcing gender roles? what does that mean? what if someone in your family is transexual?

I believe enforcing gender roles gives a child direction. An environment for natural development. If I felt my child had the opposite gender role I would accept that.

 

[Siegcram]

"spirit power of conception" sounds pretty radical, I have to admit

 

[Shining Sunshine]

I was moving on to a general point in the third "paragraph", but can see how that would be confusing. That said, being hateful is worse than being judgmental, but both are against the core tenants of the religion and unacceptable.

Then at least Catholics have a consistent rhetoric. That sort of reasoning is at least functional enough to be debated and not immediately contradictory. Disapproving of, for instance, all anal and oral sex regardless of participants is at least consistent - although there is still the issue that what is being disapproved of is still a core defining facet of a group of people, but at least it is more like their lifestyles are being included in the sin pile by extrapolation as opposed to a direct objection.

Sorry, but judgement is very core to Religious beliefs. Catholics are living their lives knowing their acts will be judge at the end of their lives, and that judgement determines their fate in the afterlife.

And Catholics aren't perfect, which is fundamental to Catholicism and humanity. You have priests that molest children, which really means they aren't Catholic at all. You will find a lot of "Catholics" that don't act Catholic.
Being Catholic and having a religious status as Catholic are two different things, imo, so it's hard to figure out what Catholics are based on how Catholics act.

The person in the OP image is probably being more Christian than a lot of Christians out there that are protesting against Homosexual Marriages.

He should have prayed the gay away, right?

Welp, I'm out. No point of discussion with unreasonable posts like this and all those that followed. You quoted my entire line and missed the second half.

A lot of posters making assumptions of what it means to be Christian, but those assumptions are completely full of fallacies.

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

If you believe in homosexuality, you're not a Catholic. You can't have a Catholic wedding without being a Catholic.

Just curious(really, not trying to be clever or anything here), what do you mean by believe in homosexuality?

I seriously don't understand.

 

[Triggafinga]

"spirit power of conception" sounds pretty radical, I have to admit

Any talk about spirituality is radical because its unproven. If things were figured out and faith was not needed . Life would suck lol

 

[2002whitegt]

My views on many things have changed over the last few years. Having grown up in a very traditional and conservative hispanic household, lots of my views were obviously shaped from the Bible as it was interpreted by my church at the time.

As I've grown older I've come to realize that my relationship with God is "my" relationship with God, and that things are never fully black and white. What may be a sin to someone else might not be a sin for me, for example growing up I was told by my parents that drinking was sin, and I can now understand that was a view my dad developed as a recovered alcoholic, it's the why, not, what that's makes something a sin in my eyes.

So when it comes to answering, is homosexuality a sin, I can't speak for others, but for myself, and in my life, being not gay, it would be a sin for me to be in a gay relationship, because I'm not being who I was made not necessarily just because it's a gay relationship.

I fully believe that people are born gay, and do not "choose" to be gay. I also believe that if two people love each other enough to spend their life together, they deserve to be treated by equals in the eyes of the government regardless of race, gender, and sexual orientation.

I cannot say it's a sin, because it's not my place to decide or give my opinion on it, and that's not a cop put either. It's really just as simple as being true to yourself in my opinion, and truly loving others. Which brings me to seeing so much hate on my FB wall, I had to unfollow a few older friends. Life is too short and beautiful to be wasting time worrying what others are doing in their private lives.

If the church is failing, it's not because of the "gays, abortions, and Obama" it's because we have lost sight of what's really important and that's loving your neighbor, without certain conditions.

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

I don't think I could ever be friends with someone who told me they don't like who I am or want me to have the same rights as them. Seriously. It's really obnoxious to say you still love someone but believe them to be inferior to you.

It's what I've been saying multiple times this thread. The people who are saying "friends can disagree with each other" are missing the point that there's a difference between disagreeing over what a band's best song is and giving your two cents on somebody's sexuality and civil rights. For the latter, "I'm not being judgemental" is not some magic phrase that suddenly causes the intent of your words to become undetectable to whoever hears it. If you really didn't want to make your friend feel like they're judged about something you simply wouldn't bring it up.

But this? This is just selfish. It's like trying to have all the benefits of wagging your finger at someone but with none of the consequences that come with it. I don't think that's something that a good friend would do.

 

[Damerman]

if homosexuality is a sin, like any other, and one you don't care about, what the hell are you even saying

this is what undersmines the entire christian platform for homophobia. show me where it says jesus hates gays...

it's fucking stupid. Jesus said to cast a stone if you are without sin... if you love jesus and want to be like jesus so much, why is this such a big issue for you? it's because you would rather hold onto incompatible man made social constructs just because you label yourself as conservative... you don't really give a fuck what jesus has to say.

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

Any talk about spirituality is radical because its unproven. If things were figured out and faith was not needed . Life would suck lol

why would life suck? I'm an atheist, so I don't think about any of that and life is great.

Also regarding the gender thing, how do you enforce gender roles? Honestly curious, do you make boys do "manly stuff while girls do "girly" stuff? If gender is already defined, wouldn't they find out everything on their own without guidance?

It's cool that you'd be fine with a trans family member btw.

 

[poncle]

Please, correct me if I'm wrong: gay couples aren't getting married in churches, so can't see why Catholics care so much.

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

Please, correct me if I'm wrong: gay couples aren't getting married in churches, so can't see why Catholics care so much.

Because there's a lot of ignorant people out there, it's disgusting.

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

Please, correct me if I'm wrong: gay couples aren't getting married in churches, so can't see why Catholics care so much.

You are correct, the only churches that will have gay marriages in them are the ones that are okay with holding them. No churches will be forced to do this because the law prevents that from happening.